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Tuff Nut
07-08-2011, 02:35 PM
Saw this and thought it was very interesting.
http://web.minorleaguebaseball.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20110707&content_id=21576810&fext=.jsp&vkey=news_farmalmc

lollipopcurve
07-08-2011, 03:29 PM
Congrats to Dayton -- the greatest minor league baseball town in America.

BuckeyeRedleg
07-08-2011, 04:25 PM
A great year for this to happen as this team is absolutely loaded with prospects.

Last check I counted 12 prospects that could be considered good enough to be in the top 20 of the entire Reds system.

dougdirt
07-08-2011, 04:31 PM
A great year for this to happen as this team is absolutely loaded with prospects.

Last check I counted 12 prospects that could be considered good enough to be in the top 20 of the entire Reds system.

Which 12?
Corcino
Hamilton
Rodriguez
Torreyes
Duran

I wouldn't have Barnhart or Lotzkar in my top 20 right now. Josh Smith has great numbers, but I wouldn't put him in the Top 20. He has solid stuff, but as a starter I don't see him being special. As a reliever I think he could be a good one, but he won't close so the value isn't there.

Tuff Nut
07-08-2011, 04:35 PM
Which 12?
Corcino
Hamilton
Rodriguez
Torreyes
Duran

I wouldn't have Barnhart or Lotzkar in my top 20 right now. Josh Smith has great numbers, but I wouldn't put him in the Top 20. He has solid stuff, but as a starter I don't see him being special. As a reliever I think he could be a good one, but he won't close so the value isn't there.
Drew Hayes has some awesome numbers, imho. 30 games, 38 IP, 14 hits, 57 Ks, 13 saves and a 0.94 ERA.

dougdirt
07-08-2011, 04:53 PM
Drew Hayes has some awesome numbers, imho. 30 games, 38 IP, 14 hits, 57 Ks, 13 saves and a 0.94 ERA.

He does have awesome numbers, and heck, he even has good stuff.... but control issues need to be worked on and he doesn't project to be a closer. Non closer relievers simply don't have high value in terms of prospect lists because the idea is that a lot of guys can be 6-8th inning guys, where as there aren't nearly as many guys that can close at the big league level. As of right now, I would only have one reliever in my Top 20 and that would be Boxberger. And he would be outside of the Top 10 and he is a guy who is flat out dominating at the highest levels of the minors and can throw up to 98 MPH (though he doesn't work there).

BuckeyeRedleg
07-08-2011, 05:08 PM
Which 12?
Corcino
Hamilton
Rodriguez
Torreyes
Duran

I wouldn't have Barnhart or Lotzkar in my top 20 right now. Josh Smith has great numbers, but I wouldn't put him in the Top 20. He has solid stuff, but as a starter I don't see him being special. As a reliever I think he could be a good one, but he won't close so the value isn't there.

As you mentioned, the big 5:

Corcino
Duran
Hamilton
Torreyes
Rodriguez

Then:

Lotzkar
Vidal
Barnhart
Josh Smith
Hayes
Renken
Gerson

I like D'Anna too.

I'm sure 12 might be a slight exaggeration, but I really think those 12 (+ D'Anna) are all solid and could be considered decent prospects. I think coming into the year, Lotzkar was ranked #10 by BA and #15 by our own Redszone. He's healthy (knock on wood) and has some decent peripheral numbers after 5 starts. Smith and Hayes might be a little old for low A, but they have been lights out. Overall a ton of talent down there and a ton to be excited about going forward.

Tuff Nut
07-08-2011, 05:19 PM
He does have awesome numbers, and heck, he even has good stuff.... but control issues need to be worked on and he doesn't project to be a closer. Non closer relievers simply don't have high value in terms of prospect lists because the idea is that a lot of guys can be 6-8th inning guys, where as there aren't nearly as many guys that can close at the big league level. As of right now, I would only have one reliever in my Top 20 and that would be Boxberger. And he would be outside of the Top 10 and he is a guy who is flat out dominating at the highest levels of the minors and can throw up to 98 MPH (though he doesn't work there).
I've only checked his stats a few times, and don't recall his walks being high.( a reference to the control issue) He is from a local town, about 35 miles from me, and pitched for a Kitty League team, that was in my town, for a couple years, before going to Cape Cod. I thought he was more of a starter, but can see where being a reliever, will get him innings, and he can work on things. Much like his college teammate, David Price. I still think he can be a productive pro, and help this team in a couple years, if it even takes him that long.

mace
07-08-2011, 05:33 PM
I've only checked his stats a few times, and don't recall his walks being high.( a reference to the control issue) He is from a local town, about 35 miles from me, and pitched for a Kitty League team, that was in my town, for a couple years, before going to Cape Cod. I thought he was more of a starter, but can see where being a reliever, will get him innings, and he can work on things. Much like his college teammate, David Price. I still think he can be a productive pro, and help this team in a couple years, if it even takes him that long.

Fun fact of the day on Drew Hayes: In 2005, he was Mr. Football in the state of Tennessee. Finished with the second-most passing yards in state history.

partisan
07-08-2011, 05:48 PM
Bought my tickets for this game about a month ago, can't wait to be there when they break the record.

dougdirt
07-08-2011, 05:54 PM
I've only checked his stats a few times, and don't recall his walks being high.( a reference to the control issue) He is from a local town, about 35 miles from me, and pitched for a Kitty League team, that was in my town, for a couple years, before going to Cape Cod. I thought he was more of a starter, but can see where being a reliever, will get him innings, and he can work on things. Much like his college teammate, David Price. I still think he can be a productive pro, and help this team in a couple years, if it even takes him that long.
He has 18 walks in 36.2 innings. That is a lot of walks. It may have been hidden at a glance because he has 57 strikeouts as well, so his K/BB is very strong still. But that many walks is a concern as he moves up and guys better understand both the strikezone and better understand how to read pitches quicker and lay off the ones that break/run out of the zone.

fearofpopvol1
07-08-2011, 10:43 PM
He does have awesome numbers, and heck, he even has good stuff.... but control issues need to be worked on and he doesn't project to be a closer. Non closer relievers simply don't have high value in terms of prospect lists because the idea is that a lot of guys can be 6-8th inning guys, where as there aren't nearly as many guys that can close at the big league level. As of right now, I would only have one reliever in my Top 20 and that would be Boxberger. And he would be outside of the Top 10 and he is a guy who is flat out dominating at the highest levels of the minors and can throw up to 98 MPH (though he doesn't work there).

I don't know if I would agree with "flat out dominating," but he's been very good this year. He still walks too many batters to be dominating in my opinion, but he makes up for it with Ks and a low HR rate.

dougdirt
07-09-2011, 02:05 AM
I don't know if I would agree with "flat out dominating," but he's been very good this year. He still walks too many batters to be dominating in my opinion, but he makes up for it with Ks and a low HR rate.

He struggled with walks in April. Since April ended, he has 8 walks and 43 strikeouts while facing 104 batters. That is a strong walk rate. April was rough in the walk department though.

fearofpopvol1
07-09-2011, 04:35 AM
He struggled with walks in April. Since April ended, he has 8 walks and 43 strikeouts while facing 104 batters. That is a strong walk rate. April was rough in the walk department though.

That's true, but I'm more referring to his career walk numbers in the minors, which aren't "dominating" in my opinion.

dougdirt
07-09-2011, 11:27 AM
That's true, but I'm more referring to his career walk numbers in the minors, which aren't "dominating" in my opinion.

I wouldn't be too concerned with his career walk numbers. He has made note of the fact that he wasn't used to preparing for a bullpen role last year and it really messed with him. This year has been an incredibly different story.

Tuff Nut
07-09-2011, 10:47 PM
He struggled with walks in April. Since April ended, he has 8 walks and 43 strikeouts while facing 104 batters. That is a strong walk rate. April was rough in the walk department though.
So you are saying he has control issues because he had 10 walks, during the first month of the season? Boy , you're tough on a player.

camisadelgolf
07-10-2011, 03:48 AM
So you are saying he has control issues because he had 10 walks, during the first month of the season? Boy , you're tough on a player.
I think dougdirt was focusing more about Hayes' career than just one month. Sure, one month was particularly bad, but with or without that month, his career walk rate is underwhelming. Overall in 2011, he has issued 4.4 waks per 9 innings pitched, which isn't very impressive. For his career, he's at 5.2 BB/9IP, which is pretty bad. Doug at least pointed out the drastic improvement in recent months, but I don't think you can throw out the majority of his career's numbers just because he has been performing better recently.

dougdirt
07-10-2011, 04:44 AM
I think there is some confusion going on here.... Tuff Nut, you are quoting numbers I posted on Brad Boxberger. My point was actually that his control had been quite strong since the month of April ended and that I wasn't concerned with it.

With Drew Hayes, he has improved his number of walks so far with each month of the season (July not withstanding, but he has 2 walks in 4.2 innings so it really isn't valid to add this month in yet). But, in April, he had a BB/9 of 5.58. That is very bad. In May, it dropped to 4.38. That is still quite poor. In June, it lowered to 3.27. That is below average.

Improvement is good to see, but he has gone from really bad to slightly below average so far. Lots of improvement to go still, especially when considering the competition level where a lot of players are willing to expand the strikezone.

He has a good arm, but it isn't a great arm. Tonight he was working in the low 90's and hit 94 once.

Tuff Nut
07-10-2011, 12:46 PM
Fair enough. But, as his low ERA shows, atleast those walks aren't scoring, and at the present time, this has been killing the Reds.

bubbachunk
07-10-2011, 01:18 PM
Fair enough. But, as his low ERA shows, atleast those walks aren't scoring, and at the present time, this has been killing the Reds.

If you keep putting guys on, you will eventually get bitten in the butt

dougdirt
07-10-2011, 02:51 PM
Fair enough. But, as his low ERA shows, atleast those walks aren't scoring, and at the present time, this has been killing the Reds.

Eventually it will catch up with you though, especially at the higher levels (if there isn't improvement of course).