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RedLegSuperStar
08-02-2011, 09:22 PM
At 7 GB I feel that the white flag has been raised & the chance at back to back playoff apperances has come to an end. Magic can happen.. but lets be real! The Pirates are ahead of us and are contending. The flag is at 3/4 staff and on its way up. With that said lets take a look at the 2012 Cincinnati Reds.

Catcher:
Devin Mesoraco
Ryan Hanigan

Infield:
Joey Votto
Brandon Phillips* (Has option that will fully be picked up)
Zack Cozart
Scott Rolen
Miguel Cairo
Paul Janish

OF:
Jay Bruce
Drew Stubbs
Chris Heisey
Yonder Alonso
Todd Frazier

Other candidates: Juan Francisco, Dave Seppelt, Chris Valaika

Starting Rotation:
Johnny Cueto
Mike Leake
Aroldis Chapman
Bronson Arroyo
Homer Bailey/Travis Wood/Edison Volquez

Bullpen:
Nick Masset
Bill Bray
Sam LeCure
Logan Ondrusek
Jose Arredondo

Other candidates: Jarrod Burton, Jordan Smith, Brad Boxberger

Potential Trade Chips:
Yasmani Grandel
Chris Heisey
Yonder Alonso
Todd Frazier
Neftali Soto
Mike Leake
Homer Bailey
Edison Volquez
Travis Wood

Needs:
TOR/Ace
Left Fielder/Power Bat
Leadoff
Closer (Maybe)

This team could and should deal so chips for needs. If not they will be forced to battle for Free Agents and we know how that typically goes. In my next post I will list the potential Free Agents for 2012.

RedLegSuperStar
08-02-2011, 09:23 PM
Updated 8-2-11

Catchers
Rod Barajas (36)
Henry Blanco (40)
Ramon Castro (36)
Ryan Doumit (31) - $7.25MM club option for 2012, $8.25MM club option for '13 with a $500K buyout
Ramon Hernandez (36)
Jason Kendall (38)
Gerald Laird (32)
Jose Molina (36)
Yadier Molina (29) - $7MM club option with a $750K buyout
Dioner Navarro (28)
Ivan Rodriguez (40)
Brian Schneider (35)
Kelly Shoppach (29) - $3.2MM club option with a $300K buyout
Chris Snyder (31) - $6.75MM club option with a $750K buyout
Matt Treanor (36)
Jason Varitek (40)

First basemen
Lance Berkman (36)
Russell Branyan (36)
Jorge Cantu (30)
Michael Cuddyer (33)
Prince Fielder (28)
Ross Gload (36)
Brad Hawpe (33)
Eric Hinske (34) - $1.5MM club option with a $100K buyout
Nick Johnson (33)
Casey Kotchman (29)
Mark Kotsay (36)
Derrek Lee (36)
Xavier Nady (33)
Lyle Overbay (35)
Carlos Pena (34)
Wily Mo Pena (30)
Albert Pujols (32)

Second basemen
Clint Barmes (33)
Willie Bloomquist (34) - $1.1MM mutual option with a $150K buyout
Orlando Cabrera (37)
Robinson Cano (29) - $14MM club option with a $2MM buyout
Jamey Carroll (37)
Alex Cora (36)
Craig Counsell (41)
Mark Ellis (35)
Jerry Hairston Jr. (36)
Aaron Hill (30) - $8MM club option for 2012 and $8MM club option for '13
Omar Infante (30)
Joe Inglett (34)
Kelly Johnson (30)
Adam Kennedy (36)
Felipe Lopez (32)
Jose Lopez (28)
Julio Lugo (36)
Aaron Miles (35)
Augie Ojeda (37)
Brandon Phillips (31) - $12MM club option with a $1MM buyout

Shortstops
Clint Barmes (33)
Yuniesky Betancourt (30) - $6MM club option with a $2MM buyout
Orlando Cabrera (37)
Jamey Carroll (37)
Ronny Cedeno (29) - $3MM club option with a $200K buyout
Craig Counsell (41)
Rafael Furcal (34) - $12MM club option with a $1.3MM buyout
Alex Gonzalez (34)
Jerry Hairston Jr. (36)
Omar Infante (30)
Cesar Izturis (32)
Julio Lugo (36)
John McDonald (37)
Augie Ojeda (37)
Nick Punto (34)
Edgar Renteria (35)
Jose Reyes (29)
Jimmy Rollins (33)
Ramon Santiago (32)
Marco Scutaro (36) - $6MM club option/$3MM player option with a $1.5MM buyout
Miguel Tejada (38)
Jack Wilson (34)

Third basemen
Wilson Betemit (30)
Casey Blake (38) - $6MM club option with a $1.25MM buyout
Jorge Cantu (30)
Eric Chavez (34)
Craig Counsell (41)
Mark DeRosa (37)
Greg Dobbs (33)
Edwin Encarnacion (29) - $3.5MM club option with a $500K buyout
Jerry Hairston Jr. (36)
Wes Helms (36)
Omar Infante (30)
Felipe Lopez (32)
Jose Lopez (28)
Nick Punto (34)
Aramis Ramirez (34)
Miguel Tejada (38)
Omar Vizquel (45)

Left fielders
Pat Burrell (35)
Jack Cust (33)
Johnny Damon (37)
Mark DeRosa (37)
Jonny Gomes (31)
Carlos Guillen (36)
Scott Hairston (32)
Willie Harris (34)
Jeremy Hermida (28)
Eric Hinske (34) - $1.5MM club option with a $100K buyout
Raul Ibanez (40)
Joe Inglett (34)
Conor Jackson (30)
Reed Johnson (35)
Austin Kearns (32)
Ryan Ludwick (33)
Jason Michaels (36)
Laynce Nix (31)
Juan Pierre (34)
Scott Podsednik (36)
Juan Rivera (33)
Matt Stairs (44)
Marcus Thames (35)
Josh Willingham (33)

Center fielders
Rick Ankiel (32)
Carlos Beltran (35)
Willie Bloomquist (34) - $1.1MM mutual option with a $150K buyout
Mike Cameron (39)
Coco Crisp (32)
David DeJesus (32)
Scott Hairston (32)
Andruw Jones (35)
Nate McLouth (30) - $10.65MM club option with a $1.25MM buyout
Corey Patterson (32)
Cody Ross (31)
Grady Sizemore (29) - $8.5MM club option with a $500K buyout

Right fielders
Bobby Abreu (38) - $9MM club option with a $1MM buyout; vests with 433 PAs in 2011
Lance Berkman (36)
Willie Bloomquist (34) - $1.1MM mutual option with a $150K buyout
Milton Bradley (34)
Michael Cuddyer (33)
David DeJesus (32)
J.D. Drew (36)
Jeff Francoeur (28) - $3MM mutual option
Kosuke Fukudome (35)
Willie Harris (34)
Brad Hawpe (33)
Jeremy Hermida (28)
Joe Inglett (34)
Austin Kearns (32)
Jason Kubel (29)
Ryan Ludwick (33)
Xavier Nady (33)
Magglio Ordonez (38)
Cody Ross (31)
Nick Swisher (31) - $10.25MM club option with a $1MM buyout
Josh Willingham (33)

Designated hitters
Milton Bradley (34)
Jack Cust (33)
Johnny Damon (37)
Jason Giambi (41)
Vladimir Guerrero (37)
Carlos Guillen (36)
David Ortiz (36)
Jason Kubel (29)
Hideki Matsui (38)
Jorge Posada (40)
Jim Thome (41)

Starting pitchers
Mark Buehrle (33)
Chris Carpenter (37) - $15MM club option with a $1MM buyout
Bruce Chen (35)
Bartolo Colon (39)
Aaron Cook (33) - $11MM mutual option with a $500K buyout
Kyle Davies (28)
Doug Davis (36)
Ryan Dempster (35) - $14MM player option, no buyout
Zach Duke (29) - $5.5MM club option with a $750K buyout
Jeff Francis (30)
Freddy Garcia (36)
Jon Garland (32) - $8MM club option with a $500K buyout; vests with 190 IP
Aaron Harang (34) - $5MM mutual option with a $500K buyout
Rich Harden (30)
Livan Hernandez (37)
Edwin Jackson (28)
Kenshin Kawakami (37)
Scott Kazmir (28) - $13.5MM club option with a $2.5MM buyout
Hiroki Kuroda (37)
Rodrigo Lopez (36)
Paul Maholm (30) - $9.75MM club option with a $750K buyout
John Maine (31)
Jason Marquis (33)
Kevin Millwood (37)
Sergio Mitre (31)
Scott Olsen (28) - $4MM club option with a $100K buyout
Roy Oswalt (34) - $16MM mutual option with a $2MM buyout
Brad Penny (34)
Oliver Perez (30)
Joel Pineiro (33)
C.C. Sabathia (31) - may opt out of remaining four years, $92MM
Javier Vazquez (35)
Adam Wainwright (30) - $10MM vesting option for '12, $12MM for '13
Tim Wakefield (45)
Chien-Ming Wang (32)
Brandon Webb (33)
Dontrelle Willis (30)
C.J. Wilson (31)
Chris Young (33)

Closers
Heath Bell (34)
Jonathan Broxton (28)
Matt Capps (28)
Francisco Cordero (37) - $12MM club option with a $1MM buyout
Frank Francisco (32)
Brad Lidge (35) - $12.5MM club option with a $1.5MM buyout
Joe Nathan (37) - $12.5MM club option with a $2MM buyout
Jonathan Papelbon (31)
Jon Rauch (33) - $3.75MM club option with a $250K buyout
Francisco Rodriguez (30)
Rafael Soriano (32) - $11MM player option or a $1.5MM buyout
Jose Valverde (34) - $9MM club option, no buyout

Right-handed relievers
Danys Baez (34)
Miguel Batista (41)
Blaine Boyer (30)
Dave Bush (32)
Shawn Camp (36)
Clay Condrey (36)
Lance Cormier (31)
Juan Cruz (31)
Octavio Dotel (38) - $3.75MM club option with a $750K buyout
Kyle Farnsworth (36) - $3.3MM club option with a $650K buyout
Jason Frasor (34) - $3.75MM club option
LaTroy Hawkins (37)
Aaron Heilman (33)
Jason Isringhausen (39)
Scott Linebrink (35)
Ryan Madson (31)
Guillermo Mota (38)
Micah Owings (29)
Vicente Padilla (34)
Joel Peralta (36)
Mark Prior (31)
Chad Qualls (33) - $6MM club option with a $1.5MM buyout
Jon Rauch (33) - $3.75MM club option with a $250K buyout
Chris Ray (30)
Fernando Rodney (35)
Takashi Saito (42)
Jeff Suppan (37)
Koji Uehara (37) - vesting option
Dan Wheeler (34) - $3MM club option with no buyout; vests with 65 appearances in 2011
Kerry Wood (35)
Jamey Wright (37)
Michael Wuertz (33) - $3.25MM club option with a $250K buyout
Joel Zumaya (27)

Left-handed relievers
Tim Byrdak (38)
Randy Flores (36)
Mike Gonzalez (34)
John Grabow (33)
Mark Hendrickson (38)
Javier Lopez (34)
Ron Mahay (41)
Damaso Marte (37) - $4MM club option with a $250K buyout
Hideki Okajima (36) - can opt for free agency
Darren Oliver (41)
Dennys Reyes (35)
Arthur Rhodes (42) - $4MM club option with a $200K buyout; vests with 62 appearances in 2011
J.C. Romero (36)
George Sherrill (35)
Brian Tallet (34)

GADawg
08-02-2011, 09:51 PM
nothing to see here....I don't see the answers to the problems hiding in that list...imo

Captain Hook
08-02-2011, 10:08 PM
nothing to see here....I don't see the answers to the problems hiding in that list...imo

I'd be willing to bet that the Cardinals can find the answers to their problems somewhere in that list.Seems like it doesn't matter who they sign, the player seems to work out.

I agree though.No one jumps out at me as someone who could really make a difference although there are a few RP that could help.

Will M
08-02-2011, 10:16 PM
the team has the exact same issues facing them this offseason that have faced them since last year.

1) I think the Reds are going to have to spend money better. Arroyo's contract for 2012/2013 & Rolen's contract for 2012 may be money flushed down the toilet.

2) I think the Reds are going to have to up payroll a bit. This year if the payroll was $10M higher we could have had Haren, Greinke or Marcum. Yet we were not players when these guys were on the market because of salary issues.

3) IMO Chapman needs to start being stretched out NOW if he is going to be in the rotation in the future. if the team decides to keep him in the pen this year then i'd make him the closer for 2012 & beyond.

4) I'm not going to get too excited about the team getting a TOR starter or a cleanup hitter until they actually do. burn me 3 times (2010 trade deadline, 2010-2011 off season and 2011 trade deadline) shame on me.

5) one bright note is that Pujols & Fielder are likely out of the division after this year. however, teams like Philadelphia & San Francisco are starting to look like the Yankees & Red Sox. By that I mean teams that are not just trying to slip into the playoffs but are trying to build juggernauts that can win it all. it seems for years the talent level in baseball was tilted to the AL & now the balance is shifting (or at least not so off kilter)

PuffyPig
08-03-2011, 01:35 AM
I'd be willing to bet that the Cardinals can find the answers to their problems somewhere in that list.Seems like it doesn't matter who they sign, the player seems to work out.

I agree though.No one jumps out at me as someone who could really make a difference although there are a few RP that could help.

Thta's simply becoming an old wives tale, as the cards got guys like Theriot, Winn, Tallett, Miller, Feliz, Patterson etc over the last few years.

Their crap stinks too.

Slyder
08-03-2011, 02:33 AM
My 2012 Cincinnati Reds:

Catchers (2)
Devin Mesoraco
Ryan Hanigan

Pretty much everyone should expect this duo. The interesting thing will be if Yasmani Grandal blows up spring training.

Infield:
Yonder Alonso/Joey Votto
Miguel Cairo
Zack Cozart
Scott Rolen
Jimmy Rollins
Todd Frazier/Chris Valaika

I fully expect 1 of Votto/Alonso to be traded during the winter. The Other will be starting 1b. I am not as big a fan of Francisco as many here, I would let him play fall ball somewhere in hopes that a gm will "fall in love" with him or polish him up to be a 2nd piece for a major deal. I think Rollins could have the same type of impact that OCab had for this team at shortstop. Valaika, Cozart, and Frazier are allowed to compete for 2b.

Outfield:
Drew Stubbs
Jay Bruce
Jose Batista/Colby Rasmus
Dave Sappelt
Chris Heisey

Depending on which one gets traded will be the LF.

Rotation:
Johnny Cueto
Mike Leake
Aroldis Chapman
Homer Bailey
Bronson Arroyo

If Shields is acquired he, Chapman, Cueto, and Leake compete for 1.

Bullpen
Nick Masset
Bill Bray
Sam LeCure/Matt Maloney
Logan Ondrusek

I leave room to try and find another Arthur Rhodes type veteran presence to help the elevation of guys with the departure of Chapman to the rotation and Coco to another team.

Guacarock
08-03-2011, 03:24 AM
OK, here's my early-bird stab at what a decent Reds' roster might look like in 2012. I'm conjuring up two trades as part of the mix, with the Rays and the Royals. Perhaps we end up dealing with the Twins, Orioles, A's, Blue Jays or other prospect-hungry teams instead, so the names of the players involved could change, but I don't see the dynamics being significantly different, budget-wise.

C
Mesoraco
Hanigan

INF
Votto
Phillips
Cozart
Rolen
Brignac
Francisco/Frazier/Stewart

OF
Bruce
Sappelt
Melky Cabrera
Heisey
Hermida/Lewis

SP
Cueto
Shields
Leake
Bailey
Arroyo

Relievers
Lecure -- Long Man
Ondrusek, Arredondo, Boxberger, Burton, Horst -- Middle Relief
Masset, Bray -- Setup
Chapman -- Closer

Trades

Alonso, Stubbs and Janish to Rays for Shields, Brignac
Volquez and Cairo to Royals for Melky Cabrera and LHP prospect (they have quite a few, mostly starters at different stages of development)

Free-agent signings

3B Ian Stewart, whose arb is likely to be declined this off-season by the Rockies

SP Dontrelle Willis, if we're at all worried about Arroyo's health and losing Volquez

Possibly a reliever, especially if we decline arb for Burton or just want extra insurance/coverage

Rationale for trades

Rays have highly coveted SP in their pipeline, but could use cheap, high-voltage positional players at 1B (Alonso) and in the OF (Stubbs, if they let Upton go). We need a reliable, affordable and TOR arm (Shields). Brignac and Janish are both MI prospects who have lost their starting gigs. A switch in leagues/uniforms/scenery might help them find a new groove.

Royals' Cabrera gives us CF coverage if Sappelt can't step up and fill Stubbs' shoes. Cabrera will get an arb raise in 2012, but still probably receive less than $2.5 million, so we can afford him. If Sappelt does just fine, Cabrera can move to LF and compete with Heisey for the starting gig there. Royals get Volquez from us, a SP with plus-stuff but issues we probably aren't inclined to address any longer. They could make out like bandits with this deal, but we can't obsess about shipping off Hamilton to acquire Volquez, knowing that begat us only Cabrera. If we spin the roulette wheel correctly and snag the right lower-level LHP prospect from the Royals, we could end up alright a few years down the line. Finally, Cairo gives the Royals a replacement for Betemit. I would miss Miggy (he's been very, very good for us), but he's 38, and we need his roster spot to audition Rolen's replacements.

Which brings us to Frazier, Francisco and free-agent signee Stewart. All have warts but all are young, with some power, and probably just enough defensive chops to handle the hot corner. Let them all compete next spring to be Scott Rolen's understudy and successor. May the best man win. If the best man proves inadequate over 2012, we go to option C, D, E, or trolling again for 2013.

Would this scenario fill all of our gaps? No. We still wouldn't have a clearcut, cleanup batter to sandwich between Votto and Bruce, and we might need to ask Phillips to continue to handle that role if Bruce doesn't take a step forward. But if we followed this course we would improve by having:

* A few great lead-off candidates (Sappelt, Cabrera, Cozart), any one or two of which might surpass Stubbs' OBP, if not his speed or power.
* We would have a steady, TOR-caliber, innings-eater horse in Shields to join our rotation.
* We would retain a budget within $5 million of this year's.
* And we would still keep in the fold several battle-ready prospects to help us fill critical positions in the event of injury or performance issues, including Wood (SP), Grandal (C), and the IF-OF guys who lost out in the competition among Francisco, Frazier, Stewart to caddy for Rolen.

Makes some sense to me, but that's now, and it is still real early in the game. Better options might emerge this winter, and that's OK if we veer and adapt to the opportunities as they emerge. But not OK if we go another winter acting like we don't need a true leadoff man, or some better LH sticks, or a stronger and more dependable rotation.

GAC
08-03-2011, 05:08 AM
Losing Fielder after this season is gonna put a chink in the Brewer's armor. And I wouldn't count the Pirates out in 2012.

We've had a down (and puzzling) year. But I still like this team and the potential they show for the future with many of our young players.