PDA

View Full Version : 2012 team



R_Webb18
08-06-2011, 10:15 PM
I'd try to do the votto/bautista trade
also id try to move stubbs if ppl think dave s can do the job. (no clue on this guy but he seems to be a better hitter than stubbs)

my batting order

dave s
brandon p
bautista
alonzo
bruce/devin m
devin m/bruce
rolen/fransico
cozart

how do ppl feel with this lineup? to me it seems legit

Red Raindog
08-06-2011, 10:26 PM
I'd try to do the votto/bautista trade
also id try to move stubbs if ppl think dave s can do the job. (no clue on this guy but he seems to be a better hitter than stubbs)

my batting order

dave s
brandon p
bautista
alonzo
bruce/devin m
devin m/bruce
rolen/fransico
cozart

how do ppl feel with this lineup? to me it seems legit

puts a lot of faith & pressure on very young guys -- Alonso - Mesocaro & Bruce (who has had chances)

will still need a pitching staff & a manager that is not sleep walking

R_Webb18
08-06-2011, 10:29 PM
puts a lot of faith & pressure on very young guys -- Alonso - Mesocaro & Bruce (who has had chances)

will still need a pitching staff & a manager that is not sleep walking

true true but i just think its dumb signing old guys that cant play

Vottomatic
08-07-2011, 10:56 AM
I'd try to do the votto/bautista trade
also id try to move stubbs if ppl think dave s can do the job. (no clue on this guy but he seems to be a better hitter than stubbs)

my batting order

dave s
brandon p
bautista
alonzo
bruce/devin m
devin m/bruce
rolen/fransico
cozart

how do ppl feel with this lineup? to me it seems legit

Great minds think alike. I just posted nearly the same comment on the "Bad News Bears" thread. Except I hope Rolen retires.

I'd also trade Stubbs for pitching, which I stated on the other thread.

If the Reds weren't so small market and cheap, I'd be willing to trade Stubbs and Bruce to the Dodgers and try and get Kemp. Adding Kemp along with obtaining Bautista would make the Reds offense one of the most dangerous in the NL.

CF Sappelt
2B Phillips
1B Alonso
LF Bautista
RF Kemp
3B Francisco/Frazier
SS Cozart
C Hanigan/Mesoraco

Reds would have traded away Votto, Bruce, and Stubbs.........and rebuilt an entire new 3, 4, 5 part of the lineup and gone with Sappelt at leadoff in lieu of Stubbs. Quite a change, but I'd do it if the Reds had the $$$ to do it. It adds 5 players to the lineup at league minimum in Sappelt, Alonso, Francisco/Frazier, Cozart, and Mesoraco.

Improve the starting pitching and that lineup makes the postseason. No doubt about it.

CrosleyField
08-08-2011, 07:39 PM
Realistically

Sappelt 7
Cozart 6
Votto 3
Phillips 4
Bruce 9
Frazier 5
Stubbs 8
Hanigan/Mes 2

Spider Tre
08-08-2011, 08:26 PM
oops. wrong thread. nevermind

SidneySlicker
08-08-2011, 09:29 PM
I'd only trade Votto if they if they bring in another big bat AND you resign Brandon Phillips. In which case I'd do whatever it takes to bring in Matt Kemp in left. I'm guessing Stubbs would be part of that deal.

Sappelt cf
Phillips 2nd
Kemp lf
Bautista 3rd
Alonso 1rst
Bruce rf
Cozart ss
Mez c
P

Cincy10
08-08-2011, 10:35 PM
Not exactly what i would personally put out there, but realistically i think it will look along the lines of:

Sappelt LF
Phillips 2B
Votto 1B
Rolen 3B
Bruce RF
Mesoraco C
Cozart SS
Stubbs CF

R_Webb18
08-08-2011, 10:38 PM
Realistically

Sappelt 7
Cozart 6
Votto 3
Phillips 4
Bruce 9
Frazier 5
Stubbs 8
Hanigan/Mes 2

R_Webb18
08-08-2011, 10:39 PM
Realistically

Sappelt 7
Cozart 6
Votto 3
Phillips 4
Bruce 9
Frazier 5
Stubbs 8
Hanigan/Mes 2

ive never seen mes play but if he's such a good hitter why would he bat 8th?

mckbearcat48
08-08-2011, 10:43 PM
Doesn't every Dusty order have to have CF/SS as the top 2 spots?

R_Webb18
08-08-2011, 10:46 PM
Doesn't every Dusty order have to have CF/SS as the top 2 spots?

it does but does not mean it has to

wabashfalcon
08-08-2011, 10:57 PM
I don't think Castilini lets Votto get traded. He is the Reds' first homegrown Superstar since Larkin... and the first since Junior. He stays in Cincy... and Castilini will open up the pocketbook to keep him once the contract expires.

That being said, here is how I see the lineup next year:

1. Stubbs CF: I think he finally puts it all together and can bat leadoff.
2. Cozart/Janish SS
3. Votto 1B
4. Phillips 2B
5. Bruce RF
6. Yonder/Sappelt LF
7. Rolen/Frazier 3B
8. Hanny/Puxatonany Mes

Rotation:

1. Cueto
2. Leake
3. Homer
4. Arroyo
5. (Chapman), Willis, Wood, LeCure.

Pen:

Closer: Billy Bray/Chappy
Masset
Logan
Horst
Lecure/Maloney
Boxberger

Vottomatic
08-08-2011, 11:01 PM
I don't think Castilini lets Votto get traded. He is the Reds' first homegrown Superstar since Larkin... and the first since Junior. He stays in Cincy... and Castilini will open up the pocketbook to keep him once the contract expires.

That being said, here is how I see the lineup next year:

1. Stubbs CF: I think he finally puts it all together and can bat leadoff.
2. Cozart/Janish SS
3. Votto 1B
4. Phillips 2B
5. Bruce RF
6. Yonder/Sappelt LF
7. Rolen/Frazier 3B
8. Hanny/Puxatonany Mes

Rotation:

1. Cueto
2. Leake
3. Homer
4. Arroyo
5. (Chapman), Willis, Wood, LeCure.

Pen:

Closer: Billy Bray/Chappy
Masset
Logan
Horst
Lecure/Maloney
Boxberger

In other words, 2012 is going to look like 2011. Yikes.

If Phillips is batting cleanup again, kiss next season goodbye.

R_Webb18
08-08-2011, 11:08 PM
In other words, 2012 is going to look like 2011. Yikes.

If Phillips is batting cleanup again, kiss next season goodbye.

no way bp bats 4th

CrosleyField
08-09-2011, 07:31 AM
Yonder will be traded in the off season. Probably Volquez too.

FireDusty
08-09-2011, 08:49 AM
I'd try to do the votto/bautista trade
also id try to move stubbs if ppl think dave s can do the job. (no clue on this guy but he seems to be a better hitter than stubbs)

my batting order

dave s
brandon p
bautista
alonzo
bruce/devin m
devin m/bruce
rolen/fransico
cozart

how do ppl feel with this lineup? to me it seems legit
We win with that lineup.

Maybe we could pry David Wright away from the Mets for Stubbs and Bailey.

Red Rover
08-09-2011, 11:11 AM
I agree changes need to be made to the 2012 Reds, but pitching is where you start. The Reds have quality depth in position players, but no depth at pitching worth anything.

DGullett35
08-09-2011, 12:34 PM
I'd like to see if they can get the deal done for Sheilds. I agree that pitching esp. starting pitching is where they need to start. Frazier looks servicable at third and i hope and pray that Sappelt gets to play every day in left and hit leadoff. heisey would be a good option as the 4th outfielder but i say try and trade him and/or Stubbs for a good right handed bat to put in the middle of the lineup. I also think that they may have to trade Alonso unless for some god-awful reason Votto gets dealt

*Pitching*
Cueto/Sheilds
Cueto/Sheilds
Bailey
Leake
Arroyo- I hate that hes gonna have to be in the rotation but we gave him too much money not to and i dont see this team resigning Willis

I dont know about the order however-

1b-Votto
2nd-Phillips
SS-Cozart
3rd-Frazier
C-Hannigan-Mes
LF-Sappelt
CF-Stubbs(unless traded)
RF-Bruce

The bullpen looks to possibly be the same as this year but with CoCo leaving. I am one to think that Chapman would be better off as a closer than a starter. He can come in for his one inning and just throw as hard as he can since he seems to like that radar gun

We need a right handed bat that has some pop to put in the middle of the order. That and getting a starting pitcher(Sheilds) has to be on the list of priorities for next season

faffy42
08-09-2011, 04:55 PM
1. Cozart
2. Phillips
3. Votto
4. Alonso (3b)
5. Heisey (c)
6. Hanigan/Mesorasco
7. Sappelt (lf)
8. Bruce (rf)

I see frazier coming in as utility guy for infielders. Lewis/stubbs are utility guys for outfield.
Hanigan will produce better, he's a good contact hitter.
Alonso and heisey could swap depending on success.
Stubbs we keep as a replacement specialist late in a game for a baserunner or defense in close games. He Ks too much too start in the lineup.
I barely could muster bruces bat and lackluster defense in the line up, but he's got a fat contract, so he will play everyday. I don't think he's going to amount to much, and will hurt us more than help imo.

Vottomatic
08-10-2011, 12:50 AM
Alot of players within the organization to consider this offseason. What to do with this guy or that guy.

Starting pitching:
Arroyo
Cueto
Leake
Bailey
Willis?
Wood
Volquez
Chapman?
Maloney

Do they upgrade the starting pitching? Can they acquire something better than what they got?

Bullpen:
Bray
Ondrusek
Masset
Lecure
Arredondo
Boxberger
J. Smith
Fisher
Chapman???? (bullpen or developing starter in Louisville?)

Or do they go to free agency or trade to bolster this group?

Infield:
Do they pick up Phillips option? I say yes. If the team implodes again next year, they can trade him at the deadline if they haven't signed him to a multi-year contract.

Keep or trade Votto? If it brings more quality pieces, I'd consider it.

Is Cozart the answer at SS? I hope they give him a legit shot at it.

Third Base: How effective with Rolen be if he returns (which is likely)? Platoon him? I say yes, even if they are paying him a boatload. Frazier? Francisco?

Utility: Cairo has one more year on his contract and has proven his worth the past 2 seasons. Keep him.

Outfield:
I'd like to see Sappelt leading off next year. I hope they give him a chance.

Bruce and Stubbs frustrate me. I'm willing to trade them this offseason but don't expect it to happen. I can see Stubbs more than Bruce.

Extra outfielder: Heisey and ????. It wouldn't surprise me to see Frazier make the team since he can play multiple positions like Hairston, Jr. could. But Frazier is cheap.

Where does Alonso fit into next year's plans?

My gut feeling is that Votto and Stubbs will be traded this offseason, and possibly one or two of our young starting pitchers, to strengthen the lineup and starting pitching:

CF Sappelt
2B Phillips
1B Alonso
LF Bautista
RF Bruce
3B Rolen/Frazier/Francisco
SS Cozart
C Hanigan/Mesoraco

Manager: Will Dusty be replaced? I think he will.

bshall2105
08-10-2011, 12:53 AM
ive never seen mes play but if he's such a good hitter why would he bat 8th?

assuming Dusty is the manager he has to

Vottomatic
08-27-2011, 12:58 PM
Kind of changing my mind as the season goes on.

They can't move Arroyo because of his salary and this year's poor season. Cueto is the ace. And Leake has asserted himself pretty well. I wish they had money to sign Dontrelle as the 5th starter. I really do.

Then I'd like to package some players for James Shields.

Cueto
Shields
Leake
Arroyo
Willis

I could live with that. Package Bailey, Wood, and Volquez in different trades to improve the team.

I wish they would make Chapman a starter in Louisville, but I see them making him the closer. He should be closing the last month of the season to prepare him for it, if they're going to use him this way next season.

We really need a 4-hole hitter. Wish they could acquire Matt Kemp. But money is becoming a problem with this roster I'm creating.

Makes me wonder if they'll keep BP.

webbbj
08-27-2011, 03:40 PM
finding a spot where alonso can play everyday would be a nice start and firing dusty.

nux fan
08-27-2011, 05:34 PM
arroyo willis leake bailey all question marks
masset, chapman closer question marks

ss , 3b lf cf all question marks

Roush's socks
08-27-2011, 11:28 PM
First look at the reasons this year's team failed. Pitching- Volquez , Wood and Arroyo were the starters who blew a lot of games. In the pen, Massett has been less than stellar. Chapman remains an enigma.
Hitting- Janish was worthless. Rolen was a big let down, but could maybe return to form if his surgery was a success. Stubbs has been less than league average OPS, and has more SO's than Dave Kingman.

In the starting rotation there are a lot of ????'s even though they have been pretty good since the Allstar break. Bailey is stil linconsistent.

All in all if was the Reds GM I would try to trade Stubbs for pitching. Alonso could be part of a deal. They'll need someone to replace Dontrelle.

1b- Votto
2b-Phillips
ss- Cozart
3b= Rolen or Frazier/francisco if Rolen is done
C- Mesoraco/Hannigan
LF- new player
CF-Sappelt/Heisey/ someone else
RF-Bruce

SP- Cueto, Leake, Arroyo, Bailey and 1 new player. Wood is insurance.

Will they sign a closer or use Ondrusek or Bray or Chapman?

WillRich
08-28-2011, 03:11 AM
Kind of changing my mind as the season goes on.

They can't move Arroyo because of his salary and this year's poor season. Cueto is the ace. And Leake has asserted himself pretty well. I wish they had money to sign Dontrelle as the 5th starter. I really do.

Then I'd like to package some players for James Shields.

Cueto
Shields
Leake
Arroyo
Willis

I could live with that. Package Bailey, Wood, and Volquez in different trades to improve the team.

I wish they would make Chapman a starter in Louisville, but I see them making him the closer. He should be closing the last month of the season to prepare him for it, if they're going to use him this way next season.

We really need a 4-hole hitter. Wish they could acquire Matt Kemp. But money is becoming a problem with this roster I'm creating.

Makes me wonder if they'll keep BP.

If Dontrelle Willis is your fifth starter. Don't plan to see the Reds in October

Vottomatic
08-28-2011, 03:28 AM
If Dontrelle Willis is your fifth starter. Don't plan to see the Reds in October

Yeah because Bailey's 4.44 e.r.a., Arroyo's 5.02 e.r.a., Wood's 5.02 e.r.a., and Volquez's 5.93 e.r.a. are so much better than Willis' 4.10 e.r.a.

:rolleyes:

Oh yeah, and so many 5th starters are dominant these days.

WillRich
08-28-2011, 03:48 AM
Yeah because Bailey's 4.44 e.r.a., Arroyo's 5.02 e.r.a., Wood's 5.02 e.r.a., and Volquez's 5.93 e.r.a. are so much better than Willis' 4.10 e.r.a.

:rolleyes:

Oh yeah, and so many 5th starters are dominant these days.

Well I'll take my chances on a 25 year old pitcher who was our best pitcher at one point this season, a pitcher that has had mono all year and will probably return next year healthy and much improved (cough8.0 IP 0 ER 1K last gamecough), a 24 year old southpaw who if I'm not mistaken had a near prfect game against the Phillies a year ago, and a rehabbing, former 17 game winner. Over a 30 year old pitcher who couldn't make a ML team a year ago. And teams that make the playoffs usually have good pitchers all around.
5th starters from playoff/1st place teams:
Erik Beard, Doug Fister, Derek Holland, Vance Worley, Chris Narveson, Ryan Vogelsong.
If I had my choice of all of those or Dontrelle Willis. Willis would be at the bottom of the totem pole

Vottomatic
08-28-2011, 10:32 AM
Well I'll take my chances on a 25 year old pitcher who was our best pitcher at one point this season, a pitcher that has had mono all year and will probably return next year healthy and much improved (cough8.0 IP 0 ER 1K last gamecough), a 24 year old southpaw who if I'm not mistaken had a near prfect game against the Phillies a year ago, and a rehabbing, former 17 game winner. Over a 30 year old pitcher who couldn't make a ML team a year ago. And teams that make the playoffs usually have good pitchers all around.
5th starters from playoff/1st place teams:
Erik Beard, Doug Fister, Derek Holland, Vance Worley, Chris Narveson, Ryan Vogelsong.
If I had my choice of all of those or Dontrelle Willis. Willis would be at the bottom of the totem pole

You sould like Walt Jocketty. No wonder this team was in 4th place at one time and will finish out of the playoffs.

WillRich
08-28-2011, 03:45 PM
You sould like Walt Jocketty. No wonder this team was in 4th place at one time and will finish out of the playoffs.

No wonder we made the playoffs for the first time in 15 years last year. This year was just the Brewers year this is practically the same team as last year, that talent is in there, it has to be. I will agree with you on the fact that we need to try and get James Shields that would be a great move for this ball club to get a pitcher like him would make a huge difference on this team. I would also like to see them go get a big bat for the line-up although I feel like Yonder could really make a big difference if someone could get his left field defense to a major league level. Third base is also a concern for me, I just dont have faith in Rolen like I used to and I really feel like his time in Cincinnati should be over.