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View Full Version : Harang says extra-inning game in '08 did him in



Blitz Dorsey
08-12-2011, 07:19 PM
Hal McCoy piece:

http://www.daytondailynews.com/blogs/content/shared-gen/blogs/dayton/cincinnatireds/entries/2011/08/12/harang_says_relief_appearance.html

edabbs44
08-12-2011, 07:24 PM
Whatever Aaron. Thanks for being a Cincinnati Red all those years, but flexing those Petco muscles now is pretty transparent.

LvJ
08-12-2011, 07:30 PM
Whatever Aaron. Thanks for being a Cincinnati Red all those years, but flexing those Petco muscles now is pretty transparent. Why the tude?


Then he said, carefully, ďMaybe it did, and I donít point the finger at all, even though people blame Dusty Baker. I donít blame Dusty at all. Iím a grown man and I volunteered to come into that game in relief. Being the competitor that I am I didnít turn him down to when he asked if I could make a start four days later when I probably should have waited a few more days. Josh Fogg was there at the time and they could have flipped him into my spot.Ē

He isn't blaming anyone but himself. Why is that wrong?

Blitz Dorsey
08-12-2011, 07:34 PM
Yeah, I'm not a big Harang fan, but he's definitely a class act. No animosity towards him at all.

edabbs44
08-12-2011, 07:35 PM
Its not the blame, it's the Acting like the magic is back when he is likely the same guy who left Cincy.

Blitz Dorsey
08-12-2011, 07:36 PM
I'm sorry ... can a mod please change the thread title? I meant to say '08 not '07.

Blitz Dorsey
08-12-2011, 07:37 PM
Its not the blame, it's the Acting like the magic is back when he is likely the same guy who left Cincy.

Yeah, his ERA and WHIP are not impressive at all. He's also giving up a ton of hits. Only his W-L record is impressive and everyone knows that's largely based on luck.

Going from GABP to Petco must feel like going from a Little League field to Yellowstone National Park.

Mario-Rijo
08-12-2011, 07:37 PM
It did do him in and alot of us knew it already. It was as plain as the nose on his face. And although I appreciate his stance that it wasn't Dusty's fault it was Dusty's fault IMO because he knew Aaron wouldn't say no and Dusty should have just refused to consider letting him come back and make that start so soon after the relief appearance.

And yes I believe his resurgence has alot to do with being in the most spacious division in baseball. It was a no brainer fit for lots of reasons.

Blitz Dorsey
08-12-2011, 07:40 PM
It did do him in and alot of us knew it already. It was as plain as the nose on his face. And although I appreciate his stance that it wasn't Dusty's fault it was Dusty's fault IMO because he knew Aaron wouldn't say no and Dusty should have just refused to consider letting him come back and make that start so soon after the relief appearance.

Yep, we talked about it plenty on here, but it was interesting to hear Harang talk about it for the first time. (That I know of.) Glad Hal was able to pull the honesty out of him, because it's obviously a touchy subject for Aaron.

And I agree ... it was totally Dusty's fault. Of course most professional athletes are going to be uber-competitive (even someone who doesn't show much emotion like Harang) and they are going to say "Yeah, Skip, give me the ball."

The manager needs to be the one to understand that he can't rely on what his players tell him all the time. He needs to use something called common sense as well. I think it's great that Harang had the "give me the ball" attitude and wasn't going to pass up any chance to pitch. I also think it's extremely classy he's not blaming Dusty. But that one was all on Dusty. And I am no Dusty basher as evidenced by my posts.

fearofpopvol1
08-12-2011, 08:09 PM
Its not the blame, it's the Acting like the magic is back when he is likely the same guy who left Cincy.

He was about as classy as he could be without being dishonest. What's wrong with that?

:beerme: to Harang

edabbs44
08-12-2011, 08:24 PM
I have no hatred towards Aaron at all, but I dont believe the premise which then casts doubt over the rest. If he believes that the SD game screwed with his mechanics and now he believes that his mechanics are back without mentioning Petco as a contributor, should we believe that te SD game was really the culprit?

RedsManRick
08-12-2011, 09:45 PM
I still blame Dusty and Dick Pole. Players are groomed to say yes. The ones who say 'no' have their manhood questioned and get run out of town. That's not just the Reds and not just baseball. That's sports. Especially at the professional level but really all the way down.

A large part of the coaching staff's job is to put the players in a position to succeed and to keep them healthy in the process. They didn't do that. Could Harang have said no? Of course. But he shouldn't have had to.

LvJ
08-12-2011, 09:47 PM
I have no hatred towards Aaron at all, but I dont believe the premise which then casts doubt over the rest. If he believes that the SD game screwed with his mechanics and now he believes that his mechanics are back without mentioning Petco as a contributor, should we believe that te SD game was really the culprit?

He is pitching like he basically did in Cincinnati before last year. So he feels like he is back to normal. I don't think you'll find many players saying "Yeah, I still suck but good thing I pitch in San Diego!" :laugh:

I think Aaron is a real class act and does a lot of good and nothing he said in that piece is in any way bad.

mbgrayson
08-12-2011, 11:44 PM
I think Aaron has handled this as well as possible. He won't ever be a league leader in Ks or ERA, but he's still an Ace to me!

traderumor
08-12-2011, 11:44 PM
I still blame Dusty and Dick Pole. Players are groomed to say yes. The ones who say 'no' have their manhood questioned and get run out of town. That's not just the Reds and not just baseball. That's sports. Especially at the professional level but really all the way down.

A large part of the coaching staff's job is to put the players in a position to succeed and to keep them healthy in the process. They didn't do that. Could Harang have said no? Of course. But he shouldn't have had to.I'm not sure that is true. Arroyo has been quoted several times as saying "I'm done," and I don't recall any negative comments thrown his way for that.

But is this recycled? I thought this was "revealed" by Hal earlier in the season.

Phhhl
08-13-2011, 12:12 AM
What Aaron is talking about is exactly the way I felt about it when it was unfolding, despite so many that denied and excused what happened. It does not surprise me in the least that he confirms it now, and I am actually glad he did. Dusty seems to have finally relented on his historic abuse of starting pitchers. But, look at what it has cost?

WVRedsFan
08-13-2011, 12:51 AM
Why the tude?



He isn't blaming anyone but himself. Why is that wrong?

If you've watched Aaron this year (and I have several of his games), you'll see the old Harang. Aaron will always be a fly ball pitcher and GABP was part of his problem, but a bigger problem was his mechanics. After the debacle in San Diego, Aaron was a different pitcher. It was discussed ad nauseum in these pages, and AH was right. He was never the same after that. Why? Panic. He had problems and way trying everything to get back, as he admitted. He was fighting for a high paying job and nothing was going right.

It wasn't Aaron's fault that he was offered what I thought was an unrealistic salary for what he was. He came from Oakland and was the shining star for the starting staff for a long time. One of the reasons that I despise long term contracts can be found in the story of Aaron Harang. But he gave back to his community and was a class act through it all. I wept when he came out of that last game and wept himself for not being able to do what his club needed him to do. He was and is a great fellow. Yes, if you look at what he's done in SD and what he's done on the road, the results are strikingly different, butit's just the kind of pitcher he is. He is a good pitcher again because the Padres know how to use him. He's on occasion pitched only 5 innings and got the win because someone realized he was out of gas. Never mind that this is possible in Cincinnati. He has his command back and his mechanics are so much better now. Bravo.

He's one of my favorite Reds of all time because he came at a time when no one could pitch, soldiered on and had success with no chance of any glory from anyone. He didn't complain and was loyal to his adopted community. He is a class act. And I root for him eery start as long as it's not against the Reds.

Blitz Dorsey
08-13-2011, 01:27 AM
I think Aaron has handled this as well as possible. He won't ever be a league leader in Ks or ERA, but he's still an Ace to me!

Actually, he has been a league-leader in Ks. 2006 with the Reds. (216 Ks I believe.)

dougdirt
08-13-2011, 02:15 AM
But is this recycled? I thought this was "revealed" by Hal earlier in the season.
I know someone wrote about it. I thought it was Hal too.

RedLegSuperStar
08-13-2011, 08:05 AM
I actually commend Harang.. would you want Josh Fogg going in your spot?

lollipopcurve
08-13-2011, 08:34 AM
I still blame Dusty and Dick Pole. Players are groomed to say yes. The ones who say 'no' have their manhood questioned and get run out of town. That's not just the Reds and not just baseball. That's sports. Especially at the professional level but really all the way down.

A large part of the coaching staff's job is to put the players in a position to succeed and to keep them healthy in the process. They didn't do that. Could Harang have said no? Of course. But he shouldn't have had to.

Yep. It was the crisis-mode managing style of Baker that persists to this day, though tempered a bit.

edabbs44
08-13-2011, 08:43 AM
He is pitching like he basically did in Cincinnati before last year. So he feels like he is back to normal. I don't think you'll find many players saying "Yeah, I still suck but good thing I pitch in San Diego!" :laugh:

I think Aaron is a real class act and does a lot of good and nothing he said in that piece is in any way bad.

I'm not sure that he is pitching like he did in Cincy.

Chip R
08-13-2011, 04:48 PM
Anyone rember why Harang was available to pitch in that game? His performance - or lack thereof - after the relief outing wasn`t the first time he pitched poorly that year.