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klw
08-13-2011, 09:36 PM
I think the Reds surge we waited for most of the season is here. I was watching the highlight of Bruce's homer from last night and what struck me is that the team was into it. I realize they are 10 out and have shown no signs of life in an awful long time but I think we are seeing the start of the Reds move. It is probably too late but I think come mid September the Reds may be within a few games. Bruce's swing looks so easy and he is getting locked in. Votto is driving the ball. Nothing else seems to make sense as to why a move could be here but I think it is. Now I will check out the 30 post game thread and be brought back to reality. :beerme::beerme:

AtomicDumpling
08-14-2011, 12:12 AM
This is one of the few periods that the Reds have finally been able to both pitch well and hit well at the same time for multiple games in a row. Definitely makes the games more fun to watch. Could be the easier schedule this month. I will enjoy it while it lasts!

IslandRed
08-14-2011, 12:34 AM
Like you, I think it's too much to ask for them to really get back into it, but if we go on a run... well, the Brewers have won 15 of 17, they have to cool off sooner or later. Maybe we can get close enough to make them sweat that mid-September series a little bit, keep things interesting.

Roy Tucker
08-14-2011, 01:09 AM
I figured this would happen.

They'll make a run, get within 4-5 games, but like the girl with the curl, they'll break your heart.

Ghosts of 1990
08-14-2011, 01:09 AM
win 10 of the next 12.... and things will be a little more interesting.

5 games out sounds so good to me right now. Just get there Reds. I agree, they're going to go on a tear and no one will want to play them. They seem to do it this time of year.

AtomicDumpling
08-14-2011, 01:15 AM
I figured this would happen.

They'll make a run, get within 4-5 games, but like the girl with the curl, they'll break your heart.

... and then the front office will use the late-season run as an excuse to avoid upgrading the team in the offseason. Been there, done that. With the Reds and the Bengals both.

PuffyPig
08-14-2011, 02:13 AM
The Cards have scored 1 more run that us this year, and given up 1 less.

We maintain the 7th best run differential in the MLB, and trail the 6th place Cards by 2.

Captain Hook
08-14-2011, 02:35 AM
The Cards have scored 1 more run that us this year, and given up 1 less.

We maintain the 7th best run differential in the MLB, and trail the 6th place Cards by 2.

That's real nice and probably does indicate that the talent on this Reds team isn't as bad as many here act like it is but it does't make those 10 games the Reds trail the Brewers by any less.

I do agree that the Reds will probably finish the season hot and end up a few games over .500 and it's even possible that the Reds could make the Brewers sweat a little.The truth is,it's completely on the Brewers now.If they play even close to .500 baseball the rest of the way there's no way the Reds catch them.

mbgrayson
08-14-2011, 03:17 AM
When you win four in a row, only pick up one game in the standings, and are still 10 games back, that is a sign you are in trouble. But we have at least bypassed the Pirates....

757690
08-14-2011, 03:28 AM
I predict second place, 2 games back after game 162. Which to me is the the same as third place 10 games out.

GAC
08-14-2011, 05:09 AM
... and then the front office will use the late-season run as an excuse to avoid upgrading the team in the offseason. Been there, done that. With the Reds and the Bengals both.

You don't think some of the answers to this team's weaknesses can be found in the current crop of young players?

mth123
08-14-2011, 07:54 AM
You don't think some of the answers to this team's weaknesses can be found in the current crop of young players?

IMO, Sappelt can be a boon at the top of the order, Cozart will be an adequate answer at SS and Mesoraco will allow the team to save some bucks by replacing Hernandez without a huge drop (and some improvement since he'll probably take some ABs from Hanigan) but the two main things that this team needs are a solid, dependable starter who has the ability to pitch competitively against good line-ups (like you would see in the post season) and a middle of the order run producer who can play a positon that isn't already taken (Mesoraco may be this in a couple of years but he won't be in 2012 IMO). Those things don't exist in this next wave of players. Moves have got to be made and it probably means opening a spot in the OF for the bat. If Sappelt and Bruce fill two of those OF spots....

... Stubbs along with Alonso, Grandal and at least one of Volquez/Wood/Bailey should be made available. A number of lesser lights on the roster or in the minor leagues should all be available to complete a package or two.

mth123
08-14-2011, 08:08 AM
As far as a miracle for 2011 goes, the Reds have won 4 in a row and haven't gained any ground. Stick a fork in 2011. The last homestand of the year before the kids are in school ends today. Attendance will tank anyway with the kiddies back in school. Time to end the shell game being played on the fans and deal off Ramon and Cordero if possible for whatever can be had and move Mesoraco and Chapman into their probable roles for 2012.

Eric_the_Red
08-14-2011, 09:40 AM
I agree that the Reds aren't catching the Brewers this year, but how nice would it be to pass the Cards and leave LaRussa sitting in third? Division champs in 2010 and 2nd place in 2011 is nothing to sneeze at, especially given the injuries the team has faced this year.

BCubb2003
08-14-2011, 10:04 AM
The Cards have scored 1 more run that us this year, and given up 1 less.

We maintain the 7th best run differential in the MLB, and trail the 6th place Cards by 2.

Are the Reds closing in on some kind of anti-Pythagorean record? The gap seems drastic.

PuffyPig
08-14-2011, 10:18 AM
I predict second place, 2 games back after game 162. Which to me is the the same as third place 10 games out.

The difference is how good your team actually is.

The closer you finish to first, the more likely you hit first next year.

redsmetz
08-14-2011, 10:31 AM
Like you, I think it's too much to ask for them to really get back into it, but if we go on a run... well, the Brewers have won 15 of 17, they have to cool off sooner or later. Maybe we can get close enough to make them sweat that mid-September series a little bit, keep things interesting.

This is what blew me away. I hadn't really looked at the standings in the previous week, knowing only that we'd dropped to 4th place. When I looked at the standings and saw we were 11 games out, I was blown away. It was only yesterday, watching a bit of the Brewers/Prates game when I heard they'd gone 14 for 16 prior to that. We stayed cold while they got red hot. That hurts a lot. I'd like to see us finish out the season very well, just to regain some respect following a mostly brutal season.

_Sir_Charles_
08-14-2011, 11:30 AM
IMO, Sappelt can be a boon at the top of the order, Cozart will be an adequate answer at SS and Mesoraco will allow the team to save some bucks by replacing Hernandez without a huge drop (and some improvement since he'll probably take some ABs from Hanigan) but the two main things that this team needs are a solid, dependable starter who has the ability to pitch competitively against good line-ups (like you would see in the post season) and a middle of the order run producer who can play a positon that isn't already taken (Mesoraco may be this in a couple of years but he won't be in 2012 IMO). Those things don't exist in this next wave of players. Moves have got to be made and it probably means opening a spot in the OF for the bat. If Sappelt and Bruce fill two of those OF spots....

... Stubbs along with Alonso, Grandal and at least one of Volquez/Wood/Bailey should be made available. A number of lesser lights on the roster or in the minor leagues should all be available to complete a package or two.

Or, that middle of the order bat could come from 3rd base. Rolen simply isn't cutting it since the first half of last year. Defensively, he's excellent...offensively...not close. And yes, I realize that it's a down year offensively for all 3B but that doesn't mean we have to accept it because others do.

IslandRed
08-14-2011, 12:35 PM
You don't think some of the answers to this team's weaknesses can be found in the current crop of young players?

Some. Not all.

The Reds have done pretty well in the talent collection and development areas lately, I think. We have good players, very good depth, and we're reasonably young -- we're not losing anyone we need to keep for at least one year (and only Phillips even then). But we need some reconfiguring aimed at turning a pretty strong Top 40 into a better, more cohesive Top 25. That's the offseason work to be done.

mth123
08-14-2011, 12:42 PM
Or, that middle of the order bat could come from 3rd base. Rolen simply isn't cutting it since the first half of last year. Defensively, he's excellent...offensively...not close. And yes, I realize that it's a down year offensively for all 3B but that doesn't mean we have to accept it because others do.

Its possible, I suppose, but I certainly wouldn't design the team counting on it. Rolen hurt his shoulder in 2005 and its gotten progressively worse. His recent surgery is the 4th he's had on it and he really hasn't been a middle of the order force, except for the 3 month hot streak in 2010, since it finally sidelined him in late 2006. I don't really expect this latest surgery to provide any miracles since the other three really didn't. I'd guess its more about helping Rolen be a little more normal off the field.

The Reds miss Rolen's glove when he isn't in there, but from an offensive standpoint, the Reds would probably be better off with a platoon of Frazier and Francisco at 3B in 2012. The Reds should plan on Rolen providing about 100 games of strong defense and production equal to a typical number 7 hitter and should look elsewhere to solidify the middle of the order.

Hap
08-14-2011, 01:36 PM
I predict second place, 2 games back after game 162.

In which case, I will personally contact Dusty Baker and continually remind him of the 1-0 loss in Pittsburgh when he could have allowed Mike Leake to bat for himself against a tiring starter with the bases loaded and one out in the top of the seventh, but he brought in an ice-cold Jay Bruce to pinch hit and the Pirates brought in a left-handed reliever and Bruce whiffed badly to kill the threat.

At least Leake would have put the ball into play and given his team a chance to score.

In my opinion, that was the beginning of the final nails in this season's proverbial coffin.

Roy Tucker
08-14-2011, 01:41 PM
Brewers are due to cool off.

The Reds will go on a tear here for a couple weeks. They'll gain some games and, like my lawn, there will be a fall resurgence and the brown grass will turn a little green. But it won't be a deep green lush growth like May-June. A little dry spell will set in and it will turn brown again.

Or maybe a miracle will happen. They do happen every 25-30 years. You never know. That's why I can't ever give up.

Sappelt needs to learn to take a pitch.

kaldaniels
08-14-2011, 01:49 PM
In which case, I will personally contact Dusty Baker and continually remind him of the 1-0 loss in Pittsburgh when he could have allowed Mike Leake to bat for himself against a tiring starter with the bases loaded and one out in the top of the seventh, but he brought in an ice-cold Jay Bruce to pinch hit and the Pirates brought in a left-handed reliever and Bruce whiffed badly to kill the threat.

At least Leake would have put the ball into play and given his team a chance to score.

In my opinion, that was the beginning of the final nails in this season's proverbial coffin.

If you could pick one game thats the one you are upset about? You are mad that Dusty brought our all-star OF into hit instead of a pitcher in an important situation?

Leake has struck out 15 of 41 at bats this season.

Bruce has struck out 40 of 117 at bats this season vs LHP.

I can do the math in my head and see that Bruce had a better shot of putting the ball in play.

VR
08-15-2011, 01:23 AM
Is it still here?

OldXOhio
08-17-2011, 09:15 AM
The Reds will go on a tear here for a couple weeks.


No they won't. This team is a combination of part mediocrity in the talent pool, part apathetic. There's a reason why it's now mid-August and we still haven't seen this big run Dusty's been waiting for.

klw
08-17-2011, 09:31 AM
I think the Reds surge we waited for most of the season is here.

Upon further review by the official in the box of further video, the standings now showing the Reds 12.5 back, Milwaukee's refusal to lose, and the end of the streak, I think I Taw a Putty Tat. Come on hot stove!

redsmetz
08-17-2011, 10:04 AM
Upon further review by the official in the box of further video, the standings now showing the Reds 12.5 back, Milwaukee's refusal to lose, and the end of the streak, I think I Taw a Putty Tat. Come on hot stove!

Barring a miracle on the magnitude of the parting of the Red Sea, no question this season is toast viz a viz and any hope of a post season appearance is, as they say, slim to none.

That said, there are games to play and hopefully some of them will be enjoyable. One never wishes for the "hot stove". Rogers Hornsby spoke true when he said, "People ask me what I do in winter when there's no baseball. I'll tell you what I do. I stare out the window and wait for spring." If I may be so bold, never forget that. A baseball game is still a joy even if it has no meaning in the standing, IMHO.

Roy Tucker
08-17-2011, 10:20 AM
No they won't. This team is a combination of part mediocrity in the talent pool, part apathetic. There's a reason why it's now mid-August and we still haven't seen this big run Dusty's been waiting for.

So I was wrong. Sue me for optimism.

Let's all join hands and jump off a cliff together.

mdccclxix
08-17-2011, 10:38 AM
With Alonso back in LF, the 2012 tinkering has begun. The players don't think their in it anymore as a result.

REDREAD
08-17-2011, 11:20 AM
I think this team is in pretty good shape for next year.
As others said, our run differential has been pretty good this year.

In addition, there's potential upside from:
Arroyo (getting healthy)
Rolen (shoulder cleaned out)
Bruce and Stubbs.. still upside
LF.. Gomes is now gone.. maybe a kid or someone outside the org.
SS.. full year of Cozart will definitely be better than Yawnish. (Janish)
Wood.. a darkhorse here.. we didn't get much out of him this year. Maybe this year is the true indicator of Wood's talent? Or maybe not?
Hopefully we have a full year of effective Chapman too.

Hopefully they add talent from outside the organization as well. I'd like to make a good run next year, as I think it's Phillips' last year.

Edskin
08-17-2011, 12:44 PM
I've stopped DVRing the games or going out of my way to watch, but last night was the first time the game was on, I had nothing else to do, it was the 7th inning, and I really had no interest. Not enjoyable at all. Chose to flip channels for awhile and watch the some of the reply of the Redskins game I'd already seen. Yes, replays of NFL preseason over live Reds. I'm stunned it came to that this year.

Normally I can convince myself there is SOME value in the remaining six weeks, but not this year. It actually makes it sting worse that Cueto is pitching so well; makes it seem all the more wasted.

No doubt the expectations burned me this year. First time in a decade I had and therefore I was "out there" to potentialu get stung by this team. Not the worst season the Reds have had in my lifetime, but it is the most frustrating and least enjoyable. I just really want it to end. Just being honest

Reds/Flyers Fan
08-17-2011, 02:59 PM
Last night at the Fox & Hound in Mason, the Western & Southern Open tennis tournament was on almost every one of the big screens. The Reds were relegated to one or two TVs and nobody was paying the slightest attention.

And on Friday night, TV ratings for the Bengals 34-3 pre-season loss to Detroit more than doubled the Reds' ratings for their exciting 5-3 win over San Diego.

People have definitely turned the page on the 2011 Reds and we're only in mid-August.

OldXOhio
08-17-2011, 03:17 PM
So I was wrong. Sue me for optimism.

Let's all join hands and jump off a cliff together.


A tad sensitive don't you think? I don't see how that was a shot at you....it was directed at the team. If you can't handle someone disagreeing with your thoughts, you might reconsider posting.

AtomicDumpling
08-17-2011, 03:20 PM
This is the time of year when we find out who the truest Reds fans are.

I will be the first to admit there are some stronger than me.

There are lots of good reasons to continue to watch the Reds after they are out of contention. You can still learn something about the team and the game everyday. Amazing feats will still happen occasionally. You can watch the stars on opposing teams. You can still follow the progress of your favorite players. Some fans don't require the thrill of victory to enjoy watching a game. The sights and sounds of a baseball game are still enjoyable even if the game is meaningless. Watching the Reds in the tough times makes the good times taste sweeter.

Edskin
08-17-2011, 03:43 PM
Are the sights and sounds of baseball still worth experiencing? Sure, baseball is great and we should embrace everyday we get to experience it. But in that case I'll go to the little league park and grab a hot dog and sit back and relax. When it comes to MLB, winning and losing absolutely matters to me and my sense of enjoyment takes a major hit when the Reds are out of contention. And again, this year is even a bit more unique because I expected August and September to be thrilling.