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View Full Version : Do you think the Reds will make a major offseason move or even two?



Vottomatic
08-30-2011, 08:42 AM
Just wondering if you think the Reds will stand pat, make minor moves (Hermida, Lewis, Renteria-type), or make a major move to upgrade the cleanup spot and possibly pitching?

I know overall payroll is an issue.

mroby85
08-30-2011, 08:59 AM
I think they will probably let Cordero go, and that will be about the extent of the offseason lol.

nux fan
08-30-2011, 10:40 AM
I think they will go huge in the off season and probably recall Carlos Fisher to get him ready for the next 19 inning game

texasdave
08-30-2011, 11:56 AM
I hear everyone, print media, fans, announcers talk about all the changes there will be over the winter. I have almost no hope that will happen. Who are they gonna move and who are they gonna get? Which positions are open? I think mostly cosmetic changes are made and, once again, they will rely on the young arms to get better. I don't expect any blockbusters, maybe a mid-level trade at most. Don't expect Shields, or Kemp or anything along those lines.
I WOULD LOVE TO BE WRONG. ECSTATIC EVEN.

C Hanigan/Mesoraco
1B Votto
2B Phillips
SS Cozart
3B Rolen
LF Heisey/Sappelt (This might be the one position to see somewhat of an upgrade)
CF Stubbs
RF Bruce

SP Cueto
SP Arroyo
SP Leake
SP Bailey
SP Willis (Would resigning the D-Train be considered a big move? If Willis moves on insert Wood/Volquez.)

CL Chapman
RP Ondrusek
RP Masset
RP Arredondo
RP Lecure
RP Bray
RP ????? (Boxberger, Burton, Horst, Wood, Volquez - probably stays inside the organization)

Hanigan/Mesoraco
Heisey/Sappelt
Cairo
Janish/Renteria
Alonso/Frazier/Francisco

I just don't see that many openings or that much money being available to upgrade. Until Castellini opens that wallet, I think it is pretty much what you see is what you get.

Roush's socks
08-30-2011, 12:35 PM
No one knows what offers will be available. I think Stubbs could be traded if some team wants him. He has been underwhelming this year but there could be teams out there that like his speed/defense/20 HR. The Reds could get maybe a good bullpen arm. Also, Stubbs, Wood and Alonso packaged together could maybe get a good startig pitcher from a team looking to rebuild.

The DARK
08-30-2011, 02:25 PM
I predict that a mid-level addition will be made, and Phillips will have his option picked up. I wouldn't expect a TOR guy like Shields, but a trade of one of our young backup third basemen (Frazier, Francisco, or Alonso if the price is right) and a rotation option (Volquez and Wood on the low side, Bailey on the high) would fetch either a TOR rental or an above-average left fielder. Wandy could be a target, and would be relatively cheap. If we want to make a signing, Furcal will be a free agent as well, in all likelihood. Not sure how LF shakes out, but if Alonso isn't a long-term option there, an upgrade needs to be made (sorry Sappelt, but you need to be seasoned as a 5th outfielder before you make the transition).

Stray
08-30-2011, 03:18 PM
To me we have two huge needs. Pitching and a bat behind Votto.

We can live with the other frustrations and still win a lot of games if we had to. Someone needs to be able to make opposing managers pay for pitching around Votto. Bruce isn't that guy, BP isn't that guy, and Scott Rolen....just no. And our bullpen needs some guys that can get people out. Third on my list would be a leadoff guy but I think BP could do a decent job if he had to.

At this point I'm kinda okay with our starting rotation.

texasdave
08-30-2011, 03:46 PM
A quick adding up of the salaries for 2012 left me in the neighborhood of 77 million. If the budget gets bumped to say 85 million there could be a big addition. (Assuming my salary assumptions were in the ballpark)

SpanishArmada
08-30-2011, 04:18 PM
I would try VERY hard to sign CJ Wilson. He's 31 and has pitched very well the last 2 seasons, his first two as a SP. I don't think his arm has been taxed, so he may just now be entering his prime. He's a lefty, he's pitched well in Texas, and he pitched well in the postseason. He's a legit TOR starter that would help us very much for the next few years. He may be a bit expensive, but it's a need.

Vottomatic
08-30-2011, 07:37 PM
The Reds won't trade for a Matt Kemp. BUT........if they did........

Votto bats .350, 35 HR's, 130 rbi just with a guy like that hitting behind him.
Kemp bats .310, 40 HR's (in GABP), 130 rbi, 40 SB's.

But unfortunately, it won't happen.

It's like doublemint gum. Double the fun with Joey being protected in the lineup.

drowg14
08-30-2011, 08:30 PM
The Reds won't trade for a Matt Kemp. BUT........if they did........

Votto bats .350, 35 HR's, 130 rbi just with a guy like that hitting behind him.
Kemp bats .310, 40 HR's (in GABP), 130 rbi, 40 SB's.

But unfortunately, it won't happen.

It's like doublemint gum. Double the fun with Joey being protected in the lineup.

Votto would indeed get better. .350 seems pretty high to me, but the big reach i see is 130 rbi. In order for Votto to knock runners in, the people in FRONT of him have to get on base.

FireDusty
08-30-2011, 08:36 PM
Trade Votto for a frontline starter. Insert Alonzo at 1b and watch him hit .300with 30 homeruns and 100 RBI.

Increase run differential and win total because you prevent 60 fewer runs with second top notch starter.

Votto will never be worth more than he will this offseason. Every second after this offseason that you hang onto him, the value drops.

Hondo
08-30-2011, 09:00 PM
Baker won't be fired because of the extension. But Walt should be Fired, or Bob C should sell to an Owner with the financial means to IMPROVE the Club. This team was on the brink last year and all it needed this year was a move to IMPROVE the ROSTER.

Walt did nothing, so it either falls on his shoulders or Bob Castellini for not making the financial commitment.

That is all.

nux fan
08-30-2011, 09:06 PM
i think they will sign renteria cairo and lewis to five year extensions each

texasdave
08-30-2011, 09:14 PM
Baker won't be fired because of the extension. But Walt should be Fired, or Bob C should sell to an Owner with the financial means to IMPROVE the Club. This team was on the brink last year and all it needed this year was a move to IMPROVE the ROSTER.

Walt did nothing, so it either falls on his shoulders or Bob Castellini for not making the financial commitment.

That is all.

Walt and/or Bob wasted this season. Flat out wasted it.

FireDusty
08-30-2011, 09:19 PM
Baker won't be fired because of the extension. But Walt should be Fired, or Bob C should sell to an Owner with the financial means to IMPROVE the Club. This team was on the brink last year and all it needed this year was a move to IMPROVE the ROSTER.

Walt did nothing, so it either falls on his shoulders or Bob Castellini for not making the financial commitment.

That is all.The Reds made major finacial commitments to numerous players.

You = wrong.

The talent is here. The leadership in the dugout is not.

webbbj
08-30-2011, 10:00 PM
i dont have the energy to discuss the reds tonite.

texasdave
08-30-2011, 10:03 PM
i dont have the energy to discuss the reds tonite.

The Reds didn't have the energy to play against the Phillies tonight.

40YrRedsFan
08-30-2011, 10:17 PM
The Reds need major upgrades in the bullpen, hitting, and a quality starter. The first two games against the Phils show we are not close to competing at their level. If Walt & Co. do little or nothing this winter, it will be another frustrating season next year. With it being uncertain if the Brewers will retain Fielder, we may have a chance at the division title, but it would be another quick postseason I fear.

Vottomatic
08-31-2011, 08:19 AM
I think as soon as the offseason hits, the Reds should make it known that every player on the roster is available for the right price. Then they shouldn't be aggressive and call any other teams, but sit back and see if any crazy offers come in, and consider them if they do. If everything is a lowball offer, sit tight.

You never know what some dumb GM of another team might be willing to do. Heck, the Nationals did that stupid Werth contract.

texasdave
08-31-2011, 08:43 AM
NVM.

DocRed
08-31-2011, 10:35 AM
The only type of trades this team will make will be similar to last year's....ala Renteria and Lewis, or basically trades that won't make one bit of difference.

nux fan
08-31-2011, 10:44 AM
i think they may get bold and activate jeremy horst

drowg14
08-31-2011, 11:34 AM
The Reds didn't have the energy to play against the Phillies tonight.

Hey, we are getting better. The reds got 2 whole hits off of Halladay tonight.

Vottomatic
08-31-2011, 11:53 AM
I hear long term contracts are in the works for Renteria and Lewis. Janish too.

webbbj
08-31-2011, 12:27 PM
i dont expect a big FA signing, at most someone to solidify the mid relief.

the big moves need to come via trade.

Krawhitham
08-31-2011, 02:34 PM
Alonso or Votto will be traded

And I really do not think Castellini has the balls to trade Votto

Krawhitham
08-31-2011, 02:35 PM
Baker won't be fired because of the extension. But Walt should be Fired, or Bob C should sell to an Owner with the financial means to IMPROVE the Club. This team was on the brink last year and all it needed this year was a move to IMPROVE the ROSTER.

Walt did nothing, so it either falls on his shoulders or Bob Castellini for not making the financial commitment.

That is all.

they spent like $150 million in the last off season

brm7675
08-31-2011, 02:36 PM
The Reds made major finacial commitments to numerous players.

You = wrong.

The talent is here. The leadership in the dugout is not.

Where is the talent at SS, 3rd, LF?

drowg14
08-31-2011, 02:41 PM
they spent like $150 million in the last off season

They did not spend $150 million. They agreed to $150 million worth of future investments going forward as far as 6 years. Big difference.

How much did the payroll increase from last year?

texasdave
08-31-2011, 02:46 PM
they spent like $150 million in the last off season

No, they didn't. That is not true. I wish people would stop saying that. Where is all that new talent that 150 million brought in? Oh, there is none. That's right. They were simply contract extensions. So instead of signing players year-by-year they signed them to long-term contracts. None of the money was spent. Bob's bank account isn't 150 million dollars lighter. He was going to have to pay that money either way, unless he expected Votto, Arroyo, Cueto, Bruce and Hanigan to play a year or two for free. In fact, the club probably saved money by doing it that way, reaching agreements on the extensions.

texasdave
08-31-2011, 03:10 PM
They did not spend $150 million. They agreed to $150 million worth of future investments going forward as far as 6 years. Big difference.

How much did the payroll increase from last year?

This is correct.

Tuff Nut
08-31-2011, 05:41 PM
I would try VERY hard to sign CJ Wilson. He's 31 and has pitched very well the last 2 seasons, his first two as a SP. I don't think his arm has been taxed, so he may just now be entering his prime. He's a lefty, he's pitched well in Texas, and he pitched well in the postseason. He's a legit TOR starter that would help us very much for the next few years. He may be a bit expensive, but it's a need.
This is a nice idea........Is he gonna be a FA or does he have to be aquired by trade? IF FreeAgent, yes sign him, IF trade...I'd offer Bailey + a low level talent, then go from there.

Tuff Nut
08-31-2011, 05:56 PM
Where is the talent at SS, 3rd, LF?
I have liked what I have seen from Cozart at SS, to be fine with him going forward. 3B...lets see if Dusty and Co. give Alonso more than a tease there. He was one growing up, and seems comfortable...gotta give the kid a chance. LF.........Heisey, Frazier and Sappelt.......something might could be done here, and IF I were to pick one to stay, it would be Frazier. He is a SUPER SUB. Can play everywhere, and does have a good stick. Still raw at the MLB level, but love his game.(wish we'd see/seen more of him at SS with Cozart on the DL)

Old NDN
09-01-2011, 09:11 AM
No.

jwmann2
09-01-2011, 09:08 PM
The attendance sucks. 18,000 for the game last night against the Phillies, the best team in baseball. You fans point the finger at the owners for not having money to spend but sit on these message boards instead of going to games. How is the team supposed to have money when no one comes to the ballpark? How many games in a row have the Red Sox and Phillies sold out?

JeremiahHorsley
09-02-2011, 12:59 AM
Attendence was decent until we started struggling to stay at 500. and yes the red sox and phillies sell out every game, but they also have two of the highest payrolls in baseball which leads to consistantly winning 90+ games year in and out. the payroll isnt totally dependent upon attendence.

tedies
09-02-2011, 02:27 AM
Look at what the Brewers did the past off-season, a couple moves here and there and we can be right back on top

nux fan
09-02-2011, 07:48 AM
maybe the reds can sign marcus thames

bounty37h
09-02-2011, 10:06 AM
The attendance sucks. 18,000 for the game last night against the Phillies, the best team in baseball. You fans point the finger at the owners for not having money to spend but sit on these message boards instead of going to games. How is the team supposed to have money when no one comes to the ballpark? How many games in a row have the Red Sox and Phillies sold out?

How many years in a row have they also made the playoffs? If the owner doesnt have money to make the team better and do what they need, than they need to sell it to someone who does or will (I dont think its the case, but rather your arguement). If you go to a grocery store that always has out of date food, do you keep going back hoping your business/money will allow them to get better stuff, or do you go to a better store to get higher quality? If you go to clothing store that as no selection, do yo ukeep going back or go to a store that has more options? Its on the store to bring customers in, its a business afterall.

texasdave
09-02-2011, 10:11 AM
Not too mention that Boston and Philadelphia are 2 or 3 times bigger than Cincinnati. All things being equal they SHOULD draw a heckuva lot more fans into the stadium.

smixsell
09-02-2011, 01:01 PM
The Reds made major finacial commitments to numerous players.

You = wrong.

The talent is here. The leadership in the dugout is not.

Spot on. :)

Baker (aka "Uncle Rusty") will be fired in the offseason. :thumbup:

smixsell
09-02-2011, 01:04 PM
Look at what the Brewers did the past off-season, a couple moves here and there and we can be right back on top

And don't forget the Diomondback's turnaround under a new manager. It's amazing what decent leadership will do for a club lacking in that department. :)

Bye bye Baker! :thumbup:

Roush's socks
09-02-2011, 01:32 PM
The attendance sucks. 18,000 for the game last night against the Phillies, the best team in baseball. You fans point the finger at the owners for not having money to spend but sit on these message boards instead of going to games. How is the team supposed to have money when no one comes to the ballpark? How many games in a row have the Red Sox and Phillies sold out?

The Reds attendance problems are also due to the fact that GABP does not have a viable entertainment district. In some MLB cities going to the game is a social thing which also includes eating at a restaurant and going to bars to drink before/after the game. It takes a lot to motivate fans to get into the car and drive in traffic, spend tons of money, sit in potentially bad weather, and watch a game that they could sit in their house and watch on TV. Cincy needs to develop the whole area and give fans a reason to go to games. There are teams that don't even have winning records that always do good in attendance because going to a game is part of the culture of the city.