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mdccclxix
10-29-2011, 02:25 AM
Hey! Season's over!

Here are some quality FA's that I think the Reds could benefit from signing in 2012:

Grady Sizemore: Total Stud. With depth in CF, the Reds could roll the dice he stays healthy for 4-5 million. Injuries are a concern, but players with this talent only need to be 80%.

Johnny Damon: This guy still has 2-3 years left and can probably still hit 15 HR in GABP while providing a tough out in the lineup. 3-5 million.

Josh Willingham: He'll probably get close to 8-10 million since there isn't much else out there and he's never OPS'd under .800. No doubt he'd help this lineup as a cleanup hitter.

JD Drew: Another premium talent. He knows the K zone. Coming off an injury year and going to be 36. He's a winner. 3-5 million.

Roy Oswalt: His retirement talk is probably him coming to terms with an aging body. Maybe he would hang it up early, but I doubt it. 3 years, 36 million.

Vazquez

Buehrle


These are the types of targets the Reds need. Similar to the Rolen acquisition, this team will benefit from another veteran with a consistant bat or arm. Making room in the OF shouldn't be an issue, and the rotation needs more stability. Perhaps they have 10-15 million to spend if payroll goes to 85 million and they don't keep Cordero.

MikeThierry
10-29-2011, 02:53 AM
Your list is nice but I don't know about JD Drew. Maybe my bias is coming through, being a Cards fan and seeing what he did when he was a Cards player, but the guy is unreliable.

mth123
10-29-2011, 04:11 AM
Hey! Season's over!

Here are some quality FA's that I think the Reds could benefit from signing in 2012:

Grady Sizemore: Total Stud. With depth in CF, the Reds could roll the dice he stays healthy for 4-5 million. Injuries are a concern, but players with this talent only need to be 80%.

Johnny Damon: This guy still has 2-3 years left and can probably still hit 15 HR in GABP while providing a tough out in the lineup. 3-5 million.

Josh Willingham: He'll probably get close to 8-10 million since there isn't much else out there and he's never OPS'd under .800. No doubt he'd help this lineup as a cleanup hitter.

JD Drew: Another premium talent. He knows the K zone. Coming off an injury year and going to be 36. He's a winner. 3-5 million.

Roy Oswalt: His retirement talk is probably him coming to terms with an aging body. Maybe he would hang it up early, but I doubt it. 3 years, 36 million.

Vazquez

Buehrle


These are the types of targets the Reds need. Similar to the Rolen acquisition, this team will benefit from another veteran with a consistant bat or arm. Making room in the OF shouldn't be an issue, and the rotation needs more stability. Perhaps they have 10-15 million to spend if payroll goes to 85 million and they don't keep Cordero.

Starting pitcher first. Vazquez is retiring. Oswalt has too many injury issues. Buehrle is the guy I'd like to see them add. If they could add a strong starter without dealing Alonso, Votto or Bruce, then I don't really think they need to do anything with the position players they have. The primary weakness they had in 2011, as far as position players are concerned, was a lack of middle of the order depth and guys who can hit well against RHP. That weakness is addressed with Alonso replacing Gomes as the primary LF and with Heisey as a strong 4th OFer. The bottom of the roster is much stronger with Cozart replacing Janish, Mes replacing Ramon and Francisco and Frazier replacing Lewis and Renteria. The only reason they may need to add a position player would be if some need to be dealt to fix the rotation. If they could sign Buerhle while leaving Chapman in the pen, I'd say they are all set. Deal Volquez for a prospect or two and be done with it.

Cueto
Buerhle
Leake
Bailey
Arroyo

Wood
Lecure
Ondrusek
Masset
Bray
Arredondo
Chapman

Phillips 2B
Stubbs/Heisey CF
Votto 1B
Bruce RF
Alonso LF
Rolen/Francisco 3B
Meseraco/Hanigan C
Cozart SS

Cairo and Frazier round out the bench as utility guys. Beyond that, they may look at dealing Stubbs if Sappelt forces his way in. Sappelt in CF and the 2 hole looks alot better, but they wouldn't need to force the move.

Fortifying the rotation with another effective innngs horse like Buehrle will do wonders for the bullpen and if Arroyo can bounce back to the 200+ league average innings guy that he has basically been while taking the gloves off as far as limiting Leake's innings and that pen should avoid imploding under the weight of overuse in April and May. Bailey would be the biggest question mark they have because of his health, but if he can stay healthy, I still think he'll be the ace by the end of the year. If his health falters, they still have Wood and Lecure as options.

They should sign some vets as insurance for AAA. This year's version of Willis (my vote is Scott Kazmir) and a steady defesive SS who could come up and field the position every day should Cozart be injured or awful should be things they look to add on the cheap.

If they must spend money on the bullpen, I hope its for cheap experience along the lines of Jason Isringhausen rather than sinking multiple years or anything over $2 Million into a reliever, but if they keep everyone but Cordero and leave Chapman in the pen, I don't think its necessary. Brad Boxberger will be on the scene by June and if used correctly he and Chapman might be dynamic at the end of the game (think Kimbrel/Ventors in Atlanta as an example) with strong arms like Arredondo, Bray and Masset really solid in the middle.

blumj
10-29-2011, 11:17 AM
Your list is nice but I don't know about JD Drew. Maybe my bias is coming through, being a Cards fan and seeing what he did when he was a Cards player, but the guy is unreliable.
I mostly liked him as a Sox, but he was already talking about retiring after the season in ST.

lollipopcurve
10-29-2011, 11:31 AM
Buerhle's going to the Cards if he leaves Chicago. He's from the St. Louis area.

MikeS21
10-29-2011, 02:18 PM
Meh. Its OK to kick the tires. But none of them really excite me much more than anyone we already have in house.

mdccclxix
10-29-2011, 04:32 PM
Starting pitcher first. Vazquez is retiring. Oswalt has too many injury issues. Buehrle is the guy I'd like to see them add. If they could add a strong starter without dealing Alonso, Votto or Bruce, then I don't really think they need to do anything with the position players they have. The primary weakness they had in 2011, as far as position players are concerned, was a lack of middle of the order depth and guys who can hit well against RHP. That weakness is addressed with Alonso replacing Gomes as the primary LF and with Heisey as a strong 4th OFer. The bottom of the roster is much stronger with Cozart replacing Janish, Mes replacing Ramon and Francisco and Frazier replacing Lewis and Renteria. The only reason they may need to add a position player would be if some need to be dealt to fix the rotation. If they could sign Buerhle while leaving Chapman in the pen, I'd say they are all set. Deal Volquez for a prospect or two and be done with it.

Cueto
Buerhle
Leake
Bailey
Arroyo

Wood
Lecure
Ondrusek
Masset
Bray
Arredondo
Chapman

Phillips 2B
Stubbs/Heisey CF
Votto 1B
Bruce RF
Alonso LF
Rolen/Francisco 3B
Meseraco/Hanigan C
Cozart SS

Cairo and Frazier round out the bench as utility guys. Beyond that, they may look at dealing Stubbs if Sappelt forces his way in. Sappelt in CF and the 2 hole looks alot better, but they wouldn't need to force the move.

Fortifying the rotation with another effective innngs horse like Buehrle will do wonders for the bullpen and if Arroyo can bounce back to the 200+ league average innings guy that he has basically been while taking the gloves off as far as limiting Leake's innings and that pen should avoid imploding under the weight of overuse in April and May. Bailey would be the biggest question mark they have because of his health, but if he can stay healthy, I still think he'll be the ace by the end of the year. If his health falters, they still have Wood and Lecure as options.

They should sign some vets as insurance for AAA. This year's version of Willis (my vote is Scott Kazmir) and a steady defesive SS who could come up and field the position every day should Cozart be injured or awful should be things they look to add on the cheap.

If they must spend money on the bullpen, I hope its for cheap experience along the lines of Jason Isringhausen rather than sinking multiple years or anything over $2 Million into a reliever, but if they keep everyone but Cordero and leave Chapman in the pen, I don't think its necessary. Brad Boxberger will be on the scene by June and if used correctly he and Chapman might be dynamic at the end of the game (think Kimbrel/Ventors in Atlanta as an example) with strong arms like Arredondo, Bray and Masset really solid in the middle.

I wouldn't mind your way of doing things at all. However, Chapman needs to go into the rotation soon, he's more valuable that way. I hope a good Winter League showing doesn't stop Jocketty from getting another arm, or thinking practically about Cordero. Hazarding those things are hand in hand with entering Chapman into the rotation, at least until we see what happens.

I had heard about Vazquez retiring, but maybe he could be talked back for some extra cash. Renteria was talking that way last year as well.

Oswalt would need to find a clean bill of health for the Reds to sign him, and I somehow think he'd shirk off the idea of coming here, but he's an elite talent, totally grizzled, he'd be a boon for the rotation if healthy.

We agree on Buehrle. If he goes to St. Louis, that would suck. Maybe playing in the Central would be enough for him. His price tag will likely be too high and would probably squeeze out Phillips in 2013.

Again, I like the Heisey/Stubbs platoon, or possibly letting Sappelt take over CF. I like the upgrade Alonso brings to the lineup, specifically vs RHP. I think Cozart will add some offense as well. All those things will stabilize the offense. However, I think a great way to find value is to pick up guys that are coming off injury. In fact, I'd sign Sizemore to a 3 year deal if he'd do it. Eventually, he'll come out on the other side with the same talent as before. Perhaps he'd take a year to catch on, but catching on for him is something special. Think of what Lance Nix, Junior, Carpenter, etc have done post injury history. The fact that Sizemore comes with significant value as a slugger makes it worth while. I wouldn't, for example, pursue a guy like Rollins, who as a small speedy guy, I think would be more likely to perform badly.

I try to focus on premium talent and the list above is mostly that. In years past I've thought Damon, Abreu, Rolen, and Berkman were good finds. I feel pretty good about Sizemore and Oswalt in particular. These players could supercharge this team if they perform to 85% of their ability. Meanwhile, there is certainly enough depth to replace them if they falter. And their market values are down as well.

Finally, these also have a Walt Jocketty flavor to them. Add vets that have pedigree and an exceptional past, even while in decline or recovering from injury. Younger the better, sure, but don't overlook your Abreu's or Damons, especially since they are very healthy. As we've seen with Rolen, just half a season of production at their full potential is very valuable.

mdccclxix
10-29-2011, 04:41 PM
I mostly liked him as a Sox, but he was already talking about retiring after the season in ST.

If he wants to sit it out and get healthy, great, but I bet he'll find it hard to retire and bringing him back is worth the risk. I'm not familiar with his "troubled" past, but I don't really care. If Jocketty were to bring him in, big IF I guess, I would think it's all clear. I just like his OBP skills, this lineup could use more tough outs. In general, the Reds can find some outfield help among this list, which would be aimed at relegating the K kings Heisey and Stubbs to a less burdened role. Perhaps even traded.

mth123
10-29-2011, 05:52 PM
I wouldn't mind your way of doing things at all. However, Chapman needs to go into the rotation soon, he's more valuable that way. I hope a good Winter League showing doesn't stop Jocketty from getting another arm, or thinking practically about Cordero. Hazarding those things are hand in hand with entering Chapman into the rotation, at least until we see what happens.

I had heard about Vazquez retiring, but maybe he could be talked back for some extra cash. Renteria was talking that way last year as well.

Oswalt would need to find a clean bill of health for the Reds to sign him, and I somehow think he'd shirk off the idea of coming here, but he's an elite talent, totally grizzled, he'd be a boon for the rotation if healthy.

We agree on Buehrle. If he goes to St. Louis, that would suck. Maybe playing in the Central would be enough for him. His price tag will likely be too high and would probably squeeze out Phillips in 2013.

Again, I like the Heisey/Stubbs platoon, or possibly letting Sappelt take over CF. I like the upgrade Alonso brings to the lineup, specifically vs RHP. I think Cozart will add some offense as well. All those things will stabilize the offense. However, I think a great way to find value is to pick up guys that are coming off injury. In fact, I'd sign Sizemore to a 3 year deal if he'd do it. Eventually, he'll come out on the other side with the same talent as before. Perhaps he'd take a year to catch on, but catching on for him is something special. Think of what Lance Nix, Junior, Carpenter, etc have done post injury history. The fact that Sizemore comes with significant value as a slugger makes it worth while. I wouldn't, for example, pursue a guy like Rollins, who as a small speedy guy, I think would be more likely to perform badly.

I try to focus on premium talent and the list above is mostly that. In years past I've thought Damon, Abreu, Rolen, and Berkman were good finds. I feel pretty good about Sizemore and Oswalt in particular. These players could supercharge this team if they perform to 85% of their ability. Meanwhile, there is certainly enough depth to replace them if they falter. And their market values are down as well.

Finally, these also have a Walt Jocketty flavor to them. Add vets that have pedigree and an exceptional past, even while in decline or recovering from injury. Younger the better, sure, but don't overlook your Abreu's or Damons, especially since they are very healthy. As we've seen with Rolen, just half a season of production at their full potential is very valuable.

I don't fool with Sizemore unless he'll sign a minor league deal. The Reds can afford productive players. They can't afford dead money and I'm not convinced Sizemore will ever be all the way back.

The Reds should not spend one additional dime of the payflex that they have until a starter is added and they see how much room they have left afterwards. Any offseason plan that does not include adding a proven starting pitcher who is healthy and has repeatedly gone 200+ innings with an ERA under 4.00 is akin to punting 2012. This team can win if it gets what it needs and IMO adding that from the outside is an absolute requirement. All other things are secondary and that includes moving Chapman to the rotation. I just don't believe he'll develop into a good starter until he's had a couple of seasons of starting under his belt and by then he'll be looking for his next contract. I'd ride him as a weapon in the pen and wouldn't waste the time developing him to be the next ace in Boston or New York.

Scrap Irony
10-29-2011, 06:42 PM
1. Deal for Gonzalez, Shields, Pineda, or another TOR starter. If not, look to the following:

SP
Paul Maholm-- LH, MOR starter. Meh signing, but could net value. Is he better than anything the Reds already have? The jury's out on that one.

Hiroki Kuroda-- This would be a prescient signing. But he's coming on the market at the perfect time and both New York and Boston are likely to bid big. If he's overlooked, he's a well above average starter who'd be at least the third-best Red pitcher next year.

Adam Wainwright-- Want to make a splash? Take a gamble paying TOR money to Wainwright. He may become available as the Cardinals look to find money for Pujols.

CJ Wilson-- No chance he signs for less than $18 million per season. No chance the Reds can go that high. Sigh. He'd have been nice.


If they deal for a starter, the Reds are likely going to have to give up Alonso. If so, here's my LF wish list:

LF
Andruw Jones-- Power, can still play CF occasionally, and hits LH a ton. An odd platoon with Heisey could net 40 homers from LF, with 120 RBI, but low BA. Willing to take a walk. Plus, he's had a couple years to play from the bench and has done well. Should be fairly cheap.

Jason Kubel-- Another high K guy, but he has a chance to really go all monster in LF. He's a lefty, though, and I'd prefer a RH to hit between Votto and Bruce.

Omar Infante-- Might be a nice guy to have as a 140-game utility guy, a la Tony Phillips. Could play LF, 2B, SS, 3B, RF, and CF. Would be a good number two hitter in Cincinnati and might blossom in the small confines. Doesn't K much at all which would be a nice compliment to the rest of the order.

RP
Jonathan Broxton-- Good gamble to take, IMO, in a two- or three-year contract. Great arm, could again become a monster closer. Or he could be out of baseball in a year.

Jon Rauch-- From northern Kentucky (Oldham County) and may want to spend more time at home. Still has a nice arm and could be a cheap option as closer. Worth a look.

mth123
10-29-2011, 06:50 PM
The Cardinals already exercised Wainwright's option for the next 2 seasons. He's not available.

mdccclxix
10-29-2011, 09:23 PM
I don't fool with Sizemore unless he'll sign a minor league deal. The Reds can afford productive players. They can't afford dead money and I'm not convinced Sizemore will ever be all the way back.

The Reds should not spend one additional dime of the payflex that they have until a starter is added and they see how much room they have left afterwards. Any offseason plan that does not include adding a proven starting pitcher who is healthy and has repeatedly gone 200+ innings with an ERA under 4.00 is akin to punting 2012. This team can win if it gets what it needs and IMO adding that from the outside is an absolute requirement. All other things are secondary and that includes moving Chapman to the rotation. I just don't believe he'll develop into a good starter until he's had a couple of seasons of starting under his belt and by then he'll be looking for his next contract. I'd ride him as a weapon in the pen and wouldn't waste the time developing him to be the next ace in Boston or New York.

I agree about adding a #3 or better starter. It's necessary. Depending on how much money is available before or after that acquisition I think it's possible to find value to improve the outfield. There are a lot of pieces in play, especially if the SP addition is via trade. My goal is to explore FA options for the Reds.

As far as Sizemore, or other injured players or older players, nothing ventured nothing gained. The best you can do is rest with players that, when they are healthy, are likely still elite. The idea is worthwhile to me because, even though there are some decent chances for development with the young guys, there is too much at stake not to explore if there are better options.

mdccclxix
10-29-2011, 09:36 PM
1. Deal for Gonzalez, Shields, Pineda, or another TOR starter. If not, look to the following:

SP
Paul Maholm-- LH, MOR starter. Meh signing, but could net value. Is he better than anything the Reds already have? The jury's out on that one.

Hiroki Kuroda-- This would be a prescient signing. But he's coming on the market at the perfect time and both New York and Boston are likely to bid big. If he's overlooked, he's a well above average starter who'd be at least the third-best Red pitcher next year.

Adam Wainwright-- Want to make a splash? Take a gamble paying TOR money to Wainwright. He may become available as the Cardinals look to find money for Pujols.

CJ Wilson-- No chance he signs for less than $18 million per season. No chance the Reds can go that high. Sigh. He'd have been nice.


If they deal for a starter, the Reds are likely going to have to give up Alonso. If so, here's my LF wish list:

LF
Andruw Jones-- Power, can still play CF occasionally, and hits LH a ton. An odd platoon with Heisey could net 40 homers from LF, with 120 RBI, but low BA. Willing to take a walk. Plus, he's had a couple years to play from the bench and has done well. Should be fairly cheap.

Jason Kubel-- Another high K guy, but he has a chance to really go all monster in LF. He's a lefty, though, and I'd prefer a RH to hit between Votto and Bruce.

Omar Infante-- Might be a nice guy to have as a 140-game utility guy, a la Tony Phillips. Could play LF, 2B, SS, 3B, RF, and CF. Would be a good number two hitter in Cincinnati and might blossom in the small confines. Doesn't K much at all which would be a nice compliment to the rest of the order.

RP
Jonathan Broxton-- Good gamble to take, IMO, in a two- or three-year contract. Great arm, could again become a monster closer. Or he could be out of baseball in a year.

Jon Rauch-- From northern Kentucky (Oldham County) and may want to spend more time at home. Still has a nice arm and could be a cheap option as closer. Worth a look.

I like Infante as well, he'd be a good pickup for next year given the flux at SS, 3b and the OF.

I have to admit, I'm not to privy to relievers, I just can't get a read on who among them would be a clear upgrade, except maybe Heath Bell.

And I think Kuroda is pretty set on southern Cal.

KoryMac5
10-29-2011, 10:30 PM
I would kick the tires on Sizemore, and trade Stubbs in a package for pitching. If Sizemore fails to remain healthy you can still fall back on Heisey. Always deal from your strengths, the Reds have some depth in the OF.

Vottomatic
10-30-2011, 10:14 AM
I'd issue a private statement to all MLB teams that any player on the Reds is available for the right price. Then sit back and see if any crazy offers come in.

But in my book, if Cozart and Rolen are healthy, the only upgrades that need to be done are starting pitching and the bullpen.

mth123
10-30-2011, 10:35 AM
I'd issue a private statement to all MLB teams that any player on the Reds is available for the right price. Then sit back and see if any crazy offers come in.

But in my book, if Cozart and Rolen are healthy, the only upgrades that need to be done are starting pitching and the bullpen.

Agreed as long as they don't give up Alonso, Votto or Bruce to get the pitching they need. They also need Cozart, Phillips and Mesoraco. If they can keep those 6 guys, they don't need to add any position players.

People are overlooking the money here. The Reds have the money to make a splash to fix the rotation, but if they start nickel and diming it away on reclamation projects, relievers and iffy players they'll be stuck with in house options and IMO that is simply not good enough. Get the pitcher first.

As far as the bullpen goes, leave Chapman out there and get a good starter to go with Cueto, Leake, Arroyo and Bailey and the bullpen will be fine. Arroyo should be healthy and go deeper into games in 2012. Cueto should be available all year and the team should get more innings from him. Leake is ready for a full 200 inning load now, so he should provide more innings as well. Bailey is still a bit iffy but has teh most talent of the bunch IMO. If they can get a consistent guy who can start 32 times and average about 7 innings, that bullpen should be much improved. The team won't need to use 5 or 6 pitchers every day and the whole lot of them should be better prepared to handle the dog days. Chapman, Bray, Arredondo, Masset, Ondrusek, Lecure and Wood (with Boxberger on the way and lots of reinforcements as 12th pitcher candidates) should provide a deep, well balanced pen who have guys who can give innings, provide heat late in the game and give multiple looks. The only thing this pen needs IMO is to leave Chapman in place and to be paired with a rotation that doesn't put them in a hole 5 times each week.

cincinnati chili
10-30-2011, 02:45 PM
CJ Wilson-- No chance he signs for less than $18 million per season. No chance the Reds can go that high. Sigh. He'd have been nice.

Seriously?

The Yankees can't be expected to be a bidder as his postseason record is 1-5 with a 4.82 ERA. The guy also led the league in walks two years ago and was pretty high this year. He's 31 next year, and I see him a prime candidate to go Eric Milton.

Vottomatic
10-30-2011, 04:39 PM
Buerhle's going to the Cards if he leaves Chicago. He's from the St. Louis area.

Cards won't have the money. Buerhle made in the neighborhood (without looking it up) of $14M last season.

After paying Pujols $25M per season, re-signing Berkman with a raise, picking up Wainwright's option, re-signing Carpenter and Garcia, the rest of the team might look like scrap heap guys.

Best thing Reds fans can hope for is that the Cardinal players get fat and old this offseason and lay an egg next season.

schroomytunes
10-30-2011, 05:30 PM
I would like to see the Reds do this in the offseason:

1) Sign Andrew Jones to platoon with Alonzo/Stubbs in LF/CF giving us @ 200 AB's and allowing Heisey to be the super sub guy! This allows us to have 5 solid OF positions and one heck of a bench!

2) Sign Clint Barmes to be the ss/3b/2b backup, he has some pop and would be a fine addition to share time with Cozart.

3) Sign Edwin Jackson to fill the #3 spot in the rotation, he provides stability to the rotation.

4) Trade Edison Volquez to KC for middle reliever Blake Wood, Wood is an extreme GB pitcher and should help the bullpen.

Scrap Irony
10-30-2011, 10:39 PM
Seriously?

The Yankees can't be expected to be a bidder as his postseason record is 1-5 with a 4.82 ERA. The guy also led the league in walks two years ago and was pretty high this year. He's 31 next year, and I see him a prime candidate to go Eric Milton.

Yankees need some serious starting pitching, as three-quarters of their staff is testing free agency. Too, they got bounced from the playoffs largely because they couldn't pitch well enough.

Because of the deep pockets, they'll chase the perceived best pitchers on the open market. Wilson is one of two (with CC being the other) who profile as having talent enough to be a TOR guy.

Couple that with Boston's need for pitching and Wilson is going to be out of the Cincinnati price range really quickly.

If both New York and Boston decide they could spend their money better elsewhere (Darvish and Sabathia, perhaps Buehrle and Kuroda), then, were I Jocketty, Wilson would be my first option on the market. Tons of innings, lots of Ks. Still in his pitching prime and took a huge leap forward last season.

Sign me up for that, please.

cincinnati chili
10-30-2011, 11:20 PM
I would like to see the Reds do this in the offseason:

1) Sign Andrew Jones to platoon with Alonzo/Stubbs in LF/CF giving us @ 200 AB's and allowing Heisey to be the super sub guy! This allows us to have 5 solid OF positions and one heck of a bench!

2) Sign Clint Barmes to be the ss/3b/2b backup, he has some pop and would be a fine addition to share time with Cozart.

3) Sign Edwin Jackson to fill the #3 spot in the rotation, he provides stability to the rotation.

Yuck on 1 and 2. Both are extreme outmakers and Jones is no longer a defensive asset. Jackson is fine for the right price.

--

Guys who I suspect will be worth the price to the Reds (in order of impact to Reds if signed):
1. Yu Darvish - if he stays healthy, he'll be the second Japanese player in Hall after Ichiro
2. Roy Oswalt PHI
3. Hiroki Kuroda LAD
4. Javier Vazquez FLA
5. Ryan Madson PHI
6. Joel Peralta TB
7. Jamey Carroll LAD
8. Ramon Santiago DET
9. David DeJesus OAK
10. Jason Kubel MIN

Guys I'd love to have but who will be priced out of the range of reason or who play positions where we are all set:

Albert Pujols STL
Prince Fielder MIL
CC Sabathia NYY (player option)
Jose Reyes NYM
Heath Bell SD
Edwin Jackson STL
C.J. Wilson TEX
Mark Buehrle CWS
Aramis Ramirez CHC
David Ortiz BOS
Jim Thome MIN


Avoid

Paul Maholm PIT
Josh Willingham OAK
Michael Cuddyer MIN
Grady Sizemore CLE (team option)
Francisco Rodriguez MIL
Freddy Garcia NYY
Jose Valverde DET


Extreme sleepers worth a flier perhaps
Brandon Webb ARI (out until 2013; maybe worth a cheap deal with a club option for 2013)
Conor Jackson OAK
Justin Duchscherer OAK

mdccclxix
11-01-2011, 11:10 AM
MLBTR's top 50 with their guesses on where players will end up:


The sixth annual MLB Trade Rumors Top 50 Free Agents list is here! The entire list of available free agents can be found here, and you can filter by position and signing team with our free agent tracker here.

This year, I'm excited to introduce a new contest that will allow you to test your free agent prediction abilities against those of the MLBTR writing team as well as other readers. After players start signing, we'll have a leaderboard showing the contestants with the best "batting averages" on their picks. Once everyone has signed, the winners will receive sweet prizes. Here are the top 50 free agents for which you'll be making predictions, along with my guesses.

1. Albert Pujols - Cardinals. The Cubs, Blue Jays, Orioles, Mariners, Rangers, Marlins, Nationals, and Dodgers are other potential suitors, but a significant premium would be required to lure away the longtime Cardinal. $225-230MM over nine years seems a fair compromise for the Cardinals and their superstar first baseman.

2. Prince Fielder - Mariners. Fielder has the same potential suitors as Pujols, with the Brewers also a possibility. The Scott Boras client is a tough free agent to place, as there are good reasons for every team to avoid a potential $150MM+ commitment. The Mariners and Cubs are the most likely matches for me. Mariners GM Jack Zduriencik drafted Fielder in '02 with the Brewers, and his team lacks a premium bat.

3. Jose Reyes - Brewers. Reyes is another difficult top free agent to predict. The Nationals, Braves, Phillies, Giants, Pirates, Reds, Twins, Rays, and Cardinals could have a need at shortstop, but not all of those teams can or should spend $100MM+ on Reyes. The Mets will entertain re-signing Reyes, but the Brewers seem more likely to approach Ryan Braun's speculated $120MM price range.

4. C.J. Wilson - Nationals. Wilson's poor postseason may have damaged his stock slightly, but in his defense he racked up 250 innings over 39 starts this season in total and started 37 games in 2010. $100MM is still possible for Wilson, though 78% of MLBTR readers think he'll fall short. Front-of-the-rotation starting pitching is a big need for many teams, including the Nationals, Marlins, Royals, Blue Jays, Yankees, Red Sox, and Cubs.

5. Yu Darvish - Blue Jays. Darvish is not technically a free agent, and in fact he hasn't even decided about being posted at this point. If he does come over from Japan, a $100MM commitment will likely be required. The Yankees, Red Sox, Rangers, Nationals, Mariners, and Royals could put in bids, and it wouldn't be surprising to see a few "mystery teams" enter the fray.

6. Edwin Jackson - Marlins. Jackson, a Scott Boras client, could also make sense for the Nationals and several other teams looking for a 200-inning starter with upside. Since Jackson is only 28, Boras could seek a four-year deal.

7. Jimmy Rollins - Phillies. Rollins probably won't find the five-year deal he seeks, but the Phillies have the need and the means to reach a new agreement with him.

8. Aramis Ramirez - Orioles. Ramirez seeks a multiyear deal, and as the best available free agent third baseman he's justified. He could give the Orioles a powerful corner bat on a three-year deal.

9. Carlos Beltran - Red Sox. Beltran is a tough player to place, if the Giants are unable to re-sign him. He's a 34-year-old Scott Boras client who's likely to seek at least three years despite significant injury concerns in 2009-10 and a disinterest in being a designated hitter. It'll take a team with a right field opening and a tolerance for risk.

10. Jonathan Papelbon - Red Sox. I can picture the Red Sox going as high as three years and $39MM to retain Papelbon, though the closer will test the market. A half-dozen teams could seek closers this winter, but the list is short on big spenders and it's been a while since we've had a $40MM+ reliever.

11. Michael Cuddyer - Twins. Cuddyer would fit with the Rockies, Red Sox, or Cubs, but he's spent his entire career with the Twins and may prefer to stay.

12. Mark Buehrle - White Sox. Buehrle is another player who is difficult to picture with another club. The lefty finds the National League enticing, however, and he could join Ozzie Guillen in Miami since the Cardinals don't have an opening.

13. David Ortiz - Blue Jays. Ortiz backed off from his comments about Red Sox drama, and there's a limited market for an expensive player with no ability to play defense. Still, he'd give Toronto's offense a nice boost without requiring more than a two-year deal. That might leave Edwin Encarnacion having to play a significant amount of first base, however.

14. Ryan Madson - Phillies. If the Phillies don't re-sign Madson, and the Red Sox keep Papelbon, who would give Madson big money to close? As a Scott Boras client, Madson could seek a four-year deal with a salary approaching $10MM.

15. Hiroki Kuroda - Dodgers. Kuroda doesn't want to play anywhere else, according to Dodgers GM Ned Colletti.

16. Carlos Pena - Pirates. Pena is a nice fit for the Pirates on another one-year deal, assuming they don't re-sign Derrek Lee.

17. Francisco Rodriguez - Marlins. K-Rod, a Scott Boras client, would like to return to the closing role on a three-year deal. The Marlins would have the opening and the money, if they non-tender Juan Carlos Oviedo.

18. Roy Oswalt - Rangers. Oswalt could return to Texas for a winning team, and he'll require a much shorter commitment than C.J. Wilson.

19. Javier Vazquez - Retirement. There's a strong sentiment that Vazquez will retire, but he'd be in demand if not after posting a 1.92 ERA and 6.05 K/BB ratio since mid-June.

20. Heath Bell - Padres. Bell hopes and expects to return to the Padres, perhaps on the first multiyear deal of his career.

21. Coco Crisp - Giants. Though he posted a low on-base percentage in 2011, Crisp could fill the Giants' need for a center fielder and leadoff man.

22. Hisashi Iwakuma - Twins. The Twins bid on Iwakuma last year when he was posted, and this year they can simply sign him as a free agent.

23. Kelly Johnson - Dodgers. Johnson could provide the Dodgers some offense from second base, though the Blue Jays and Tigers could also be in the mix.

24. Josh Willingham - Reds. As one of few affordable right-handed power sources on the market, Willingham could fit with the Reds, Rockies, Indians, and others.

25. Paul Maholm - Rockies. Though Maholm does not appear to be on the Rockies' radar at the moment, he's coming off a decent season and won't require a huge commitment.

26. Grady Sizemore - Marlins. Sizemore is a classic risk/reward case, and the Marlins don't seem interested in playing it safe this winter.

27. Bartolo Colon - Red Sox. Colon had an excellent comeback season, but he will still have a hard time finding a two-year deal. Perhaps he could take an incentive-based contract and remain in the AL East with the Red Sox.

28. Erik Bedard - Blue Jays. If the Blue Jays hit on a wild card like Bedard and also land Darvish, they'd have a fearsome rotation. Bedard is a healthy free agent for the first time, and perhaps he'll lean toward his native Canada.

29. David DeJesus - Cubs. DeJesus could be an asset for the Cubs at the outfield corners on a one-year deal.

30. Jason Kubel - Dodgers. Kubel could improve the Dodgers' offense as their left fielder, unless they go with Jerry Sands at the position.

31. Ramon Hernandez - Pirates. Hernandez would give the Pirates offense out of the catcher spot, though GM Neal Huntington may balk at giving up a second-round pick to sign him.

32. Jeff Francis - Pirates. Francis is one of many starting pitchers who could add depth to the Pirates' rotation at a reasonable cost.

33. Chris Capuano - Mariners. After subtracting Doug Fister this summer, Mariners GM Jack Zduriencik seems likely to add a piece to his rotation.

34. Tsuyoshi Wada - Orioles. Wada is expected to come to MLB as a free agent, though one question is his ability to handle a full rotation workload.

35. Clint Barmes - Twins. Barmes provided good value this season, and the Twins have a clear middle-infield need.

36. Casey Kotchman - Rays. Kotchman posted a fine 2011 season after signing a minor league deal, but his price should remain reasonable as teams wonder whether he can do it again.

37. Freddy Garcia - Yankees. Even with Sabathia in the fold, the Yankees will need additional rotation depth. Another stint with Garcia makes sense if his price remains reasonable.

38. Aaron Hill - Diamondbacks. Hill's stellar 142 plate appearances for the Diamondbacks this year provided hope he can bounce back in 2012.

39. Johnny Damon - Orioles. Damon probably requires a designated hitter opening, yet his level of offense doesn't justify a full-time spot. He's a difficult free agent to place.

40. Aaron Harang - Angels. Would Harang accept a below-market deal to stay close to home?

41. Jamey Carroll - Tigers. The versatile Carroll fits at the top of the Tigers' order, playing mostly second base.

42. Rafael Furcal - Cardinals. The Cardinals and Furcal are known to have mutual interest in a new deal; he showed promise in his Cards stint this year.

43. Juan Pierre - Reds. Pierre will have to take a more reduced role next year, perhaps under Dusty Baker again.

44. Frank Francisco - Mariners. Francisco was homer-prone this year, but he's still an asset in the late innings.

45. Jason Marquis - Mets. Marquis may have to take a one-year deal with the Mets to realize his goal of playing in New York.

46. Joel Pineiro - Cubs. Pineiro had great success in '09 in the NL Central, and could be a bargain if he rights the ship.

47. Jonathan Broxton - Mets. Broxton had arthroscopic surgery to remove a bone spur and loose bodies from his elbow in September and expects to be ready for Spring Training. Though he may not be the Broxton of old, I expect incentive-laden offers to be plentiful.

48. Joe Nathan - Twins. Nathan is excited about free agency, but after so many successful years closing for the Twins he may want to return to the role full-time in 2012.

49. Kerry Wood - Cubs. It's Cubs or retirement for Wood, and there's no reason not to bring him back.

50. Bruce Chen - Royals. As long as Chen's price tag doesn't get excessive, he's a good fit back with the Royals.


I just can't see Juan Pierre being useful here in Cincinnati. Willingham would be nice on a 3 year 25 million type deal. He doesn't have much to prove, yet he always does. Must have been born under a bad star.

Vottomatic
11-01-2011, 11:13 AM
MLBTR's top 50 with their guesses on where players will end up:




I just can't see Juan Pierre being useful here in Cincinnati. Willingham would be nice on a 3 year 25 million type deal. He doesn't have much to prove, yet he always does. Must have been born under a bad star.

Already a thread about this:

http://www.redszone.com/forums/showthread.php?t=92630

mdccclxix
11-01-2011, 11:33 AM
Agreed as long as they don't give up Alonso, Votto or Bruce to get the pitching they need. They also need Cozart, Phillips and Mesoraco. If they can keep those 6 guys, they don't need to add any position players.

People are overlooking the money here. The Reds have the money to make a splash to fix the rotation, but if they start nickel and diming it away on reclamation projects, relievers and iffy players they'll be stuck with in house options and IMO that is simply not good enough. Get the pitcher first.

As far as the bullpen goes, leave Chapman out there and get a good starter to go with Cueto, Leake, Arroyo and Bailey and the bullpen will be fine. Arroyo should be healthy and go deeper into games in 2012. Cueto should be available all year and the team should get more innings from him. Leake is ready for a full 200 inning load now, so he should provide more innings as well. Bailey is still a bit iffy but has teh most talent of the bunch IMO. If they can get a consistent guy who can start 32 times and average about 7 innings, that bullpen should be much improved. The team won't need to use 5 or 6 pitchers every day and the whole lot of them should be better prepared to handle the dog days. Chapman, Bray, Arredondo, Masset, Ondrusek, Lecure and Wood (with Boxberger on the way and lots of reinforcements as 12th pitcher candidates) should provide a deep, well balanced pen who have guys who can give innings, provide heat late in the game and give multiple looks. The only thing this pen needs IMO is to leave Chapman in place and to be paired with a rotation that doesn't put them in a hole 5 times each week.


It's going to be tough to find a 200 inning pitcher on the FA market, but I would be thrilled if the Reds landed one. Cordero's option wasn't picked up, so that's a start. If you take out the deferments from Rolen and Arroyo, you may have 17+ million after arbitration to sign FA's. Adding a 14+ million contract like Buehrle would certainly stave off a Phillips contract and in 2013 you'd have to find a 2b. Votto's 19 million in 2013 is doable.

Cueto
Buehrle
Leake
Arroyo
Chapman

Trade Bailey and Volquez for a top prospect in the infield. Save Wood for injury insurance and/or to takeover when Chapman reaches innings limit.

It's one way to do it. Lot's of ways to do it, though. Adding a FA bat while trading for a more affordable pitcher with pieces like Alonso, Stubbs, Heisey, Frazier, Bailey, Volquez, and Sappelt is another way to go.

mdccclxix
11-01-2011, 11:34 AM
Already a thread about this:

http://www.redszone.com/forums/showthread.php?t=92630

gotcha, just think this ranking will work well in this thread as well.

Gallen5862
11-01-2011, 08:02 PM
http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/

Today's minor moves...

Jared Burton elected free agency, according to MLB.com's Mark Sheldon (on Twitter). The 30-year-old right-hander showed promise out of the 'pen in 2007-08, but has appeared in just ten MLB games since 2010. He spent time on the 60-day DL with shoulder inflammation in 2011.

mth123
11-02-2011, 08:02 AM
It's going to be tough to find a 200 inning pitcher on the FA market, but I would be thrilled if the Reds landed one. Cordero's option wasn't picked up, so that's a start. If you take out the deferments from Rolen and Arroyo, you may have 17+ million after arbitration to sign FA's. Adding a 14+ million contract like Buehrle would certainly stave off a Phillips contract and in 2013 you'd have to find a 2b. Votto's 19 million in 2013 is doable.

Cueto
Buehrle
Leake
Arroyo
Chapman

Trade Bailey and Volquez for a top prospect in the infield. Save Wood for injury insurance and/or to takeover when Chapman reaches innings limit.

It's one way to do it. Lot's of ways to do it, though. Adding a FA bat while trading for a more affordable pitcher with pieces like Alonso, Stubbs, Heisey, Frazier, Bailey, Volquez, and Sappelt is another way to go.

I think Phillips is a goner. His resume, age and status have reached a tipping point. His resume and status suggests a free agent deal in the 4 year $50 Million range after 2012 is complete. His age and the Reds finances says the Reds should pass no matter who else they sign or what type of season Phillips has in 2012. Phillips contract status shouldn't have any impact on what the Reds do with the pitching staff IMO. If Phillips won't sign home town discount in the 3 year $20 Million range, I just don't see how the Reds could keep him. I like Phillips a lot. I think he's the best defensive 2B the Reds have had in the time I've been watching, which spans back to when Tommy Helms played 2B for the Reds. He deserves a big payday. I don't think the Reds can or should be the team to give it to him.

I don't think Buerhle will get that much. I'm thinking 3 years, $35 Million would get him. The Reds could afford more in 2012 and should approach that with a somewhat front loaded deal with say a $5 Million signing bonus and Salaries in the $10 Million per year range. They could do it this year and I think it would be a move to go for it that I would applaud, but I understand its fairly risky to spend the entire playflex on one player so I really expect that a trade is more likely if they do anything at all.

As I said earlier. I'm not optimistic about Chapman in the rotation for a couple years. He won't give the innings needed until 2014. He'll probably get hit fairly hard for a season or two as he figures out how to get hitters out while dialing his stuff back to the mid-90s. I'm just not optimistic that a guy like him who seems to get outs with a 100 MPH+ fastball setting up his low 90s slider. If he's starting and trying to get through a line-up three times, he won't be throwing 100 MPH + and if he's working at 95 or 96, I'm not sure that his slider will be nearly as effective as it is today. He's going to have to add to his assortment and figure out how to work through opposing line-ups multiple times and that will take a couple of seasons IMO. After 2013, he'll be arb eligible and the remainder of his current deal will convert to a signing bonus and then they'll have to sign him all over again or go to arb. The team will be dealing with paying that bonus as well as paying the new contract just to keep him until free agency comes around and it will only be a matter of time before he's priced himself out of town. Add that they'll also have to spend to replace him in the pen and that will cost money too which means they'll have to settle for a lesser starter. That means moving Chapman, in the short term, actually weakens two rotation spots - one devoted to Chapman as he takes his lumps and another where a lesser starter is added because some of the money needed to get help form outside will be reallocated to the pen to replace Chapman. They've been through those growing pain years with Bailey and now just as they are ready to realize the reward for sticking with him they're going to give his rotation spot to Chapman and start the whole process over again all while creating a hole in the bullpen that will require pricey help from the outside? I understand that Chapman could go on to a great career as a starter once this process is complete, but IMO that career will probably be mostly for teams that are not the Reds. Why go through all the short term set-backs just to let some other team with a bigger bank account swoop in and reap the rewards? Pass on the moving Chapman to the rotation. Let Bailey have that spot. Forget about acquiring a pricey reliever and use the cash on an established starter.

I'd be all for a scenario where the Reds deal Alonso, Grandal and some other excess parts for somebody effective and less pricey like Shields and use the savings to sign somebody like Willingham to play LF. I'm just beginning to think that it will take more than Alonso and Grandal and lesser guys. There aren't many starters who are effective and cheap like that and probably even less that match up with the Reds for a deal. Signing Buehrle, even if they have to expand the budget a couple million, means that Alonso can play LF and the Reds can hold on to their trade chips for whatever other need may reveal itself. Even if it costs more on next season's budget, it may be the best fiancial move in the long run.

All I know is, they need to bring in at least one established starter. The worst case scenario IMO is a rotation with Cueto, Arroyo, Leake, Bailey and Chapman. Too many question marks for me. I'm guessing those 5 will be the rotation though unless they make a spot for Volquez instead of Bailey.

I agree that dealing Volquez for a prospect to save cash and sure up a weakness should be on the to do list.

mdccclxix
11-02-2011, 10:50 AM
FWIW, Walt did say when posed between a bat and a pitcher he would be looking for a pitcher. From the names that have come up, like Jiminez and Shields, he's looking to trade for a young, effective, cost controlled #2 or #3 starter. You can't say he's set his sights too low.

On Chapman, you have one scenario that could happen, but parts of it have holes. If he struggles in 2012 and succeeds in 2013 to the point where he's too expensive, that means he had 4-7 WAR in 2013. In that case, let's get this started now! But, if he struggles and say progresses to a 4.25 ERA in 2013, I don't see Arb, or a reworked contract, being too expensive. And under no circumstance would any of his success or failure preclude him being on the Reds 2014-2016. If he's worth it, he'll get a contract to buy out his Arb years like Votto, Bruce, Cueto, etc. If he's not, he could go back to the pen as early as 2012, or at any point at any time. The point is, you have to start finding out now. Walt did say he could still be the closer in 2012. I imagine if he gets boxed in payroll wise he could decide Chapman will need to be closer. Personally, I hope he considers LeCure or perhaps Masset or a cheap vet FA and resigns Willis as a LOOGY.

crazybob60
11-02-2011, 11:27 AM
We need a TOR guy. Period. We need to look that way and in my opinion, that is the only place we need to look. Except if we can not resign Cordero to a one year deal at much less money. If we can't do that then we need to look at signing one of the relievers for a one year deal until Boxberger is MLB ready. Maybe a Madson type. Other than that, we need to be setting our sights on the TOR guy. A CJ Wilson type or trying our best to get someone like that. We have the other guys to move around with on the playing field and such, let's go after what we really need instead of going the 'stop gap' route or the aging veteran route and wasting time and money there.

redsfandan
11-03-2011, 07:27 AM
We need a TOR guy. Period. We need to look that way and in my opinion, that is the only place we need to look. Except if we can not resign Cordero to a one year deal at much less money. If we can't do that then we need to look at signing one of the relievers for a one year deal until Boxberger is MLB ready. Maybe a Madson type. Other than that, we need to be setting our sights on the TOR guy. A CJ Wilson type or trying our best to get someone like that. We have the other guys to move around with on the playing field and such, let's go after what we really need instead of going the 'stop gap' route or the aging veteran route and wasting time and money there.
I agree that the #1 priority for the Reds should be a good starting pitcher but I bet they'll make a trade instead of a signing and not for a CJ Wilson type.

mdccclxix
12-14-2011, 05:10 PM
THE BP FIRST TAKE
With C.J. Wilson and Mark Buehrle now gone, the free agent market for starting pitchers is low on upside and high on risk. It got a small boost on Monday night, when the Diamondbacks non-tendered Joe Saunders to avoid paying him roughly $8 million in arbitration, but the pickings remain slim.

Nonetheless, one pitcher in particular is strangely being overlooked. When Saunders became a free agent, rumors immediately spread suggesting that multiple teams—including the Red Sox (http://twitter.com/#!/JimBowdenESPNxm/status/146407895498620928)—would have interest. Yet there is another lefty still on the market who is both younger and more effective than Saunders: Paul Maholm.

The 29-year-old Maholm will never contend for a Cy Young award, but in a rapidly thinning market, he deserves far more attention than he’s received.
Maholm’s 6-14 record jumps off the stat-sheet first, but his career-best 3.75 FIP from last season is far more important, and he was worth 2.0 WARP compared to Saunders’ 1.3.

With a fastball that sits in the 86-88 m.p.h. range and only one strong offspeed offering (a slider), Maholm won’t miss many bats. But he makes up for that by keeping his walk rate below 3.00 per nine innings, and inducing plenty of groundballs to keep his home run rate down. Though he missed the last month and a half of the 2011 season with a shoulder strain, Maholm had no prior history of arm trouble and was cleared for workouts in late October (http://twitter.com/#!/Maholm28/status/128509181887127552).

A significant portion of Maholm’s struggles can be attributed to the Pirates’
inability to convert balls put in play against him into outs. Pittsburgh has ranked in the bottom third of the league in defensive efficiency in each of the last three seasons, bloating Maholm’s BABIP over .325 in 2009 and 2010.
Conversely, Saunders benefited from a strong Arizona defense this past season, logging a .271 BABIP that’s well below his career mark of .289.

Maholm is by no means an ace, but he has the potential to be an effective No.
3 or No. 4 starter on a contender with solid gloves, particularly in the infield. Assuming his shoulder is healthy, as reported, Maholm can be counted on for at least 180 league average innings.

In a market where quality pitchers are hard to find, Maholm—who is likely to settle for a short-term deal even though he is still in his prime—could be a diamond in the rough.


Anybody think this guy could help?

If nothing else, throwing your name in the hat for some FA's may make some of the trading partners feel less secure.

RedLegSuperStar
12-14-2011, 05:13 PM
I think both would help

Benihana
12-14-2011, 05:43 PM
My FA Wish List (same as it was a month ago):

1. Carlos Beltran
2. Hiroki Kuroda
3. Paul Maholm

The one guy who signed that I wished we would've went after was Erik Bedard, especially for $4.5M

lollipopcurve
12-14-2011, 05:48 PM
Still on the Cespedes bandwagon.

RedLegSuperStar
12-14-2011, 06:02 PM
Call me crazy but id rather go with what we have rather then sign a free agent OFer. If we are trading that's a different subject but Beltran seems like an aged vet with a history of injuries. Heisey could provide comparable numbers given the playing time.

Mahalom or Saunders would be solid pick ups just not top of the rotation guys like we constantly hear Walt talk about.

mth123
12-14-2011, 10:03 PM
1. Hiroki Kuroda
2. Edwin Jackson
3. Joe Saunders
4. Roy Oswalt

Nobody else unless the Reds deal some one, then maybe somebody as a replacement if need be.

Vottomatic
12-15-2011, 08:17 AM
I still feel we need 2 more quality starting pitchers.

Cueto
Leake
Arroyo isn't going anywhere
?
?

Include Homer in the trade that brings a quality starter.

I'd overpay for Kuroda for 2 years. IMHO, he's worth it. And I think to pry him off the west coast, the Reds WOULD have to overpay him. In fact, because of GABP's prolific HR rate, I think the Reds have to overpay any quality FA starting pitcher to come pitch at GABP.

I've thought about Maholm, because of his solid e.r.a. But his sub-90 mph fastball concerns me. If he really only has a fastball and slider, and the fastball isn't fast, how does he get people out? Seems like Homer has better stuff, but Maholm had better numbers.........and it doesn't make much sense.

The Reds can't exactly be choosy if other teams aren't willing to trade for a fair return. Reds may have to entertain some of these free agents.

RedLegSuperStar
12-15-2011, 10:39 AM
I still feel we need 2 more quality starting pitchers.

Cueto
Leake
Arroyo isn't going anywhere
?
?

Include Homer in the trade that brings a quality starter.

I'd overpay for Kuroda for 2 years. IMHO, he's worth it. And I think to pry him off the west coast, the Reds WOULD have to overpay him. In fact, because of GABP's prolific HR rate, I think the Reds have to overpay any quality FA starting pitcher to come pitch at GABP.

I've thought about Maholm, because of his solid e.r.a. But his sub-90 mph fastball concerns me. If he really only has a fastball and slider, and the fastball isn't fast, how does he get people out? Seems like Homer has better stuff, but Maholm had better numbers.........and it doesn't make much sense.

The Reds can't exactly be choosy if other teams aren't willing to trade for a fair return. Reds may have to entertain some of these free agents.

So you have Cueto, Leake, & Arroyo and listed Bailey but what about Wood, Volquez, & Chapman? That's a lot of Starting Pitchers for a ball club. Granted Chapman might not be in the rotation but that has always been the plan with him.

If you can't get a front of the rotation guy like a Shields or Kershaw (who at one time was out their in the rumor mill) then you focus on LF and SS. This team has prospects at its disposal and should use them to obtain their needs. This club has a huge opportunity to regain the Central Division and should take this opportunity to capitalize on that. Brewers might be without Prince and Braun; Cards are without Pujols; and frankly the Cubs are the Cubs.. They could have all three of those players and find ways to lose. The Reds should be trying to fill the GABP seats and obtain some talent for once.

I hate to say it but Frazier, Sappelt, Heisey, Alonso, Grandal, & Francisco all are not going to be everyday starters so why continuously hang on to them so that their value never peaks as high as it might be now. Walt's supposed to be this master mind but witnessed this club go from winning the division to not even hitting .500. It's pathetic being a Reds fan when this club preaches about winning but does nothing to win.