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View Full Version : Braun wins appeal, no suspension



takealeake
02-23-2012, 05:15 PM
Lucky jerk. Bet if he weren't MVP he wouldn't have gotten off.

BREAKING NEWS

Ryan Braun has won his appeal of a positive drug test and his 50-game suspension has been overturned, according to the Milwaukee Journal-Sentinel.

tedies
02-23-2012, 05:19 PM
Hmm so much for the 0 tolerance rule... Good thing for him Bud Selig is a huge Brewers fan. This is pretty BS if you ask me

takealeake
02-23-2012, 05:22 PM
Hmm so much for the 0 tolerance rule... Good thing for him Bud Selig is a huge Brewers fan. This is pretty BS if you ask me

Word is it was because he was taking medication for herpes. Well there's something for opposing fans to ride on him for now.

Jefferson24
02-23-2012, 05:26 PM
New rule: win MVP and you get a different set of rules than everyone else.

texasdave
02-23-2012, 05:28 PM
Word is it was because he was taking medication for herpes. Well there's something for opposing fans to ride on him for now.

If he was taking it for medicinal purposes he still was supposed to get a waiver. And if he had a valid waiver then we should never have heard of this. I call 'shenanigans'.

Jefferson24
02-23-2012, 05:36 PM
If he was taking it for medicinal purposes he still was supposed to get a waiver. And if he had a valid waiver then we should never have heard of this. I call 'shenanigans'.

There are a few reasons I can think of that he didn't request a waiver and those are he either wasn't taking it for herpes or he was taking something in addition to the herpes medicine that is unrelated to the condition and he knew was illegal. Why in the world would you chance something like that if you weren't doing anything wrong?

texasdave
02-23-2012, 06:07 PM
Someone familiar with the decision said the appeal went Braun's way not so much on contesting the result of the test but the testing process itself. And it was arbitrator Shyam Das who decided to rule in favor on that technicality, making it a 2-1 decision by the three-man panel.

[deleted]
02-23-2012, 06:11 PM
Interesting. Primarily, though, Reds fans should be concerned with the impact this ha on our season. Which is huge.

Jefferson24
02-23-2012, 06:12 PM
Sound like he tested positive but got off on a technicality. A courier didn't mail the test in Saturday night and instead waited until Monday morning because he thought the building was already closed - this is being said by a source with knowledge of the testimony according to someone on ESPN.

Ohayou
02-23-2012, 06:13 PM
Isn't that the same guy who sided with Kenny Rogers in the camera man attack case and John Rocker?

PedroBourbon
02-23-2012, 06:32 PM
Sound like he tested positive but got off on a technicality. A courier didn't mail the test in Saturday night and instead waited until Monday morning because he thought the building was already closed - this is being said by a source with knowledge of the testimony according to someone on ESPN.

Kinda like getting out of a traffic ticket b/c the cop missed 1 digit on your license plate or wrote the wrong street name down. Doesn't mean you didn't do it.......

takealeake
02-23-2012, 06:36 PM
So apparently the pee was left in a fridge because the courier thought the place was closed on a Saturday. Not that leaving it in the fridge caused testosterone spikes or anythingm but that's what he got off on.

texasdave
02-23-2012, 06:46 PM
Haudricourt says the appeal went Braun's way not because of the test result, but because of a technicality with the testing process. CBSSports.com's Jon Heyman and The New York Post's Joel Sherman report that part of Braun's argument was that the sample was not shipped in a timely fashion and that the chain of custody was broken for two days, meaning the sample was left unprotected (Twitter links). Independent arbitrator Shyam Das ruled in favor of the technicality, giving him the win by a 2-1 margin.

So let me get this straight. Braun is alleging that even though nobody knew he was being tested because of confidentiality and even though nobody would have any freaking idea where this courier lived and even though nobody would have known the sample had not been delivered in a timely manner, that someone MAY HAVE tampered with the sample? So someone, on the off chance that the courier did not deliver the sample as required, broke into the courier's residence and tampered with the sample? Or maybe one of the courier's friends was over, went into the fridge for a brew, saw a plastic bottle with yellow liquid in it and R. Braun markered on the outside, put two and two together, was a big Reds or
Cardinals fan and tampered with the sample. Puhlease!
Ryan Braun = cheating dog.

Jefferson24
02-23-2012, 07:01 PM
How in the world can he honestly claim he is innocent? He should come out and proclaim himself "not guilty".

Mutaman
02-23-2012, 07:40 PM
Baseball in the Bud Lite era. Let's give him another raise.

NCCardfan
02-23-2012, 08:29 PM
So let me get this straight. Braun is alleging that even though nobody knew he was being tested because of confidentiality and even though nobody would have any freaking idea where this courier lived and even though nobody would have known the sample had not been delivered in a timely manner, that someone MAY HAVE tampered with the sample? So someone, on the off chance that the courier did not deliver the sample as required, broke into the courier's residence and tampered with the sample? Or maybe one of the courier's friends was over, went into the fridge for a brew, saw a plastic bottle with yellow liquid in it and R. Braun markered on the outside, put two and two together, was a big Reds or
Cardinals fan and tampered with the sample. Puhlease!
Ryan Braun = cheating dog.

:lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:
Thanks for the chuckle, I needed that Dave. This whole thing has a stench from top to bottom. What a crock of crud - the smell of Selig is all over this one.

Braun gets off on a technicality:thumbdown:
MLB 'officially' gets to say that they 'vehemently disagree' with the decision:thumbdown::thumbdown:
Bud Selig gets to laugh once he gets home tonight and for the first 50 games:thumbdown::thumbdown::thumbdown:


This stinks, my thoughts are stronger than that but don't want to get banned;)

Ohayou
02-23-2012, 08:37 PM
Instead of being a reactionary you-know-what like the rest of the board, I'll wait to hear all the details before I pass judgment.

George Foster
02-23-2012, 08:56 PM
I can make an argument that being in the posession of the tester over a weekend is safer than in the fed-ex drop box outside a Wallgreens.

Braun never questioned the results. He's a juicer, plain and simple. He got off on a technicality. Happy Birthday!

His numbers this year will be way down...count on it. He will have to stay clean this year.

joshua
02-23-2012, 10:02 PM
The thing is, tests before have been kept until monday because Fed Ex has closed. The whole "shipped as soon as possible" thing is where he gets off scot free. I can't believe he's getting away with this.

2011 NL MVP*

AintlifeGrande
02-23-2012, 10:05 PM
Instead of being a reactionary you-know-what like the rest of the board, I'll wait to hear all the details before I pass judgment.

Quite a detailed discourse going on in the ORG.

AintlifeGrande
02-23-2012, 10:08 PM
And the Invertebrate that is Bud Selig continue's.

AintlifeGrande
02-23-2012, 10:15 PM
Baseball in the Bud Lite era. Let's give him another raise.

This.


They mine as well find a way to get Manny's suspension dropped as well.

LeDoux
02-23-2012, 11:04 PM
I am not sure I understand the issue. What is difference between the sample being in the courier's possession for two days or two hours? If Braun is claiming the sample was intentionally tainted, wouldn't this opportunity arise every time a courier obtains custody for any reasonable length if time?

Perhaps the refrigeration process invalidated the sample? I really do not understand Braun’s alternative theory.

Jefferson24
02-23-2012, 11:15 PM
I am not sure I understand the issue. What is difference between the sample being in the courier's possession for two days or two hours? If Braun is claiming the sample was intentionally tainted, wouldn't this opportunity arise every time a courier obtains custody for any reasonable length if time?

Perhaps the refrigeration process invalidated the sample? I really do not understand Braunís alternative theory.

Refrigerating it isn't going to account for the fact that they found synthetic testosterone in the sample. In order for him to claim innocence he must take the position that the sample was altered, but I didn't read that he is saying that. This is clearly a procedural issue and he is clearly not innocent.

joshua
02-23-2012, 11:40 PM
I have a feeling that if it were a replacement level player who tested positive NOT the reigning NL MVP, FedEx or no FedEx, this suspension wouldn't be overturned.

Mutaman
02-23-2012, 11:43 PM
Personally I wish Braun would have been found guilty and suspended for the next 10 years. But as far as complaining about him getting off on a technicality- its called Due Process of law and its a silly rule that comes out of that constitution everyone keeps yapping about. It requires that people who enforce the rules do it with a certain level of competence. Its sort of based on the idea that its better that 10 guilty guys go free rather than one innocent guy gets convicted.

Since I always figure I will be that innocent guy, I sort of like the concept.

joshua
02-23-2012, 11:50 PM
http://espn.go.com/mlb/story/_/id/7608360/ryan-braun-wins-appeal-50-game-suspension


According to one of the sources, the collector, after getting Braun's sample, was supposed to take the sample to a FedEx Office for shipping.

But the source said the collector thought the FedEx Office was closed because it was late on a Saturday and felt the sample wouldn't get shipped until Monday.

As has occurred in some other instances, the collector took the sample home and kept it in a cool place, in his basement at his residence in Wisconsin, according to the source.

Policy states that the sample is supposed to get to FedEx as soon as possible.

Braun's initial T/E ratio was more than 20:1. Sources previously confirmed synthetic testosterone in his system. A source says MLB is livid and is considering options and other comment.

The source told ESPN the seals were totally intact and testing never reflected any degradation of the sample. Based on the World Anti-Doping Agency code, this is exactly what would have been expected to happen, and the collector took the proper action, the source said.

The source also noted that synthetic testosterone doesn't just show up because a sample sits in one place or another.

Travis Tygart, chief executive officer of the U.S. Anti-Doping Agency, called the decision "a real gut-kick to clean athletes."

"To have this sort of technicality of all technicalities let a player off ... it's just a sad day for all the clean players and those that abide by the rules within professional baseball," he said.

And some pretty strong words from MLB:

http://mlb.sbnation.com/2012/2/23/2820119/ryan-braun-appeal-suspension-mlb-statement/in/2391077

joshua
02-23-2012, 11:54 PM
Personally I wish Braun would have been found guilty and suspended for the next 10 years. But as far as complaining about him getting off on a technicality- its called Due Process of law and its a silly rule that comes out of that constitution everyone keeps yapping about. It requires that people who enforce the rules do it with a certain level of competence. Its sort of based on the idea that its better that 10 guilty guys go free rather than one innocent guy gets convicted.

Since I always figure I will be that innocent guy, I sort of like the concept.

But the same process being in place for other players who get tested later at night, they can still be suspended. He walks because his test is an hour late? The goal is to find those using PEDs and punish them. When you're working the rules to get away with exactly that, it does nothing to help baseball.

And due process applies to the constitution: Not to professional baseball. if I fail a drug test at my job, I'm done. Fired. No due process.

texasdave
02-24-2012, 12:04 AM
x

Stray
02-24-2012, 12:10 AM
Well he's not suspended for 50 games but he sure as heck looks guilty.

I think we're better than they are regardless, but it does irk me that a cheater gets off on a technicality.

Mutaman
02-24-2012, 01:27 AM
But the same process being in place for other players who get tested later at night, they can still be suspended. He walks because his test is an hour late? The goal is to find those using PEDs and punish them. When you're working the rules to get away with exactly that, it does nothing to help baseball.

And due process applies to the constitution: Not to professional baseball. if I fail a drug test at my job, I'm done. Fired. No due process.

Braun belongs to a union that negotiated a contract that requires that drug testing be done according to certain procedures. If management is to incompetent too follow those procedures, than Braun gets to walk. It has nothing to do with your job or what you perceive will help baseball.

Life is hard.

joshua
02-24-2012, 01:37 AM
But, as I said: Other players get tested late on Saturday nights and their samples are kept in refrigerators or basements until monday morning. If they tested positive, they would be suspended. To allow him to continue to play based on a technicality does nothing but hurt the game and bring back the ghosts of 1998. And there wasn't a decision on whether a contract was broken, the decision was voted on based on whether or not the samples were valid. In the instance of a player being tested later on a Saturday than Braun, he would be suspended 50 games. But based on him being tested before a f'n Kinko's closes let's him continue to play baseball and have a ban overturned? You have to admit that this is weak.

Mutaman
02-24-2012, 02:00 AM
But, as I said: Other players get tested late on Saturday nights and their samples are kept in refrigerators or basements until monday morning. If they tested positive, they would be suspended. To allow him to continue to play based on a technicality does nothing but hurt the game and bring back the ghosts of 1998. And there wasn't a decision on whether a contract was broken, the decision was voted on based on whether or not the samples were valid. In the instance of a player being tested later on a Saturday than Braun, he would be suspended 50 games. But based on him being tested before a f'n Kinko's closes let's him continue to play baseball and have a ban overturned? You have to admit that this is weak.

Maybe. WE'll have to see what the facts end up being, if they ever come out. And I share your frustration because I'd like to think Braun was cheating and should be punished. But if the collector didn't do his job properly and did not follow proper procedure, then the punishment should not stand.

Since these guys are also testing Votto and Bruce, i want to make sure that the tests are done properly.

Jr's Boy
02-24-2012, 02:07 AM
Says a lot for the mlb courier service when they think Fed Ex is closed,much less not thinking the package would be shipped till Monday.Likely excuse,sounds shady to me.

joshua
02-24-2012, 02:22 AM
The thing is, reading a couple of Yahoo articles on this, they both said that the Fed Ex WAS closed. Also, WADA representatives say that results are kept overnight ALL THE TIME. From boxers, to olympic athletes to baseball players, this is not unusual at all. They didn't find a loop hole in drug testing procedures, they found a semi-loop hole in MLBs new drug enforcement rules and attacked it. Any player who tested positive who's test was ever held overnight could appeal now using this scenario. MLB is frantically rewriting it to fix the problem.

Jefferson24
02-24-2012, 08:15 AM
MLB is frantically rewriting it to fix the problem.

But wouldn't the players union have to agree to change the current rules? I think that is unlikely to happen. They simply won't be doing any more sampling too late in the day if there is any chance the Fed Ex office could be closed.

swaisuc
02-24-2012, 08:58 AM
Braun belongs to a union that negotiated a contract that requires that drug testing be done according to certain procedures. If management is to incompetent too follow those procedures, than Braun gets to walk. It has nothing to do with your job or what you perceive will help baseball.

Life is hard.

Just curious. Do you actually believe if another union player's test had been handled the same way (probably happened many times, but who knows) they would not be suspended right now?

ervinsm84
02-24-2012, 08:59 AM
hmmm

http://mlblogsclemsongirlbaseball.files.wordpress.com/2009/04/ryanbrauntakesoffhisshirt.jpg

Fireball
02-24-2012, 09:07 AM
After reading all of the information regarding the testing, it's pretty not hard to fall on on the side where Braun is guilty. I think the arbitrator did what he had to do if the proper procedures were not following, but Braun doesn't come out of this looking like anything but a cheater. He just doesn't have to miss 50 games.

This is not good for baseball, not at all.

brm7675
02-24-2012, 11:34 AM
So let me get this straight. Braun is alleging that even though nobody knew he was being tested because of confidentiality and even though nobody would have any freaking idea where this courier lived and even though nobody would have known the sample had not been delivered in a timely manner, that someone MAY HAVE tampered with the sample? So someone, on the off chance that the courier did not deliver the sample as required, broke into the courier's residence and tampered with the sample? Or maybe one of the courier's friends was over, went into the fridge for a brew, saw a plastic bottle with yellow liquid in it and R. Braun markered on the outside, put two and two together, was a big Reds or
Cardinals fan and tampered with the sample. Puhlease!
Ryan Braun = cheating dog.

What if the courier tainted it? What if it sitting over the weekend caused problems. This is all on MLB, if you are going to have a drug testing policy then you MUST make sure the samples are "ALL" handled in the same way and in a quick and professional manner.

bounty37h
02-24-2012, 11:35 AM
If he was taking it for medicinal purposes he still was supposed to get a waiver. And if he had a valid waiver then we should never have heard of this. I call 'shenanigans'.

+ 1,000,000,000.....I don't buy this "I didnt know what it was", or even "it was for a condition" crap players try. If you have to take anything for anything, you need to gt it checked and cleared. If you dont go that route, I have to assume your hiding something.

brm7675
02-24-2012, 11:37 AM
But, as I said: Other players get tested late on Saturday nights and their samples are kept in refrigerators or basements until monday morning. If they tested positive, they would be suspended. To allow him to continue to play based on a technicality does nothing but hurt the game and bring back the ghosts of 1998. And there wasn't a decision on whether a contract was broken, the decision was voted on based on whether or not the samples were valid. In the instance of a player being tested later on a Saturday than Braun, he would be suspended 50 games. But based on him being tested before a f'n Kinko's closes let's him continue to play baseball and have a ban overturned? You have to admit that this is weak.

those samples are kept in "safe and secure" locations...NOT BOBS fridge in his apt. Did Braun get one over on MLB, maybe, but if MLB had a process that was fair and safe then he wouldn't have...sorry MLB, not Ryan Braun are the idiots here.

brm7675
02-24-2012, 11:41 AM
We all have to move past if he did or didn't use, the issue is was the test taken correctly, handled correctly and such and it wasn't. MLB screw this one up, the guy keeping the "test" in his house screwed up.

Also do you all actually believe that not one single Red isn't taking something? Come on people drugs and sports go hand in hand and always will, it's not a big deal.

goreds2
02-24-2012, 12:08 PM
The real courts will come down when he is not elected to the Hall of Fame. :thumbup:

brad1176
02-24-2012, 12:08 PM
We all have to move past if he did or didn't use, the issue is was the test taken correctly, handled correctly and such and it wasn't. MLB screw this one up, the guy keeping the "test" in his house screwed up.

Also do you all actually believe that not one single Red isn't taking something? Come on people drugs and sports go hand in hand and always will, it's not a big deal.

I agree, it's a game of who gets caught and who doesn't. Remember, our very own Bronson Arroyo took androstenedione and amphetamines when he was with Boston. He still takes a witches brew of supplements, many of which are not certified through MLB. And, let's not forget about Volquez, although I wish we could....

LeDoux
02-24-2012, 12:36 PM
We all have to move past if he did or didn't use, the issue is was the test taken correctly, handled correctly and such and it wasn't. MLB screw this one up, the guy keeping the "test" in his house screwed up.



I strongly disagree with perspective. I believe the ONLY thing that matters in this case is if he used or he didn't. Braun has a right to challenge evidence, and just maybe he had a stronger case than the media presents. But guilt or innocence is the only worthwhile question here. The more "the rules" are seperated from the principle of justice the sicker out society becomes.

texasdave
02-24-2012, 01:37 PM
x

BuckeyeRed27
02-24-2012, 02:09 PM
The last article I read said the courier kept the test for 2 days. I'm not going to pretend to know enough about the procedure and the science behind it, but that does seem a little weird. It doesn't explain why the test failed with a super high amount of testosterone, but it is interesting.

Also it has been reported that he took 3 or 4 drug tests last year. Why would he have passed all the other ones and then failed one so badly? Got lucky on the other ones maybe?

brm7675
02-24-2012, 02:11 PM
I strongly disagree with perspective. I believe the ONLY thing that matters in this case is if he used or he didn't. Braun has a right to challenge evidence, and just maybe he had a stronger case than the media presents. But guilt or innocence is the only worthwhile question here. The more "the rules" are seperated from the principle of justice the sicker out society becomes.

this whole idea that "testing" is going to stop athletes from using is flawed, they are going to use, have used and will continue to use...I am not sure why it matters.

takealeake
02-24-2012, 02:37 PM
The last article I read said the courier kept the test for 2 days. I'm not going to pretend to know enough about the procedure and the science behind it, but that does seem a little weird. It doesn't explain why the test failed with a super high amount of testosterone, but it is interesting.

Also it has been reported that he took 3 or 4 drug tests last year. Why would he have passed all the other ones and then failed one so badly? Got lucky on the other ones maybe?

Just listening to an hour of whoever is subbing in for Rome on the Jim Rome show. Talked to about 4 or 5 guys, a guy called in who was head of testing for some airlines or something and said it's totally common procedure for things to be held like that, and it wasn't a strange occurance at all. But the fact that it's a CONTRACT issue, and the letter of the law between MLB and the Players Union and it wasn't handled to that standard is what he got off on, not the fact that how his sample was handled was strange in general or anything.

BuckeyeRed27
02-24-2012, 03:03 PM
Just listening to an hour of whoever is subbing in for Rome on the Jim Rome show. Talked to about 4 or 5 guys, a guy called in who was head of testing for some airlines or something and said it's totally common procedure for things to be held like that, and it wasn't a strange occurance at all. But the fact that it's a CONTRACT issue, and the letter of the law between MLB and the Players Union and it wasn't handled to that standard is what he got off on, not the fact that how his sample was handled was strange in general or anything.

Well that's good to know I suppose, but it still doesn't answer why the guy held onto the sample for 2 days. I assume they use couriers that know the policy so why didn't he go the next morning and get it taken care of?

brm7675
02-24-2012, 03:04 PM
Just listening to an hour of whoever is subbing in for Rome on the Jim Rome show. Talked to about 4 or 5 guys, a guy called in who was head of testing for some airlines or something and said it's totally common procedure for things to be held like that, and it wasn't a strange occurance at all. But the fact that it's a CONTRACT issue, and the letter of the law between MLB and the Players Union and it wasn't handled to that standard is what he got off on, not the fact that how his sample was handled was strange in general or anything.

I'm sorry but I think it is very strange that someone would take home a drug sample and keep it at their home all weekend. I can see it being "stored" at a secure facility for a weekend, but at some guys house...sorry but I would fight that also.

bounty37h
02-24-2012, 03:19 PM
this whole idea that "testing" is going to stop athletes from using is flawed, they are going to use, have used and will continue to use...I am not sure why it matters.

It matters cause its an unfair disadvantage to those who do not want to harm their body with those substances-many of which are illegal.

joshua
02-24-2012, 03:26 PM
I'm sorry but I think it is very strange that someone would take home a drug sample and keep it at their home all weekend. I can see it being "stored" at a secure facility for a weekend, but at some guys house...sorry but I would fight that also.

Its totally normal and happens ALL of the time with tests like this since they are done randomly, 24/7. Two independent companies both said the sample was in good condition and not tampered with.

smixsell
02-24-2012, 03:41 PM
Absolute joke of a decision.

texasdave
02-24-2012, 04:45 PM
this whole idea that "testing" is going to stop athletes from using is flawed, they are going to use, have used and will continue to use...I am not sure why it matters.

It matters because it gives the cheating dogs an unfair advantage. I would think that would be pretty easily understood. I guess not.

joshua
02-24-2012, 07:39 PM
Well that's good to know I suppose, but it still doesn't answer why the guy held onto the sample for 2 days. I assume they use couriers that know the policy so why didn't he go the next morning and get it taken care of?

Because FedEx doesnt ship on Sundays. Neither does UPS.

Sent from my ADR6300 using Tapatalk

texasdave
02-25-2012, 02:17 AM
http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/story/_/page/OTL-Ryan-Braun/ryan-braun-defense-raises-more-questions-doping-experts

Ryan Braun = cheating dog.

joe51391
02-25-2012, 02:13 PM
PED's get you a MVP

LeDoux
02-25-2012, 06:01 PM
[url]

Ryan Braun = cheating dog.

How dare you!

Since an MLB employee used two extra commas when he created his report on Braun's tests results; and since the courier had spilled coffee on his sleeve that very morning - Ryan Braun should be viewed as a hero, a patriot, and the patron saint of Baseball. Forshame ye speak ill of him!

RedsfaninMT
02-25-2012, 07:33 PM
The last article I read said the courier kept the test for 2 days. I'm not going to pretend to know enough about the procedure and the science behind it, but that does seem a little weird. It doesn't explain why the test failed with a super high amount of testosterone, but it is interesting.

Also it has been reported that he took 3 or 4 drug tests last year. Why would he have passed all the other ones and then failed one so badly? Got lucky on the other ones maybe?

Not that I'm particularly proud of it, but a tumor and age have resulted in my having to take daily testosterone. My Doctor has repeatedly tested me the day after I take testosterone, then again several days after, and you can see the dip in the testosterone very quickly. Braun could have been test earlier in the season and passed, then used testosterone later in the season for an energy boost, and gotten unlucky to have been tested the day after he received a testosterone injection, which to me would explain the unusually high numbers...which (again) go down very rapidly.