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View Full Version : Would you move Heisey for a setup man today?



SirFelixCat
03-26-2012, 06:15 PM
Over in the Chapman to the BP thread, this was brought up.


IMO, this seems like a logical, non-panic move that helps shore up perceived weakness w/ the loss of Madson and deals a player that many feel is a 4th OF. Obviously, not just any arm, but a veteran, consistent, high quality reliever.

With Frazier looking good in ST (small sample size yadda yadda), he can fill in w/ Ludwick in LF and keeps Frazier on the 25-man.

Will M said:


Madson - out for the year.
Chapman - concerns regarding whether he can start or not.
Bailey & Arroyo - not looking good this spring.

What say you?

reds1869
03-26-2012, 06:17 PM
If the setup man is of a high quality, yes. I wouldn't just deal Heisey for anyone with the label "setup man."

Ron Madden
03-26-2012, 06:23 PM
No there's no reason to panic just yet.

SirFelixCat
03-26-2012, 06:25 PM
No there's no reason to panic just yet.

But is it panicking if there is a legit BP arm that helps? Personally, I'm a fan of Heisey's, but he hasn't shown that he is much more than a 4th OF. Plus, it ensures that Chapman can continue to grow as a SP and allows Frazier (who, imo, is much more valuable than Heisey) to stay w/ the club instead of wasting away in Louisville.

Ron Madden
03-26-2012, 06:29 PM
I don't wanna see Walt trade anything of value for 50 or so innings of middle relief pitching. That's just my humble opinion

kaldaniels
03-26-2012, 06:33 PM
A simple no will suffice for my answer. (No "lets wait and see" qualifier needed) If Heisey is what I think he is (a slightly above average OF), I would only trade him for a Marshall-type set-up man.

Tom Servo
03-26-2012, 06:38 PM
If the setup man is of a high quality, yes. I wouldn't just deal Heisey for anyone with the label "setup man."
Pretty much this. Depends on the reliever.

Kc61
03-26-2012, 06:46 PM
I don't wanna see Walt trade anything of value for 50 or so innings of middle relief pitching. That's just my humble opinion

Nick Masset threw 76, 76 and 70 innings in the last three years.

He pitched in 74, 82, and 75 games in the last three years.

And in the last two of those years, he wasn't that great.

So a good reliever isn't throwing just 50 innings necessarily.

The problem with moving Heisey is that Stubbs needs relief in CF. Stubbs was overused last season. He needs a replacement when tough righties are throwing.

But adding a good reliever is a good idea. It isn't panicking to fill an obvious hole, unless you trade for poor quality. Wouldn't want that.

Ron Madden
03-26-2012, 06:57 PM
Nick Masset threw 76, 76 and 70 innings in the last three years.

He pitched in 74, 82, and 75 games in the last three years.

And in the last two of those years, he wasn't that great.

So a good reliever isn't throwing just 50 innings necessarily.

The problem with moving Heisey is that Stubbs needs relief in CF. Stubbs was overused last season. He needs a replacement when tough righties are throwing.

But adding a good reliever is a good idea. It isn't panicking to fill an obvious hole, unless you trade for poor quality. Wouldn't want that.

You've been saying all along that the Reds need another LH pitcher in the pen and you would even move Chapman into that roll. How many innings has Dusty given to LH relief pitchers since he's been the Manager of the Reds?

Kc61
03-26-2012, 07:06 PM
You've been saying all along that the Reds need another LH pitcher in the pen and you would even move Chapman into that roll. How many innings has Dusty given to LH relief pitchers since he's been the Manager of the Reds?

I don't recall specifying that another reliever has to be left handed. I just think they are thin in the pen right now. I don't see how the Reds go a full season at this point without employing guys like Fisher, Mahay, etc. to hold down the fort.

I'm a big fan of multi-inning relievers, my preference would be to add a guy who can do that. Or a closer, probably too expensive.

Ron Madden
03-26-2012, 07:10 PM
It's my opinion the Reds bullpen will be fine as is. I see no reason to trade anything of value for another bullpen arm. Why don't we wait a few weeks and see how it plays out?

Kc61
03-26-2012, 07:16 PM
It's my opinion the Reds bullpen will be fine as is. I see no reason to trade anything of value for another bullpen arm. Why don't we wait a few weeks and see how it plays out?

I see several problems with the pitching staff, particularly if Chapman is in the minors.

I would try to fix one or two of these problems as soon as possible. There is no deadline, you're right. The only thing bad that can happen in the meantime is losses.

Ron Madden
03-26-2012, 07:22 PM
And trading value for another bullpen arm is guaranteeing wins?

Edd Roush
03-26-2012, 07:25 PM
I hate to see that we trade Heisey and then Bruce, Ludwick or Stubbs goes down for an extended period. I may not like Heisey's OBP on a daily basis, but I still prefer him strongly over Denis Phipps (and his BABIP magic) or journeyman Daryl Jones. This is partially why I was so big on signing Manny earlier. We have no corner outfield depth behind Heisey. No way do I want to deal him when relievers are very volatile and while the Reds don't have an abundance of Madson-level talent, but they do have a lot of league average arms and some with upside to be plus arms to go along with Marshall.

Caveat Emperor
03-26-2012, 09:00 PM
Heisey is a 4th OF who has shown himself to be incapable of answering the bell every day when called on to start.

Guys like him are a dime a dozen. Get help for the bullpen.

757690
03-26-2012, 09:37 PM
The Reds can surely find a decent pen arm off of waivers in these last weeks of Spring Training, if they feel they really need one. No need to trade for one.

reds44
03-26-2012, 09:43 PM
Heisey is a 4th OF who has shown himself to be incapable of answering the bell every day when called on to start.

Guys like him are a dime a dozen. Get help for the bullpen.

And middle relievers aren't?

Phhhl
03-26-2012, 09:46 PM
I would probably not deal Heisey right now. However, if the Reds were considering it, Atlanta has been asking around for outfield help (Wil Venable) and is absolutely loaded with bullpen arms. What if they could get someone like Medlen or Venters for him?

Gallen5862
03-26-2012, 10:09 PM
http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/

Cubs Release Trever Miller
By Ben Nicholson-Smith [March 26 at 3:03pm CST]

Miller, who turns 39 in May, posted a 3.80 ERA with 5.1 K/9, 5.1 BB/9 and a 38% ground ball rate in 21 1/3 innings for the Cardinals, Blue Jays, and Red Sox in 2011. He started the season in St. Louis, went to Toronto in a July trade, and signed with Boston after the Blue Jays released him.

edabbs44
03-26-2012, 10:12 PM
I wouldn't be scared to.

RedsManRick
03-26-2012, 10:43 PM
For a really solid arm, yes. Solid as in closer potential. But not for just a guy.

Sea Ray
03-26-2012, 10:50 PM
It all depends on who the reliever is. If it's Coco, probably not

RedsManRick
03-26-2012, 11:02 PM
What about Sergio Romo. Would the Giants do that? I mean, they're giving Aubrey Huff reps in LF...

757690
03-26-2012, 11:23 PM
Ludwick was pulled from tonight's game. All that was reported was that he's sick. This could alter the picture a bit.

corkedbat
03-27-2012, 01:50 AM
I chose other. I'm not deadset against moving Heisey, but I'd want to move Homer for an OF bat.

REDREAD
03-27-2012, 02:11 AM
I hate to see that we trade Heisey and then Bruce, Ludwick or Stubbs goes down for an extended period. .

Yes, that's why I am voting no too.
The Reds are really only 4 deep in the OF.. they need Heisey or someone like him.

Caveat Emperor
03-27-2012, 09:43 AM
For a really solid arm, yes. Solid as in closer potential. But not for just a guy.

Heisey is just a guy. You're probably going to get just a guy in return.

IslandRed
03-27-2012, 10:34 AM
I'd consider it with these caveats:

* That the Reds have already decided Ludwick will be the primary left fielder and Heisey's role will be as a backup, so the production given up will be that of a part-time player.

* The reliever is actually pretty good.

* We would need to scrounge another outfielder who (1) can handle center field, (2) preferably hits left-handed and (3) is not named Corey Patterson.

Sea Ray
03-27-2012, 11:04 AM
I'd consider it with these caveats:


* The reliever is actually pretty good.



You really can't ask a poll question like this unless we know who the reliever is, so your point above is a huge one.

Will M
03-27-2012, 04:48 PM
i read that the Nats & Braves are interested in Marlon Byrd. either team could be a fit if we decided to trade Heisey for a pitcher

Dan
03-27-2012, 05:06 PM
No.

Benihana
03-27-2012, 06:45 PM
I would not. But I would also keep Chapman in the rotation.

Between Marshall, Masset, Arredondo, Bray et al, I think they can manage the bullpen on their own.