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View Full Version : This team is in bad shape.



joe51391
04-11-2012, 12:31 AM
I know we are only 5 games in but look at the big picture here. Drew Stubbs looks absolutely horrible at the plate, Bailey is to inconsistant, there is no true closer although I think Marshall will be just fine, Rolen will be lucky to play 110 games, no legit LF who has had sucsess lately, a GM who has 3 lefty batters on the whole team who traded our future lh 3rd baseman away for a bullpen arm and for years now who has not addressed the 1 hole or 4 hole in the line-up who also gave a 12 yes 12 year $225 million contract to votto who i'm glad they signed but 12 years what if he gets hurt like jr, then gives a 2nd baseman a 6 year $72.5 million contract who is aging fast, all managed by the worst manager I've ever seen. With only 17000 people going to see a big rivalery game and all I've just said is a recipe for disaster. The future does not look good and something has to be done.

DGullett35
04-11-2012, 01:53 AM
All your questions were answered in your first sentence."I know we are only 5 games in" and the big picture is this team will be fine. Give it some time. Bailey wasn't horrible after the first inning. Cueto looks like the ace we envisioned, and Arroyo had his best start in over a year(at least for 6 innings). Pitching and defense win games and by all accounts other than Latos(who will be fine), and Arredondo in the pen this pitching staff has been good(also Simon had 1 rough inning). We will know how good this team is by May 15. the only thing I'm worried about and you touched on it is the 4 spot in the order. that does worry me. I think Rolen is better than he was last year but he would be better off in the 6 or 7 spot. I wish Dusty would at least try bruce in the 4 hole. He has to do something to start this offense. I would love for Brandon to hit there but we have no leadoff hitter.

Maker_84
04-11-2012, 02:11 AM
This what happens when management does nothing to upgrade a bad offense in the offseason. Losing Madson and Masset have absolutely killed the bullpen and prevented Chapman from taking Bailey or Arroyos spot in the rotation. Im not even the gonna mention our manager because i think everyone already knows how bad he is. The cardinal's are just a much better team in all areas because of this. 85 wins is the ceiling

wabashfalcon
04-11-2012, 03:36 AM
I know we are only 5 games in but look at the big picture here. Drew Stubbs looks absolutely horrible at the plate, Bailey is to inconsistant, there is no true closer although I think Marshall will be just fine, Rolen will be lucky to play 110 games, no legit LF who has had sucsess lately, a GM who has 3 lefty batters on the whole team who traded our future lh 3rd baseman away for a bullpen arm and for years now who has not addressed the 1 hole or 4 hole in the line-up who also gave a 12 yes 12 year $225 million contract to votto who i'm glad they signed but 12 years what if he gets hurt like jr, then gives a 2nd baseman a 6 year $72.5 million contract who is aging fast, all managed by the worst manager I've ever seen. With only 17000 people going to see a big rivalery game and all I've just said is a recipe for disaster. The future does not look good and something has to be done.

Relax. Pop a Xanex. All will be fine.

wabashfalcon
04-11-2012, 03:44 AM
I know we are only 5 games in but look at the big picture here. Drew Stubbs looks absolutely horrible at the plate, Bailey is to inconsistant, there is no true closer although I think Marshall will be just fine, Rolen will be lucky to play 110 games, no legit LF who has had sucsess lately, a GM who has 3 lefty batters on the whole team who traded our future lh 3rd baseman away for a bullpen arm and for years now who has not addressed the 1 hole or 4 hole in the line-up who also gave a 12 yes 12 year $225 million contract to votto who i'm glad they signed but 12 years what if he gets hurt like jr, then gives a 2nd baseman a 6 year $72.5 million contract who is aging fast, all managed by the worst manager I've ever seen. With only 17000 people going to see a big rivalery game and all I've just said is a recipe for disaster. The future does not look good and something has to be done.

Relax. Pop a Xanex. All will be fine.

Mutaman
04-11-2012, 06:04 AM
Gee, I'm shocked- several people have now addressed the lack of left handed bats on this team as a real problem. A problem that was addressed by signing Ryan Ludwick? A problem that most fans would resolve by bring up Frazer? I am no longer a voice crying in the wilderness. Unfortunately its probably too late to do anything about this now.

Mutaman
04-11-2012, 06:11 AM
all managed by the worst manager I've ever seen. .


Please! Were you around for Jerry Naron? Not to mention Bob Boone or Ray Knight.

We've got enough problems without the hyperbole.

texasdave
04-11-2012, 06:44 AM
Gee, I'm shocked- several people have now addressed the lack of left handed bats on this team as a real problem. A problem that was addressed by signing Ryan Ludwick? A problem that most fans would resolve by bring up Frazer? I am no longer a voice crying in the wilderness. Unfortunately its probably too late to do anything about this now.

I want to know what changed so drastically from the time they were putting their team together for 2012 and the signings of Votto and Phillips to contract extensions for roughly 300 million? What do they know now that they didn't know then? If these contract extensions are being fueled by expected future television revenues they must have had an inkling back in December/January. Right? Seth Smith would have been a nice addition in left field. Instead, they poor-mouthed and shopped in the bargain bin to come up with Ryan Ludwick. They moaned that they couldn't afford a Roy Oswalt and ended up with Jeff Francis and Brett Tomko. To me there is a serious disconnect here.

jhu1321
04-11-2012, 07:54 AM
Who is Steve Smith?

texasdave
04-11-2012, 07:58 AM
Who is Steve Smith?

It is too early. I meant Seth Smith.

will5979
04-11-2012, 08:09 AM
Who is Steve Smith?

WR for the Panthers, or the WR for the Giants?

texasdave
04-11-2012, 08:19 AM
Who is Steve Smith?


More importantly, who is Mike Jones?

will5979
04-11-2012, 08:32 AM
More importantly, who is Mike Jones?

A rapper?

cincyforever
04-11-2012, 09:58 AM
or the WR for the Giants?
He now plays for the Rams :)

bigredmechanism
04-11-2012, 10:16 AM
More importantly, who is Mike Jones?

WHO?

Jr's Boy
04-11-2012, 11:17 AM
Mt biggest concern is the SP.Of course you have to give it a month at least to figure out where we stand.

UPRedsFan
04-11-2012, 11:47 AM
Chill Reds fans. The Cards won't keep this up. Their lineup is old. I can't believe Berkman, Beltran and Furcal will make it thru 162 games. Their rotation is fair but won't hold together without Carpenter and Wainwright's got a rebound year to get thru. Lohse is their ace?

Here are the bright spots:
Cueto - could be really, really good this year
Latos - despite Sat. will be a huge improvement over Volquez
Leake - looked good last night again, just like last year
Arroyo - surprise, he did better than we thought he would, maybe he'll rebound
Bruce - looks like this could be his year, do we have a national league homerun leader in our lineup again?
Cozart - wow, what a big improvement over Janish, etc.
Closer - who was more comfortable last year with Cordero as our closer instead of Marshall this year, anyone?
Set up - Who is the best 8th inning guy in the league right now? I think he's on our team.
Bailey - as someone pointed out he did settle down in that game. He may be alright. But if not, Chapman can move in when Masset gets back and he'll have enough innings left to pitch into October.

I'm not worried

malcontent
04-11-2012, 11:54 AM
Gee, I'm shocked- several people have now addressed the lack of left handed bats on this team as a real problem. A problem that was addressed by signing Ryan Ludwick? A problem that most fans would resolve by bring up Frazer? I am no longer a voice crying in the wilderness. Unfortunately its probably too late to do anything about this now.
You were there, Mutaman. You and Kc61. Maybe a couple others. Lollipopcurve, perhaps.

The bigger worry around these parts was how to split up Votto and Bruce in the lineup!

Meanwhile, the Cardinals deftly finesse the Pujols problem, allowing LA to offer the albatross contract, and replacing him in the field with Berkman and in the lineup with Beltran. St. Louis now has an even more balanced lineup than they did last year.

With the recent trades, Jocketty has now made a major problem a catastrophe.

Mutaman
04-11-2012, 12:00 PM
I want to know what changed so drastically from the time they were putting their team together for 2012 and the signings of Votto and Phillips to contract extensions for roughly 300 million? What do they know now that they didn't know then? If these contract extensions are being fueled by expected future television revenues they must have had an inkling back in December/January. Right? Seth Smith would have been a nice addition in left field. Instead, they poor-mouthed and shopped in the bargain bin to come up with Ryan Ludwick. They moaned that they couldn't afford a Roy Oswalt and ended up with Jeff Francis and Brett Tomko. To me there is a serious disconnect here.

Couldn't they have just gone out and gotten somebody like Ludwick who hits lefthanded? I'd settle for Jeremy Hermida at this point.

I will take Votto and BP extended over Seth Smith or Roy Oswalt, though. :)

bounty37h
04-11-2012, 02:49 PM
Bad shape, I thought Bruce and a few others lostt weight, and we got rid of Francisco, who was the only one I read about being fat/in bad shape coming into camp :p.

CALIREDSFAN72
04-11-2012, 06:04 PM
A bad offense? Really? Number 2 in the NL for runs scored last year is a bad offense? The upgrade needed was the starting rotation and they did that by getting rid of Volquez and picking up Latos. These guys will be fine when the weather warms up and the balls start to fly!


This what happens when management does nothing to upgrade a bad offense in the offseason. Losing Madson and Masset have absolutely killed the bullpen and prevented Chapman from taking Bailey or Arroyos spot in the rotation. Im not even the gonna mention our manager because i think everyone already knows how bad he is. The cardinal's are just a much better team in all areas because of this. 85 wins is the ceiling

jwmann2
04-12-2012, 07:51 PM
I know we are only 5 games in but look at the big picture here. Drew Stubbs looks absolutely horrible at the plate, Bailey is to inconsistant, there is no true closer although I think Marshall will be just fine, Rolen will be lucky to play 110 games, no legit LF who has had sucsess lately, a GM who has 3 lefty batters on the whole team who traded our future lh 3rd baseman away for a bullpen arm and for years now who has not addressed the 1 hole or 4 hole in the line-up who also gave a 12 yes 12 year $225 million contract to votto who i'm glad they signed but 12 years what if he gets hurt like jr, then gives a 2nd baseman a 6 year $72.5 million contract who is aging fast, all managed by the worst manager I've ever seen. With only 17000 people going to see a big rivalery game and all I've just said is a recipe for disaster. The future does not look good and something has to be done.

Let's save these threads for late May. They're still in spring training mode. Let them get at least a couple of road trips out of their system.

texasdave
04-12-2012, 09:02 PM
Let's save these threads for late May. They're still in spring training mode. Let them get at least a couple of road trips out of their system.

Funny thing is the teams they have been playing don't seem to be in Spring Training mode.

will5979
04-13-2012, 09:39 AM
Funny thing is the teams they have been playing don't seem to be in Spring Training mode.

X 10.

Stop the damn apologies for this team sucking right now, BECAUSE THEY DO!

joshua
04-13-2012, 12:13 PM
If we don't start producing runs we're going to be in a **** load of trouble every single game. All a team has to do is score one or two on us and it's panic time. My main concern is the bullpen completely shredded by June...it would be very hard to come back after that.

And having Marshall doing NOTHING BUT close is so stupid. Guy is the best pitcher in the pen, he needs to do more than throw 3 innings every week.

Bob Sheed
04-13-2012, 02:17 PM
And having Marshall doing NOTHING BUT close is so stupid. Guy is the best pitcher in the pen, he needs to do more than throw 3 innings every week.

That's not how Dusty uses closers.

If he uses Marshall like he used Cordero, we may see him 2, 3 nights in a row.

WrightRed
04-13-2012, 02:31 PM
No Cozart tonight...did I miss something or are we just resting one of our hottest hitters?

Mutaman
04-13-2012, 02:35 PM
No Cozart tonight...did I miss something or are we just resting one of our hottest hitters?

I've never been big on who bats where, but Stubbs is a mess right now, so why lead him off? Personally I would start only playing Stubbs against lefties until he starts getting it together. Can Valdez play outfield?

Who Dey Time
04-13-2012, 02:37 PM
No Cozart tonight...did I miss something or are we just resting one of our hottest hitters?

If you consider 4 for his last 16 to be hot then yes we are doing that tonight.

Mutaman
04-13-2012, 02:40 PM
You were there, Mutaman. You and Kc61. Maybe a couple others. Lollipopcurve, perhaps.

The bigger worry around these parts was how to split up Votto and Bruce in the lineup!


Thanks. KC61 was right on the money. Failing to go out and get even an ordinary left handed hitting outfielder for the last two years (I'd settle for Layance Nix) is the biggest mistake Walt and Baker made.