PDA

View Full Version : What's our best lineup?



DirtyBaker
04-18-2012, 12:52 AM
The problem with the offense is too hard to ignore. How would you shake things up? Here's what I'd try:

Phillips 2B
Cozart SS
Votto 1B
Bruce RF
Ludwick LF
Hannigan C
Rolen 3B
Stubbs CF
P

Only the third or fourth time through the order does it matter to have lefties back to back. Despite the slump, Bruce has the RBI potential that Rolen just doesn't have, and the jury is still out on Ludwick. I go with Bruce at clean-up and take my chances.

Hanigan's ability to keep the inning alive and be a productive out is under utilized. He's a dangerous hitter with runners on base because he puts the ball in play and hits to all fields - just not enough power to be higher in the lineup.

Stubbs at 8. I like that he's in scoring position after a sac bunt with the pitcher spot due behind him. Phillips will have a better RBI chance with Stubbs on 2nd as opposed to Hanigan.

ED44
04-18-2012, 01:11 AM
With the guys Dusty pencils in:

BP
Cozart
Votto
Bruce
Ludwick
Rolen
Catcher of the day
Stubbs
P

I wouldn't be against giving Heisey the CF and leadoff spot and going:

Heisey
Cozart
Votto
BP
Bruce
Ludwick
Rolen
Mes
P

faffy42
04-18-2012, 01:30 AM
Cozart
Phillips
Votto
Frazier
Hanigan
Bruce
Heisey
Call up a decent hitting center fielder from AAA
Pitcher

Anyones got to be better than stubbs and rolen...bruce has never impressed me, except for a few weeks here and there in the season.

R_Webb18
04-18-2012, 01:41 AM
cozart
bruce
votto
phillips
hanigan
ludwick
rolen
stubbs

40YrRedsFan
04-18-2012, 03:02 AM
Even though I am not a fan of Dusty Baker (and believe me, I scratch my head every game at some of his moves), you can't blame him for the players he has to work with. Be realistic...I consider Votto, Phillips, Cozart, and Bruce as the only full time players on our roster. Ludwick, Rolen, Valdez, Harris, Hanigan, Mesoraco, Stubbs, Cairo (now Frazier), and Heisey are just part time or platoon players. Rolen and Ludwick are past their prime; Stubbs could be a full time player, but his strikeout rate is unacceptable for a starter, Hanigan was almost 30 when brought to the bigs and has never been much of a hitter, Mes is a rookie that needs experience, Heisey and Frazier are basically unproven and Harris, Cairo, Valdez have never been and never will be starters. Cozart has started well, but you never know when the pitchers will figure out his weak spots. Bruce is so streaky...unfortunately he has longer bad streaks than good streaks. This roster of players is going to be very inconsistent and have trouble scoring runs. Here is my lineup:

Phillips
Cozart
Votto
Bruce
Ludwick
Rolen
Stubbs
Hanigan/Mesoraco
Pitcher

This is what I would do with the players we have, but several obvious holes.
We just need some better players.

texasdave
04-18-2012, 08:40 AM
We don't have a best. Wanna reword that question into something a little more meaningful like "What is not our worst" lineup?

ervinsm84
04-18-2012, 09:03 AM
It will never happen bc Dusty and the majority of baseball is locked into a "your best hitter should hit 3rd mindset" but moving Votto to 2nd in the order is better (no this doesnt mean he needs to start bunting or other nonsense). It lets us split up the lefties, get the most protection for Votto possible while getting him more ABs, and with Heisy/Stubbs hitting 9th gives Votto a better chance of hitting with men on base than if we hit the pitcher 9th. I think the tradeoff for a few extra PA's from the pitcher slot is trumped by letting the top of the order hit with men on base more.


SS Cozart
1b Votto
2b Phillips
RF Bruce
LF Ludwick
3b Rolen
C Mesorasco/Hannigan
Pitcher
CF Stubbs/Heisy

faffy42
04-18-2012, 09:18 AM
It will never happen bc Dusty and the majority of baseball is locked into a "your best hitter should hit 3rd mindset" but moving Votto to 2nd in the order is better (no this doesnt mean he needs to start bunting or other nonsense). It lets us split up the lefties, get the most protection for Votto possible while getting him more ABs, and with Heisy/Stubbs hitting 9th gives Votto a better chance of hitting with men on base than if we hit the pitcher 9th. I think the tradeoff for a few extra PA's from the pitcher slot is trumped by letting the top of the order hit with men on base more.


SS Cozart
1b Votto
2b Phillips
RF Bruce
LF Ludwick
3b Rolen
C Mesorasco/Hannigan
Pitcher
CF Stubbs/Heisy

Hmmmm...votto 2nd...kinda makes sense. I get that. Its worth a try.

texasdave
04-18-2012, 09:59 AM
How does Votto hit second when he doesn't even play shortstop?

Stray
04-18-2012, 10:15 AM
There's Votto and Cozart, and then there's a bunch of interchangeable outs. I agree that we don't have a 'best'. If you look up and down our lineup you'd think we were starting 7 pitchers each night.

texasdave
04-18-2012, 10:23 AM
This is downright embarrassing. In the Reds' last 8 games they have scored the following: 1,1,4,2,1,1,8 and1 runs respectively. I knew this offense was struggling but not to that extent. The 8-run game came courtesy of four unearned runs in the first and 3 in extra innings. Amazing. That is a big-time slump.

Who Dey Time
04-18-2012, 10:26 AM
I'd give this a try.....

Cozart SS
Stubbs CF
Votto 1B
Phillips 2B
Bruce RF
Rolen 3B
Ludwick LF
Hanigan/Mesoraco C
Pitcher

Couple points:

-When Heisey start you simply put him in the 2-hole if he's in CF, 7-hole when in left.

-Stubbs in the 2-hole is not ideal but its the best option, IMO, when you consider that Phillips is the best option in the 4-hole and the idea of Hanigan or Bruce in the 2-hole is simply laughable.

-As for the 4-hole, it's clear to me that Phillips is the best option there at least until Rolen gets out of his ealry season funk. The idea that Bruce should go there, to me, is beyond idiotic. Bruce is 1 for his last 20 and continues to show that he is, at best, a streaky offensive player. For all those crushing Rolen in the 4 take a look and realize that not only is Bruce not a better option, he shouldn't even be a candidate.

Grouse
04-18-2012, 10:44 AM
1 Phillips
2 Cozart
3Leake
4Votto
5 Arroyo
6 Cueto
7Catcher
8 Latos
9 Chapman

DirtyBaker
04-18-2012, 05:00 PM
I'd give this a try.....

Cozart SS
Stubbs CF
Votto 1B
Phillips 2B
Bruce RF
Rolen 3B
Ludwick LF
Hanigan/Mesoraco C
Pitcher
-

This is roughly tonights lineup per Sheldon's blog http://marksheldon.mlblogs.com/2012/04/18/418-at-stl-lineup-shakeup/

LexRedsFan
04-18-2012, 06:41 PM
How does Votto hit second when he doesn't even play shortstop?

And how does the pitcher hit 8th when he's not the catcher?

EMAW
04-18-2012, 08:55 PM
How did Stubbs get so awful? Looked like a guy on the verge of stardom in 2010 and would be shocked if he stays in the majors all season.

texasdave
04-18-2012, 11:10 PM
What's our best lineup? Probably Bakersfield. LOL. You have to joke about this start. What else can you do?

ukwazoo
04-19-2012, 01:43 AM
At this point, I'd try something goofy-looking:

Cozart
Hanigan
Bruce
Votto
Heisey
Phillips
Rolen
Stubbs
Pitcher

Although, no lineup will work until we start attempting to manufacture runs.

texasdave
04-19-2012, 08:10 AM
At this point, I'd try something goofy-looking:

Cozart
Hanigan
Bruce
Votto
Heisey
Phillips
Rolen
Stubbs
Pitcher

Although, no lineup will work until we start attempting to manufacture runs.

The sad part is this team has been in a number of close, winnable games and yet has failed at getting a sac bunt down how many times now? Probably not as many times as it seems. But it seems like a lot.

Kingspoint
04-19-2012, 12:59 PM
Any lineup without Rolen, Ludwick, Cairo and Harris is a good lineup.