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View Full Version : Looks like Rolen finally isn't hitting cleanup



reds44
04-18-2012, 02:56 PM
GoodAfternoon... Gotta NEW ROLE at work, AGAIN 😱 Guess #DatDude is the ONE you can move around, but the OBJECTIVE stays the same! #GotWs

lollipopcurve
04-18-2012, 03:00 PM
Don't like it. If it means Stubbs leads off, it's a bad, bad move.

flyer85
04-18-2012, 03:02 PM
Don't like it. If it means Stubbs leads off

it doesn't have to mean that, but since Dusty is the manager then ...

If Stubbs leads off at least he can get back to the bench with great haste.

Reds/Flyers Fan
04-18-2012, 03:02 PM
Rearranging the deck chairs comes to mind. This team has serious offensive issues. If DatDude in the No. 4 hole means Stubbs leading off, it's possible they just made this whole mess a lot worse.

CySeymour
04-18-2012, 03:03 PM
Maybe Cozart is now leading off?

11larkin11
04-18-2012, 03:05 PM
Cozart-Catcher-Votto-DatDude-Bruce?

RichRed
04-18-2012, 03:06 PM
I don't mind BP hitting cleanup against lefties, but to just plug him in there regardless of pitcher doesn't make much sense to me.

Kc61
04-18-2012, 03:07 PM
Since it's a lefty tonight, it could be Stubbs at the top of the order.

Redsfan320
04-18-2012, 03:26 PM
Like others have said, if it means Stubbs leading off, I hate it. Otherwise, I like it- EDIT: at least temporarily, until we can get going a little.

320

cumberlandreds
04-18-2012, 03:32 PM
The thing about it is the Reds just don't have a true leadoff hitter. Phillips isn't. Stubbs certainly isn't. I don't think Cozart is. So who would it be?

Brutus
04-18-2012, 03:34 PM
I'd much rather have Rolen in the cleanup spot than Stubbs at leadoff.

I realize it doesn't have to be mutually exclusive, but I preferred the previous lineup construct over this apparent one.

TOBTTReds
04-18-2012, 03:38 PM
Maybe Cozart is now leading off?

I'd take this. Just yesterday I (sort of) criticized Cozart's approach in the "Your Lineup" thread, but he took a walk that showed great maturity in last night. Took four very close pitches to get a walk on a full count. I think if plugged in that role, he could be alright.

He did hit leadoff a lot in Louisville last year, and I swear he had a 2B a game last year.

OldXOhio
04-18-2012, 03:39 PM
what is that word again used to describe making the same mistakes over and over without learning anything from them?

RedsBaron
04-18-2012, 03:41 PM
I sometimes think that if Dusty Baker was given Babe Ruth, Lou Gehrig, Ted Williams and Eddie Mathews, all in their prime, he would still insist on breaking up the lefties, with Phillips, Rolen and Stubbs somehow sandwiched in between the lefties.

Kc61
04-18-2012, 03:55 PM
I sometimes think that if Dusty Baker was given Babe Ruth, Lou Gehrig, Ted Williams and Eddie Mathews, all in their prime, he would still insist on breaking up the lefties, with Phillips, Rolen and Stubbs somehow sandwiched in between the lefties.

When Dusty has two or three superb lefty hitters and breaks them up for no apparent reason, you can make that argument.

He has had one superb lefty hitter so far. And still has one today. And separating Votto and Bruce still is reasonable, particularly against lefties.

And tonight the Reds face a lefty pitcher. I would prefer the slumping Mr. Bruce hitting about sixth tonight. If, however, the Babe or Gehrig is available . . . .

By the way, if Lou G is available, Votto to left field becomes a discussion topic again.

redsmetz
04-18-2012, 04:06 PM
GoodAfternoon... Gotta NEW ROLE at work, AGAIN 😱 Guess #DatDude is the ONE you can move around, but the OBJECTIVE stays the same! #GotWs

So is this quoting a tweet from Phillips?

cbowen2112
04-18-2012, 04:16 PM
So is this quoting a tweet from Phillips?

*In my best Ed McMahon voice*

Yes sir. You are correct sir!

klw
04-18-2012, 04:30 PM
I like dat dude tweet last night
http://twitter.com/#!/datdudebp


Brandon Phillips ‏ @DatDudeBP
#RealTalk... As a team, right now WE ARE #SLAW!! But guess what, I #BELIEVE in our team & we'll get our �� together REAL SOON! TRUST ME

mattfeet
04-18-2012, 04:36 PM
Cozart 6, Stubbs 8, Votto 3, Phillips 4, Bruce 9, Rolen 5, Heisey 7, Mesoraco 2, Latos RHP

klw
04-18-2012, 04:36 PM
Maybe tonight we see:

Frazier 3b
Cozart SS
Votto
Phillips
Bruce
Ludwick
Mesoraco
Stubbs
Latos

Edit: or not

WildcatFan
04-18-2012, 04:37 PM
Not a terrible lineup. I'd love to see Rolen batting second though with Votto protecting him.

mattfeet
04-18-2012, 04:39 PM
Not a terrible lineup. I'd love to see Rolen batting second though with Votto protecting him.

Me too, but maybe Stubbs batting 2nd isn't the worst thing. He should see some good pitches to hit. *fingers crossed*

-Matt

Kc61
04-18-2012, 04:44 PM
Cozart 6, Stubbs 8, Votto 3, Phillips 4, Bruce 9, Rolen 5, Heisey 7, Mesoraco 2, Latos RHP

I like the Cozart/Stubbs idea against the lefty.

Phillips cleanup only makes sense if he is healthy enough to do damage. If so, fine.

Dislike Bruce fifth against the lefty while slumping badly.

Dislike Heisey in the lineup, he doesn't hit lefties well usually.

Predicting that Stubbs will be bunting all over the place tonight, particularly when Cozart is on base.

RedEye
04-18-2012, 05:09 PM
If no one is hitting, it doesn't really matter what order they are in.

fearofpopvol1
04-18-2012, 05:45 PM
Actually, this doesn't look half bad. I don't like Phillips hitting cleanup, but Stubbs in the 2 spot could be good. You would think he'll see more pitches to hit there batting ahead of Votto.

OldXOhio
04-18-2012, 05:56 PM
Actually, this doesn't look half bad. I don't like Phillips hitting cleanup, but Stubbs in the 2 spot could be good. You would think he'll see more pitches to hit there batting ahead of Votto.

Agreed, but I'm not a big fan of moving a rookie around like that, particularly one thriving in the 2 hole.

OldXOhio
04-18-2012, 05:57 PM
Predicting that Stubbs will be bunting all over the place tonight, particularly when Cozart is on base.

so we can at least expect he'll make contact

RedsManRick
04-18-2012, 05:58 PM
Against lefties, both Stubbs and Phillips are good candidates to bat at the top of the order (or the middle, for that matter).

The problem is that neither guy can hit righties.

Phillips has a career .844 OPS vL (.344/.500), .720 vR (.314/.408).
Stubbs has a career .821 OPS vL (.349/.473), .688 vL (.313/.375).

medford
04-18-2012, 05:59 PM
So Drew is playing SS by default then, right?

TOBTTReds
04-18-2012, 06:11 PM
Predicting that Stubbs will be bunting all over the place tonight, particularly when Cozart is on base.

That was my first thought. I think this is good, considering Stubbs' power is non-existance right now. We need him putting the ball in play, on the ground, and trying to beat out the throw to first if he is bunting. He could still try to bunt for a hit if Cozart is on.

I fear this creates a lot of pitch arounds for Votto though. We need our #2 hitter to get on base almost more than our leadoff guy so first isn't empty when Votto comes up.

Homer Bailey
04-18-2012, 06:12 PM
Predicting that Stubbs will be bunting all over the place tonight, particularly when Cozart is on base.

Why? Why would they open up first base to give Votto a free pass?

Roy Tucker
04-18-2012, 07:57 PM
So, I don't speak tweet. What's #SLAW?

Screwball
04-18-2012, 08:05 PM
So, I don't speak tweet. What's #SLAW?

Terrible.

KittyDuran
04-18-2012, 08:18 PM
So, I don't speak tweet. What's #SLAW?

Urbandictionary.com says:

Something that is terrible.
"That old car is pretty slaw. I would never be seen driving around in it."

WVRedsFan
04-18-2012, 08:27 PM
Why? Why would they open up first base to give Votto a free pass?
My question exactly. If you bunt, you take the bat out of Votto's hands. Shaking my head at that.

dougdirt
04-18-2012, 09:11 PM
The Reds made an improvement in the clean up spot. They went from probably the worst clean up hitter in baseball to only one of the worst clean up hitters in baseball. Phillips has moderate at best power. He won't hit you 20 home runs this year.

HokieRed
04-18-2012, 09:19 PM
The Reds made an improvement in the clean up spot. They went from probably the worst clean up hitter in baseball to only one of the worst clean up hitters in baseball. Phillips has moderate at best power. He won't hit you 20 home runs this year.

Agree. Given the current available talent, I don't see how it can be anybody but Bruce.

klw
04-18-2012, 09:52 PM
I assume with Thursday's outing in St. Louis being a day game, that Frazier will get the start tomorrow and Rolen will rest.

Screwball
04-18-2012, 11:52 PM
I think Doug is calling our cleanup hitters slaw.

Ghosts of 1990
04-19-2012, 12:26 AM
Another move that has Dusty primed for termination IMHO. His reluctance to hit Bruce and Votto back to back is just so short-sighted. Dusty just never changes. Please fire this guy, Bob. Honestly a lot of guys managing a Rallys or Denny's could come up with a similar record jogging these guys out and letting them play.

dougdirt
04-19-2012, 12:57 AM
I think Doug is calling our cleanup hitters slaw.

I would never use a 'word' like that.

gilpdawg
04-19-2012, 04:32 AM
Doug, that post was slaw. :D

cumberlandreds
04-19-2012, 02:12 PM
So Drew is playing SS by default then, right?


:lol:



If you ask me I think most slaw is pretty terrible. But that's just me. :D