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Brutus
08-03-2012, 09:52 PM
They're convinced that Chapmen hit McCutchen intentionally and they believe there should (will?) be retribution tomorrow.

Biggest game of the year and the Reds would intentionally want to put runners on in the 9th inning? Riiiight.

Seems reality has escaped Pittsburgh for far too long.

RedEye
08-03-2012, 09:55 PM
Well, they've been waiting for a long time to have stuff like this happen in games that actually matter. So I'll let them have their fun.

Vottomatic
08-03-2012, 09:55 PM
I'm glad he hit McCutcheon. Not because I want him hurt, but because it strikes fear in the other Pirate hitters having to think they could get plunked by a 100 mph fastball. An occasional wild pitch without runners on base can do wonders in terms of fear.

Pirates are babies, just like the Cardinals.

Tom Servo
08-03-2012, 09:57 PM
Sounds like Pittsburgh fans are weird wusses.

edabbs44
08-03-2012, 09:57 PM
They're convinced that Chapmen hit McCutchen intentionally and they believe there should (will?) be retribution tomorrow.

Biggest game of the year and the Reds would intentionally want to put runners on in the 9th inning? Riiiight.

Seems reality has escaped Pittsburgh for far too long.

Where are you getting this info?

Brutus
08-03-2012, 09:58 PM
I've no doubt it was a purpose pitch. I am sure Chapman was trying to push him off the plate. But I don't believe for a second it was meant to hit him.

Brutus
08-03-2012, 09:58 PM
Where are you getting this info?

They're going off about it on both the MLB board and the Pittsburgh Sports forums.

VottoFan54
08-03-2012, 09:58 PM
They're convinced that Chapmen hit McCutchen intentionally and they believe there should (will?) be retribution tomorrow.

Biggest game of the year and the Reds would intentionally want to put runners on in the 9th inning? Riiiight.

Seems reality has escaped Pittsburgh for far too long.

I think if the Pirates hit Votto in the 9th inning with 2 outs and a three run lead that there would be many posters on Redszone saying the pitch was intentional. I can't really blame Pirates fans for being mad.

Captain Hook
08-03-2012, 09:59 PM
Champan seems pretty nasty.I don't think he cares one bit what any of those guys think about him(player or fans)and if he didn't do it on purpose tonight he might do it tomorrow just for being accused.

Brutus
08-03-2012, 10:00 PM
I think if the Pirates hit Votto in the 9th inning with 2 outs and a three run lead that there would be many posters on Redszone saying the pitch was intentional. I can't really blame Pirates fans for being mad.

You can't blame fans for assuming, without a shred of evidence, that someone was intentionally throwing a 102 MPH baseball at someone on purpose?

fearofpopvol1
08-03-2012, 10:00 PM
I'm glad he hit McCutcheon. Not because I want him hurt, but because it strikes fear in the other Pirate hitters having to think they could get plunked by a 100 mph fastball. An occasional wild pitch without runners on base can do wonders in terms of fear.

Pirates are babies, just like the Cardinals.

McCutcheon looked absolutely furious. He looked like he thought Chapman did it on purpose.

Tom Servo
08-03-2012, 10:01 PM
I think if the Pirates hit Votto in the 9th inning with 2 outs and a three run lead that there would be many posters on Redszone saying the pitch was intentional. I can't really blame Pirates fans for being mad.
I doubt we would be up in arms. In fact, I don't really recall any of these types of incidents with the Reds outside of the Cardinals brawl. I can't recall any recent Reds charging the mound or staring down a pitcher after a HBP.

membengal
08-03-2012, 10:02 PM
I guess its a rivalry, then, again.

Cool. I have hated the Pirates for my entire life. Hated them in the 70s with a passion. Hated them through the 80s and into the early 90s. I find it easy to access the old hate. Feels good.

vic715
08-03-2012, 10:03 PM
If I'm one of those Pirate players I' privatly hoping its forgotten,I mean do you want your pitcher retaliating knowing Chapman may come in and answer that.Don't think so.

edabbs44
08-03-2012, 10:03 PM
Maybe "Cutch" should worry about backing up the LFer rather than complaining about getting hit.

VottoFan54
08-03-2012, 10:07 PM
You can't blame fans for assuming, without a shred of evidence, that someone was intentionally throwing a 102 MPH baseball at someone on purpose?

A 102 MPH fastball near the head in the ninth inning with 2 outs on their best player, Is it really a stretch to say that was on purpose? I guess I just have a hard time believing that he just happened to hit a batter at the worst time for the Pirates.

GullyFoyle
08-03-2012, 10:09 PM
If anybody sees a clip of McCutchen in the dugout afterwards, I'd love to see it. MLB cut the game off very quickly.

Brutus
08-03-2012, 10:14 PM
A 102 MPH fastball near the head in the ninth inning with 2 outs on their best player, Is it really a stretch to say that was on purpose? I guess I just have a hard time believing that he just happened to hit a batter at the worst time for the Pirates.

I don't think it's a stretch to say he was trying to brush McCutchen off the plate. He's known for being right up on the plate, so sure I wouldn't at all be surprised he was trying to brush him back. But there's a huge difference trying to pitch inside to knock a guy back and actually trying to hit him with malice intent.

membengal
08-03-2012, 10:17 PM
That is, quite literally, the kind of pitch that Bob Gibson never hesitated to throw. Ever.

Vottomatic
08-03-2012, 10:17 PM
Geez, score some runs and you don't have to face Chapman in the 9th.

VottoFan54
08-03-2012, 10:18 PM
I don't think it's a stretch to say he was trying to brush McCutchen off the plate. He's known for being right up on the plate, so sure I wouldn't at all be surprised he was trying to brush him back. But there's a huge difference trying to pitch inside to knock a guy back and actually trying to hit him with malice intent.

Once again, if a team did that to Votto, Redszone would be upset about it. If you are going to brush a guy off the plate, a 102 MPH fastball is not neccessary.

cincrazy
08-03-2012, 10:21 PM
Once again, if a team did that to Votto, Redszone would be upset about it. If you are going to brush a guy off the plate, a 102 MPH fastball is not neccessary.

I know I'm in the minority here, but I agree with you. I think it's a bush league move. Between the somersaults, the speeding tickets, the girl tied up in his hotel room, and now this, it's been quite the interesting year for Chapman.

WMR
08-03-2012, 10:21 PM
Pirates fans? :lol:

You almost had me going for a second there.

Brutus
08-03-2012, 10:23 PM
Once again, if a team did that to Votto, Redszone would be upset about it. If you are going to brush a guy off the plate, a 102 MPH fastball is not neccessary.

I think you're painting with a broad brush. Would some people on Redszone be upset? Maybe. But would everyone or most on Redszone be upset? I doubt that.

I wouldn't be, personally (unless it were a Tony LaRussa-managed Cardinals' team then I would for the sake of hating them).

cincrazy
08-03-2012, 10:24 PM
I think you're painting with a broad brush. Would some people on Redszone be upset? Maybe. But would everyone or most on Redszone be upset? I doubt that.

I wouldn't be, personally.

Dusty would be upset. Just ask Derek Lowe :D.

wolfboy
08-03-2012, 10:26 PM
I know I'm in the minority here, but I agree with you. I think it's a bush league move. Between the somersaults, the speeding tickets, the girl tied up in his hotel room, and now this, it's been quite the interesting year for Chapman.

Give me a break.

VottoFan54
08-03-2012, 10:28 PM
I think you're painting with a broad brush. Would some people on Redszone be upset? Maybe. But would everyone or most on Redszone be upset? I doubt that.

I wouldn't be, personally (unless it were a Tony LaRussa-managed Cardinals' team then I would for the sake of hating them).

Obviously not all of RZ would be mad in that situation, I guess we will have to disagree on how many people would be upset. When you are throwing a brushback pitch, is a 102 MPH fastball necessary?

Virginia Beach Reds
08-03-2012, 10:28 PM
Maybe "Cutch" should worry about backing up the LFer rather than complaining about getting hit.

YES. That cost them a run.

dman
08-03-2012, 10:31 PM
I posted about this in tonight's game thread, but I'll say the same thing here. I don't think even for the slightest that Chapman was trying to hit Cutch... I even have doubts he was trying to brush him back... I think it was simply a fastball that got away from him.

I do believe that there will be some attempt at retribution in this series though, especially if Hanrahan comes in to pitch.

Hanrahan did that to the Reds in 2010 when Mike Leake hit Cutch with a changeup by hitting a Reds batter the very next inning... He may have even hit Mike Leake. At any rate, sometime this weekend I'd count on a Reds hitter getting nailed by a pitch.

BuckeyeRedleg
08-03-2012, 10:31 PM
Three words.

Kimo von Oelhoffen.

"Pirate" fans (LOL) can zip it and put their Big Ben jerseys back on.

wally post
08-03-2012, 10:31 PM
Wally thinks it is ridiculous to think he hit him on purpose. He was pitching inside

reds44
08-03-2012, 10:32 PM
All Pirates reporters are saying this "isn't over" and "Cutch" is "pissed."

redsfandan
08-03-2012, 10:32 PM
Maybe "Cutch" should worry about backing up the LFer rather than complaining about getting hit.

Good point. Don't think Votto would've made that kind of mistake.

membengal
08-03-2012, 10:33 PM
Membengal commends this to the community on this subject. A little over four minutes...worth a look:

Bob Gibson and Reggie Jackson Discuss "Who Owns the Plate?" - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IJlUD6o30rg)

redsfandan
08-03-2012, 10:35 PM
That is, quite literally, the kind of pitch that Bob Gibson never hesitated to throw. Ever.

Funny you should say that, I was just thinking Chapman had some Bob Gibson in him.

WMR
08-03-2012, 10:38 PM
Three words.

Kimo von Oelhoffen.

"Pirate" fans (LOL) can zip it and put their Big Ben jerseys back on.

That name automatically triggers my upchuck reflex. :barf:

Brutus
08-03-2012, 10:40 PM
Obviously not all of RZ would be mad in that situation, I guess we will have to disagree on how many people would be upset. When you are throwing a brushback pitch, is a 102 MPH fastball necessary?

Do you think big league hitters are going to be intimidated by 85 MPH offspeed pitches as brushback pitches? lol

The purpose of a brushback pitch is to, you know, try to move the hitter off the plate.

VottoFan54
08-03-2012, 10:48 PM
Do you think big league hitters are going to be intimidated by 85 MPH offspeed pitches as brushback pitches? lol

The purpose of a brushback pitch is to, you know, try to move the hitter off the plate.

If you are going to throw a 102 MPH fastball to Andrew McCutchen in that situation you are asking for trouble. I am not asking him to throw 85 MPH, but don't you think 94 would've sent enough of a message. If you are going to mess around with 102 MPH fastballs inside, you better be able to locate it.

Why did he have to move McCutchen off the plate with 2 outs in the ninth and a 3-0 lead? He should've just pitched McCutchen like any other hitter and just get out of the game with the save. I am sure the Reds hitters are going to appreciate it when one of them is hit by a pitch tomorrow.

membengal
08-03-2012, 10:49 PM
The Reds players are not shrinking violets. If one gets hit in retaliation...thanks for the free base.

Scrap Irony
08-03-2012, 10:51 PM
My hope is that the Pirate starter, in "protecting" their star, hits a Red in retaliation. The ump then will throw said pitcher out of the game, and the 'Rats will play Johnny All-Staff, costing them the game and a worn-out 'pen for the next night.

This could all be undone, however, if the Pittsburgh is looking for the Reds' star player. Because, y'know, he's not on the field. (Nor is the second-best Red, for that matter.)

hebroncougar
08-03-2012, 10:53 PM
They're convinced that Chapmen hit McCutchen intentionally and they believe there should (will?) be retribution tomorrow.

Biggest game of the year and the Reds would intentionally want to put runners on in the 9th inning? Riiiight.

Seems reality has escaped Pittsburgh for far too long.

All six of the Pirates fans are mad? :lol:

traderumor
08-03-2012, 10:56 PM
All Pirates reporters are saying this "isn't over" and "Cutch" is "pissed."Hilarious. Chapman was so phased that he blew Jones away on three 100+ pitches that he never saw, much less had a chance of hitting.

VottoFan54
08-03-2012, 10:56 PM
This could all be undone, however, if the Pittsburgh is looking for the Reds' star player. Because, y'know, he's not on the field. (Nor is the second-best Red, for that matter.)

FWIW, I think BP is starting tomorrow.

dsmith421
08-03-2012, 10:58 PM
Hilarious. Chapman was so phased that he blew Jones away on three 100+ pitches that he never saw, much less had a chance of hitting.

My thoughts on Garrett Jones are similar to Tommy Lasorda's view of Kurt Bevacqua.

CrackerJack
08-03-2012, 11:02 PM
They're going off about it on both the MLB board and the Pittsburgh Sports forums.

I can't believe such a thing would occur on the internets.

LoganBuck
08-03-2012, 11:08 PM
Between Kimo and Hines Ward Pittsburgh has had more than its fair share of chreap shots. Perhaps McCutcheon will stop diving at the plate.

dsmith421
08-03-2012, 11:12 PM
I christen thee "Cutchy-Poo"

wolfboy
08-03-2012, 11:14 PM
http://cdn.fansided.com/wp-content/blogs.dir/4/files/2012/08/AndrewMcCutchenChapman1.jpg?d7b0e7

http://cdn.fansided.com/wp-content/blogs.dir/4/files/2012/08/andrewmccutchenchapman4.jpg?d7b0e7

cumberlandreds
08-03-2012, 11:18 PM
Forgive the Pirates and their fans. They just know how to act in a pennant race this late in the season. It's been 20 years since they have sniffed a winning record much less a playoff spot. :D

That was maybe a knockdown pitch but not an intentional HBP. Its just effective wildness by Chapman.

WVRedsFan
08-03-2012, 11:32 PM
This player has singlehandedly carried this team. I asked the question why teams were pitching to him long ago on these boards, but I believe a pitch got away from Chapman. McCutcheon's reaction was immature and childish. Regardless, their fans will play it up for all it's worth,.. Such is sports fandom.

guttle11
08-03-2012, 11:36 PM
The guy is having an incredible career season, and should have a nice career, but...

Who is Andrew McCutchen? Is he too good to see a pitch not where he desires it to be? LaRussa attitude with no leg to stand on.

guttle11
08-03-2012, 11:36 PM
The guy is having an incredible career season, and should have a nice career, but...

Who is Andrew McCutchen? Is he too good to see a pitch not where he desires it to be? LaRussa attitude with no leg to stand on.

Chip R
08-03-2012, 11:37 PM
Didn't McCutchon take Chapman deep last time they met?

Reds Nd2
08-03-2012, 11:38 PM
Biggest game of the year and the Reds would intentionally want to put runners on in the 9th inning? Riiiight.

Why not hit him? Give him something to think about tomorrow.

"I hated to bat against (Don) Drysdale. After he hit you he'd come around, look at the bruise on your arm and say, 'Do you want me to sign it?'" - Mickey Mantle

REDREAD
08-03-2012, 11:42 PM
I think if the Pirates hit Votto in the 9th inning with 2 outs and a three run lead that there would be many posters on Redszone saying the pitch was intentional. I can't really blame Pirates fans for being mad.

I agree.. Many Redszone fans would be in a tizzy for sure.

kaldaniels
08-03-2012, 11:46 PM
As much as some of us may say "time to brush him back" or even "_____ needs to be plunked" it rarely happens.

However, there may not have been a better time all season long to throw a purpose pitch than that AB.

_Sir_Charles_
08-03-2012, 11:47 PM
Why not hit him? Give him something to think about tomorrow.

"I hated to bat against (Don) Drysdale. After he hit you he'd come around, look at the bruise on your arm and say, 'Do you want me to sign it?'" - Mickey Mantle

Just wanted to say how much I LOVE that Mantle quote. Pure gold.

Reds Nd2
08-03-2012, 11:47 PM
Didn't McCutchon take Chapman deep last time they met?

McNugget has never taken Chapman deep.

Tom Servo
08-03-2012, 11:47 PM
Didn't McCutchon take Chapman deep last time they met?
Nope. McCutchen has a single and a strikeout in 2 career PA's against Chapman.

corkedbat
08-03-2012, 11:50 PM
McCutcheon and the Pissburgh fans planned on them coming in here this weekend and making a major statement. Losing the first game of the series kind of limits them to making a minor comment or two. Got to vent their collective spleens somewhere.

corkedbat
08-03-2012, 11:55 PM
McCutcheon and the Pissburgh fans planned on them coming in here this weekend and making a major statement. Losing the first game of the series kind of limits them to making a minor comment or two. Got to vent their collective spleens somewhere.

lidspinner
08-03-2012, 11:56 PM
Was it intentional? Probably...or at least he was intentionally trying to pitch far inside and chapman probably figured he could care less if it hit cutch or not.....was it bush league? Hell no and not even close.....that's how winning pitchers pitch....you wanna crowd the plate and dig in on me?, your gonna have to earn it. Andrew has far from earned the right to dig in and crowd the plate in a central race against the Reds......there are few players that have the respect to not pitch inside in a race and none are in the central, and only a few in the National League and I am not sure I could even name them outside of Chipper Jones....pitching inside is what you do when you wanna win, pitching to the batters strengths is what the pirates have done for years. If they hit Votto come September in that last week of the season I will not care in the slightest as long as its not at his head, even votto has not earned the right to dig in....you better go up there with your feet loose in the dirt in this series and that's the way I like it.

Reds/Flyers Fan
08-04-2012, 12:11 AM
Pukesburgh can take their manufactured anger elsewhere, because they sure didn't care when Kimo Von Oeljackass and Wines Hard used cheap shots to end two players' seasons.

Whine some more McCutcheon.

WMR
08-04-2012, 12:13 AM
Kimo von Karmaisstillgonnagetyousomedayolhoffen

REDREAD
08-04-2012, 12:19 AM
Chapman has had outstanding control for a long time now
He had outstanding control other than that one pitch.
No way to prove it, but probably 80% likely it was intentional.
It's not like a curveball that slipped or whatever.
It was a 102 mph fastball. he did it on purpose.
Honestly, it was too close to McCuthon's head.. it could've really hurt him.
If you're going to hit someone, don't throw so close to their head

kaldaniels
08-04-2012, 12:24 AM
Chapman has had outstanding control for a long time now
He had outstanding control other than that one pitch.
No way to prove it, but probably 80% likely it was intentional.
It's not like a curveball that slipped or whatever.
It was a 102 mph fastball. he did it on purpose.
Honestly, it was too close to McCuthon's head.. it could've really hurt him.
If you're going to hit someone, don't throw so close to their head

It hit him level with the "P" on his jersey, right on the logo patch on the arm. Not close enough for me to complain "oh no, too close to the head".

AmarilloRed
08-04-2012, 12:27 AM
I didn't see the pitch just followed the game thread but-if you're going to throw a brushback pitch it doesn't make sense to do it with one strike left in the game.

reds44
08-04-2012, 12:27 AM
I just don't get what he was so pissed about. He got hit in the arm. It really wasnt close to his head. Sure, I bet it hurt, but it's not like Chapman showed him up or anything.

reds44
08-04-2012, 12:28 AM
I didn't see the pitch just followed the game thread but-if you're going to throw a brushback pitch it doesn't make sense to do it with one strike left in the game.
There wasn't one strike left. It was the first pitch of the AB. For the record Hanigan was set up inside.

AtomicDumpling
08-04-2012, 12:35 AM
Aw they're just ticked 'cuz they got smacked around even when the Reds' three best players weren't on the field.

crazybob60
08-04-2012, 12:36 AM
Cutch was serious thinking about charging the mound...you could see it crossed his mind, but then the other thought crossed his mind, what happened just a mere 3 days ago, a bold, unexpected move by the Reds GM....the acquistion of Jonathan Broxton. For fear of being sat upon, Cutch quickly and quietly proceeded to first.

CrackerJack
08-04-2012, 12:40 AM
I just don't get what he was so pissed about. He got hit in the arm. It really wasnt close to his head. Sure, I bet it hurt, but it's not like Chapman showed him up or anything.

I don't blame him for being pissed about it at all...actually commend him for brushing it off like he did and Chapman not backing down - all the macho stuff is silly but it's baseball and it happens.

I suspect the Pirates are going to be pretty focused and tough to beat tomorrow. If the Reds win again, it'll be a great statement game, sort of asserting their superiority, and I like it, and I love Chapman's attitude and competitive nature, as well as Latos', these guys aren't the same as the 2010 team that got schooled in the post season at all. They may not score a lot of runs against elite teams, especially with their two best bats on the bench, but they are confident as hell, fun to watch. The city's buzzing.

REDREAD
08-04-2012, 12:42 AM
It hit him level with the "P" on his jersey, right on the logo patch on the arm. Not close enough for me to complain "oh no, too close to the head".

It was bush league... I love watching Chapman pitch, but that was stupid and dangerous if intentional.

The guy has pinpoint control his year, I doubt it was an accident.

Just exactly why was there a need to brush back McCutchon when there's two outs in the ninth, leading by 3 runs? There wasn't.

Matt700wlw
08-04-2012, 12:48 AM
He'll get over it.

kaldaniels
08-04-2012, 12:51 AM
It was bush league... I love watching Chapman pitch, but that was stupid and dangerous if intentional.

The guy has pinpoint control his year, I doubt it was an accident.

Just exactly why was there a need to brush back McCutchon when there's two outs in the ninth, leading by 3 runs? There wasn't.

I was addressing the charge that it was "too close to the head".

Sounds like you are a "never brush the other guy back" type of guy. And if so, just say so and I will accept that.

However....

It really wasn't that close to the head, and if there is a good time for a brushback, when would that be?

REDREAD
08-04-2012, 12:57 AM
I was addressing the charge that it was "too close to the head".

Sounds like you are a "never brush the other guy back" type of guy. And if so, just say so and I will accept that.

However....

It really wasn't that close to the head, and if there is a good time for a brushback, when would that be?

I believe it was an intentional drilling of the guy, and yes, there's never a good time to do that.

Why is there even a need to brush him back? The game was pretty much over. Even if McCutchson hits a HR, there's a lefty on deck that probably has no chance of getting a hit against Chapman.

If you are going to brush the guy back throw the ball at about hip level.
Pitchers do that all the time.. no need to throw near head level like Chapman did. I'm not sure what Chapman accomplished, other then making a fool out of himself and firing up the Pirates even more.

I am pretty sure the Pirates get Leake and Homer next.. not exactly the most steady hands on the Reds staff.. although both will be well rested, since their last outings were short..

fearofpopvol1
08-04-2012, 01:01 AM
Andrew seems unfazed, at least in his comments...


Asked whether getting hit by a Chapman 101-mph fastball spoiled the evening, McCutchen said:

"It didn't spoil it. It just pumped us up. And that's the feeling we're going to take on the field [Saturday]."

Brutus
08-04-2012, 01:05 AM
Andrew seems unfazed, at least in his comments...

You apparently missed his temper tantrum in the dugout. He was cursing, throwing things up against the wall, etc.

WVRedsFan
08-04-2012, 01:06 AM
Andrew seems unfazed, at least in his comments...

Typical Pittsburgh football comment. As if a HBP could inspire a baseball team. It will have a lot more to do with what Leake and Bailey do. And no matter what, they can get no closer than 2.5 games at the end. It won't be that close, much to the chagrin of the Steeler, I mean Pirate fans.

kaldaniels
08-04-2012, 01:08 AM
I believe it was an intentional drilling of the guy, and yes, there's never a good time to do that.

Why is there even a need to brush him back? The game was pretty much over. Even if McCutchson hits a HR, there's a lefty on deck that probably has no chance of getting a hit against Chapman.

If you are going to brush the guy back throw the ball at about hip level.
Pitchers do that all the time.. no need to throw near head level like Chapman did. I'm not sure what Chapman accomplished, other then making a fool out of himself and firing up the Pirates even more.

I am pretty sure the Pirates get Leake and Homer next.. not exactly the most steady hands on the Reds staff.. although both will be well rested, since their last outings were short..

I don't think I'm gonna get far in discussing this with you so I'll just step aside. You are only a "fool" in the eye of the beholder. I doubt a large percentage of people (especially neutral observers) would consider Chapman a "fool" after watching that inning of work, and even that one pitch in a vacuum.

You also argue he has pinpoint control (which I would disagree with on a pitch by pitch basis...he throws an ugly one every now and then), but are upset that he hit Andrew in the bicep because it is too close to the head.

I'm just not sure I get why you are so admanant that this was a horrible thing. But to each his own.

kaldaniels
08-04-2012, 01:09 AM
Andrew seems unfazed, at least in his comments...

Sounds like thoughts of a concussed individual. If anyone can give someone a concussion by hitting them in the arm, it's Aroldis.

fearofpopvol1
08-04-2012, 01:09 AM
You apparently missed his temper tantrum in the dugout. He was cursing, throwing things up against the wall, etc.

I saw it. And I'm sure he was livid once it happened. But when emotions run high and a lot is on the line, it's easy to get riled up in the moment. But it doesn't sound like he's holding a grudge and it sounds like he's over it now.

RedsManRick
08-04-2012, 01:10 AM
Of the guys in the lineup right now, who gets hit? Bruce cause he's got the most talent & cache'? Rolen cause it would be the biggest insult?

RedlegJake
08-04-2012, 01:11 AM
I think Chapman was just throwing inside to keep his part of the plate, not intentionally try to hit Cutch. Mac crowds the plate. Chapman let him know he owns that part of the plate. That is Bob Gibson old school no nonsense pitching and it is successful. If you look at the replays the pitch didn't even miss the inside of the zone by that much! That's how close Cutch was to the plate. And finally it wasn't even near his head.

If I were the Pirates I'd forget fights and just play baseball. Marshall, Broxton, Joey, Frazier, Ondrusek, et al - the Reds roster isn't populated by a bunch of little guys. Heck Broxton would just sit on three or four of 'em at once.

kaldaniels
08-04-2012, 01:12 AM
Of the guys in the lineup right now, who gets hit? Bruce cause he's got the most talent & cache'? Rolen cause it would be the biggest insult?

I'd say BP if the reports that he plays are accurate. Bruce next in line.

Hitting Rolen might incite a brawl...but maybe that's what they want.

I've thought to myself many times tonight that I bet Andrew went in the Pirate clubhouse and challenged the pitchers to a man to plunk someone in the next 2 days. He was one angry dude.

RedlegJake
08-04-2012, 01:12 AM
Of the guys in the lineup right now, who gets hit? Bruce cause he's got the most talent & cache'? Rolen cause it would be the biggest insult?

Ludwick - ex teamate, hottest hitter.

kaldaniels
08-04-2012, 01:13 AM
I think Chapman was just throwing inside to keep his part of the plate, not intentionally try to hit Cutch. Mac crowds the plate. Chapman let him know he owns that part of the plate. That is Bob Gibson old school no nonsense pitching and it is successful. If you look at the replays the pitch didn't even miss the inside of the zone by that much! That's how close Cutch was to the plate. And finally it wasn't even near his head.

If I were the Pirates I'd forget fights and just play baseball. Marshall, Broxton, Joey, Frazier, Ondrusek, et al - the Reds roster isn't populated by a bunch of little guys. Heck Broxton would just sit on three or four of 'em at once.

That's been my biggest point of contention with REDREAD's remarks. And you are correct, McCutch was all over the plate.

RedlegJake
08-04-2012, 01:13 AM
I've thought to myself many times tonight that I bet Andrew went in the Pirate clubhouse and challenged the pitchers to a man to plunk someone in the next 2 days. He was one angry dude.

I doubt he has to challenge them. They know what has to be done and I'll bet a Reds batter gets hit sometime tomorrow or Sunday. I think we all know that.

kaldaniels
08-04-2012, 01:16 AM
I doubt he has to challenge them. They know what has to be done and I'll bet a Reds batter gets hit sometime tomorrow or Sunday. I think we all know that.

I agree, but I still imagine him saying some harsh stuff in the clubhouse.

And I don't figure warnings will be issued before the game...the MVP candidate just got drilled, umps are gonna let business take care of itself.

Nasty_Boy
08-04-2012, 01:42 AM
Just a thought on Chapman's control tonight... During his battle with Marte (in which he was just a little wild) he was pitching from the full windup. Against Snider (with nobody on) he went to the stretch and put him away quickly. When McCutchen stepped in Chapman went back to the wind up and hit him. The out of the stretch against Jones, he was firing strikes. It may be nothing but I found it odd to switch like that, and he was more wild from the wind up.

Maybe something was throwing him off in his full motion tonight... Just something I noticed that you don't normall see.

Big Klu
08-04-2012, 02:22 AM
I don't think it's a stretch to say he was trying to brush McCutchen off the plate. He's known for being right up on the plate, so sure I wouldn't at all be surprised he was trying to brush him back. But there's a huge difference trying to pitch inside to knock a guy back and actually trying to hit him with malice intent.

Exactly. McCutchen was crowding the plate. That pitch was not that far inside. It was likely a purpose pitch. I don't think Chapman intentionally hit him, but I also don't think he was too concerned if he did hit him. As for Chapman's control, I don't think it's pinpoint. He is sometimes wild in the zone. But his extreme velocity often intimidates batters into swinging.



That is, quite literally, the kind of pitch that Bob Gibson never hesitated to throw. Ever.

Absolutely! If anyone stood on top of the plate against Gibson or Drysdale, a high hard one was practically guaranteed. Two outs in the ninth and nobody on with a 3-0 lead is the perfect time for a brushback.

reds44
08-04-2012, 02:25 AM
I don't blame him for being pissed about it at all...actually commend him for brushing it off like he did and Chapman not backing down - all the macho stuff is silly but it's baseball and it happens.

I suspect the Pirates are going to be pretty focused and tough to beat tomorrow. If the Reds win again, it'll be a great statement game, sort of asserting their superiority, and I like it, and I love Chapman's attitude and competitive nature, as well as Latos', these guys aren't the same as the 2010 team that got schooled in the post season at all. They may not score a lot of runs against elite teams, especially with their two best bats on the bench, but they are confident as hell, fun to watch. The city's buzzing.
Or it could go the opposite and they could pull a Reds in 2010 after the brawl and get swept.

vaticanplum
08-04-2012, 02:53 AM
McCutcheon and the Pissburgh fans planned on them coming in here this weekend and making a major statement. Losing the first game of the series kind of limits them to making a minor comment or two. Got to vent their collective spleens somewhere.

Ok, first of all, I have to say, enough with the name calling of the cities. Put down the team for the actions all you want, but going beyond that is bush-league fandom.

That aside, I agree with this. I think the Pirates are freaking out a bit. They remind me a lot of the Reds in 2010 at this point in the season, before the Cards fell apart and the Reds' lock on the division was secured. And that's right when the Reds-Cards brawl happened, if memory serves.

I think they were upset about the Heisey call and let it get to them emotionally, which was compounded by their inability to do anything on the field the rest of the game. Come the 9th, this happens, and McCutchen freaks out. McCutchen is well-known as an extremely level-headed player and I've never seen him angry like that. I don't necessarily think Chapman hit him intentionally, but I'm guessing he didn't exactly look apologetic after Cutch looked up in a fit of anger from being plunked hard.

The Pirates feel tremendous pressure to prove they are the real deal right now. Facing a first-place team at this point in the year -- it's huge. And one thing that hasn't been mentioned in here is that Pirates fans (beyond being part of a sports fanbase that, I feel, is ridiculously sour grapey about calls generally) one gajillion percent hold the Braves call as the turning point of their season last year. People still talk about it all the time. They have no memory of the Buccos collapsing handily on their own after that, only that call. So the pirates have a very bad chip on their shoulder about calls, I think.

I hope everybody channels their emotion onto the field, because this game was uncomfortable in a way I don't like. I like the Reds being able to stand up for themselves, but -- and I'm sorry if people don't agree with me -- I really, as a fan of this team living outside Cincinnati, don't want to have to get in a position where I'm constantly defending them as a thug team. This happened with their division rival two years ago and it's going to get tougher to defend if it happens again, even if the Reds aren't entirely at fault. On a larger level, the Pirates are the feel-good baseball story right now, so somebody has to be the villain by default. The Reds are too good a team to have to resort to that. and it would make my life completely miserable.

Superdude
08-04-2012, 04:03 AM
As for Chapman's control, I don't think it's pinpoint. He is sometimes wild in the zone. But his extreme velocity often intimidates batters into swinging.

I feel like there's a big assumption in saying it was intentional, or even that Chapman was trying to "brush him back". Regardless of his walk rate, Chapman throws some incredibly errant pitches relatively often. Unless he's planning on living on the outside part of the plate his whole career, some batters are probably gonna get plunked along the way. The fact that Cutch is the face of the team made it seem more intentional than it probably was...that and Chapman pinpointing three straight fastballs to strikeout the next batter. :usa: <----I've always wanted to use that.

Tom Servo
08-04-2012, 04:10 AM
I just don't see the big deal about a hit by pitch in an otherwise low-key game. As Superdude just said, Chapman seems to throw them to the backstop on a fairly regular basis and he has 3 HBP's this year. I suppose I could understand an uproar if McCutchen WAS plunked in the head at 100 MPH, but he wasn't nor was he particularly close to being.

GAC
08-04-2012, 05:13 AM
That is, quite literally, the kind of pitch that Bob Gibson never hesitated to throw. Ever.

Absolutely. If you were one who crowded the plate on Bob, he'd send you a strong signal without hesitation. Chapman didn't intentionally try to hit him, so Cutch needs to get over himself. That "contest" has always existed between who is going to dominate that zone - the pitcher or the hitter. Both think they own the plate. One has a ball in his hand, the other a piece of lumber. Somethings gotta give. Let the game begin!

But if Cutch is going to crowd the plate, which he does, then maybe he needs to stop by Barry Bonds Body Armor Store, cause he's going to get nailed again. LOL

GAC
08-04-2012, 05:37 AM
Maybe "Cutch" should worry about backing up the LFer rather than complaining about getting hit.

Yeah. He should be livid that he contributed to giving up the winning run that cost his team.

mth123
08-04-2012, 06:17 AM
Pitchers are allowed to pitch inside. When did this become a game for little girls? I don't think he was trying to hit him. He did. So what?

Edskin
08-04-2012, 06:19 AM
Call me a Caveman, but I'm all for it. Never support intentional plunking anywhere near the head, but if Chap went WAY inside with the "well, if it hits him it hits him" mindset, I'm ok with that. I enjoy the machismo and unwritten rules that have always defined baseball.

BCubb2003
08-04-2012, 06:27 AM
McCutchen and the Pirates' dugout were visibly upset by the plunking, but McCutchen planned to channel any lingering displeasure into a revved-up performance on Saturday.

"It just pumped us up," McCutchen said. "And that's the feeling we're going to take on the field [Saturday]."

from the MLB.com post-game story

traderumor
08-04-2012, 06:31 AM
I believe it was an intentional drilling of the guy, and yes, there's never a good time to do that.

Why is there even a need to brush him back? The game was pretty much over. Even if McCutchson hits a HR, there's a lefty on deck that probably has no chance of getting a hit against Chapman.

If you are going to brush the guy back throw the ball at about hip level.
Pitchers do that all the time.. no need to throw near head level like Chapman did. I'm not sure what Chapman accomplished, other then making a fool out of himself and firing up the Pirates even more.

I am pretty sure the Pirates get Leake and Homer next.. not exactly the most steady hands on the Reds staff.. although both will be well rested, since their last outings were short..Tony LaRussa has hacked REDREAD's account. ;)

Personally, it looked like one got away from Chapman. McCutcheon needs to get over himself.

Raisor
08-04-2012, 07:38 AM
from the MLB.com post-game story

Raisor will bring the same question as he did when people were saying that Rolen had reved up HIS game.

This quote implies that the Pirates weren't reved up for last night's game, right?

If not, why not?

edabbs44
08-04-2012, 08:42 AM
Raisor will bring the same question as he did when people were saying that Rolen had reved up HIS game.

This quote implies that the Pirates weren't reved up for last night's game, right?

If not, why not?

Different kind of revved up. But you probably know that.

puca
08-04-2012, 08:44 AM
I don't have an issue with Chapman hitting McCutchen - whether it was quasi on purpose or not. I also don't have a problem with the Pirates being upset and retaliating in some fashion. As long as it is within the rules of the game and no clear intent to injure (the pitches stay below the head) - it's just some good old fashioned baseball right there.

Nothing would be better than if both the Reds and Pirates were legitimate enough for long enough for this to become a rivalry again.

traderumor
08-04-2012, 08:55 AM
Raisor will bring the same question as he did when people were saying that Rolen had reved up HIS game.

This quote implies that the Pirates weren't reved up for last night's game, right?

If not, why not?I'm with you. As if getting "fired up" is a performance enhancer in a game where repitition, tempo and timing are the core components of the game's skills.

BuckeyeRedleg
08-04-2012, 08:59 AM
Manufactured outrage.

Griffey012
08-04-2012, 09:19 AM
McCutcheon looked absolutely furious. He looked like he thought Chapman did it on purpose.

He had every right to be furious. I would be as well if I just took a 101 MPH fastball up and in, regardless of my player status or numbers, but not to mention you are the leading NL MVP candidate playing against the team who you are trying to overtake in the division.

PIT has a right to be mad, we have a right to feel like it was nothing, it is just the way it works, and I will be shocked if I do not see some retaliation tonight. It is fair.

cincrazy
08-04-2012, 09:30 AM
I'm just hoping if/when they do retaliate, we don't charge the mound. The last thing we need right now is any suspensions, or Votto and BP slugging it out while injured.

SirFelixCat
08-04-2012, 09:31 AM
He had every right to be furious. I would be as well if I just took a 101 MPH fastball up and in, regardless of my player status or numbers, but not to mention you are the leading NL MVP candidate playing against the team who you are trying to overtake in the division.

PIT has a right to be mad, we have a right to feel like it was nothing, it is just the way it works, and I will be shocked if I do not see some retaliation tonight. It is fair.

This.


While I don't think hitting Cutch was intentional, I get where he's coming from. IMO, one of our guys will get plunked tonight and we all move on. I don't mind a rivalry being rekindled. Good for the fans, players and sport.

Big Klu
08-04-2012, 09:37 AM
I'm just hoping if/when they do retaliate, we don't charge the mound. The last thing we need right now is any suspensions, or Votto and BP slugging it out while injured.

Players on the DL are automatically suspended if they enter the field during an altercation. Russ Springer was suspended for the Reds in 2010 following the fight with St. Louis.

cincrazy
08-04-2012, 09:39 AM
Players on the DL are automatically suspended if the enter the field during an altercation. Russ Springer was suspended for the Reds in 2010 following the fight with St. Louis.

Thanks for the heads up, didn't know that. Let's really hope Votto knows that rule! Lol.

PS I would just like to add, that after seven years, and 3,606 posts on Redszone, I've finally decided to go with an avatar. What took me so long? Good question.

Bob Borkowski
08-04-2012, 10:26 AM
PS I would just like to add, that after seven years, and 3,606 posts on Redszone, I've finally decided to go with an avatar. What took me so long? Good question.

Great...now how about a signature? :)

cincrazy
08-04-2012, 10:31 AM
Great...now how about a signature? :)

Baby steps :). Maybe another 3,000 posts and 7 years away.

NJReds
08-04-2012, 10:32 AM
It was bush league... I love watching Chapman pitch, but that was stupid and dangerous if intentional.

The guy has pinpoint control his year, I doubt it was an accident.

Just exactly why was there a need to brush back McCutchon when there's two outs in the ninth, leading by 3 runs? There wasn't.

Sorry. I have to disagree. How many times have we seen Chapman overthrow his fastball and miss really high our outside. He doesn't have pinpoint control.

McCutchen stands close to the plate, Hanigan set up inside and the pitch was in a little too much. Good hitters get pitched inside. That's why Votto gets hit or brushed back. It's baseball, and a HBP there makes no sense. It's only a 3-0 lead, and why wake a team that was sleepwalking all night.

I don't blame McCutchen for being mad, though. That's got to hurt. He should be more upset for being a spectator on Heisey's inside-the-park HR.

jojo
08-04-2012, 10:45 AM
JoJo thinks somebody on MLB.com is livid about something anytime someone wants to find someone livid about something.

JoJo is glad for redszone.

RedEye
08-04-2012, 10:51 AM
Thanks for the heads up, didn't know that. Let's really hope Votto knows that rule! Lol.

PS I would just like to add, that after seven years, and 3,606 posts on Redszone, I've finally decided to go with an avatar. What took me so long? Good question.

And a nice one at that. Question - is that flag actually in Barry's hat or does it just look like it?

Reds/Flyers Fan
08-04-2012, 11:00 AM
So McCutcheon says this is going to fire the Pirates up?

They're having their best season in years, are playing well, and they're playing the first-place team they've been chasing all summer and THIS is now going to fire them up?

OK, then. Go back in your irrelevant hole soon Pirates.

cincrazy
08-04-2012, 11:09 AM
And a nice one at that. Question - is that flag actually in Barry's hat or does it just look like it?

I think that it's in his hat, but I don't know for cetain.

traderumor
08-04-2012, 11:53 AM
I'm not real keen on the "Cutch" nickname, esp. on a Reds fan board, but that might just be my pet peeve.

traderumor
08-04-2012, 11:54 AM
Oh, and the Jolly Roger needed some Viagra last night.

BuckeyeRedleg
08-04-2012, 12:03 PM
I'm not real keen on the "Cutch" nickname, esp. on a Reds fan board, but that might just be my pet peeve.

Agree. First I've heard of the nickname as well.

Seems kind of overly manufactured. Kind of like their outrage from last night.

Oh well, I guess before you can "act like you've been there before", you have to have spent a little time actually BEING there.

vaticanplum
08-04-2012, 12:19 PM
Agree. First I've heard of the nickname as well.

Seems kind of overly manufactured. Kind of like their outrage from last night.

Oh well, I guess before you can "act like you've been there before", you have to have spent a little time actually BEING there.

He's always been called Cutch. Same as A-Rod or K-Rod or anything else. It's as manufactured as any other nickname in sports.

BuckeyeRedleg
08-04-2012, 12:32 PM
He's always been called Cutch. Same as A-Rod or K-Rod or anything else. It's as manufactured as any other nickname in sports.


Difference is that I've heard of A-Rod, K-Rod, etc.

Never heard of "Cutch" and within a day it's been used several times on the board.

wally post
08-04-2012, 12:36 PM
Ok, first of all, I have to say, enough with the name calling of the cities. Put down the team for the actions all you want, but going beyond that is bush-league fandom.

That aside, I agree with this. I think the Pirates are freaking out a bit. They remind me a lot of the Reds in 2010 at this point in the season, before the Cards fell apart and the Reds' lock on the division was secured. And that's right when the Reds-Cards brawl happened, if memory serves.

I think they were upset about the Heisey call and let it get to them emotionally, which was compounded by their inability to do anything on the field the rest of the game. Come the 9th, this happens, and McCutchen freaks out. McCutchen is well-known as an extremely level-headed player and I've never seen him angry like that. I don't necessarily think Chapman hit him intentionally, but I'm guessing he didn't exactly look apologetic after Cutch looked up in a fit of anger from being plunked hard.

The Pirates feel tremendous pressure to prove they are the real deal right now. Facing a first-place team at this point in the year -- it's huge. And one thing that hasn't been mentioned in here is that Pirates fans (beyond being part of a sports fanbase that, I feel, is ridiculously sour grapey about calls generally) one gajillion percent hold the Braves call as the turning point of their season last year. People still talk about it all the time. They have no memory of the Buccos collapsing handily on their own after that, only that call. So the pirates have a very bad chip on their shoulder about calls, I think.

I hope everybody channels their emotion onto the field, because this game was uncomfortable in a way I don't like. I like the Reds being able to stand up for themselves, but -- and I'm sorry if people don't agree with me -- I really, as a fan of this team living outside Cincinnati, don't want to have to get in a position where I'm constantly defending them as a thug team. This happened with their division rival two years ago and it's going to get tougher to defend if it happens again, even if the Reds aren't entirely at fault. On a larger level, the Pirates are the feel-good baseball story right now, so somebody has to be the villain by default. The Reds are too good a team to have to resort to that. and it would make my life completely miserable.

I just want to go back to this GREAT post. I'm in full agreement regarding saying things like Pukesburgh and the like. It's really bad form and makes Redszone appear to be like other forums. It's not a stretch to say that we Reds fans have to learn how to deal with greater success.

Now, regarding the Reds becoming bullies: I think all great teams have swagger and some of them learn how to not appear like bullies. Believe me, I'm not a Yankee fan but "Yankee tradition" comes to mind. i think the Reds may vary here and there and vary as they learn their own way to kick butt and I think they will never be as aggressive as (for example) the '86 Mets.
Dusty sets a tone in this department - as does Joey.
And I'll say it again, Chapman was taking the inside of his plate back. I think it is cool the way this situation mirrors the '10 Reds and Cards. This series just got a lot better. Thanks Aroldis! (and I mean that!):beerme:

vaticanplum
08-04-2012, 12:47 PM
Difference is that I've heard of A-Rod, K-Rod, etc.

Never heard of "Cutch" and within a day it's been used several times on the board.

Then you just missed it somehow. It's a long-standing nickname on a national level, at least as far as the media is concerned. Do a google search for "cutch pirates 2010". It's been a marketing tool for years, Cutch shirts all over Pittsburgh. It's the first line on his wikipedia page.

traderumor
08-04-2012, 12:53 PM
He's always been called Cutch. Same as A-Rod or K-Rod or anything else. It's as manufactured as any other nickname in sports.Well, lets be honest, the Pirates aren't manufacturing anything outside of Pittsburgh, and probably isn't widely known there, so to put in the "K-Rod" or "A-Rod" or even "Cargo" category is a bit of an overstatement on its status as vernacular.

GullyFoyle
08-04-2012, 12:56 PM
For those of you who haven't seen it ... here is McCutchen in the dugout after the game ...

http://youtu.be/DSS20zemaPE

(The language is a little blue at the end, not McCutchen, but whoever taped it)

traderumor
08-04-2012, 12:59 PM
For those of you who haven't seen it ... here is McCutchen in the dugout after the game ...

http://youtu.be/DSS20zemaPEUh oh, he turned his hat sideways. That was probably a signal to the boyz to retaliazizzle.

max venable
08-04-2012, 01:02 PM
For those of you who haven't seen it ... here is McCutchen in the dugout after the game ...

http://youtu.be/DSS20zemaPE

(The language is a little blue at the end, not McCutchen, but whoever taped it)

Look at the comments on that YouTube video. PieRats fans are saying that AC was intentionally trying to end McCutchen's career.

More evidence that they haven't paid a lick of attention to baseball in 20 years.

BCubb2003
08-04-2012, 01:04 PM
Well, lets be honest, the Pirates aren't manufacturing anything outside of Pittsburgh, and probably isn't widely known there, so to put in the "K-Rod" or "A-Rod" or even "Cargo" category is a bit of an overstatement on its status as vernacular.

Dusty probably calls him Cutchy. At least they don't call him McClutchin' ...

Anyway, he's their Votto. How would we react?

cincrazy
08-04-2012, 01:12 PM
Ok, first of all, I have to say, enough with the name calling of the cities. Put down the team for the actions all you want, but going beyond that is bush-league fandom.

That aside, I agree with this. I think the Pirates are freaking out a bit. They remind me a lot of the Reds in 2010 at this point in the season, before the Cards fell apart and the Reds' lock on the division was secured. And that's right when the Reds-Cards brawl happened, if memory serves.

I think they were upset about the Heisey call and let it get to them emotionally, which was compounded by their inability to do anything on the field the rest of the game. Come the 9th, this happens, and McCutchen freaks out. McCutchen is well-known as an extremely level-headed player and I've never seen him angry like that. I don't necessarily think Chapman hit him intentionally, but I'm guessing he didn't exactly look apologetic after Cutch looked up in a fit of anger from being plunked hard.

The Pirates feel tremendous pressure to prove they are the real deal right now. Facing a first-place team at this point in the year -- it's huge. And one thing that hasn't been mentioned in here is that Pirates fans (beyond being part of a sports fanbase that, I feel, is ridiculously sour grapey about calls generally) one gajillion percent hold the Braves call as the turning point of their season last year. People still talk about it all the time. They have no memory of the Buccos collapsing handily on their own after that, only that call. So the pirates have a very bad chip on their shoulder about calls, I think.

I hope everybody channels their emotion onto the field, because this game was uncomfortable in a way I don't like. I like the Reds being able to stand up for themselves, but -- and I'm sorry if people don't agree with me -- I really, as a fan of this team living outside Cincinnati, don't want to have to get in a position where I'm constantly defending them as a thug team. This happened with their division rival two years ago and it's going to get tougher to defend if it happens again, even if the Reds aren't entirely at fault. On a larger level, the Pirates are the feel-good baseball story right now, so somebody has to be the villain by default. The Reds are too good a team to have to resort to that. and it would make my life completely miserable.

Agreed. I was able to visit Pittsburgh last summer. BEAUTIFUL city, with wonderful people. And I don't know why we, as Reds fans, have to hate every single team that serves as competition. I for one am glad to see the Pirates back from the dead. It's good for baseball, and good for our entertainment value.

Bob Borkowski
08-04-2012, 01:15 PM
Agreed. I was able to visit Pittsburgh last summer. BEAUTIFUL city, with wonderful people. And I don't know why we, as Reds fans, have to hate every single team that serves as competition. I for one am glad to see the Pirates back from the dead. It's good for baseball, and good for our entertainment value.

Yeah, but these Pirates fans are reminding me of Steelers fans. Not good.

corkedbat
08-04-2012, 01:16 PM
If I was Aroldis, everytime I came in, my first pitch would be behind the batter, then I would rub my eyes and squint really hard for the next sign. Bet there'd be some dancing in the batter's box. :D

cincrazy
08-04-2012, 01:18 PM
Yeah, but these Pirates fans are reminding me of Steelers fans. Not good.

They're proud of their city, and their teams. I've come to respect them since visiting them. It's a beautiful place, and if I was from there I'd probably boast too haha.

wolfboy
08-04-2012, 01:18 PM
Agreed. I was able to visit Pittsburgh last summer. BEAUTIFUL city, with wonderful people. And I don't know why we, as Reds fans, have to hate every single team that serves as competition. I for one am glad to see the Pirates back from the dead. It's good for baseball, and good for our entertainment value.

They make it easy when their message board has multiple threads on how best to retaliate. I'm especially tickled by those calling for pitches to the head. The city might be great, but that doesn't mean their sports fans have an ounce of class. I do agree that the variations of Pittsburgh reek of juvenile behavior.

wlf WV
08-04-2012, 01:20 PM
The fans are taking their cue from Cushion,he obviously acted if he thought it was intentional,whether he did or not.

max venable
08-04-2012, 01:21 PM
Yeah, but these Pirates fans are reminding me of Steelers fans. Not good.

I went to one of the weekend games in Pittsburgh in June. We lost that one 4-1. Family and I were walking back to downtown across the Clemente Bridge and a guy was standing on the steel beam of the bridge playing sax, trying to make a buck. He sees us coming, wearing Reds gear, and he stops his song and starts jawing at us about the Reds losing. I look up and just say, "Still in first place."

His response: "How many Superbowls you won?" :lol:

wally post
08-04-2012, 01:21 PM
For those of you who haven't seen it ... here is McCutchen in the dugout after the game ...

http://youtu.be/DSS20zemaPE

(The language is a little blue at the end, not McCutchen, but whoever taped it)

The key words in the commentary are "Watch tomorrow night". Media will do anything to get people to watch

cincrazy
08-04-2012, 01:26 PM
They make it easy when their message board has multiple threads on how best to retaliate. I'm especially tickled by those calling for pitches to the head. The city might be great, but that doesn't mean their sports fans have an ounce of class. I do agree that the variations of Pittsburgh reek of juvenile behavior.

That's any fanbase though. If Votto was hit like this, I guarantee this board would've been up in arms.

I enjoy it. This rivalry matters again. It's pretty cool :).

Phhhl
08-04-2012, 01:33 PM
I don't think McCutchen cares if Chapman hit him intentionally or not. He is a leader of that team, and he is trying to fire them up before they are down 2-0, or even get swept. They had won 8 out of the previous 10 games here and I am pretty sure they felt high and mighty coming into this series. Maybe it is reckless to use something like that as motivation. It probably is if it evolves into a beanball war and fist fights moving forward. So, I am certainly not defending it. But, I can see where he is coming from.

Brutus
08-04-2012, 01:48 PM
I'm not big on purposeful plunkings, but now I think the Reds should issue a preemptive strike in the first inning tonight to beat Pittsburgh to the punch and draw a warning to both benches so they can't retaliate without being ejected.

CrackerJack
08-04-2012, 01:49 PM
That's any fanbase though. If Votto was hit like this, I guarantee this board would've been up in arms.

I enjoy it. This rivalry matters again. It's pretty cool :).

Agreed. He hit him in the back of the shoulder, they were shut-out, I suspect they'll be tough to beat tonight. Hurt pride and all...

kaldaniels
08-04-2012, 01:53 PM
I'm not big on purposeful plunkings, but now I think the Reds should issue a preemptive strike in the first inning tonight to beat Pittsburgh to the punch and draw a warning to both benches so they can't retaliate without being ejected.

Who should the victim be??? :D

Superdude
08-04-2012, 01:58 PM
Who should the victim be??? :D

Where's Yadi Molina when you need him?!

Brutus
08-04-2012, 02:01 PM
Who should the victim be??? :D

Cutch!

cincrazy
08-04-2012, 02:04 PM
Cutch!

Oh my. That would start the mother of all wars. If he noticed a Leake fastball hitting him anyways :).

traderumor
08-04-2012, 02:09 PM
Dusty probably calls him Cutchy. At least they don't call him McClutchin' ...

Anyway, he's their Votto. How would we react?
Votto got plunked in a similar situation earlier in the year, I believe the Reds were down, it was slightly fishy, Votto glared, a few folks expressed indignation, and then the game went on.

Brutus
08-04-2012, 02:10 PM
Oh my. That would start the mother of all wars. If he noticed a Leake fastball hitting him anyways :).

Is that like a bee stinging after a shark bite?

wally post
08-04-2012, 02:14 PM
Broxton should be in the dugout until the 6th inning :)

Far East
08-04-2012, 02:15 PM
I'm convinced that it was not intentional:

A. Because Chapman has thrown other 100 MPH pitches in the dirt or over the catcher's head.

B. Because if the next batter gets on base, it would bring the tying run to the plate.

puca
08-04-2012, 02:33 PM
They make it easy when their message board has multiple threads on how best to retaliate. I'm especially tickled by those calling for pitches to the head. The city might be great, but that doesn't mean their sports fans have an ounce of class. I do agree that the variations of Pittsburgh reek of juvenile behavior.

And this thread contains the suggestion that Leake goes out and make a pre-emptive strike by hitting Andrew again. Fans will be fans. They are not always rational but, as much as we like to pretend, they are not much different from city to city.

RedsfaninMT
08-04-2012, 02:42 PM
And this thread contains the suggestion that Leake goes out and make a pre-emptive strike by hitting Andrew again. Fans will be fans. They are not always rational but, as much as we like to pretend, they are not much different from city to city.

Yes, fans will be fans. But that comment about hitting McCutcheon was funny stuff, and I took it as being sarcastic. There were other funny posts about how much it would "hurt" to be hit by a Leake "fastball."

In reality You don't do a preemptive strike, because when we go to Pittsburgh, payback would be warranted. It quickly gets dangerous. I suspect McDonald will hit a Red in the first, likely BP, both benches will be warned, and that should be the end of it.

Brutus
08-04-2012, 02:50 PM
And this thread contains the suggestion that Leake goes out and make a pre-emptive strike by hitting Andrew again. Fans will be fans. They are not always rational but, as much as we like to pretend, they are not much different from city to city.

I wasn't really being serious when I made that suggestion, by the way. It was nothing more than a little humor about the whole thing. I apologize if you didn't receive the humor intended, but it wasn't a serious suggestion.

edabbs44
08-04-2012, 02:52 PM
You can understand McCutcheon's frustration. On a number of levels. Beat them 10-0 tonight and I am sure he'll be in an even worse mood.

757690
08-04-2012, 03:09 PM
You can understand McCutcheon's frustration. On a number of levels. Beat them 10-0 tonight and I am sure he'll be in an even worse mood.

Yep, I could care less who wins the battle of knockdown pitches. Just win the baseball game.

5DOLLAR-BLEACHERBUM
08-04-2012, 03:29 PM
I'm guessing Phillips takes one to the back in the first.

DGullett35
08-04-2012, 03:31 PM
I'm guessing Phillips takes one to the back in the first.

I hope not. We need him to stay on the field. He was absolutely raking here lately and has had to sit the last 3 games.

Redsfan320
08-04-2012, 03:37 PM
I'm guessing Phillips takes one to the back in the first.


If that happens, I hope we get a good fight out of it (sue me, I find a good baseball fight entertaining), or at least another payback pitch. Chappy's wasn't intentional. I don't care if we're at an even 1-for-1 or not, there should be retribution if that happens. Or maybe its just wishful thinking.... I love a good heated rivalry.

320

hebroncougar
08-04-2012, 04:04 PM
They're proud of their city, and their teams. I've come to respect them since visiting them. It's a beautiful place, and if I was from there I'd probably boast too haha.


I don't think anyone is proud of the Pirates.
Sent from my Desire HD using Tapatalk 2

edabbs44
08-04-2012, 04:06 PM
I wish they sat BP tonight.

Blitz Dorsey
08-04-2012, 04:07 PM
Ahh, give 'em a break. They haven't had MLB in Pittsburgh for so long that they forgot the rules.

(Honestly, I'd probably be upset too. But that's just baseball.)

WMR
08-04-2012, 04:10 PM
Pittsburgh would be great if it wasn't for the winters and all the Steeler fans. It sucks.

GullyFoyle
08-04-2012, 04:13 PM
I enjoyed my time in Pittsburgh too, it's nice to be able to hit a Jazz club from time to time.

I try to remember this when I see a car (here in CA) with Steeler plates. Ugh, just want to hit them :)

reds44
08-04-2012, 04:14 PM
Sigh. The posts in this thread with the racial undertones are highly disappointing.

Blitz Dorsey
08-04-2012, 04:16 PM
Sigh. The posts in this thread with the racial undertones are highly disappointing.

Really? Haven't noticed anything of the sort.

A Cuban plunked a black dude. This is a racial situation now?

jojo
08-04-2012, 04:17 PM
Yep, I could care less who wins the battle of knockdown pitches. Just win the baseball game.

Yes. THIS. And if they have to do something extracurricular, how but make it be great plays at key moments of the game or getting back up off of the ground in response to a metaphorical punch in the nose (i.e. like coming back from a big deficit)?

The nation is watching because this is a meaningful series, probably one of the most compelling ones of the weekend. I kinda hope the nation isn't treated to Cardinals series 2.0.

reds44
08-04-2012, 04:18 PM
Really? Haven't noticed anything of the sort.

A Cuban plunked a black dude. This is a racial situation now?


Uh oh, he turned his hat sideways. That was probably a signal to the boyz to retaliazizzle.

Earlier in the thread (I'm too lazy to find it) McCutchen was referred to as a "thug" as well. Black guy must be a thug.

EDIT: he was actually called a thug in the game thread.

wolfboy
08-04-2012, 04:19 PM
And this thread contains the suggestion that Leake goes out and make a pre-emptive strike by hitting Andrew again. Fans will be fans. They are not always rational but, as much as we like to pretend, they are not much different from city to city.

My post was in response to the question regarding why we have to hate every team that's a competitor, to which I responded they make it easy. I have no doubt we make it easy for them as well. I never said this was unique.

Vottomatic
08-04-2012, 04:23 PM
Again, remember in Bull Durham when Crash Davis tells Tim Robbins to hit the bull behind him with a wild pitch?

A little wildness can be an effective tool. Now the next hitter has to decide not only whether or not to swing or not swing, but whether to get out of the way too. Adds another dimension.

I don't think he tried to hit him. I think it was a brushback pitch, and Chapman can be wild from time to time anyway.

I hope it gets in the Pirates crawl. I hope they concentrate more on retaliating than winning. Because that would be the dumb thing to do. I hope McDonald hits one of our batters in the first inning, gets ejected, they have to wear out their bullpen all day, and we take advantage of it today and tomorrow.

Brutus
08-04-2012, 04:25 PM
Earlier in the thread (I'm too lazy to find it) McCutchen was referred to as a "thug" as well. Black guy must be a thug.

EDIT: he was actually called a thug in the game thread.

I don't think anyone should be making a race issue out of the term thug. It's not a racial term by definition, and unless you have evidence that someone called him a thug merely because he's black, I don't think this should be a topic of conversation on here. You're really reaching.

Tom Servo
08-04-2012, 04:27 PM
Earlier in the thread (I'm too lazy to find it) McCutchen was referred to as a "thug" as well. Black guy must be a thug.

EDIT: he was actually called a thug in the game thread.
If you're gonna call people out, you have to at least have the right thread. :nono:

Blitz Dorsey
08-04-2012, 04:33 PM
Earlier in the thread (I'm too lazy to find it) McCutchen was referred to as a "thug" as well. Black guy must be a thug.

EDIT: he was actually called a thug in the game thread.

You are reeeeeeeeealy reaching here. Be careful you don't pop your shoulder out of socket.

Tom Servo
08-04-2012, 04:35 PM
http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/blog/big_league_stew/post/andrew-mccutchen-takes-issue-with-matt-wieters-block-of-plate?urn=mlb,wp614

Thought this was interesting. I like McCutchen and think he's a great player, but he seems to have a thing about perceiving other players as trying to hurt him.

reds44
08-04-2012, 04:47 PM
You are reeeeeeeeealy reaching here. Be careful you don't pop your shoulder out of socket.
I'll let it go, but I'm not reaching at all. Randomly calling an African-American a thug (for pretty much no reason) and saying turning your hat sideways is a sign for the "boyz to retaliazizzle" has pretty obvious racial undertones to it. For some reason I think of Neil Walker did the same thing the term "thug" would have never been used. I'll leave it at that.

wally post
08-04-2012, 05:03 PM
To comment on this direction of "thug" takes the thread to another place so I have no comment. To me, it is not baseball related

traderumor
08-04-2012, 05:05 PM
Earlier in the thread (I'm too lazy to find it) McCutchen was referred to as a "thug" as well. Black guy must be a thug.

EDIT: he was actually called a thug in the game thread.Me thinks you may be taking this message board stuff too seriously. I think my mocking statement is probably about 15 years behind the times. But.........there is a HUGE difference between teasing about a cultural distinctive and racism. My black brothers in law and my biracial nephews and adopted son have yet to accuse me of racism, so cool it with the accusations, pal.

reds44
08-04-2012, 05:15 PM
Me thinks you may be taking this message board stuff too seriously. I think my mocking statement is probably about 15 years behind the times. But.........there is a HUGE difference between teasing about a cultural distinctive and racism. My black brothers in law and my biracial nephews and adopted son have yet to accuse me of racism, so cool it with the accusations, pal.
I never accused you of being a racist, just said it had racial undertones. Considering I've gotten multiple private messages agreeing with me, perhaps you should choose your words more carefully, pal.

kbrake
08-04-2012, 05:20 PM
I'm with reds44 and was thinking it before even reading this thread. I saw thug being used last night and then again now I saw it as thread title in the Sun Deck. Maybe people are not aware of how that word is taken by some. I'm certainty not saying you're a racist if you use it but I will say maybe you should choose words more carefully. Like it was said same incident occurs with Neil Walker and that word isn't used once. I've never heard a bad word about Andrew McCutchon and I think it is low class for this board to start calling him a thug. I won't say more in this thread but I felt the need to mention there was at least one more person on Redszone who thinks we can do better than calling a guy a thug.

traderumor
08-04-2012, 05:23 PM
I never accused you of being a racist, just said it had racial undertones. Considering I've gotten multiple private messages agreeing with me, perhaps you should choose your words more carefully, pal.Then people are joining you in taking this discussion way too seriously. Trust me, you and apparently others are overreacting to a corny joke by amiddle aged white guy who grew up on the wrong side of the tracks and has never been accused of racist comments in my life, so back off and move on. BTW, sideways hat and flat billed caps are gang ware for all manner of ethnicities, for the record.

Brutus
08-04-2012, 05:26 PM
I never accused you of being a racist, just said it had racial undertones. Considering I've gotten multiple private messages agreeing with me, perhaps you should choose your words more carefully, pal.

The word "undertones" basically means underlying feelings or quality. It would seem to me that racial underlying feelings is just a nicer way of saying someone is racist.

reds44
08-04-2012, 05:29 PM
The word "undertones" basically means underlying feelings or quality. It would seem to me that racial underlying feelings is just a nicer way of saying someone is racist.
Look, you can make a poor joke or comment without being a racist. I'm not accusing anybody of being racist, but there are better ways to discuss McCutchen getting angry about getting drilled than calling him a thug. All you do is make yourself look bad doing that.

GullyFoyle
08-04-2012, 05:29 PM
I suspect we are on the cusp of a huge tangent ... Context is very important in all communications, and an internet message board has next to none. Let's just give everyone the benefit of the doubt.

Brutus
08-04-2012, 05:34 PM
Look, you can make a poor joke or comment without being a racist. I'm not accusing anybody of being racist, but there are better ways to discuss McCutchen getting angry about getting drilled than calling him a thug. All you do is make yourself look bad doing that.

OK that's fair but don't accuse them of racial undertones if you're not accusing them of being a racist. It's basically the same thing just said in a nicer way.

Not everyone uses the term, as it's actually defined, in the racial sense and suggesting someone does without any proof is a stereotype just like you're accusing others of. Even based on the 'clinical definition' of the term, I wouldn't agree with anyone calling McCutchen a "thug" based on what I know about him, but it doesn't mean someone did so because of race. I don't know how everyone uses the term, as I know there are some that use it improperly, but some use words as they're defined. If someone thinks McCutchen is violent, then calling him a thug doesn't have to be used in a racial context.

reds44
08-04-2012, 05:39 PM
OK that's fair but don't accuse them of racial undertones if you're not accusing them of being a racist. It's basically the same thing just said in a nicer way.

Not everyone uses the term, as it's actually defined, in the racial sense and suggesting someone does without any proof is a stereotype just like you're accusing others of.
Now you're just getting into logistics. People need to choose their words more carefully. Or don't. Whatever. All it does is make the people making the comments look bad, no matter what their intention may be. I didn't call anybody a racist nor did I imply anybody was a racist no matter how you may try to spin it. Calling an African-American a thug for no reason has racial undertones to it. And I have no reason to not believe traderumour didn't mean anything by what he said, but again, it doesn't look good.

I'm moving on. Have a good day.

smith288
08-04-2012, 05:40 PM
Im pretty sure I read that the person who called him a "thug" (WVReds?) said that you have to live near Pittsburgh to understand why they called him that. So perhaps it's not a race issue...

alloverjr
08-04-2012, 05:42 PM
Im pretty sure I read that the person who called him a "thug" (WVReds?) said that you have to live near Pittsburgh to understand why they called him that. So perhaps it's not a race issue...

I believe those two are in rival gangs...

jojo
08-04-2012, 05:44 PM
Jeeps, 7:10 can not get here fast enough....

traderumor
08-04-2012, 05:51 PM
Now you're just getting into logistics. People need to choose their words more carefully. Or don't. Whatever. All it does is make the people making the comments look bad, no matter what their intention may be. I didn't call anybody a racist nor did I imply anybody was a racist no matter how you may try to spin it. Calling an African-American a thug for no reason has racial undertones to it. And I have no reason to not believe traderumour didn't mean anything by what he said, but again, it doesn't look good.

I'm moving on. Have a good day.Now I know how Mrs. O'Leary's cow must have felt.

steig
08-04-2012, 06:02 PM
If they think he hit mccutchen on purpose then they better watch out. Height just do that tonight and really get him. I wouldn't get into a hit batsman contest when aroldis can throw 107.

Raisor
08-04-2012, 06:08 PM
Tupac was the biggest celeb that brought "Thugz" into lexicon.

The only white "Thugz" were Tracy Smothers and the Dirty White Boy Tony Anthony, wrestlers in SMW doing a redneck gimmick.

"T" is for "Tough"
"H" is for "Hell"
"U" is for "Ugly"
and "G" is for "Jail", because everybody knows that a Thug can't spell.

SirFelixCat
08-04-2012, 06:35 PM
Wow, reading the last couple of pages...


I miss the old board and the old posters :sadkitty:

Blitz Dorsey
08-04-2012, 06:36 PM
Brutus the Pimp has changed his screen name to just Brutus? What a thug.

CrackerJack
08-04-2012, 06:57 PM
OK that's fair but don't accuse them of racial undertones if you're not accusing them of being a racist. It's basically the same thing just said in a nicer way.

Not everyone uses the term, as it's actually defined, in the racial sense and suggesting someone does without any proof is a stereotype just like you're accusing others of. Even based on the 'clinical definition' of the term, I wouldn't agree with anyone calling McCutchen a "thug" based on what I know about him, but it doesn't mean someone did so because of race. I don't know how everyone uses the term, as I know there are some that use it improperly, but some use words as they're defined. If someone thinks McCutchen is violent, then calling him a thug doesn't have to be used in a racial context.

Or you could just do some self-reflection and admit it was inappropriate, move on, and everyone else can to - and we'd all feel better about your ability to recognize how built-in stereotypes are something we some times all struggle with and need to correct or think about more, before spitting out an emotional comment that's just stupid.

alloverjr
08-04-2012, 06:58 PM
Tupac was the biggest celeb that brought "Thugz" into lexicon.



See how well that worked out for him ;)

VR
08-04-2012, 07:01 PM
First time in 22 years the Pirates have been competitive enough to be worth throwing at.

757690
08-04-2012, 07:04 PM
Brutus the Pimp has changed his screen name to just Brutus? What a thug.

He must have finally realized that it's tough out there for a pimp.

Brutus
08-04-2012, 07:05 PM
Or you could just do some self-reflection and admit it was inappropriate, move on, and everyone else can to - and we'd all feel better about your ability to recognize how built-in stereotypes are something we some times all struggle with and need to correct or think about more, before spitting out an emotional comment that's just stupid.

First of all, it's not my comment and have said I personally don't agree with calling him the term based on how it's defined and what I know about him.

That said, I think you need to get out a dictionary and actually see what the term means and consider that not everyone uses the term in the racial connotation. If someone thinks McCutchen is violent, then calling him a thug wouldn't be "inappropriate" regardless of race because that's what the word actually means.

Brutus
08-04-2012, 07:07 PM
Brutus the Pimp has changed his screen name to just Brutus? What a thug.

You can now refer to me as the Artist formerly known as Brutus the Pimp.

reds44
08-04-2012, 07:10 PM
Or you could just do some self-reflection and admit it was inappropriate, move on, and everyone else can to - and we'd all feel better about your ability to recognize how built-in stereotypes are something we some times all struggle with and need to correct or think about more, before spitting out an emotional comment that's just stupid.
Thank you.

Brutus
08-04-2012, 07:36 PM
Thank you.

Thought you were moving on? I didn't reply to you out of respect to your saying you were.

dougdirt
08-04-2012, 07:43 PM
I'm not big on purposeful plunkings, but now I think the Reds should issue a preemptive strike in the first inning tonight to beat Pittsburgh to the punch and draw a warning to both benches so they can't retaliate without being ejected.

First inning, second inning.... same thing right? Which player reads Redszone?:laugh:

Brutus
08-04-2012, 07:47 PM
First inning, second inning.... same thing right? Which player reads Redszone?:laugh:

Yeah that's hilarious how it worked out.

And clearly the only reason Hurdle should be upset at the warnings is if they intended to plunk a Reds' batter sometime tonight.

Reds Nd2
08-04-2012, 07:53 PM
If they were livid last night, they must be totally indignant tonight.

Vottomatic
08-04-2012, 07:56 PM
Marty and Brantley complained on the radio that the batter, I think it was Harrison, didn't even try and move out of the way of Leake's pitch that hit him. I agree.

Raisor
08-04-2012, 09:59 PM
Tupac was the biggest celeb that brought "Thugz" into lexicon.

The only white "Thugz" were Tracy Smothers and the Dirty White Boy Tony Anthony, wrestlers in SMW doing a redneck gimmick.

"T" is for "Tough"
"H" is for "Hell"
"U" is for "Ugly"
and "G" is for "Jail", because everybody knows that a Thug can't spell.

and of course, Tim Hummell

hebroncougar
08-04-2012, 10:13 PM
Hebroncougar thinks "Cutch" will be mad that Scotty his that ball over his head tonight.

Raisor
08-04-2012, 10:15 PM
Maybe tomorrow Cutch will play extra EXTRA hard.

Vottomatic
08-04-2012, 10:19 PM
Cutch probably lost 2 games for them. He should have backed up LF last night and Heisey doesn't do the inside the park HR. I thought Cutch shoud have caught Rolen's triple tonight.

Here's hoping Cutch does something tomorrow to help us win. :beerme:

George Foster
08-04-2012, 10:43 PM
I've no doubt it was a purpose pitch. I am sure Chapman was trying to push him off the plate. But I don't believe for a second it was meant to hit him.

to play the devils advocate...2 outs no one on. Best hitter in baseball up. 3 run lead. Left handed batter on deck who you then strike out in 3 pitches with pin point control. I can see why they could think it was done on purpose...just sayin.

If the situation were reverse...and they hit Votto on the first pitch to get to Bruce who you waste in 3 pitches...I might think the same thing..

RedFanAlways1966
08-04-2012, 10:48 PM
If the situation were reverse...and they hit Votto on the first pitch to get to Bruce who you waste in 3 pitches...I might think the same thing..

You had me convinced until you had Bruce batting behind Votto. Come on, George, that cannot happen. EVER! ;)

George Foster
08-04-2012, 10:51 PM
You had me convinced until you had Bruce batting behind Votto. Come on, George, that cannot happen. EVER! ;)

haha...Brandon hurt again...Bruce has to bat 4th....my bad!

REDREAD
08-04-2012, 10:58 PM
Tony LaRussa has hacked REDREAD's account. ;)

Personally, it looked like one got away from Chapman. McCutcheon needs to get over himself.

I believe it was intentional.. Of course Chapman is the only one that knows for sure.

IF it was intentional, it was a stupid thing to do.

I hope it was not intentional.

Vottomatic
08-04-2012, 11:05 PM
Chapman has battled periods of wildness in his Reds career.

Dusty said on the pregame show they are trying to pitch Cutch inside.

It wasn't intentional according to Dusty, and I believe him.

I(heart)Freel
08-04-2012, 11:26 PM
to play the devils advocate...2 outs no one on. Best hitter in baseball up. 3 run lead. Left handed batter on deck who you then strike out in 3 pitches with pin point control. I can see why they could think it was done on purpose...just sayin.

If the situation were reverse...and they hit Votto on the first pitch to get to Bruce who you waste in 3 pitches...I might think the same thing..

Again with the insinuation that Chapman has pinpoint control. He does NOT. Tonight that fact was again on full display. Just because he looks good against the next batter does not mean he turns it on and off. He has pitches that pull Hanigan way out of his spot. Often. That just is.

Also, will it make everyone feel better if we now call Jared Hughes a thug for his shove? Cuz that was by definition thug-ish.

hebroncougar
08-04-2012, 11:30 PM
Chapman stopped going from the windup at one point un the game, so he was definitely uncomfortable with something.

Sent from my Desire HD using Tapatalk 2

Brutus
08-04-2012, 11:33 PM
Again with the insinuation that Chapman has pinpoint control. He does NOT. Tonight that fact was again on full display. Just because he looks good against the next batter does not mean he turns it on and off. He has pitches that pull Hanigan way out of his spot. Often. That just is.

Also, will it make everyone feel better if we now call Jared Hughes a thug for his shove? Cuz that was by definition thug-ish.

I agree, and the only reason I didn't mention it is because I didn't want to be the one to open up that can of worms. But you're absolutely right it was that kind of behavior.

vaticanplum
08-04-2012, 11:45 PM
Ok, I've been silent on the matter long enough. there is no "o" in McCutchen's last name.

It's a pretty rampant mistake on this board. If we're going to be the better, smarter, higher-road team, we should at least spell correctly :)

I hate that he's showing so poorly and inciting hate with this series. He's traditionally anything but a thug in any sense of the word -- stand-up, even-tempered, a leader, all-around good guy. Never shown any predilection toward anger or violence whatsoever that I can remember. And a helluva ballplayer. He's young and he's bearing the brunt of the pressure on that team and he's never dealt with anything like this before, and he's not handling it well, which is a mistake a lot of young people make. I hope he doesn't have people turn against him forever.

On the other hand, a lot of other guys in his situation might have been a lot more hot-headed. He did let it get to him on the field though.

_Sir_Charles_
08-04-2012, 11:51 PM
Vatican Plum = Vocabulary Police

Coincidence? I think not. ;) Just kidding VP. It drives me nuts too.

vaticanplum
08-04-2012, 11:52 PM
It's true. I can't play ball so I have to plunk the moniker transgressions.

traderumor
08-05-2012, 08:17 AM
Ok, I've been silent on the matter long enough. there is no "o" in McCutchen's last name.

It's a pretty rampant mistake on this board. If we're going to be the better, smarter, higher-road team, we should at least spell correctly :)

I hate that he's showing so poorly and inciting hate with this series. He's traditionally anything but a thug in any sense of the word -- stand-up, even-tempered, a leader, all-around good guy. Never shown any predilection toward anger or violence whatsoever that I can remember. And a helluva ballplayer. He's young and he's bearing the brunt of the pressure on that team and he's never dealt with anything like this before, and he's not handling it well, which is a mistake a lot of young people make. I hope he doesn't have people turn against him forever.

On the other hand, a lot of other guys in his situation might have been a lot more hot-headed. He did let it get to him on the field though.
The Reds have had his number this year. But they also pointed out during the TV broadcast that he is in about a two week power slump. His reaction to getting hit by a pitch is simply misplaced, unfortunate, and childish. I will watch my spelling more carefully, but I will not call him that other name.

Tom Servo
09-11-2012, 02:19 AM
So, this happened:

Brandon Phillips ‏@DatDudeBP
#RealTalk... Not really surprised by what I heard come outta another player's mouth tonite but DAMN... Still PISSED bout that $h+!! #Racism

Superdude
09-11-2012, 02:35 AM
So, this happened:

Brandon Phillips ‏@DatDudeBP
#RealTalk... Not really surprised by what I heard come outta another player's mouth tonite but DAMN... Still PISSED bout that $h+!! #Racism

That's gotta be from the Hughes incident. He was visibly upset on first base, and the pick off with Phillips literally standing on the bag was just bizarre.

reds44
09-11-2012, 02:37 AM
Not hard to figure out what happened here. I always thought Hughes looked like a raging (insert whatever bad word you want here), guess I was right.

Vottomatic
09-11-2012, 07:10 AM
So, is McCutche(o)n the league MVP? :D

OldXOhio
09-11-2012, 08:35 AM
Not hard to figure out what happened here. I always thought Hughes looked like a raging (insert whatever bad word you want here), guess I was right.

Exactly what Brantley was saying on the radio during the incident. Talked repeatedly about the massive chip on Hughes' shoulder that he's known around the league for.

OesterPoster
09-11-2012, 08:52 AM
So we think Hughes called BP the N word? If so, it makes sense that BP confronted McCutcheon about it.

WildcatFan
09-11-2012, 09:25 AM
So we think Hughes called BP the N word? If so, it makes sense that BP confronted McCutcheon about it.

I couldn't make out everything BP was saying to the umpire, but he did point back at center field (McCutcheon) and say "No, he's my boy." It looked like right before that he yelled something at McCutcheon, who stopped, said something, nodded, and ran back to the dugout. Then the umpire came over, and he and Phillips had a pretty civil-looking conversation.

But Brandon definitely didn't look mad at MuCutcheon, and he definitely called McCutcheon "my boy."

Blitz Dorsey
09-11-2012, 09:42 AM
I love how Brandon handled it. OK, you want to call me that? Guess what hilljack, your best player is black. I bet he won't enjoy hearing this. This should all go over well in your already-imploding clubhouse.

See you in 2013, losers. Try and hold on to that winning record! The first one in 20 years! It's slipping away fast.

WildcatFan
09-11-2012, 10:09 AM
I love how Brandon handled it. OK, you want to call me that? Guess what hilljack, your best player is black. I bet he won't enjoy hearing this. This should all go over well in your already-imploding clubhouse.

See you in 2013, losers. Try and hold on to that winning record! The first one in 20 years! It's slipping away fast.

Well this was just delightful! :clap:

traderumor
09-11-2012, 10:10 AM
As BP said, not surprised coming from Hughes and his Lurch imitation, but very disappointing. If that happened, and you know Phillips will talk to players like McCuthen and Harrison, I can't imagine Hughes will be a Pirate next year. At least I would hope not.

OesterPoster
09-11-2012, 10:41 AM
I've read a few other articles on the matter, and I didn't realize that AJ Burnett came out of the dugout and yelled at BP. Wondering if he's the culprit, and not Hughes. If so, should be fun when he pitches tomorrow.

WildcatFan
09-11-2012, 10:44 AM
I've read a few other articles on the matter, and I didn't realize that AJ Burnett came out of the dugout and yelled at BP. Wondering if he's the culprit, and not Hughes. If so, should be fun when he pitches tomorrow.

Remember from the last game, make sure you throw the first beanball.

redsmetz
09-11-2012, 11:54 AM
So we think Hughes called BP the N word? If so, it makes sense that BP confronted McCutcheon about it.

I doubt he used that word. My guess would be he may have said "boy" which coming from a white player in the heat of a play would be taboo, IMO.

RedsMan3203
09-11-2012, 11:54 AM
So we think Hughes called BP the N word? If so, it makes sense that BP confronted McCutcheon about it.

He called him a "Nice Guy" right? :D

Tom Servo
09-11-2012, 11:59 AM
I've read a few other articles on the matter, and I didn't realize that AJ Burnett came out of the dugout and yelled at BP. Wondering if he's the culprit, and not Hughes. If so, should be fun when he pitches tomorrow.
Burnett is a self proclaimed "redneck", so take that for what it's worth.

757690
09-11-2012, 12:04 PM
I doubt he used that word. My guess would be he may have said "boy" which coming from a white player in the heat of a play would be taboo, IMO.

That would explain WildcatFan's lip reading of what Phillips told McCutchen.

Tom Servo
09-11-2012, 12:07 PM
That would explain WildcatFan's lip reading of what Phillips told McCutchen.
I missed that post. Yeah, that seems to be the answer. Hughes called BP "boy".

The Operator
09-11-2012, 12:07 PM
Is there anything likeable at all about that Pirates team? I hope they lose every game the rest of the season quite honestly.

More realistically, I do hope they continue to plumit and finish with yet another losing record. That would be oh so sweet after all of their cockiness and bravado this year.

The Operator
09-11-2012, 12:14 PM
I'd have to think if anyone did use the "N" word that they would have been automatically ejected, so I doubt that happened.

Still, calling someone "boy" in that context is absolutely ridiculous and I hope the league does something about it.

redsfan30
09-11-2012, 01:20 PM
I have to think if it was the "N" word, Brandon would not have stood calmly at first base.

Stuff would have hit the fan.

WildcatFan
09-11-2012, 01:42 PM
He called him a "Nice Guy" right? :D

You know what they say: Nice guys finish third from last.

OesterPoster
09-11-2012, 04:15 PM
Much ado about nothing apparently. BP and Hughes hashed out their issues over the phone with McCutcheon as the go-between. End of story?

crazybob60
09-11-2012, 05:26 PM
http://cincinnati.com/blogs/reds/2012/09/11/phillips-hughes-speak-resolve-things/

mbgrayson
09-11-2012, 06:17 PM
Fair use excerpt, a quote from BP from Fay's story (http://cincinnati.com/blogs/reds/2012/09/11/phillips-hughes-speak-resolve-things/):


“We reached out, and me and Mr. Hughes had a great conversation before I came to the stadium today. It was the best thing that ever happened.....It was just a big misunderstanding. When you say certain things in the heat of the moment, you really don’t mean it. You forgive people. He forgave me. I forgive him. It’s the baseball family. I love him as a brother.”

The Operator
09-11-2012, 07:39 PM
Is it just me, or does Brandon sound a bit sarcastic in that quote? I'm sure he's giving the whole kiss and make-up thing lip service, but I can't imagine that much bad blood just vanishes after a phone call.

WildcatFan
09-12-2012, 09:43 AM
Is it just me, or does Brandon sound a bit sarcastic in that quote? I'm sure he's giving the whole kiss and make-up thing lip service, but I can't imagine that much bad blood just vanishes after a phone call.

I didn't read it that way. He seems like a business man--you talk to me, I talk to you, we handle business. I think if Hughes really apologized or showed that he was misunderstood, Brandon ends it there.

Unless you're a Cardinal or an Indian.

Bumstead
09-12-2012, 10:30 AM
Good to hear.

vaticanplum
09-12-2012, 03:46 PM
All over the radio waves in Pittsburgh today. They're upset Phillips made references on Twitter rather than dealing with it "in an official capacity". The talk show hosts are making some questionable comments from a racial perspective IMHO.

Wonderful Monds
09-12-2012, 03:56 PM
All over the radio waves in Pittsburgh today. They're upset Phillips made references on Twitter rather than dealing with it "in an official capacity". The talk show hosts are making some questionable comments from a racial perspective IMHO.

That's sports talk radio for you.

The Operator
09-12-2012, 04:37 PM
All over the radio waves in Pittsburgh today. They're upset Phillips made references on Twitter rather than dealing with it "in an official capacity". The talk show hosts are making some questionable comments from a racial perspective IMHO.Even more reason why I'm enjoying The Pirates' face-first slide into oblivion down the stretch.