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View Full Version : Adrian Gonzalez to the Dodgers?



Brutus
08-24-2012, 05:44 PM
Possibly, according to ESPN.

I'm highly skeptical, and it seems some officials are too, but nonetheless it's being discussed, apparently.

http://espn.go.com/boston/mlb/story/_/id/8300112/boston-red-sox-adrian-gonzalez-headed-los-angeles-dodgers-sources-say

Tom Servo
08-24-2012, 05:45 PM
Apparently somebody just claimed Beckett off waivers, possibly the Dodgers. I'd say there's a bigger chance he moves than Gonzalez.

klw
08-24-2012, 05:51 PM
Apparently somebody just claimed Beckett off waivers, possibly the Dodgers. I'd say there's a bigger chance he moves than Gonzalez.

That someone is apparently again the Dodgers


https://twitter.com/Sean_McAdam/status/239101353278984192
Sean McAdam
‏@Sean_McAdam
Confirmed: It is indeed the Dodgers who have also claimed Beckett. #RedSoxTalk

blumj
08-24-2012, 06:05 PM
This has to be prearranged that they get Gonzalez if they take Beckett, too, right? Why would anyone claim Beckett otherwise? Heck, why would they think it was necessary even if it was arranged, who did they think would take the risk of claiming Beckett and getting stuck with him just to block them?

Spitball
08-24-2012, 06:14 PM
I smell a conspiracy...maybe. It does seem suspicious to me that Kelly Shoppack who sent the text criticizing Valentine, and Bob McClure who is rumored to have leaked the story to the press were both sent away recently. Now, Gonzalez, who was also involved, is placed on waivers. Hmmm...

Brutus
08-24-2012, 06:17 PM
It's amazing that a team with all these financial woes are suddenly so able to go take anyone and everyone. This is Texas all over again.

Kc61
08-24-2012, 06:34 PM
There are reports floating around that Gonzalez, Beckett and others to the Dodgers is serious. Maybe just rumors on Twitter, etc.

Wonderful Monds
08-24-2012, 06:35 PM
I love this rumor. As it stands, the story is...

Adrian Gonzalez, Josh Beckett, Carl Crawford

For

James Loney.


What. The. Hell.

blumj
08-24-2012, 06:43 PM
I love this rumor. As it stands, the story is...

Adrian Gonzalez, Josh Beckett, Carl Crawford

For

James Loney.


What. The. Hell.
They're supposedly trying to get them to take Punto, too. I doubt that's a deal breaker, though.
http://espn.go.com/boston/mlb/story/_/id/8300112/adrian-gonzalez-carl-crawford-josh-beckett-nearing-boston-red-sox-exit-sources-say

powersackers
08-24-2012, 07:07 PM
They're supposedly trying to get them to take Punto, too. I doubt that's a deal breaker, though.
http://espn.go.com/boston/mlb/story/_/id/8300112/adrian-gonzalez-carl-crawford-josh-beckett-nearing-boston-red-sox-exit-sources-say

Beckett in the kitchen with the candlestick. Oh I thought we were playing Clue.

757690
08-24-2012, 07:17 PM
I love this rumor. As it stands, the story is...

Adrian Gonzalez, Josh Beckett, Carl Crawford

For

James Loney.


What. The. Hell.

That's around $265M cleared off the books between now and 2017. AGon is the only player the BoSox will miss, and 1B are pretty easy to find.

Really, really smart move by the BoSox if they can pull it off.

marcshoe
08-24-2012, 07:25 PM
I heard the Dodgers were offering the Red Sox Dave Revering.

AmarilloRed
08-24-2012, 07:31 PM
Beckett has 10-5 rights and can refuse the trade.

cincrazy
08-24-2012, 07:34 PM
Are the Dodgers out of their mind? I don't care how much money they have to spend, spend it wisely. Crawford is banged up and aging, and I'm sure will continue his decline in quick order in Dodger Stadium and in the NL West in general. Gonzalez is good, but Beckett appears to be done, has a bad back, etc. I don't get this. At. All. If the Red Sox can do this, it'd be a great move for them.

Brutus
08-24-2012, 07:44 PM
I don't see any way Bud Selig and MLB would approve that trade. Yet, I don't see any way and they probably will if it goes down. There's no way they could justify that as being in the best interests of the sport, though.

marcshoe
08-24-2012, 07:45 PM
Are the Dodgers out of their mind? I don't care how much money they have to spend, spend it wisely. Crawford is banged up and aging, and I'm sure will continue his decline in quick order in Dodger Stadium and in the NL West in general. Gonzalez is good, but Beckett appears to be done, has a bad back, etc. I don't get this. At. All. If the Red Sox can do this, it'd be a great move for them.

In essence they'er simply deciding that if you add Beckett, Crawford (who I think may be worth something in the future, at least) and Punto's salaries to Adrian, he's still worth it. And maybe he is.

Tom Servo
08-24-2012, 07:48 PM
What the hell are the Dodgers smoking?

Brutus
08-24-2012, 07:53 PM
What the hell are the Dodgers smoking?

Whatever it is, I want some.

AtomicDumpling
08-24-2012, 07:54 PM
The Dodgers would be taking a huge financial risk, but they would get one of the best hitters in the entire league in Adrian Gonzalez to fill their black hole at first base, which would definitely help their playoff chances this year. Where else are they going to get an impact player this time of year? Plus they would get two very talented but injured stars in Beckett and Crawford to pencil into the lineup for next year and beyond provided they get healthy. It is an aggressive move by the Dodgers. It could be genius or it could blow up in their face.

Virginia Beach Reds
08-24-2012, 07:54 PM
If the Bosox can clear a few aging, bad contracts away at the same time, they deserve to be commended. I still don't know what the Dodgers are doing with this trade.

klw
08-24-2012, 07:58 PM
Well this would free up cash for Boston to sign Ellsbury. Do they go after Josh Hamilton too?

Tom Servo
08-24-2012, 08:00 PM
The Dodgers would be taking a huge financial risk, but they would get one of the best hitters in the entire league in Adrian Gonzalez to fill their black hole at first base, which would definitely help their playoff chances this year. Where else are they going to get an impact player this time of year? Plus they would get two very talented but injured stars in Beckett and Crawford to pencil into the lineup for next year and beyond provided they get healthy. It is an aggressive move by the Dodgers. It could be genius or it could blow up in their face.
I definitely get the idea, but Crawford is money down the toilet. He's never going to be as good as he was. Beckett could probably be like Burnett and improve with a return to the NL, but to take that contract on as well is just nuts.


I guess new ownership wants to send the message that they are the Angels of the NL.

757690
08-24-2012, 08:08 PM
Crawford would do well in LA. His biggest problem was that he was a terrible match for Fenway, especially LF. Speed doesn't play well there. The wide open spaces of Dodger Stadium would help increase his production and value.

757690
08-24-2012, 08:09 PM
Something's going down. AGon was pulled from the lineup along with Punto.

Joseph
08-24-2012, 08:10 PM
Gonzo scratched tonight apparently.

757690
08-24-2012, 08:13 PM
Loney was scratched too.

Wow, this is really happening.

Raisor
08-24-2012, 08:14 PM
My friend Robert, the Dodgers fan, is over the moon.

AtomicDumpling
08-24-2012, 08:15 PM
I definitely get the idea, but Crawford is money down the toilet. He's never going to be as good as he was. Beckett could probably be like Burnett and improve with a return to the NL, but to take that contract on as well is just nuts.


I guess new ownership wants to send the message that they are the Angels of the NL.

Yes it is definitely a risk. The Dodgers apparently have a ton of money to spend despite the huge purchase price for the franchise. I don't think Beckett and Crawford are finished as star players. They are injured and that is why their performance has suffered. When (or if) they return to health they will return to being very good players. They have long track records of being very productive players and they are not old enough to be in decline yet. If their injuries are permanent though they could be duds.

Raisor
08-24-2012, 08:17 PM
Wait, does this mean Bobby Valentine is going to win the war?

westofyou
08-24-2012, 08:22 PM
Wait, does this mean Bobby Valentine is going to win the war?

No larry lucchino is

dougdirt
08-24-2012, 08:23 PM
Wait, the Dodgers are taking on $261M AND giving up actual talent? Crazy.

cincrazy
08-24-2012, 08:26 PM
This. Is. Insane.

cinreds21
08-24-2012, 08:36 PM
This is better than the trade deadline.

kaldaniels
08-24-2012, 08:39 PM
Meanwhile yet again Walt sits on his hands and does nothing.

dougdirt
08-24-2012, 08:41 PM
Meanwhile yet again Walt sits on his hands and does nothing.

RECANTED!

kaldaniels
08-24-2012, 08:41 PM
Sarcasm. (sorry) :D

cincrazy
08-24-2012, 08:46 PM
Per Jon Morosi on Twitter, Dodgers sending Allen Webster, James Loney, Jerry Sands, Ivan Dejesus, and Rubby De La Rosa. For Punto, A-Gon, Crawford, and Beckett.

cinreds21
08-24-2012, 08:48 PM
So a couple of weeks ago I went to Cleveland and saw the Red Sox and Indians play as I have friends for both teams. I went to lunch with Adrian and I asked him if he liked the Boston area. He replied that it was ok. Then I smartly said "I guess you have to like it, you'll be here for the next seven years." Oops

kaldaniels
08-24-2012, 08:49 PM
So a couple of weeks ago I went to Cleveland and saw the Red Sox and Indians play as I have friends for both teams. I went to lunch with Adrian and I asked him if he liked the Boston area. He replied that it was ok. Then I smartly said "I guess you have to like it, you'll be here for the next seven years." Oops

Just who are you? Batman?

cinreds21
08-24-2012, 08:50 PM
Just who are you? Batman?

A big deal.

dougdirt
08-24-2012, 08:51 PM
A big deal.

This is true. But if he divulged his true identity, well, no one would be able to find you anymore. :lol:

Tom Servo
08-24-2012, 08:52 PM
Per Jon Morosi on Twitter, Dodgers sending Allen Webster, James Loney, Jerry Sands, Ivan Dejesus, and Rubby De La Rosa. For Punto, A-Gon, Crawford, and Beckett.
Great deal for Boston. Get some good prospects, and clear all that salary. Only negative is Loney, but I'm sure they'll non-tender him in the offseason.

blumj
08-24-2012, 08:53 PM
Meanwhile yet again Walt sits on his hands and does nothing.
Hey, the Sox have more where that came from, can I interest you in some nice fresh Lackey? Maybe with Pods on the side and a little extra Salt?

dougdirt
08-24-2012, 08:58 PM
Dave Cameron tweeted this:

Here is a live look in from Dodger Stadium
http://www.christopherbenek.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/04/scrooge_mcduck.jpeg

Brutus
08-24-2012, 09:07 PM
Per Jon Morosi on Twitter, Dodgers sending Allen Webster, James Loney, Jerry Sands, Ivan Dejesus, and Rubby De La Rosa. For Punto, A-Gon, Crawford, and Beckett.

Other than Webster, it's not a very impressive haul.

This is mostly a salary dump. There's nothing in that crop of players that justifies getting three all-star players.

On that note, can anyone think of a trade ever that included three all-stars changing hands from one team? I can't think of one.

Patrick Bateman
08-24-2012, 09:08 PM
Other than Webster, it's not a very impressive haul.

This is mostly a salary dump. There's nothing in that crop of players that justifies getting three all-star players.

On that note, can anyone think of a trade ever that included three all-stars changing hands from one team? I can't think of one.

I know what your saying, but it's hard to call Beckett and Crawford "current" all stars. Considering the money owed, and the legit down year Gonzo is having, I am shocked the Sox are getting anything for their lot of players.

dougdirt
08-24-2012, 09:08 PM
Has there ever been a trade before where even HALF this amount of money was moved?

Tom Servo
08-24-2012, 09:11 PM
I know what your saying, but it's hard to call Beckett and Crawford "current" all stars. Considering the money owed, and the legit down year Gonzo is having, I am shocked the Sox are getting anything for their lot of players.
This. Plus DeJesus and Sands have been productive in the minors, are young, and really haven't gotten any chance in the majors yet. To get them back for sunk costs like Crawford and Beckett ain't too bad.

Brutus
08-24-2012, 09:13 PM
I know what your saying, but it's hard to call Beckett and Crawford "current" all stars. Considering the money owed, and the legit down year Gonzo is having, I am shocked the Sox are getting anything for their lot of players.

I didn't use the word "current."

That said, I'm not sure Carl Crawford is yet past his prime. Last year he wasn't very good, but it's possible it was just a temporary setback.

Josh Beckett isn't the top of the line starter he once was, but he's still a good pitcher.

The Dodgers aren't without risk here, and they're taking on a lot of money, but this is an obscene amount of talent they're getting.

UKFlounder
08-24-2012, 09:15 PM
A-Rod?


Has there ever been a trade before where even HALF this amount of money was moved?

Patrick Bateman
08-24-2012, 09:15 PM
I didn't use the word "current."

That said, I'm not sure Carl Crawford is yet past his prime. Last year he wasn't very good, but it's possible it was just a temporary setback.

Josh Beckett isn't the top of the line starter he once was, but he's still a good pitcher.

The Dodgers aren't without risk here, and they're taking on a lot of money, but this is an obscene amount of talent they're getting.

Sorry, I thought it was somewhat implied.

klw
08-24-2012, 09:36 PM
Who ever thought the Sox would be willing to trade A Gon, Beckett, and Crawford just to move Nick Punto and his contract? Really why is Punto involved in this? Does he meet a need for the Dodgers? Is his 1.5 million salary next year too much for the Sox?

cinreds21
08-24-2012, 09:41 PM
Punto has some damn Popeye forearms. No lie

blumj
08-24-2012, 09:52 PM
Punto has some damn Popeye forearms. No lie
You should see the calves on Mike Aviles.

Spitball
08-24-2012, 09:56 PM
Who ever thought the Sox would be willing to trade A Gon, Beckett, and Crawford just to move Nick Punto and his contract? Really why is Punto involved in this? Does he meet a need for the Dodgers? Is his 1.5 million salary next year too much for the Sox?

Perhaps Punto's inclusion is a public relations move. Talk show and fan reaction has not been particularly kind to him.

blumj
08-24-2012, 10:13 PM
Perhaps Punto's inclusion is a public relations move. Talk show and fan reaction has not been particularly kind to him.
He's just in the way, they hardly play him even with Middlebrooks on the DL or when Pedroia was, like he's the designated pinch bunter except for the time from the unexpected injury and the first chance to call anyone else up.

Will M
08-24-2012, 10:22 PM
Rubby is young & throws in the mid 90s. He just came back after having TJ surgery about a year ago.

powersackers
08-24-2012, 10:34 PM
I fly into LA the day the NLCS begins. Reds vs Dodgers?

Razor Shines
08-24-2012, 10:42 PM
Just who are you?


A big deal.

http://buildyoursoulpurpose.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/01/ron-b.jpg

powersackers
08-24-2012, 10:52 PM
Wrong thread

_Sir_Charles_
08-24-2012, 10:56 PM
Phillips too awesome to run to first his last two times whiffing on in the dirt pitches. He looks like a fool. Just run.

*hands powersackers a compass, a road map and some binoculars* You look lost my friend. :O)

Spitball
08-25-2012, 01:18 AM
He's just in the way, they hardly play him even with Middlebrooks on the DL or when Pedroia was, like he's the designated pinch bunter except for the time from the unexpected injury and the first chance to call anyone else up.

Back in the 1970s the Sox signed Jack Brohamer. He was signed as a role player but the fans apparently felt he was supposed to be something special. He wasn't...and the fans never appreciated what he was capable of contributing. Punto is the same.

REDREAD
08-25-2012, 04:05 AM
Meanwhile yet again Walt sits on his hands and does nothing.

:laugh:

blumj
08-25-2012, 10:57 AM
The deal will be worth in excess of $275 million to the Red Sox including luxury tax savings and salaries for the remainder of this season and beyond. Over the next six years, the Dodgers will receive $12 million from the Red Sox, with the payments to begin next year.

http://www.bostonherald.com/blogs/sports/red_sox/

traderumor
08-25-2012, 11:04 AM
Dodgers--Well, the first wave of moves netted nothing in the standings, so lets throw some more money down the rabbit hole?

The Red Sox doing a major do over and found a sucker. It seems like the Dodgers picked up more names than talent. Who knows, maybe they'll pick up lightning in a bottle, but this crew sure didn't do much for the Red Sox.

Perhaps the Dodgers have been scouring fan message boards for trade ideas with this one. This looks like something we'd write off as a "fantasy league trade idea" on this board.

blumj
08-25-2012, 11:26 AM
All the sports talk guys in Boston are whining that they can't mock callers who make crazy trade proposals anymore.

vaticanplum
08-25-2012, 01:55 PM
All the sports talk guys in Boston are whining that they can't mock callers who make crazy trade proposals anymore.

That's priceless.

757690
08-25-2012, 01:58 PM
The Dodgers got an MVP candidate, left handed power bat to hit with Kemp and Eithier, for James Loney and a bunch of minor league chaff. Their additional cost was the contracts of Beckett and Crawford.

Considering they have the money to spend, who cares about that? It's not like this will stop them from acquiring more talent down the road. Plus there's a good chance that Beckett can turn things around pitching in the NL West, and Crawford can too just for getting out of Fenway. Even if they don't, the Dodgers still come out ahead talent wise in this trade.

Smart move for both teams, imo.

Tom Servo
08-25-2012, 02:19 PM
The Dodgers got an MVP candidate, left handed power bat to hit with Kemp and Eithier, for James Loney and a bunch of minor league chaff. Their additional cost was the contracts of Beckett and Crawford.

Rubby De La Rosa is far from minor league chaff.

LoganBuck
08-25-2012, 02:36 PM
Rubby De La Rosa is far from minor league chaff.

Allen Webster isn't exactly a dried cat turd either.

757690
08-25-2012, 02:39 PM
Webster and Ruby are decent prospects, I'll grant that. However, they're B-C prospects at best. Not going to be missed.

LvJ
08-25-2012, 02:46 PM
Webster and Ruby are decent prospects, I'll grant that. However, they're B-C prospects at best. Not going to be missed.

Beckett, Crawford, Punto and $275 MIL will not be missed, either.

traderumor
08-25-2012, 03:20 PM
The Dodgers got an MVP candidate, left handed power bat to hit with Kemp and Eithier, for James Loney and a bunch of minor league chaff. Their additional cost was the contracts of Beckett and Crawford.

Considering they have the money to spend, who cares about that? It's not like this will stop them from acquiring more talent down the road. Plus there's a good chance that Beckett can turn things around pitching in the NL West, and Crawford can too just for getting out of Fenway. Even if they don't, the Dodgers still come out ahead talent wise in this trade.

Smart move for both teams, imo.If the Red Sox wanted to salary dump, buyer beware. This is definitely a different way of doing business for them.

This attempt to retool the Dodgers offense at the 11th hour is akin to the wheeling and dealing the Cards last year to rebuild their weakness in August, albeit using cash instead of shrewd dumpster diving of vet bullpen arms. I'm sure they're hoping for the same results.

Chip R
08-25-2012, 03:48 PM
This will make the Sox players in the Josh Hamilton sweepstakes.

LoganBuck
08-25-2012, 03:57 PM
This will make the Sox players in the Josh Hamilton sweepstakes.

Heard some ESPN radio speculation this morning about Grienke and Hamilton to Boston. The general consensus was that neither player is really a good fit for that environment.

kaldaniels
08-25-2012, 04:22 PM
First Philly, now Boston.

Perhaps the "plug and play" brand of baseball transactions involving big names just isn't the right way to go about business.

Don't take that the wrong way...of course I'd rather my team have deep pockets...but I would have bet anything Philly (after the Halladay/Lee signings) would have at least one championship by now.

The 2009 Yankees seem to be the only team in the past several years whose centerpieces were bought on the open market at very high prices.

Draft and development talent. Make the right decision whether to lock that talent up. -Those are the keys to success. Free agency (or lack of a teams spending during it) isn't worth losing sleep over.

757690
08-25-2012, 04:30 PM
Remember the old saying... You have to fire the manager because you can't trade the roster..?

Bobby V must be one happy manager.

Spitball
08-25-2012, 04:39 PM
All the sports talk guys in Boston are whining that they can't mock callers who make crazy trade proposals anymore.

:laugh:

traderumor
08-25-2012, 04:49 PM
First Philly, now Boston.

Perhaps the "plug and play" brand of baseball transactions involving big names just isn't the right way to go about business.

Don't take that the wrong way...of course I'd rather my team have deep pockets...but I would have bet anything Philly (after the Halladay/Lee signings) would have at least one championship by now.

The 2009 Yankees seem to be the only team in the past several years whose centerpieces were bought on the open market at very high prices.

Draft and development talent. Make the right decision whether to lock that talent up. -Those are the keys to success. Free agency (or lack of a teams spending during it) isn't worth losing sleep over.That's my take as well. The Miami Marlins also demonstrate what a disaster going on a spending spree on the market can be.

cincrazy
08-25-2012, 05:09 PM
If the Sox unload these guys just to turn around and sign Hamilton and Greinke, they're morons.

Tom Servo
08-25-2012, 05:29 PM
http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m9bsb8z6bD1qg5uwto1_500.jpg

En Route
The Dodgers sent a private plane to pick up and bring three of the newest Dodgers, Josh Beckett, Adrian Gonzalez and Nick Punto, to tonight’s game in Los Angeles.

#dodgers doing it first class! twitter.com/Shredderpunto/…

August 25, 2012

mth123
08-25-2012, 05:41 PM
http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m9bsb8z6bD1qg5uwto1_500.jpg

En Route
The Dodgers sent a private plane to pick up and bring three of the newest Dodgers, Josh Beckett, Adrian Gonzalez and Nick Punto, to tonight’s game in Los Angeles.

#dodgers doing it first class! twitter.com/Shredderpunto/…

August 25, 2012

Thise guys look really happy. Getting 2500 miles away form Bobby V would probably have that effect.

vaticanplum
08-25-2012, 05:51 PM
I don't know what it is, but Josh Beckett just looks like the kind of guy you meet in a bar and have 19 alarms go off in your head to never, ever leave him alone with your drink.

kaldaniels
08-25-2012, 05:51 PM
As a 2012 Reds fan I don't like this.

cincrazy
08-25-2012, 06:29 PM
As a 2012 Reds fan I don't like this.

Adding Gonzalez is big, but Crawford won't play this year, and Beckett isn't what he once was. The move to the NL West will help, but he doesn't scare me in a postseason matchup, especially if it takes place in GABP. The Dodgers are crazy. Taking on this salary, taking on two players who IMO don't have much left, AND giving up some pretty good prospects. Cherington should get GM of the year based on this deal.

Brutus
08-25-2012, 06:32 PM
Adding Gonzalez is big, but Crawford won't play this year, and Beckett isn't what he once was. The move to the NL West will help, but he doesn't scare me in a postseason matchup, especially if it takes place in GABP. The Dodgers are crazy. Taking on this salary, taking on two players who IMO don't have much left, AND giving up some pretty good prospects. Cherington should get GM of the year based on this deal.

Beckett's probably still pitching better than his ERA shows, but I agree that right now he's not a huge upgrade in a small remaining portion of the season.

To be honest, I'm not convinced the Dodgers are going to make the playoffs this year. The Giants are playing good baseball now, and the Dodgers will be in a fight for the last wildcard spot if they don't catch San Fran.

Brutus
08-25-2012, 06:46 PM
The trade has now been finalized and made official, as if there were any doubt (considering the players were already on a private plane heading to L.A.)

traderumor
08-25-2012, 08:23 PM
I don't know what it is, but Josh Beckett just looks like the kind of guy you meet in a bar and have 19 alarms go off in your head to never, ever leave him alone with your drink.and especially not your daughter.

klw
08-25-2012, 09:45 PM
http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m9bsb8z6bD1qg5uwto1_500.jpg

En Route
The Dodgers sent a private plane to pick up and bring three of the newest Dodgers, Josh Beckett, Adrian Gonzalez and Nick Punto, to tonight’s game in Los Angeles.

#dodgers doing it first class! twitter.com/Shredderpunto/…

August 25, 2012

Someone over on Sons of Sam Horn had this to say about the picture:

Before this picture was taken, the stewardess asked the guys to each answer a question on the count of three.
Punto? How many hits have you gotten this year?
Beckett? How many good starts have you had this year?
Gonzalez? How big of a strike zone does Beckett need to be successful?
http://sonsofsamhorn.net/topic/74064-sox-trade-gonzalez-crawford-beckett-punto-and-12-million-to-dodgers-is-done/page__st__300

The Operator
08-25-2012, 09:53 PM
Someone over on Sons of Sam Horn had this to say about the picture:

Before this picture was taken, the stewardess asked the guys to each answer a question on the count of three.
Punto? How many hits have you gotten this year?
Beckett? How many good starts have you had this year?
Gonzalez? How big of a strike zone does Beckett need to be successful?Classic. :lol:

The Operator
08-25-2012, 09:54 PM
It was a good move to dump these guys, but I also don't understand why Boston is committing to Bobby V like they are. He's so awful and unlikeable.

cincrazy
08-25-2012, 09:57 PM
It was a good move to dump these guys, but I also don't understand why Boston is committing to Bobby V like they are. He's so awful and unlikeable.

Exactly. For all of the problems I have with Baker and some of his strategic moves, at least I know the players would run through a wall for him. He's great in the clubhouse, great with the media, just a class guy all the way around. Bobby.... ugh. What an absolute a$$. I thought at the time bringing him in was a good move. I'm not sure I've ever been so wrong about anything in my life.

CTA513
08-25-2012, 10:25 PM
Gonzalez with a 3 run homer in his 1st at bat

Tom Servo
08-25-2012, 10:26 PM
Pretty good first impression. And off Josh Johnson no less.

fearofpopvol1
08-25-2012, 10:31 PM
What has just transpired, on an unforgettable Saturday afternoon in Boston and Los Angeles, is a trade unlike any you might ever see again. Nine players. A quarter of a billion dollars in contracts. No-trade clauses turning irrelevant. Waiver red tape be damned.

It's amazing. Astonishing. Un-be-frigging-lievable.

"There has never," said one longtime club official Saturday, "been anything like this."

Never. That pretty much describes the magnitude of a Red Sox-Dodgers megadeal that figures to reverberate through the annals of baseball-trade history for at least the next 87 centuries.

We have never seen a trade in which a team dumped this much money in a single transaction.

We have never seen a trade in which two players with more than $100 million left on their contracts (Adrian Gonzalez and Carl Crawford) were moved, let alone in the same direction, to the same team.

http://espn.go.com/mlb/story/_/id/8302371/red-sox-dodgers-deal-history-maker

traderumor
08-25-2012, 10:34 PM
Gonzalez with a 3 run homer in his 1st at batProbably go 2 for 25 from there.

Brutus
08-25-2012, 11:15 PM
For the record, I have a major beef with the hypocrisy of Major League Baseball for allowing this move. I'm typically not keen on MLB interfering with trades, but after all the song and dance they'd done in the past year about the Dodgers' debts and taking the team from the McCourts because of the fiscal irresponsibility, there seems to be a bit of a double standard allowing them to take on over a quarter of a billion in additional fiscal obligations.

New ownership or not, it's amazing how just like that, MLB doesn't mind the Dodgers spending money like a drunken sailor on furlough.

Roy Tucker
08-25-2012, 11:40 PM
This sounds like one of those NBA trades where its the cost of the contract and the cap hit that is the most important thing.

Big city teams can generate a lot of money but I gotta think this could be a really bad thing for LA if it doesn't work.

And its total BS that MLB let this happen. The big boys get to make up their own rules.

Chip R
08-25-2012, 11:41 PM
For the record, I have a major beef with the hypocrisy of Major League Baseball for allowing this move. I'm typically not keen on MLB interfering with trades, but after all the song and dance they'd done in the past year about the Dodgers' debts and taking the team from the McCourts because of the fiscal irresponsibility, there seems to be a bit of a double standard allowing them to take on over a quarter of a billion in additional fiscal obligations.

New ownership or not, it's amazing how just like that, MLB doesn't mind the Dodgers spending money like a drunken sailor on furlough.

They are supposed to be getting a new TV deal. Some say it will be record breaking. That was one of the problems with the McCord regime. They could not get a new TV deal in place. I also assume the new owners assumed all the old owner's debts.

Spitball
08-25-2012, 11:46 PM
New ownership or not, it's amazing how just like that, MLB doesn't mind the Dodgers spending money like a drunken sailor on furlough.

That is what Boston did in the first place when they signed Gonzalez, Crawford, and Beckett. With the new television deal, the Dodgers seem to be in a better place to handle those contracts at this point.

Brutus
08-25-2012, 11:52 PM
They are supposed to be getting a new TV deal. Some say it will be record breaking. That was one of the problems with the McCord regime. They could not get a new TV deal in place. I also assume the new owners assumed all the old owner's debts.

They were going to get a tv deal with Fox under McCourt just last year. Remember they had a $3 billion dollar deal that was going to pay the Dodgers nearly $400 million to get out from under their debts, and Major League Baseball rejected the deal, suggesting the club's financial future was too dire.

If it was too bad a situation to allow a club to continue ownership and receive $400 million immediately, I can't fathom why they'd let the club take on this much debt just a year later. It's still hypocritical.

Chip R
08-25-2012, 11:57 PM
If it was too bad a situation to allow a club to continue ownership and receive $400 million immediately, I can't fathom why they'd let the club take on this much debt just a year later. It's still hypocritical.

I'm not sure it's hypocritical when the same thing happened with TEX.

_Sir_Charles_
08-25-2012, 11:59 PM
Watching the Dodger game tonight. People can complain and be confused about the money all they want, bottom line is this lineup looks SCARY GOOD.

And btw, it's a real treat getting to listen to Scully. :O) 1st base ump just missed a call in the favor of the fish...does Vin berate the guy for missing the call, no...he defends the guy as being human and NOT being a million dollar piece of time-lapse equipment.

Brutus
08-26-2012, 12:22 AM
I'm not sure it's hypocritical when the same thing happened with TEX.

Actually I think Texas is proof of MLB's hypocrisy. They complained about Hicks and then when they took over the club, started spending a bunch of money at the expense of other teams.

The hypocrisy isn't that other teams have done it, it's that they preach about the debtload and have an opportunity to stop one of these trades from making a mockery of debt, and they don't do so.

Brutus
08-26-2012, 12:26 AM
Watching the Dodger game tonight. People can complain and be confused about the money all they want, bottom line is this lineup looks SCARY GOOD.

And btw, it's a real treat getting to listen to Scully. :O) 1st base ump just missed a call in the favor of the fish...does Vin berate the guy for missing the call, no...he defends the guy as being human and NOT being a million dollar piece of time-lapse equipment.

Scary good? I don't know about that. Hanley isn't lighting the world on fire, nor is Shane Victorino.

And this is still a team that has been giving a lot of at-bats to guys like Mark Ellis, Luis Cruz, Dee Gordon, Jerry Hairston, Adam Kennedy, Juan Uribe, Tony Gwynn and Elian Herrera.

They have 3-4 guys that are really good. But half their lineup is still very questionable.

_Sir_Charles_
08-26-2012, 12:33 AM
I meant to type "the middle of the order" looks scary good. I typed it perfectly in my head. Does that count? :O)

mth123
08-26-2012, 04:58 AM
Scary good? I don't know about that. Hanley isn't lighting the world on fire, nor is Shane Victorino.

And this is still a team that has been giving a lot of at-bats to guys like Mark Ellis, Luis Cruz, Dee Gordon, Jerry Hairston, Adam Kennedy, Juan Uribe, Tony Gwynn and Elian Herrera.

They have 3-4 guys that are really good. But half their lineup is still very questionable.

HanRam as a Dodger .296/.365/.530/.885 127 PAs
Luis Cruz .303/.340/.480/.820
Mark Ellis .358 OBP
Jerry Hairston .342 OBP

I think they look pretty imposing. Gordon will be back with HanRam moving to 3B to boost the defense. If they are smart enough to hit Mark Ellis and his .358 OBP in the 2 hole and leave Gordon in the 8 spot, they look pretty good to me.

Victorino CF (.341 Career OBP)
M. Ellis 2B (.358 OBP)
Kemp LF (.989 OPS)
Gonzalez 1B (.881 Career OPS)
Ramirez 3B (.885 OPS as a Dodger)
Ethier RF (.825 OPS)
AJ Ellis C (.815 OPS)
Gordon SS (Speed and Defense)

I'm not a huge Beckett fan these days, but he'll move right into that rotation.

Tom Servo
08-26-2012, 05:03 AM
Hanley has been good, but Victorino has basically sucked for L.A. I don't see him turning it around significantly.

fearofpopvol1
08-26-2012, 05:17 AM
1 thing is undeniable. Say what you want about the Dodgers lineup, but that lineup at GAB could do some damage. We'll get to see firsthand soon enough.

The other thing to consider is there is a good chance (though certainly not a guarantee) the Nats could finish with the best record in the NL. Thankfully, the Nats have lost 3 in a row. Their destiny largely depends on the Phillies and if they can handle them, which will be a challenge for them.

If the Reds were to win the NL Central and have the 2nd best record, the Reds would face the Dodgers if they won the NL West. The Dodgers throw out Kershaw twice in a short series and the Reds are in trouble.

Who knows how the NL West will shake out, but the Dodgers currently have the best run differential. It's only +6 better than San Francisco, but I think there's no denying that Gonzo improves that Dodger lineup noticeably.

Brutus
08-26-2012, 06:33 AM
HanRam as a Dodger .296/.365/.530/.885 127 PAs
Luis Cruz .303/.340/.480/.820
Mark Ellis .358 OBP
Jerry Hairston .342 OBP

I think they look pretty imposing. Gordon will be back with HanRam moving to 3B to boost the defense. If they are smart enough to hit Mark Ellis and his .358 OBP in the 2 hole and leave Gordon in the 8 spot, they look pretty good to me.

Victorino CF (.341 Career OBP)
M. Ellis 2B (.358 OBP)
Kemp LF (.989 OPS)
Gonzalez 1B (.881 Career OPS)
Ramirez 3B (.885 OPS as a Dodger)
Ethier RF (.825 OPS)
AJ Ellis C (.815 OPS)
Gordon SS (Speed and Defense)

I'm not a huge Beckett fan these days, but he'll move right into that rotation.

I think it's telling that you only used OBP for Ellis and Hairston, because if you include the entire picture, it doesn't look as flattering.

Ellis' career wOBA is .321. Hairston's is .311. Hanley is having a nice run so far with the Dodgers, but who knows if that will last. Luis Cruz is a 28-year old rookie and a quick glance at his peripherals suggests that with a bigger sample, his numbers will come down to earth a bit. A.J. Ellis is having a great season but he's 31 years old and has never had more 128 PAs in the big leagues prior to this year. One wonders if he won't crash down to earth too.

Kemp, Gonzalez, Ethier and Hanley are known commodities. But all these other guys are either have-beens or never-weres.

Honestly, if the Dodgers are going to be basing their success on the sustainability of guys like Luis Cruz, A.J. Ellis, Jerry Hairston and Dee Gordon as starters or major contributors... I think they're going to find themselves on the outside looking in despite the name recognition of their players.

People here quiver at the thought of Miguel Cairo and Wilson Valdez getting major at-bats as reserves. Can you imagine people here seeing Luis Cruz, Mark Ellis, A.J. Ellis, Dee Gordon and Jerry Hairston being major pieces of the puzzle? I don't think it would be pretty. Half of the Dodgers lineup is very scary. The other half... doesn't intimidate.

mth123
08-26-2012, 08:45 AM
I think it's telling that you only used OBP for Ellis and Hairston, because if you include the entire picture, it doesn't look as flattering.

Ellis' career wOBA is .321. Hairston's is .311. Hanley is having a nice run so far with the Dodgers, but who knows if that will last. Luis Cruz is a 28-year old rookie and a quick glance at his peripherals suggests that with a bigger sample, his numbers will come down to earth a bit. A.J. Ellis is having a great season but he's 31 years old and has never had more 128 PAs in the big leagues prior to this year. One wonders if he won't crash down to earth too.

Kemp, Gonzalez, Ethier and Hanley are known commodities. But all these other guys are either have-beens or never-weres.

Honestly, if the Dodgers are going to be basing their success on the sustainability of guys like Luis Cruz, A.J. Ellis, Jerry Hairston and Dee Gordon as starters or major contributors... I think they're going to find themselves on the outside looking in despite the name recognition of their players.

People here quiver at the thought of Miguel Cairo and Wilson Valdez getting major at-bats as reserves. Can you imagine people here seeing Luis Cruz, Mark Ellis, A.J. Ellis, Dee Gordon and Jerry Hairston being major pieces of the puzzle? I don't think it would be pretty. Half of the Dodgers lineup is very scary. The other half... doesn't intimidate.

I think if the Reds could find somebody to get on base 36% of the time in front of Votto, Ludwick, Bruce and Rolen/Frazier we'd be pretty happy with that and wouldn't care about his Slugging %, overall OPS or wOBA. That is what LA has with Ellis in front of Kemp, A-GON, HanRam, Etheir and AJ.

Equating M. Ellis .358 OBP and .731 OPS and AJ Ellis .388 OBP and .815 OPS playing full time in the NL West to Valdez (.224 OBP and .443 OPS) and Cairo (.200 OBP and .466 OS) as part time players in a hitters paradise is probably the most deluded argument I've ever seen made on Redszone (and that is saying something). If you think what those guys provide is remotely the same as what the Reds get out of Cairo and Valdez there really isn't any point in discussing it. I'm guessing that since these guys play out west, you really have no idea about them, but Mark Ellis OPS+ of 103 is just a tick below Brandon Phillips (104) and AJ Elis OPS+ of 126 is slightly better than the 123 the Reds are getting from Jay Bruce.

Hairston is hurt and out for the year IIRC, so he really isn't relevant, but he'd be a far better bench option than Cairo or Valdez. Cruz is more along the lines of Cairo and Valdez but even he has hit well in a fairly large role this year. Gordon is all defense at this point. LA's problem is the rotation after Kershaw. If Josh Beckett suddenly becomes Josh Beckett again, they'll be tough in a short series.

traderumor
08-26-2012, 09:15 AM
The Dodgers have one month to figure it out. I don't think they are any more imposing than the Cardinals, who we've checked quite well with our pitching staff. Familiarity breeds contempt, but the Reds have a pretty daggone good team that has been doing it all year.

Sure, there is the playoff hot streak, which is random and there is nothing you can do about, but the Dodgers had one of the worst offenses of all the contenders (below league average before the wheeling and dealing started) and just spent money like a drunken sailor with a new American Express Gold Card to improve it.

Let them play a few games as a unit before claiming they are suddenly a top offense.

Quatitos
08-26-2012, 09:41 AM
Sent from my DROID2 using Tapatalk 2

mth123
08-26-2012, 09:44 AM
The Dodgers have one month to figure it out. I don't think they are any more imposing than the Cardinals, who we've checked quite well with our pitching staff. Familiarity breeds contempt, but the Reds have a pretty daggone good team that has been doing it all year.

Sure, there is the playoff hot streak, which is random and there is nothing you can do about, but the Dodgers had one of the worst offenses of all the contenders (below league average before the wheeling and dealing started) and just spent money like a drunken sailor with a new American Express Gold Card to improve it.

Let them play a few games as a unit before claiming they are suddenly a top offense.

I don't think they are any more imposing than the Cardinals either and yes, the Reds have a very good team. I'm not scared of any team in the NL in the play-offs and if I had to name one it would be the Giants rotation and not the Dodgers. Not as sure about the AL. I think this Reds team can play with anybody, but I'd feel better with a better guy in CF.

buckeyenut
08-26-2012, 11:19 AM
after this last month without Votto, I fear NO TEAM. I feel like we are the best team in the national league and will compete with Texas and NYY without a problem. We might not win it all, but we'll be in the conversation.

REDREAD
08-27-2012, 02:23 PM
After some thought about this trade...

I'm kind of glad as a Reds fan.
Sure, it's going to suck to see Adrian Gonzales in that lineup, but it's nice that they had to take on Becket and Crawford with it.

If the Dodgers had that much money burning a hole in their pocket, they could've made a much bigger upgrade for the amount of money they spent.

Crawford and Beckett.. I guess I see them being average players at best? Maybe not even that good going forward.. Who knows though.. maybe they will be happier in LA and perform better, but that's a lot of money to invest in question marks.

I just think.. if LA waited until the offseason to spend that money, they could've probably gotten 3 impact players instead of 1.

savafan
08-27-2012, 02:42 PM
My gut tells me that Beckett could surprise and be scary good in the NL West

Chip R
08-27-2012, 03:09 PM
My gut tells me that Beckett could surprise and be scary good in the NL West

Some thought that about Barry Zito.

REDREAD
08-27-2012, 03:18 PM
My gut tells me that Beckett could surprise and be scary good in the NL West

That's possible. However, at 15.75 milion/year, LA could've definitely got more of a "sure thing".

I guess it's possible that LA could bench or cut Beckett/Crawford, but more than likely, they'll be getting playing time and be average at best.

It's nice for LA to have what's likely to be 2 sinkholes on the roster, eating up cash.

250 million could've gotten LA a lot more talent than Adrian Gonzales.. I guess that's my point. Even LA is going to feel absorbing that expense.

On the flip side.. I wonder if a trade like this makes Boston less attractive to FA.. It seems like A Gonzales and Crawford were not there very long.. Maybe it doesn't make a difference, as long as the FA get their big contracts.

Tom Servo
08-27-2012, 03:23 PM
At best, Beckett will be a decent starter for the Dodgers. I don't see him being scary good.

westofyou
08-27-2012, 03:27 PM
At best, Beckett will be a decent starter for the Dodgers. I don't see him being scary good.

http://www.grantland.com/story/_/id/8306109/financial-concern-window-comes-new-dodgers-regime


There's a reason so many teams declined a waiver claim on Beckett, a former ace and World Series MVP: He might never be all that good again.

There are durability issues, with Beckett struggling with injuries for much of the year (and making just 21 starts in 2010). There are command issues, with the normally precise right-hander striking out 38 batters and walking 21 in his past nine starts (with seven homers allowed and a 6.98 ERA over those 49 innings).

Then there's the most serious long-term concern: Beckett's plunge in fastball velocity. According to FanGraphs, his heater checks in at 91.6 miles per hour this year, down nearly 3 mph from his 2009 figure of 94.3. Beckett has a chance to put up better numbers now that he's out of the killer AL East and Fenway Park's bandbox, pitching in the NL West and pitcher-friendly Dodger Stadium

blumj
08-27-2012, 05:16 PM
Beckett v. Jeff Francis tonight, just like the first game of the 2007 World Series, except in Colorado.

Revering4Blue
10-04-2012, 08:04 PM
Boston, MA (Sports Network) - The Boston Red Sox acquired Rubby De La Rosa and Jerry Sands from the Los Angeles Dodgers on Thursday, completing August's blockbuster trade between the two clubs.

De La Rosa, a right-handed pitcher, made one relief appearance for the Dodgers this season after missing time recovering from Tommy John surgery. He compiled a 1-0 record with a 2.08 earned run average in six minor league outings between the Rookie-level Arizona League Dodgers, High-A Rancho Cucamonga and Double-A Chattanooga.

Sands, who has seen time at first base and the outfield, spent the majority of the 2012 campaign with Triple-A Albuquerque, where he batted .296 with 26 home runs and 107 RBI.

http://areyouwatchingthis.com/mlb/news/268001-Red-Sox-acquire-De-La-Rosa-Sands-to-complete-trade-with-LA?utm_medium=addon&utm_source=chrome&utm_campaign=1.96