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View Full Version : Reds moves that almost happened...



Tom Servo
08-25-2012, 01:23 PM
but either fell through or didn't work out. Sometimes they leak, sometimes they don't. But they're always interesting. :)


Of course, everybody knows Vida Blue was traded to the Reds in 1977 only for Bowie Kuhn to call it off.

JimBo had a deal was in place to trade Larkin to the Mets in 2000.

JimBo had a deal in place to trade Junior to the Padres in 2002 for Phil Nevin.

DanO went hard after Matt Morris in 2005.

Cast has tried repeatedly to get Lou Piniella to manage the Reds since he bought the team.


Any interesting ones you remember that may have been forgotten over time or never reached the general public?

WildcatFan
08-25-2012, 01:33 PM
Didn't they almost get Cliff Lee for Alonso, Wood, and a couple other prospects a couple years ago?

757690
08-25-2012, 01:34 PM
2002- JimBo traded for Kenny Rodgers at the deadline, but he vetoed the trade.
2002 - After not getting Rodgers, JimBo traded for Chuck Finley, but Linder vetoed the trade because it added $100K to the payroll.
2002 - JimBo claims he had a trade set up for Rolen, but that was vetoed by Linder since it added millions to the payroll.

mattfeet
08-25-2012, 01:34 PM
Didn't they almost get Cliff Lee for Alonso, Wood, and a couple other prospects a couple years ago?

I think Heisey was in the mix as well, IIRC. That would have been from the Mariners, right?

Tom Servo
08-25-2012, 01:36 PM
2002- JimBo traded for Kenny Rodgers at the deadline, but he vetoed the trade.
2002 - After not getting Rodgers, JimBo traded for Chuck Finley, but Linder vetoed the trade because it added $100K to the payroll.
2002 - JimBo claims he had a trade set up for Rolen, but that was vetoed by Linder since it added millions to the payroll.
And still held onto our top five prospects. That's an amazing statement. :laugh:

lidspinner
08-25-2012, 02:04 PM
I heard Marty at a benefit dinner a few years ago, 2008 to be exact...but Marty told the few people he was talking to and the other 50 that were listening(which I was part of the 50) that the Reds brass traded for Barry Bonds when we were opening the new GABP...they were going to pair he and Jr and make GABP a launching pad and watch those 2 slug it out for the home run title for the next decade. He said they almost had the trade complete but the sticking point was how many prospects we were giving up. The Reds did not want to deplete the entire farm but they were going to have to trade away their top 3 prospects along with a starting pitcher.........Marty gave no names and actually said that the entire story was rumor and he had no proof but said it was talked about that entire year by everyone behind the scenes.

Could you imagine if jr would've stayed healthy and Bonds did what he did? What a decade that could've been.....could've would've should've....if's and's and but's.....

George Anderson
08-25-2012, 02:43 PM
There were rumors around 1974 the Royals wanted Perez for George Brett.

I also heard rumors that late in his career Bench vetoed a trade to the Cards.

Spitball
08-25-2012, 03:27 PM
I believe the Reds were set to trade Larkin, then a prospect, to the Royals in 1987 for Mark Gubicza. The trade fell through, thank goodness. That following winter, the Reds decided to keep Larkin and trade Kurt Stillwell to the Royals for Danny Jackson.

Benihana
08-25-2012, 05:48 PM
Last month the Reds thought long and hard about trading Drew Stubbs, Billy Hamilton and a minor leaguer for Matt Garza and David DeJesus. With Garza out for the year, I'm obviously glad we didn't.

I remember Brandon Larson allegedly being the centerpiece in the Rolen deal just before he was traded to St Louis.

Alex Escobar and (I think) Grant Balfour were the two big prospects we were going to get from the Mets for Larkin.

batsfan
08-25-2012, 06:05 PM
http://riveraveblues.com/2009/06/revisiting-an-almost-trade-of-mariano-rivera-13917/:


Jim Bowden, the Reds’ general manager, declined to discuss the Yankees’ involvement, but an official familiar with the Wells talks said Steinbrenner called Bowden Saturday night and offered pitcher Mariano Rivera and catcher Jorge Posada.

Bowden, looking to cut his payroll, obviously decided he preferred [Curtis] Goodwin, a 23-year-old left-handed hitter, who in 87 games with the Orioles last season batted .263 and had 22 stolen bases in 26 attempts.

Wonderful Monds
08-25-2012, 06:40 PM
http://riveraveblues.com/2009/06/revisiting-an-almost-trade-of-mariano-rivera-13917/:

I don't want to hear about this. Wow.

Tony Cloninger
08-25-2012, 06:50 PM
http://riveraveblues.com/2009/06/revisiting-an-almost-trade-of-mariano-rivera-13917/:

Well now I hate Jim Bowden then. :laugh:

757690
08-25-2012, 07:09 PM
http://riveraveblues.com/2009/06/revisiting-an-almost-trade-of-mariano-rivera-13917/:

That just doesn't make sense. Riveria and Posada were rookies and making major league minimum in 1995.

Raisor
08-25-2012, 07:35 PM
Remember when the Reds almost signed Eric Milton to a big money LTC? Glad that never happened.

jojo
08-25-2012, 07:37 PM
I heard Marty at a benefit dinner a few years ago, 2008 to be exact...but Marty told the few people he was talking to and the other 50 that were listening(which I was part of the 50) that the Reds brass traded for Barry Bonds when we were opening the new GABP...they were going to pair he and Jr and make GABP a launching pad and watch those 2 slug it out for the home run title for the next decade. He said they almost had the trade complete but the sticking point was how many prospects we were giving up. The Reds did not want to deplete the entire farm but they were going to have to trade away their top 3 prospects along with a starting pitcher.........Marty gave no names and actually said that the entire story was rumor and he had no proof but said it was talked about that entire year by everyone behind the scenes.

Could you imagine if jr would've stayed healthy and Bonds did what he did? What a decade that could've been.....could've would've should've....if's and's and but's.....

Ya but they wouldn't have had any pitching if the Reds had pulled the trigger on that.... :p

klw
08-25-2012, 07:44 PM
Ya but they wouldn't have had any pitching if the Reds had pulled the trigger on that.... :p

Wait, they had pitching?

Roy Tucker
08-25-2012, 08:12 PM
I do remember the Reds were hot fter George Brett before he became George Brett.

Tom Servo
08-25-2012, 08:25 PM
Earlier this year there was speculation by Steve Berthiaume that the Reds were closer than people think to landing Pujols, and that they then spent the money on Votto.

And of course, we all remember the classic Votto for Bautista rumors that hung around but never had a real source outside of Fay saying the Blue Jays were apparently scouting Corcino one time.

Revering4Blue
08-26-2012, 12:03 AM
Reportedly in 1996, right after re-acquiring Kevin Mitchell from Boston, the Reds, who remained in contention well into September, had a deal in principle with the O's to acquire Bobby Bonilla for Steve Gibralter and fodder. Alas, in what turned out to be a wise move for the then-wild card bound O's, Angelos nixed the deal.

Revering4Blue
08-26-2012, 12:19 AM
I also heard rumors that late in his career Bench vetoed a trade to the Cards.

Interesting.

I thought it was a trade to an AL team, where Bench would have been primarily a DH, not that I'm questioning that it was, indeed, the Cards.


I remember Brandon Larson allegedly being the centerpiece in the Rolen deal just before he was traded to St Louis."]I remember Brandon Larson allegedly being the centerpiece in the Rolen deal just before he was traded to St Louis.

Reportedly, it was to be Rolen to the Reds for Larson, Williamson and Wily Mo Pena.

Johnny Footstool
08-26-2012, 12:46 AM
There were rumors around 1974 the Royals wanted Perez for George Brett.

Reported by Joe Posnanski in his book about the Big Red Machine. The Royals considered the deal, then backed out.

Yachtzee
08-26-2012, 01:23 AM
http://riveraveblues.com/2009/06/revisiting-an-almost-trade-of-mariano-rivera-13917/:

Ah yes, Bowden and his fascination with "5-toolers." I think what aggravated me most about him was his tendency to collect position players who had the so-called "5 tools," yet couldn't be bothered to come up with some decent pitching, preferring instead to seek out reclamation projects and hope Don Gullet could work the same magic on them he did with Pete Shourek. The problem with those guys is that they may have had 5 tools, but they couldn't use any of them very well.

Phhhl
08-26-2012, 01:49 AM
I can't believe this thread got this far without mentioning Vida Blue. The trade was actually done. Blue was coming to the Reds in 1977, but Bowie Kuhn shot it down because it was not in the "best interest of baseball". I think he hated Charlie Finley, but the excuse he used was that the Reds acquiring Blue would upset the competitive balance of the league. Think about that one in light of what happened this weekend between the Red Sox and Dodgers... we may have been cheated out of another world championship because of that one....

Baseball teams are pulling off all kinds of ridiculous trades these days, but the money that ends up in the league's coffers call off all bets. It just shows that it will never be an equal playing field. For people that are fond of metrics like economics and how life imitates sports, it only seems fair that money buys success. But, for the 96% of us who have to work for a living, we continue to wonder why all professional sports cannot be as fan-friendly as the NFL.

There was also the deal Bowden apparently had made with the Expos for Bartolo Colon, one of many that was shot down by Carl Lindner. That one is particularly topical.

Tom Servo
08-26-2012, 01:57 AM
I mentioned Vida in my OP. :thumbup:


One I can't believe I forgot to mention were those oh so fun early 2008 days of non-stop Cueto/Bruce/Bailey/Votto/any other million combinations for Erik Bedard discussions that were apparently pretty close. And then came the Blanton rumors. :lol:

Phhhl
08-26-2012, 02:34 AM
[QUOTE=Tom Servo;2717645]I mentioned Vida in my OP. :thumbup:

Yes, you did... my bad.

jojo
08-26-2012, 09:08 AM
I mentioned Vida in my OP. :thumbup:


One I can't believe I forgot to mention were those oh so fun early 2008 days of non-stop Cueto/Bruce/Bailey/Votto/any other million combinations for Erik Bedard discussions that were apparently pretty close. And then came the Blanton rumors. :lol:

I don't think those were anywhere near close but rather redsone fodder.

Sea Ray
08-27-2012, 03:17 PM
JimBo wanted to trade Jr for Magglio Ordonez of thw White Sox. I don't recall if it was a veto or the Chisox that nixed it

redsfan30
08-27-2012, 04:02 PM
In 2003 there were a lot of rumors about Aaron Boone going to Seattle for two of thier three top pitching prospects (names escape me).

Sea Ray
08-27-2012, 04:18 PM
In 2003 there were a lot of rumors about Aaron Boone going to Seattle for two of thier three top pitching prospects (names escape me).

Felix Hernandez? :D

Benihana
08-27-2012, 04:47 PM
JimBo wanted to trade Jr for Magglio Ordonez of thw White Sox. I don't recall if it was a veto or the Chisox that nixed it

I thought it was CF Brian Anderson as the centerpiece for Jr back then?

vic715
08-27-2012, 05:03 PM
I can't believe this thread got this far without mentioning Vida Blue. The trade was actually done. Blue was coming to the Reds in 1977, but Bowie Kuhn shot it down because it was not in the "best interest of baseball". I think he hated Charlie Finley, but the excuse he used was that the Reds acquiring Blue would upset the competitive balance of the league. Think about that one in light of what happened this weekend between the Red Sox and Dodgers... we may have been cheated out of another world championship because of that one....

Baseball teams are pulling off all kinds of ridiculous trades these days, but the money that ends up in the league's coffers call off all bets. It just shows that it will never be an equal playing field. For people that are fond of metrics like economics and how life imitates sports, it only seems fair that money buys success. But, for the 96% of us who have to work for a living, we continue to wonder why all professional sports cannot be as fan-friendly as the NFL.

There was also the deal Bowden apparently had made with the Expos for Bartolo Colon, one of many that was shot down by Carl Lindner. That one is particularly topical.
If I'm not mistaken Kuhn didn't like the amount of cash the Reds were putting up which was a million I believe.He wanted them to rework the deal and limit the cash to four hundred grand.The Reds didn't have the players they wanted but a few months later the Giants did.

Sea Ray
08-27-2012, 05:25 PM
If I'm not mistaken Kuhn didn't like the amount of cash the Reds were putting up which was a million I believe.He wanted them to rework the deal and limit the cash to four hundred grand.The Reds didn't have the players they wanted but a few months later the Giants did.

I think you are correct

corkedbat
08-27-2012, 09:06 PM
I think you are correct

I believe there was a rumor around the time that the Blue deal fell through that had Rollie Fingers and Joe Rudi also headed to the Reds from the A;' that Kuhn nixed also. I was ready to lynch Bowie at the time. :D Both later were sold to Boston for a total of $1M I believe.

Revering4Blue
08-27-2012, 09:26 PM
I believe there was a rumor around the time that the Blue deal fell through that had Rollie Fingers and Joe Rudi also headed to the Reds from the A;' that Kuhn nixed also. I was ready to lynch Bowie at the time. :D Both later were sold to Boston for a total of $1M I believe.
The sale of Fingers and Rudi to Boston was voided in 1976. Fingers signed as a free agent with SD, Rudi with the Angels, both after the '76 season.

The Blue to Cincy deal, later voided, took place in '77 at the Winter Meetings.

Revering4Blue
08-27-2012, 09:40 PM
If I'm not mistaken Kuhn didn't like the amount of cash the Reds were putting up which was a million I believe.He wanted them to rework the deal and limit the cash to four hundred grand.The Reds didn't have the players they wanted but a few months later the Giants did.

That's exactly what happened.

Revisionist history, I know..But I've always wondered if Howsam attempted to acquire Vida Blue before the '77 season with the same package that was sent to Montreal in the ill-fated Woodie Fryman/Dale Murray deal, or a similar package, and Finley said "no dice."

If it theoretically took just $$$ to acquire Blue after the '77 season, a package in late '76 (Winter Meetings) centered around Perez should have been able to net Blue, given that the A's were in firesale mode then.

Dan
08-27-2012, 10:12 PM
How about the Reds nearly signing Rollie Fingers, but the club wouldn't waive its "no facial hair" policy, and Fingers wasn't about to shave off his signature handlebar mustache.

RedsBaron
08-28-2012, 07:31 AM
I was ready to lynch Bowie at the time.

Just remember this: Bowie Kuhn is in the Hall of Fame. :eek: :barf::censored:

CySeymour
08-28-2012, 09:43 AM
Does almost drafting a certain player apply? The Reds had almost decided to draft Derek Jeter, but instead went with Chad Mattola who had all of 85 plate appearances for Cincinnati.

mattfeet
08-28-2012, 09:58 AM
Does almost drafting a certain player apply? The Reds had almost decided to draft Derek Jeter, but instead went with Chad Mattola who had all of 85 plate appearances for Cincinnati.

I bet even if we had drafted Jeter, he never would have donned a Reds uniform. His career would have overlapped Larkin's for 10 MLB seasons ('95 - '04). The only thing I can think would have happened would be for Jeter to have been moved to 2B and have Larkin/Jeter up the middle. :eek:

cumberlandreds
08-28-2012, 10:00 AM
How about the Reds nearly signing Rollie Fingers, but the club wouldn't waive its "no facial hair" policy, and Fingers wasn't about to shave off his signature handlebar mustache.

IIRC, Fingers was at the end of his career and wouldn't have likely helped much. So that, probably, was no huge loss.

CySeymour
08-28-2012, 10:01 AM
I bet even if we had drafted Jeter, he never would have donned a Reds uniform. His career would have overlapped Larkin's for 10 MLB seasons ('95 - '04). The only thing I can think would have happened would be for Jeter to have been moved to 2B and have Larkin/Jeter up the middle. :eek:

I thought I remember hearing or reading a quote from Jimbo that the idea would have been to move Jeter to center.

REDREAD
08-28-2012, 10:08 AM
I bet even if we had drafted Jeter, he never would have donned a Reds uniform. His career would have overlapped Larkin's for 10 MLB seasons ('95 - '04). The only thing I can think would have happened would be for Jeter to have been moved to 2B and have Larkin/Jeter up the middle. :eek:

According to Bowden, the plan was to draft Jeter and convert him to CF.
He said Jeter was willing to do that when they talked to him before the draft.

mattfeet
08-28-2012, 10:24 AM
Oh man, that would have been ok, too. LOL

westofyou
08-28-2012, 10:29 AM
Johnny Mize ST 1936

Returned to Cardinals

http://baseballminutia.com/images/mize_pix.jpg

Benihana
08-28-2012, 10:59 AM
Here's a guy who was reportedly almost a Red at the deadline, and I'm glad he wasn't (and I'm not talking about Matt Garza)...

http://tracking.si.com/2012/08/22/denard-span-minnesot-twins-ml/?sct=obnetwork

Chip R
08-28-2012, 12:05 PM
The Reds had a chance to acquire Babe Ruth in 1914 but decided they didn't need him.

http://books.google.com/books?id=uLVOb_5q9uwC&pg=PA70&lpg=PA70&dq=babe+ruth+cincinnati+reds+1914&source=bl&ots=d8v9Ukmnsq&sig=HW9p9LuoqTcVy5Q_Z1ThC05ovVY&hl=en#v=onepage&q=babe%20ruth%20cincinnati%20reds%201914&f=false

RedsBaron
08-28-2012, 02:07 PM
The Reds had a chance to acquire Babe Ruth in 1914 but decided they didn't need him.

http://books.google.com/books?id=uLVOb_5q9uwC&pg=PA70&lpg=PA70&dq=babe+ruth+cincinnati+reds+1914&source=bl&ots=d8v9Ukmnsq&sig=HW9p9LuoqTcVy5Q_Z1ThC05ovVY&hl=en#v=onepage&q=babe%20ruth%20cincinnati%20reds%201914&f=false

The article says that Ruth was just a pitcher in 1914. The Reds obviously were looking for some hitters. The oufielder they acquired was probably a "five tooler." ;)

Chip R
08-28-2012, 02:33 PM
The article says that Ruth was just a pitcher in 1914. The Reds obviously were looking for some hitters. The oufielder they acquired was probably a "five tooler." ;)

No doubt the Reds GM at the time was the original James G. Bowden. :D

camisadelgolf
08-28-2012, 02:37 PM
No doubt the Reds GM at the time was the original James G. Bowden. :D
At -47 years old, he became the league's youngest GM. And boy did he love to brag about it . . .

Strikes Out Looking
08-28-2012, 03:00 PM
No doubt the Reds GM at the time was the original James G. Bowden. :D

And in 1914, he tanned his own leather for his pants;)

VR
08-28-2012, 03:03 PM
If I'm not mistaken Kuhn didn't like the amount of cash the Reds were putting up which was a million I believe.He wanted them to rework the deal and limit the cash to four hundred grand.The Reds didn't have the players they wanted but a few months later the Giants did.

1.75M and Dave Revering.

Dave was later traded that spring for Doug Bair.....who saved 28 games w/ a sub 2.00 earnie in 78. :)