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View Full Version : Reds vs. Cardinals Sunday 8/26



Who Dey Time
08-26-2012, 11:03 AM
Going for the series win....

Cozart SS
Heisey CF
Phillips 2B
Ludwick LF
Bruce RF
Frazier 1B
Rolen 3B
Hanigan C
Bailey P

Ironman92
08-26-2012, 12:31 PM
Slight statement game today.

Stray
08-26-2012, 01:03 PM
Just heard Welsh say Phillips is going back to the leadoff spot when Votto comes back. I know it's the obvious move, but has it been confirmed?

Stray
08-26-2012, 01:14 PM
nice start

Who Dey Time
08-26-2012, 01:14 PM
8-pitch innings never hurt.

SWIndRed
08-26-2012, 01:15 PM
Efficient first inning for Homer. Not let's get some early runs of their guy before he can get his rhythm going.

Stray
08-26-2012, 01:20 PM
Like the aggression with 2 outs, almost looks like Furcal whiffed.

MBZags
08-26-2012, 01:23 PM
Just heard Welsh say Phillips is going back to the leadoff spot when Votto comes back. I know it's the obvious move, but has it been confirmed?

I haven't seen it online anywhere, but during the broadcast yesterday, Thom also mentioned that Dusty said this.

Ironman92
08-26-2012, 01:25 PM
Nice play by Beltran....no problem with Phillips going for it.

Ironman92
08-26-2012, 01:26 PM
With Hanigan being great at framing and Brian Runge not being very good....Homer should have it good if his control stays sharp.

Ironman92
08-26-2012, 01:28 PM
Cards aren't wasting time but they are wasting at bats.

Stray
08-26-2012, 01:31 PM
I haven't seen it online anywhere, but during the broadcast yesterday, Thom also mentioned that Dusty said this.

Sounds good to me

texasdave
08-26-2012, 01:31 PM
Bruce beats the shift with one out.

Stray
08-26-2012, 01:33 PM
double play ends the inning

Ironman92
08-26-2012, 01:35 PM
Bruce beats the shift with one out.

This one beats the shift that should be....but typically put the SS where 2nd baseman typically plays and 2nd baseman 30 feet into the grass at midpoint of where the 1st and 2nd baseman play.

texasdave
08-26-2012, 01:42 PM
Settle down, Homer.

HometownHero
08-26-2012, 01:44 PM
The bottom of their order has killed us

Stray
08-26-2012, 01:45 PM
1-0 Cards

LexRedsFan
08-26-2012, 01:45 PM
And this is why you don't let the pitcher get on base.

40YrRedsFan
08-26-2012, 01:46 PM
2 strike count and he gives Jay something to hit

LexRedsFan
08-26-2012, 01:47 PM
Wheeeeee...

texasdave
08-26-2012, 01:47 PM
T-R-O-U-B-L-E.

Who Dey Time
08-26-2012, 01:48 PM
Need some damage control here.

HometownHero
08-26-2012, 01:48 PM
More Cardinals BABIP luck

texasdave
08-26-2012, 01:48 PM
4 salamis for Holliday this year.

Ironman92
08-26-2012, 01:49 PM
Great 1st pitch to Holliday

BluegrassRedleg
08-26-2012, 01:49 PM
Classic Homer Bailey here. So frustrating. He just can't get over the hump.

Stray
08-26-2012, 01:50 PM
Ground balls finding holes

HometownHero
08-26-2012, 01:50 PM
Homer sucks at home

LexRedsFan
08-26-2012, 01:50 PM
Every ball has gone on the ground it feels like.

texasdave
08-26-2012, 01:50 PM
If this is a statement game for Homer. It is a pretty negative statement.

Who Dey Time
08-26-2012, 01:50 PM
Ground balls are effective if they find no one.

mrherd05
08-26-2012, 01:50 PM
ground balls..thats it...these are groundouts if hit anwhere else...not like he is pitching bad.

Ironman92
08-26-2012, 01:52 PM
I've said for the last 3 months that the Reds have that luck factor needed for postseason greatness.....but the Cardinals had a huge case of it last year and still have it.

The big 7 or so game lead is maybe very needed. Time will tell.

Ironman92
08-26-2012, 01:53 PM
Ground balls are effective if they find no one.

I'm glad he's not giving up those pesky foul ball homers.

Ironman92
08-26-2012, 01:54 PM
Walk Molina....

Just Do It

texasdave
08-26-2012, 01:54 PM
Half a hundred pitches so far.

Ironman92
08-26-2012, 01:54 PM
Walk Molina....

Just Do It

My bad...Beltran up

texasdave
08-26-2012, 01:54 PM
Wow. Look at the big number 11 behind second.

Ironman92
08-26-2012, 01:55 PM
Beltran smokes one for an out to start evening out the BABIP

Who Dey Time
08-26-2012, 01:55 PM
I'm glad he's not giving up those pesky foul ball homers.

Well said.

LexRedsFan
08-26-2012, 01:55 PM
Only gave up 3. As long as he settles, no big deal.

Need to at least get 1 soon. Can't let Wainwright get a rhythm.

Stray
08-26-2012, 01:55 PM
He's getting ground balls, that's usually a good sign for Homer.

Ironman92
08-26-2012, 01:56 PM
Wow. Look at the big number 11 behind second.

I couldn't tell what that was as it's upside down sometimes on the tv

HometownHero
08-26-2012, 01:57 PM
Beltran smokes one for an out to start evening out the BABIP

They had a MLB leading .319 BABIP heading into today so they got a ways to go.

Ironman92
08-26-2012, 01:59 PM
They had a MLB leading .319 BABIP heading into today so they got a ways to go.

Only speaking of today

HometownHero
08-26-2012, 02:00 PM
Only speaking of today

In that case its down to .454

Ironman92
08-26-2012, 02:01 PM
"Barry Larkin is so polished.....he'd fit right in on this team"

Not sure who on the Reds is very polished.....Rolen maybe. Don't want a battle of semantics with anyone but not sure polished is the right word to describe most of the Reds.

Ironman92
08-26-2012, 02:02 PM
In that case its down to .454

Tell me what Stubbs, Bruce and Frazier's BABIP are for the season.

Stray
08-26-2012, 02:06 PM
nice bounce back there

HometownHero
08-26-2012, 02:06 PM
Tell me what Stubbs, Bruce and Frazier's BABIP are for the season.

As of right now they are
.297 for Stubbs
.293 for Bruce
.338 for Frazier

Ironman92
08-26-2012, 02:09 PM
Wainright seems pretty funny.

Ironman92
08-26-2012, 02:11 PM
As of right now they are
.297 for Stubbs
.293 for Bruce
.338 for Frazier

What's the MLB average?

Stubbs at .297 but an awful 13% line drive %

I knew Frazier's was high.....Bruce's is seemingly high for the sheer number of balls that are unnecessarily pulled....but still find the whole.

HometownHero
08-26-2012, 02:12 PM
.296 was the MLB average this year heading into today

Ironman92
08-26-2012, 02:14 PM
.296 was the MLB average this year heading into today

Thanks....I know there are numerous other things that go into this.

Stray
08-26-2012, 02:18 PM
good at bat

Ironman92
08-26-2012, 02:18 PM
Extra stuff...

Mike Trout in his 105th game just scored his 100th run.

HometownHero
08-26-2012, 02:18 PM
Safe to say Adam Wainwright is back, over his last 10 starts including today he has a 1.86 ERA. BP had a great AB to at least make him work.

Ironman92
08-26-2012, 02:19 PM
good at bat

Yeah....an out, but those add up to make 8 inn performances into 6 2/3...but others must add some

40YrRedsFan
08-26-2012, 02:21 PM
gonna be tough to come back against Wainwright today...throwing strikes, hitters always behind in the count

Stray
08-26-2012, 02:23 PM
Yeah we gotta get him out of his rhythm...basehit to make him throw out of the stretch. Right now he's making it look easy.

HometownHero
08-26-2012, 02:24 PM
Homer has been good outside that 5 of 6 guys getting hits.

Stray
08-26-2012, 02:28 PM
The Cards have only really hurt us in 2 innings in this entire series.

HometownHero
08-26-2012, 02:28 PM
Good throw, its always nice when they give away outs on the bases especially with dangerous hitters up.

Who Dey Time
08-26-2012, 02:29 PM
The Cards have only really hurt us in 2 innings in this entire series.

That's kind of their MO. Despite their gaudy offensive numbers they have been largely inconsistent.

HometownHero
08-26-2012, 02:30 PM
The Cards have only really hurt us in 2 innings in this entire series.

That's what they do

HometownHero
08-26-2012, 02:31 PM
Man he just missed that, sucks so bad to take him to the base of the wall.

Stray
08-26-2012, 02:37 PM
Hard to see us stringing hits together off of this guy today.

HometownHero
08-26-2012, 02:39 PM
Worst play ever? Thank god he isn't fast!

Ironman92
08-26-2012, 02:41 PM
Well....there's one you don't dive on and let some idiots say you should have...good effort, wrong decision.

Ironman92
08-26-2012, 02:42 PM
Didn't matter it turns out....geesh.

HometownHero
08-26-2012, 02:42 PM
Allen Craig may be the luckiest guy in the majors

texasdave
08-26-2012, 02:43 PM
Didn't affect the old BABIP. If you're looking for a silver lining.

cw0802
08-26-2012, 02:43 PM
Allen Craig may be the luckiest guy in the majors

How do you figure?

texasdave
08-26-2012, 02:44 PM
Every thing the Cardinals do. Every hitter. Every pitcher. Every managerial decision is just pure luck according to Hometown. It is sooooooooooo old.

cw0802
08-26-2012, 02:45 PM
Every thing the Cardinals do. Every hitter. Every pitcher. Every managerial decision is just pure luck according to Hometown. It is sooooooooooo old.

Ha! Thanks for the clarification! Craig has done nothing but hit since he's been in the majors. Baffles me how people say he's lucky or not that good.

HometownHero
08-26-2012, 02:46 PM
How do you figure?

.407 BA with RISP and almost every fly ball leaves the park and has a high BABIP

HometownHero
08-26-2012, 02:47 PM
Every thing the Cardinals do. Every hitter. Every pitcher. Every managerial decision is just pure luck according to Hometown. It is sooooooooooo old.

Well they are statically the luckiest team in the majors.

Who Dey Time
08-26-2012, 02:48 PM
.407 BA with RISP and almost every fly ball leaves the park high and has a high BABIP

That tells me he's a damn good hitter vs. being lucky.

Who Dey Time
08-26-2012, 02:49 PM
Homer has pitched better than his line will indicate. But he does need to locate better with 2 strikes.

Maker_84
08-26-2012, 02:49 PM
At least we didnt get swept, still getting blown out is no good

cw0802
08-26-2012, 02:50 PM
That tells me he's a damn good hitter vs. being lucky.

Years prior to his making the marjors most scouts said there were two cardinal hitters they were anxious to see develop. Freese and Craig.

Stray
08-26-2012, 02:54 PM
I'll take a few more of those please

Who Dey Time
08-26-2012, 02:54 PM
First two on for the Reds. Chance to get some of these runs back.

Who Dey Time
08-26-2012, 02:57 PM
5-1.

Stray
08-26-2012, 02:58 PM
and we're on the board

cw0802
08-26-2012, 03:01 PM
That tells me he's a damn good hitter vs. being lucky.

Years prior to his making the marjors most scouts said there were two cardinal hitters they were anxious to see develop. Freese and Craig.

Who Dey Time
08-26-2012, 03:04 PM
Luddy makes it 5-2.

Stray
08-26-2012, 03:04 PM
Bruce could tie this thing up

Stray
08-26-2012, 03:04 PM
Even if we don't score anymore in this inning it's a win. We got Wainwright out of the game.

Who Dey Time
08-26-2012, 03:05 PM
Wainwright and Matheny with a very positive conversation.

HometownHero
08-26-2012, 03:06 PM
That tells me he's a damn good hitter vs. being lucky.

He's lucky there is zero shot he keeps up what he's done since middle of September last year into playoffs and into this year. 29 HR, 89 RBI in 394 AB all while hitting .310. That's a HR every 13.59 before that run he had 10 HR in 282 AB and 47 RBI at .280 in the minors he hit a HR one ever 21.01 AB in AAA it was 21.56 in the PCL one of the best hitters leagues in the minors.

HometownHero
08-26-2012, 03:06 PM
At least we messed up his ERA run, would be nice to get the big blow.

texasdave
08-26-2012, 03:07 PM
Well they are statically the luckiest team in the majors.

Based on what? BABIP? :lol:

texasdave
08-26-2012, 03:09 PM
Cut into the lead. Nice start to a comeback.

Stray
08-26-2012, 03:09 PM
Hit it hard

Stray
08-26-2012, 03:15 PM
The games do feel different without LaRussa in the other dugout. You see a lot of laughs and talk between the teams.

HometownHero
08-26-2012, 03:17 PM
Based on what? BABIP? :lol:

Their BABIP being 6 points higher then the next closest team plays a part in it yes but it goes much deeper than that.

texasdave
08-26-2012, 03:18 PM
A lot of folks dressed up as red seats behind home plate. I think that is odd.

Stray
08-26-2012, 03:18 PM
I'm not a Sabermetrics guy by any stretch of the imagination, but wouldn't the best hitting team in baseball always have a high BABIP?

cw0802
08-26-2012, 03:19 PM
He's lucky there is zero shot he keeps up what he's done since middle of September last year into playoffs and into this year. 29 HR, 89 RBI in 394 AB all while hitting .310. That's a HR every 13.59 before that run he had 10 HR in 282 AB and 47 RBI at .280 in the minors he hit a HR one ever 21.01 AB in AAA it was 21.56 in the PCL one of the best hitters leagues in the minors.

So he's been lucky for over a year. One year of pure luck? Riiiiight. Look, I can do that too. That guy Votto has been nothing but lucky for the past couple years.

texasdave
08-26-2012, 03:19 PM
Cardinals are so lucky. They got one run back right away.

Stray
08-26-2012, 03:20 PM
Our bullpen hasn't been that good for a while now.

texasdave
08-26-2012, 03:22 PM
Todd Frazier's numbers in the minors never suggested what he is doing this year. Frazier is so lucky this year. I am so tired of everything nowadays in baseball being luck or no luck.

cw0802
08-26-2012, 03:22 PM
...yup...lucky.

HometownHero
08-26-2012, 03:22 PM
I'm not a Sabermetrics guy by any stretch of the imagination, but wouldn't the best hitting team in baseball always have a high BABIP?

They lead the NL in hitting last year with a .305 BABIP

Stray
08-26-2012, 03:23 PM
bullpen issues

texasdave
08-26-2012, 03:23 PM
Reds' bullpen has certainly been unlucky lately.

HometownHero
08-26-2012, 03:24 PM
So he's been lucky for over a year. One year of pure luck? Riiiiight. Look, I can do that too. That guy Votto has been nothing but lucky for the past couple years.

Over that year Craig has better numbers the Votto's career averages has so yes he's been lucky right on time with the BABIP special RBI single.

Stray
08-26-2012, 03:25 PM
5 run game, I'd just leave him in there and save the arm.

reds700
08-26-2012, 03:26 PM
The bullpen is vastly overrated.

HometownHero
08-26-2012, 03:27 PM
Todd Frazier's numbers in the minors never suggested what he is doing this year. Frazier is so lucky this year. I am so tired of everything nowadays in baseball being luck or no luck.

Todd isn't going to keep doing what he's doing either, but he can't even touch Craig's lucky year long run.

cw0802
08-26-2012, 03:27 PM
:)
Over that year Craig has better numbers the Votto's career averages has so yes he's been lucky right on time with the BABIP special RBI single.

Couldn't be that he's just a good hitter?

texasdave
08-26-2012, 03:28 PM
:)

Couldn't be that he's just a good hitter?

Nope. Just pure luck.

HometownHero
08-26-2012, 03:28 PM
:)

Couldn't be that he's just a good hitter?

Unless he over night became on of the best players in the majors

cw0802
08-26-2012, 03:29 PM
Nope. Just pure luck.

I guess Pujols was lucky too...that is until he went to play form the Angels. Now he's just real good!

HometownHero
08-26-2012, 03:29 PM
Good thing they didn't sting their hits yesterday 13 so far in the 7th, had 11 in a loss yesterday after 14 in game one.

texasdave
08-26-2012, 03:30 PM
Good thing they didn't sting their hits yesterday 13 so far in the 7th, had 11 in a loss yesterday after 14 in game one.

They don't have the ability to string their hits. It is all luck. They are at the mercy of the baseball gods.

cw0802
08-26-2012, 03:34 PM
Unless he over night became on of the best players in the majors

Injured and bench player last year because he didn't have a spot to start due too Berkman, Holliday and Pujols. This is the first year he's had the opportunity to play most of the season. Look what he's done. So is it possible...just possible that he is that talented?

HometownHero
08-26-2012, 03:35 PM
I guess Pujols was lucky too...that is until he went to play form the Angels. Now he's just real good!

Pujols had a .920 OPS in the minors making it to AAA in one year, Craig was 26 before he got his first MLB HR and 27 and 3 months old when he went on this run. Pujols had over 200 HR and almost 1,00 hits by the time Craig even made the majors and had almost 1,000 games of doing it by the time he was the age Craig went on his went.

Ironman92
08-26-2012, 03:36 PM
I'm not a Sabermetrics guy by any stretch of the imagination, but wouldn't the best hitting team in baseball always have a high BABIP?

Nice point.....BABIP has flaws for sure...so many factors. To me any player that hits the ball where it's pitched should carry a higher BABIP. Almost every Cardinal hitter does that. The Reds are often pull happy with a good portion of their lineup.

Hit it hard where it's pitched is a more successful approach than hit my picture on the scoreboard.

Ironman92
08-26-2012, 03:37 PM
Todd Frazier's numbers in the minors never suggested what he is doing this year. Frazier is so lucky this year. I am so tired of everything nowadays in baseball being luck or no luck.

Tough luck my friend....that's how it is.

texasdave
08-26-2012, 03:39 PM
If people honestly think everything is luck in a sport why bother watching? I certainly wouldn't.

HometownHero
08-26-2012, 03:41 PM
If people honestly think everything is luck in a sport why bother watching? I certainly wouldn't.

Its not everything but Luck is major part of baseball light years ahead of any other sport.

cw0802
08-26-2012, 03:41 PM
If people honestly think everything is luck in a sport why bother watching? I certainly wouldn't.

Agreed.

Can you believe how lucky Larkin was? So lucky they voted him into the HOF.

Who Dey Time
08-26-2012, 03:41 PM
Rolen clearly lucky that Beltran didn't go for that ball harder.

cw0802
08-26-2012, 03:43 PM
Its not everything but Luck is major part of baseball light years ahead of any other sport.

So, using this logic, some players are just more lucky more often than others?

HometownHero
08-26-2012, 03:43 PM
Edward Mujica now at 12.1 scoreless for the Cardinals

cw0802
08-26-2012, 03:44 PM
Edward Mujica now at 12.1 scoreless for the Cardinals

He's so lucky.

HometownHero
08-26-2012, 03:47 PM
So, using this logic, some players are just more lucky more often than others?

Yes that's how the game works its hitting a round ball with a round bat and 8 guys spread around over a wide space. Even the best players who make sold hard contact consistently have runs of poor and good luck.

HometownHero
08-26-2012, 03:48 PM
He's so lucky.

I know

texasdave
08-26-2012, 03:48 PM
Lecure was definitely luckier than Schumaker on that at-bat. I hope he is luckier than Furcal as well.
Nope. Furcal was luckier.

cw0802
08-26-2012, 03:50 PM
Yes that's how the game works its hitting a round ball with a round bat and 8 guys spread around over a wide space. Even the best players who make sold hard contact consistently have runs of poor and good luck.

So no player is more talented than another...just luckier.

HometownHero
08-26-2012, 03:52 PM
So no player is more talented than another...just luckier.

I never said they didn't have players without more talent, but luck is still a major factor in baseball even for those talented players.

Who Dey Time
08-26-2012, 03:52 PM
Yes that's how the game works its hitting a round ball with a round bat and 8 guys spread around over a wide space. Even the best players who make sold hard contact consistently have runs of poor and good luck.

So under this theory Joey Votto is just luckier than Miguel Cairo?

cw0802
08-26-2012, 03:53 PM
There should be a new stat category. Luck. Because putting the bat on the ball isn't a skill. It's all luck.

HometownHero
08-26-2012, 03:54 PM
So under this theory Joey Votto is just luckier than Miguel Cairo?

Votto does have some luck in his career, but you're reaching here and you know it.

cw0802
08-26-2012, 03:55 PM
Votto does have some luck in his career, but you're reaching here and you know it.

Not really. Your argument is that players are not necessarily skilled but lucky.

Ironman92
08-26-2012, 03:55 PM
I'm lucky to have read this thread.

Who Dey Time
08-26-2012, 03:56 PM
I'm lucky to have read this thread.

And we're lucky to have you Ironman.

HometownHero
08-26-2012, 03:56 PM
There should be a new stat category. Luck. Because putting the bat on the ball isn't a skill. It's all luck.

BABIP is a form of a luck category

Ironman92
08-26-2012, 03:57 PM
This year's Reds team doesn't have as many wins as the 2010 team ended with.

cw0802
08-26-2012, 03:57 PM
BABIP is a form of a luck category

Using your logic, players like Ichiro, Jeter...lucky.

HometownHero
08-26-2012, 03:57 PM
Not really. Your argument is that players are not necessarily skilled but lucky.

No every player that makes the majors is skilled

Who Dey Time
08-26-2012, 03:58 PM
No every player that makes the majors is skilled

Yes they are.

reds700
08-26-2012, 03:58 PM
Our plate discipline is so bad.

cw0802
08-26-2012, 03:59 PM
Our plate discipline is so bad.

No...your plate discipline is unlucky

Ironman92
08-26-2012, 03:59 PM
BABIP is a form of a luck category

So are home runs....very often home runs are a product of a missed location and since the is do defense against the pitcher throwing to his location...the hitter is lucky the pitcher missed his spot.

HometownHero
08-26-2012, 04:00 PM
Using your logic, players like Ichiro, Jeter...lucky.

Yes they are lucky

Ironman92
08-26-2012, 04:01 PM
Yes they are.

Pete Rose Jr?
Stephen Larkin?
Mike Bell?

....but Tony Gwynn was pretty skilled....as is everyone that's not a courtesy call up.

cw0802
08-26-2012, 04:01 PM
Yes they are lucky

...riiiiight.

Ironman92
08-26-2012, 04:02 PM
Yes they are lucky

They are lucky to not know of this thread.

cw0802
08-26-2012, 04:04 PM
Over 3000 hits and career .314 BA. Lucky.

Maker_84
08-26-2012, 04:08 PM
Pitching was blasted by the Cards this weekend. Bullpen definitely has looked bad lately

HometownHero
08-26-2012, 04:09 PM
Over 3000 hits and career .314 BA. Lucky.

.355 BABIP in around 8,500 balls in play is lucky, he has skill but has also has had more than his fair share of good fortune.

HometownHero
08-26-2012, 04:10 PM
If the Cards aren't lucky then I guess our pitching isn't as good as we thought it was.

cw0802
08-26-2012, 04:13 PM
If the Cards aren't lucky then I guess our pitching isn't as good as we thought it was.

All of your pitchers were on a hot streak...sorry...luck streak. They were bound to become unlucky.

And how in the heck could you say a player with over 3000 hits is lucky? You're really proving you're nuts.

HometownHero
08-26-2012, 04:17 PM
And how in the heck could you say a player with over 3000 hits is lucky? You're really proving you're nuts.

He has talent but also has more than his share of luck, You honestly think he went up there and roped 3,000 liners in the gap? He's been over 50 points higher than the league average BABIP for almost 20 years there is tons of luck to go with his talent.

FloridaBuckeye
08-26-2012, 04:24 PM
this thread stinks... like the Reds today

cw0802
08-26-2012, 04:24 PM
He has talent but also has more than his share of luck, You honestly think he went up there and roped 3,000 liners in the gap? He's been over 50 points higher than the league average BABIP for almost 20 years there is tons of luck to go with his talent.

No, but to say Jeter was lucky more than talented is nuts. A week of hitting the cover off the ball. Luck. Almost 20 years? Talent.

HometownHero
08-26-2012, 04:32 PM
No, but to say Jeter was lucky more than talented is nuts. A week of hitting the cover off the ball. Luck. Almost 20 years? Talent.

I never said he wasn't very talented but he's also been lucky as well. He has the highest BABIP of players in the last quarter century by a wide gap.

cw0802
08-26-2012, 04:35 PM
I never said he wasn't very talented but he's also been lucky as well. He has the highest BABIP of players in the last quarter century by a wide gap.

Proving his talent.

This is like arguing with a wall. I'm out.

HometownHero
08-26-2012, 04:39 PM
Proving his talent.

This is like arguing with a wall. I'm out.

He does have talent but he also has tons of luck, if it was as easy as proving his talent he wouldn't have a up and down yo-yo BABIP.

Maker_84
08-26-2012, 05:21 PM
this thread stinks... like the Reds today

agreed, not much talk about the actual game today

HometownHero
08-26-2012, 05:22 PM
agreed, not much talk about the actual game today

Whats to talk about how bad we got rolled?

The Rage
08-26-2012, 06:32 PM
Homer Bailey is not a starting pitcher. He is not getting tall enough during scaploading and it is killing his 4 seamer. He already has taken velocity off of it to try and save himself, but his legs have given out now. Guys frame just isn't of a starter, but of a closer.

Rest him, put him in the pen and let him throw hard......real hard.

HometownHero
08-26-2012, 07:28 PM
D-Backs just got swept by the Padres at home, sucks going out West to play a team that's coming off a sweep with Arroyo going in a HR park.

buddha8
08-26-2012, 07:50 PM
Homer Bailey is not a starting pitcher. He is not getting tall enough during scaploading and it is killing his 4 seamer. He already has taken velocity off of it to try and save himself, but his legs have given out now. Guys frame just isn't of a starter, but of a closer.

Rest him, put him in the pen and let him throw hard......real hard.
And replace Homer with whom as SP? The guy whose body needs help as SP is Leake.
JJHoover has body-build, stuff,and mentality for SP. But Braves demotion of him from SP to RP will haunt him for awhile--until somebody gives him another shot at SP rotation. Reds?

The Rage
08-26-2012, 07:59 PM
And replace Homer with whom as SP? The guy whose body needs help as SP is Leake.
JJHoover has body-build, stuff,and mentality for SP. But Braves demotion of him from SP to RP will haunt him for awhile--until somebody gives him another shot at SP rotation. Reds?

Simon, Lecure, heck even Redmond. The 5th starter is no big deal. Bailey needs to rest and then try it out of the pen. 5/6 bad starts and considering how good his slider was in Philly, how he couldn't throw better is all about his mechanics with the 4 seamer and splitter. I bet Lecure could do better than that.

FWIW, the Splitter is why Bailey is struggling. It has gone AWOL since the Astros game. Even though 4/6 last starts, his slider has been terrific, his fastball is to "average". Since the velocity decline of 2010-12 in his 4 seamer, the splitter picked up some of the slack.

This is what I mean guys. Considering the Splitter is a tiring pitch and if he can't use it throughout the season as much, he can't make it as a starter. Go into the pen and see if you can get your fastball up to 97mph and ditch the splitter. All you would need is the 4 seamer/slider/curve in the pen. The Reds have a big big decisions here with Bailey, a big big decision. He just hasn't been bad since the Astros start, he has been replacement level horrible. Something is wrong.

Maker_84
08-26-2012, 10:06 PM
bailey bashing definitely warranted in this game, heck the entire staff minus Mike Leake looked just awful in this series

The Rage
08-26-2012, 11:06 PM
bailey bashing definitely warranted in this game, heck the entire staff minus Mike Leake looked just awful in this series

Bailey tried his arse off. With the Splitter AWOL, the guy just can't cut it. He tries so hard alot of the time, but with that average fastball, it makes him a sitting duck.

HometownHero
08-26-2012, 11:18 PM
Need to avoid pitching Bailey at home as much as possible.

Home
5.58 ERA
.319 BAA
1.62 WHIP
3-7 Record
18 HR allowed in 79.0 IP

Road
2.91 ERA
.243 BAA
1.17 WHIP
7-2 Record
4 HR allowed in 80.1 IP

PumpFak3First
08-27-2012, 12:43 AM
So a flip next year? Chapman to SP, Homer to the bullpen