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texasdave
09-17-2012, 10:08 PM
Fangraphs takes a look at Tony Cingrani. Where did his velocity go? Plenty of video if you like that kinda stuff.

http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/reds-tony-cingrani-sails-to-cincy/

dougdirt
09-18-2012, 11:11 AM
What do you mean where did his velocity go?

Kc61
09-18-2012, 11:13 AM
Cingrani and Billy Hamilton (at DH) made the first team Baseball America minor league all star team. Cingrani was one of a very few pitchers selected for that team.

Superdude
09-18-2012, 09:15 PM
What do you mean where did his velocity go?

His first scouting reports had him throwing harder, but I guess that was based on his time closing in college.

dougdirt
09-18-2012, 09:22 PM
His first scouting reports had him throwing harder, but I guess that was based on his time closing in college.

All reports I had from him this year as a starter had him around 90 MPH, give or take a MPH or 2. Topping out around 93.

John Sickels said he had a report of him working 91-93 and topping out at 96. That must have been in the California League, because the broadcasters in AA never saw that guy.

Likewise, as a reliever thus far in the Majors, he has topped out around 94-95, but mostly worked in that 89-92 range.

Either way though, I am not worried about his fastball at all, whether it is 89-90 or 93+. The pitch is nails when he is on. It is his other pitches that worry me.

Edd Roush
09-19-2012, 01:08 PM
Here is another article written by fangraphs on Tony Cingrani.

http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/an-enthusiastic-note-on-tony-cingranis-early-success/

This one is definitely more optimistic.

chicoruiz
09-19-2012, 04:07 PM
A left-handed Rick Sutcliffe? I'd take that...

crazybob60
09-20-2012, 10:31 AM
It will be interesting to see if he sticks in the bullpen to begin next season (as a part of the MLB club), or if they send him down to Louisville to possibly continue on as a starter. It would give us some much needed depth at the starter spot (beyond the 5 guys that we currently have).

mdccclxix
09-20-2012, 10:40 AM
My limited impression of Cingrani is he has a sharp mental edge and lots of confidence. We'll see how he responds to adversity, which has been very rare in his pro career so far. I really expect to see improvement from his secondary pitches this offseason.

bubbachunk
09-20-2012, 03:45 PM
It will be interesting to see if he sticks in the bullpen to begin next season (as a part of the MLB club), or if they send him down to Louisville to possibly continue on as a starter. It would give us some much needed depth at the starter spot (beyond the 5 guys that we currently have).

It would be a very poor personel decision to not let him develop more in triple A too see if he will sink or swim as a starter. Though it did not stop the Reds from making the same choice with Chapman....

REDREAD
09-21-2012, 11:00 AM
It will be interesting to see if he sticks in the bullpen to begin next season (as a part of the MLB club), or if they send him down to Louisville to possibly continue on as a starter. It would give us some much needed depth at the starter spot (beyond the 5 guys that we currently have).

I hope Cingrani stays in Louisville.. He needs to work on a breaking pitch.

The Reds should be able to add a 3rd LH to the bullpen through free agency.. I mean, let's face it.. that's not a critical need..definitely not worth stunting Cingrani's potential.

It would be nice to have Cingrani at AAA as the "emergency" starter too. Redmond is out of options after this season.

Scrap Irony
09-21-2012, 11:39 AM
I'm betting Chapman's the closer again next season, especially if Leake, Bailey, Arroyo, Latos, and Cueto are all healthy.

That would make Cingrani and Corcino the AAA starting depth.

Which would be better, IMO, than than all but a handful of team's starting depth in the high minors.

If one of the starters (Arroyo? Leake? Bailey?) is dealt this offseason, Chapman gets slotted there, and, IMO, Cingrani moves to the pen as a late-inning arm (with Hoover, who, IMO, will be the RH set-up man next season if Chapman's still the closer).

2013
Chapman Closer
Marshall SU
Hoover SU
Arredondo MR
Simon MR
LeCure MR
Bray/ Masset/ Ondrusek LR

2014
Hoover Closer
Marshall SU
LeCure SU
Cingrani MR
Corcino MR
Ondrusek/ Simon/ Arredondo LR
Rogers/ Lotzkar LR

Hard to figure out a real bullpen as they're so funglible, but it's certainly possible the Reds could go cheap in the pen and still be largely effective. (Much like this season turned out to be, with rookies, unprovens, and youngsters playing key roles in every spot but Marshall's and, late in the year, Broxton's.
Corcino LR

Brutus
09-21-2012, 04:24 PM
Chapman to the rotation. Move Bailey or Leake. Cingriani to be the final starter after Arroyo's contract expires.

camisadelgolf
09-21-2012, 05:18 PM
Chapman to the rotation. Move Bailey or Leake. Cingriani to be the final starter after Arroyo's contract expires.
We have to be careful about not taking the rotation's health for granted. If they trade away Bailey or Leake, they better sign some really good minor league free agents as insurance for having an average amount of pitching injuries next season. And you never know when a young starter could go all Jair Jurrjens on everybody. Heck, maybe 2012 is the calm before Bronson Arroyo's storm. I'm just saying that I wouldn't mind hanging on to the pitching. It would have to take a really good offer to bowl me over.

Brutus
09-21-2012, 05:31 PM
We have to be careful about not taking the rotation's health for granted. If they trade away Bailey or Leake, they better sign some really good minor league free agents as insurance for having an average amount of pitching injuries next season. And you never know when a young starter could go all Jair Jurrjens on everybody. Heck, maybe 2012 is the calm before Bronson Arroyo's storm. I'm just saying that I wouldn't mind hanging on to the pitching. It would have to take a really good offer to bowl me over.

I imagine one could expect Cingriani to be a dependable fill-in if necessary next season. That's probably a better reserve option than many teams have.

Kc61
09-21-2012, 06:25 PM
It would be a very poor personel decision to not let him develop more in triple A too see if he will sink or swim as a starter. Though it did not stop the Reds from making the same choice with Chapman....

Chapman had a lot more major league experience before this season than Cingrani has now. Reds wisely determined that it was more important to win the division than to have Chapman in the minor leagues.

Cingrani is a different story. I fully expect Cingrani, H Rod, and Gregorius to begin next year at AAA if they are not traded. None of these guys has that much AAA experience and they won't be deemed ready for prime time.

But no team has endless depth, and these three could easily see themselves with the Reds as next season progresses. And, like Todd Frazier, they could make good when given the shot.

And I fully expect Cingrani will be a starter at AAA next year. Reds can always move him to the bullpen fairly quickly if such a change is needed.