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View Full Version : Both Ludwick & Madson decline options with Reds



Krawhitham
11-01-2012, 12:12 AM
http://espn.go.com/mlb/story/_/id/8578633/ryan-ludwick-ryan-madson-decline-options-cincinati-reds-become-free-agents


CINCINNATI -- Reds outfielder Ryan Ludwick became a free agent Wednesday after declining his $5 million contract option for next season, looking for a bigger deal after his strong second half played a big role in Cincinnati winning the NL Central title.


Relief pitcher Ryan Madson also became a free agent Wednesday after declining a mutual option. The right-hander needed reconstructive elbow surgery after tearing a ligament during spring training and missed the entire season.

http://espn.go.com/mlb/story/_/id/8578633/ryan-ludwick-ryan-madson-decline-options-cincinati-reds-become-free-agents

vin19
11-01-2012, 01:21 AM
I can't believe madson declined his side of the contract. (boras probably talked him into it) or he just knew for a fact the reds weren't going to pick up that option

HometownHero
11-01-2012, 02:05 AM
I can't believe madson declined his side of the contract. (boras probably talked him into it) or he just knew for a fact the reds weren't going to pick up that option

It would have been a smart gamble to take even if the Reds planned on picking it up. He gets 2.5M to walk and has some big money teams in the market for a closer this winter. He should find a deal at least breaking even if you add in the buyout and will likely have a shot to close.

If the Yanks open up the checkbook and bring back Rafael Soriano then the Tigers could take the 9M they were paying Valverde this year and give it to Madson for a year to hold down the fort until Bruce Rondon is ready to take over the role in 2014 after a year of grooming in a lesser role.

HometownHero
11-01-2012, 02:11 AM
Ludwick wants to be here but also want some job security I can see them getting a 2 year deal worth 14-15M with maybe an option year in there if push comes to shove.

holster10
11-01-2012, 08:33 AM
I'd let Ludwick go. He had a really good run for about 1.5 months last season and was not so good to terrible the rest of the time. No consistency. I can't see him putting together two more years of consistent productivity especially since he stunk it up the last three years before this season.

bounty37h
11-01-2012, 10:06 AM
It would have been a smart gamble to take even if the Reds planned on picking it up. He gets 2.5M to walk and has some big money teams in the market for a closer this winter. He should find a deal at least breaking even if you add in the buyout and will likely have a shot to close.

If the Yanks open up the checkbook and bring back Rafael Soriano then the Tigers could take the 9M they were paying Valverde this year and give it to Madson for a year to hold down the fort until Bruce Rondon is ready to take over the role in 2014 after a year of grooming in a lesser role.

I dont get how this stuff works; mutual option that he turns down so we pay him yet another 2.5 million to never play for us? Seems if the player turns it down the buyout would/should be void IMO.

Red in Atl
11-01-2012, 10:42 AM
I'd rather see them pick up Youk for a year and put Frazier in left than spend 15 million on Ludwick. I totally see him getting the money and reverting back to the Ludwick for the first half plus of the season.

Old NDN
11-01-2012, 11:24 AM
I'd rather see them pick up Youk for a year and put Frazier in left than spend 15 million on Ludwick. I totally see him getting the money and reverting back to the Ludwick for the first half plus of the season.

I like this also. Youk + Frazier should = Rolen and Ludwick production. Although Rolen and Luddy were real positive clubhouse guys, according to most reports. Use the $$ saved to find a CF/leadoff guy.

I'm intrigued by Madson. Throughout the season, he re-iterated his desire to come back to the Reds. He's worth a shot, but at a low-cost, incentive laden deal. Maybe in his mind, he feels bad for taking 8.5 million for nothing. We can dream, can't we?

Larkin88
11-01-2012, 01:04 PM
I dont get how this stuff works; mutual option that he turns down so we pay him yet another 2.5 million to never play for us? Seems if the player turns it down the buyout would/should be void IMO.

Curious about that myself. I know theres some contract-savvy folks here and I don't have the time to research myself this afternoon. Anybody able to weigh in on this?

Stray
11-01-2012, 01:08 PM
Smart move for both of them. From what I read a while back Ludwick wants to stay though, so hopefully we can agree on a contract that's good for both of us.

texasdave
11-01-2012, 01:23 PM
http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20121031&content_id=40133446&vkey=news_mlb&c_id=mlb

Looks as if Jocketty wants everyone back. Broxton, Madson, Ludwick and Navarro.

Stray
11-01-2012, 02:29 PM
That's interesting to me, if Jocketty is saying there's interest on both sides to bring Madson back, that means Chapman to the rotation right?

1. Cueto
2. Latos
3. Homer
4. Bronson
5. Chapman

Sign me up.

HometownHero
11-01-2012, 06:37 PM
I dont get how this stuff works; mutual option that he turns down so we pay him yet another 2.5 million to never play for us? Seems if the player turns it down the buyout would/should be void IMO.

Its just a way to move money around. We were pushed up to the payroll limit in 2012 so he took just 6M when he was worth more. In that 6M he deferred 2/3 of the money until today and then this date next year lowering the present day value of the contract helping out the Reds. To do that for them they pushed off some of the money he was worth until 2013 when we had more payroll flexibility.

So to make it simple it was going to basically be a 1 year 8.5M deal from day one with him going back out this year looking for his big contract like he got voided by the Phillies management, but the Reds had to play games to find a way to play him for 2012.

It was a smart move by Walt getting him at a reduced rate it just didn't work out. Would have been nice if he could have pitched and at the deadline we could have added a CF or a bat of some type rather than Jonathan Broxton and we may have finished off the Giants in game 3.

alwaysawarrior
11-02-2012, 10:34 AM
I personally don't pay Ludwick much more than he made this year. He had a good second half and we have to contribute at least part of that bump to GABP.

Stray
11-02-2012, 11:55 AM
I personally don't pay Ludwick much more than he made this year. He had a good second half and we have to contribute at least part of that bump to GABP.

We'll be playing 82 games at GABP next year so that's fine with me.

MrRedLegger
11-02-2012, 12:47 PM
Ludwick is also a big reason why we were still in the NLDS until the last pitch.

malcontent
11-02-2012, 04:31 PM
Ludwick is also a big reason why we were still in the NLDS until the last pitch.
Yes, he was. Probably the biggest reason.

I wouldn't touch Madson but I'd do what I could to bring Luddy back.

MoneyInTheBank
11-02-2012, 04:48 PM
The question with Ludwick is not if the Reds want him back, it's how much will they be willing to pay. For me, I go no more than 2 years with a team option for a 3rd and no more than $7-8M per year. Any more than that, I let him walk and look elsewhere

UPRedsFan
11-02-2012, 07:32 PM
Say no to Ludwick.

Chances of repeating last year's production is not good.

The lost power from the lineup will be replaced by a full year of Frazier and a healthy Votto.

The money it will take to re-sign him would be much better spent on a high OBP outfielder to put at the top of the lineup.

The only way I would re-sign him is if I couldn't find the OBP outfielder.

MoneyInTheBank
11-02-2012, 08:16 PM
Say no to Ludwick.

Chances of repeating last year's production is not good.

The lost power from the lineup will be replaced by a full year of Frazier and a healthy Votto.

The money it will take to re-sign him would be much better spent on a high OBP outfielder to put at the top of the lineup.

The only way I would re-sign him is if I couldn't find the OBP outfielder.

I don't expect him to repeat his performance from last year .275/.346/.531 but I also don't think it would be unreasonable to get something close to his career numbers .263/.334/.466

If he can give close to his career slash line, he is well worth $7-8M IMO

UPRedsFan
11-02-2012, 10:50 PM
He won't sign for just one year. And there's no way I can be convinced that he'll match even his career average slash line for the next 2 or 3 years. Frazier on the other hand is much more likely to match those numbers the next couple years.

That's why I'm saying that money would be a losing investment on Ludwick and they should use it instead for the real need - someone to sit at the top of the lineup and get on base in front of Votto. Votto will lead the league in RBI if he just has a couple average to above average on base guys in front of him.