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Tom Servo
11-04-2012, 06:31 PM
Didn't know if there was a thread to discuss possible trade scenarios, so...

Fox Sports' Ken Rosenthal reports the Nationals have "been reluctant" to offer Adam LaRoche more than a two-year deal.
LaRoche declined his half of a mutual option this offseason and isn't expected to sign the Nationals' one-year, $13.3 million qualifying offer. The two sides will continue to discuss a new contract, but LaRoche is likely to test free agency and will be highly sought-after on the open market. Rosenthal suggests that Michael Morse could be shopped as a way of creating payroll.


He'd look awfully nice in LF for the Reds, but the question is what would a team ripe with depth like the Nats want from us.

cinreds21
11-04-2012, 10:23 PM
Not too sure if they would want pitching, even though you could never have enough. The Nationals are almost set for years at ever position. Maybe they would want to upgrade Desmond or Espinosa, but that's their only "hole" (assuming they sign Bourne or Upton to play center.)

Wonderful Monds
11-04-2012, 10:28 PM
Bullpen or whatever?

Lotzkar, Ondrusek, Bray?

cinreds21
11-04-2012, 10:30 PM
Lotzkar is a year away and may be a longman or fifth starter. The Reds really don't have a great bullpen arm that would help get Morse. Their best reliever in the system now is probably Chris Manno, or Tony Cingrani if he goes that route.

Wonderful Monds
11-04-2012, 10:35 PM
Lotzkar is a year away and may be a longman or fifth starter. The Reds really don't have a great bullpen arm that would help get Morse. Their best reliever in the system now is probably Chris Manno, or Tony Cingrani if he goes that route.

Is Morse that valuable though? He had a great year last year. This year he was kinda good, 18 HR but a middling OBP. Has only been over a 1 win player once in his career. Profiles best case scenario as a bad left fielder out in the field.

I would like him, but I would think a major league BP arm, a wild card arm, and a prospect is at least in the ballpark.

cinreds21
11-04-2012, 10:37 PM
Is Morse that valuable though? He had a great year last year. This year he was kinda good, 18 HR but a middling OBP. Has only been over a 1 win player once in his career. Profiles best case scenario as a bad left fielder out in the field.

I would like him, but I would think a major league BP arm, a wild card arm, and a prospect is at least in the ballpark.

He missed a good bit of time last season, started slow and then got back on track. I don't know his exact value, but they aren't going to get him for Logan Ondrusek. Maybe Lotzkar and Henry Rodriguez does it, but I don't know really what Washington would be looking for in return.

Kc61
11-04-2012, 11:41 PM
Last three years Morse OPS were .870, .910, .791.

If folks want to discuss trading for him, I think they have to be realistic about the cost.

Lotzkar, Ondrusek, Bray?

C'mon.

Patrick Bateman
11-05-2012, 12:50 AM
Last three years Morse OPS were .870, .910, .791.

If folks want to discuss trading for him, I think they have to be realistic about the cost.

Lotzkar, Ondrusek, Bray?

C'mon.

A complete picture would show that Morse also plays horrid defense at positions that require little skill.

He's going to be making near 7M next year... I mean, I'd just as soon bring Ludwick back, wouldn't even have to give anything up for him. Perhaps it would cost more than the lot people here are discussing, but from the Reds POV, I certainly wouldn't be offering anything more.

camisadelgolf
11-05-2012, 12:52 AM
Remember: there are 28 other potential suitors. I'm sure the Reds could put together a good offer, but I'm thinking there are a few other teams who could put together a more enticing package.

cumberlandreds
11-05-2012, 08:13 AM
Last three years Morse OPS were .870, .910, .791.

If folks want to discuss trading for him, I think they have to be realistic about the cost.

Lotzkar, Ondrusek, Bray?

C'mon.

Yep. The Reds would have to give up a starting pitcher in the line of someone like Bailey to get him. Also Morse is really a first baseman who is only playing the outfield because LaRoche had such a solid season. He's not very good defensivley but does make up for his deficincies with his bat.

Dan
11-05-2012, 08:29 AM
If I was going to trade for someone, that someone would probably be Nelson Cruz.

Wonderful Monds
11-05-2012, 02:11 PM
Yep. The Reds would have to give up a starting pitcher in the line of someone like Bailey to get him. Also Morse is really a first baseman who is only playing the outfield because LaRoche had such a solid season. He's not very good defensivley but does make up for his deficincies with his bat.

Bailey? That's insane. We're talking about a guy here who is basically Jonny Gomes.

cinreds21
11-05-2012, 02:32 PM
Bailey? That's insane. We're talking about a guy here who is basically Jonny Gomes.

Seriously? Come on man. In 2012, Morse hit .291 vs. RHP and .290 Vs. LHP. Gomes is solely a bat against lefties as he hit .209 vs RHP last year. No, he is not basically Jonny Gomes.

cumberlandreds
11-05-2012, 02:58 PM
Bailey? That's insane. We're talking about a guy here who is basically Jonny Gomes.



:lol: You obviously haven't watched Michael Morse. He's 100 times better than Gomes ever was.

Wonderful Monds
11-05-2012, 03:17 PM
:lol: You obviously haven't watched Michael Morse. He's 100 times better than Gomes ever was.

Ever was? Morse has been more than a replacement level player once. 3 wins last year. Gomes has put up similar offensive seasons to Morse's best 3 times, in 2005, 2009, and this year. Both are terrible defenders so that's a push.

But yeah Morse is good. He's not THAT good.

Brutus
11-05-2012, 03:24 PM
Yep. The Reds would have to give up a starting pitcher in the line of someone like Bailey to get him. Also Morse is really a first baseman who is only playing the outfield because LaRoche had such a solid season. He's not very good defensivley but does make up for his deficincies with his bat.

Why would the Nationals want a starting pitcher? That's the strongest part of their entire club.

cumberlandreds
11-06-2012, 08:05 AM
Why would the Nationals want a starting pitcher? That's the strongest part of their entire club.

Bottom line,everyone wants pitching. If they give up a key cog in their offense they will want a starter back. But I highly they are trading Morse anyway.

Scrap Irony
11-06-2012, 09:03 AM
Mesoraco might get their attention. Add in a bullpen arm (Hoover), and you've likely got a deal.

I'd hate to part with that package, though.

Brutus
11-06-2012, 12:12 PM
Bottom line,everyone wants pitching. If they give up a key cog in their offense they will want a starter back. But I highly they are trading Morse anyway.

The Nationals had five guys with ERAs basically below 4 this year. Where do you propose they would want this starting pitcher to play and why do you think they would want to use one of their best assets, based on your suggestion of Morse, to gain something they already have? That really doesn't make any sense.

cumberlandreds
11-06-2012, 01:34 PM
The Nationals had five guys with ERAs basically below 4 this year. Where do you propose they would want this starting pitcher to play and why do you think they would want to use one of their best assets, based on your suggestion of Morse, to gain something they already have? That really doesn't make any sense.

Everyone is looking for an upgrade in pitching. IMO Bailey is much better than Detwiler or Jackson. especially if it is the Bailey of the last month or so. Like I said in another post this isn't going to happen anyway so there not much need to discuss it.

Brutus
11-06-2012, 02:09 PM
Everyone is looking for an upgrade in pitching. IMO Bailey is much better than Detwiler or Jackson. especially if it is the Bailey of the last month or so. Like I said in another post this isn't going to happen anyway so there not much need to discuss it.

Ross Detwiler had a 3.40 ERA this year. As far as sheer production, Bailey was not better than he. And in FIP, even if you ignore ERA, they were almost identical (Bailey a 3.97 FIP and Detwiler a 4.04 FIP.

Edwin Jackson wasn't as good as Bailey in ERA (though he actually had a slightly better FIP), but for the less than half a run difference, is that really worth someone you suggest has a ton of trade value? Either way you look at it, trading for Bailey isn't much of an upgrade for the Nationals unless you assume his last 3-4 starts out of 30+ were the "real" Bailey. It makes no sense to trade one of your best assets for a position that is not of need. There are other positions the Nationals could benefit far greater than acquiring a starting pitcher.

traderumor
11-06-2012, 04:18 PM
The Nats could use some bullpen help, second base, and catcher. I'm not sure we're a good fit at all.

Tom Servo
04-05-2013, 02:34 PM
http://i.imgur.com/vnw6pX2.png

Now I know 4 games is way too early to be saying "I told you so", but...;)

Brutus
04-05-2013, 02:40 PM
http://i.imgur.com/vnw6pX2.png

Now I know 4 games is way too early to be saying "I told you so", but...;)

You've left yourself so ripe for a "Tuffy Rhodes says hello" response.

mdccclxix
04-05-2013, 03:16 PM
Morse is an impressively large guy, almost Dunn-ian. I wish him well in Seattle, they need him more than we do.

texasdave
04-05-2013, 03:34 PM
Is it possible that Morse has finally cracked the code?

scott91575
04-05-2013, 04:15 PM
Is it possible that Morse has finally cracked the code?

http://static.giantbomb.com/uploads/original/13/136085/2423095-boo_this_man.gif

westofyou
04-05-2013, 04:23 PM
http://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/nationals/thomas-boswell-the-nats-defense-does-not-rest-in-opening-sweep-of-marlins/2013/04/04/2754c600-9d91-11e2-9a79-eb5280c81c63_story.html



Nats GM Mike Rizzo always planned for the team he sees now. “Twenty-seven outs — and no more — that’s our goal,” he said. “You can’t afford to give good teams extra outs or they’ll kill you. We want pitching, defense, athleticism and speed wherever we can get it.

“Michael [Morse] is in the perfect league for him,” added Rizzo. “We’re more of a National League type club — a layered [left-right] lineup, more on-base percentage. And there’s a dramatic difference in our outfield. We took a pretty good center fielder and put him in left. Because Span takes perfect routes to the balls in the gaps, our corner outfielders can shade a little more toward the corners, even get to more balls in foul territory.”

jojo
04-05-2013, 06:43 PM
http://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/nationals/thomas-boswell-the-nats-defense-does-not-rest-in-opening-sweep-of-marlins/2013/04/04/2754c600-9d91-11e2-9a79-eb5280c81c63_story.html

Morse can play defense. He just can't play it well.

Little bit of trivia... he came up through the system originally as a shortstop...

Brutus
04-05-2013, 07:06 PM
http://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/nationals/thomas-boswell-the-nats-defense-does-not-rest-in-opening-sweep-of-marlins/2013/04/04/2754c600-9d91-11e2-9a79-eb5280c81c63_story.html

If I didn't know any better WOY, I'd say you just cleverly and subtly killed two discussion birds with one stone.