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View Full Version : BP and Frazier were robbed!



Larry Largen
11-17-2012, 11:11 PM
There is no way Darwin Barney deserves the 2012 gold glove over BP! BP gets to alot more balls and has much better range than DB!

Todd Frazier deserved better than 3rd place in the ROY voting. I thought he deserved the award. Giving it to Bryce Harper was a clown decision bro!

GotHeeeeem
11-17-2012, 11:33 PM
You are correct there is no way anyone other than BP should win the Gold Glove but its an easy case against Frazier. Harper stepped it up at the end of the season and Miley had a 16 win season.

Larry Largen
11-18-2012, 12:53 AM
Todd Frazier hit .273 with 67 rbi's and 19 hr's in 422 at bats.
Bryce Harper hit .270 with 59 rbi's and 22 hr's in 533(111 more) at bats.
Frazier also had better number defensively at both outfield and infield positions.

Salukifan2
11-18-2012, 01:45 AM
agree that frazier should have won. Frazier also meant more to the reds than harper did to the nats.

HometownHero
11-18-2012, 03:08 AM
Todd was lucky to finish 3rd over Wilin Rosario. People who think Todd and BP should have won these awards clearly don't watch any other teams play.

[deleted]
11-18-2012, 03:09 AM
Harper was better then Frazier offensively and defensively. Better slash line, more HR, more SB, higher WAR, better defense - he played most of his games at CF, remember.

Barney bested Phillips in essentially defensive metric we have - the old and the new. He also had that crazy long error-less streak.

Sometimes I'll let my inner homer show. Not here.

HometownHero
11-18-2012, 03:26 AM
Todd Frazier hit .273 with 67 rbi's and 19 hr's in 422 at bats.
Bryce Harper hit .270 with 59 rbi's and 22 hr's in 533(111 more) at bats.
Frazier also had better number defensively at both outfield and infield positions.

Harper is a top of the order hitter he isn't going to have RBI by default but he score 98 runs which was 5th in the NL despite missing the first 20 games of the year. Todd was 26 with MLB experience while Harper was 19 with none and went on to set the most XBH ever by a teenager in a season as well as several other records for his age which holds weight in this award.

Defensive runs save had Todd at a -1 due to his terrible -6 1B skills and Harper was a +14 due too his great range and amazing arm despite making errors. FWIW the MLB leader in DRS was Darwin Barney +28 while BP was +11.

The only possible debate here is should it been Wade Miley over Harper. When a writer from your own city puts you 3rd on the list you have no beef at all.

Salukifan2
11-18-2012, 03:28 AM
I concede that after further review todd probably didnt deserve ROY. But, neither did harper. Lets be real, harper won because of his name. The same reason he was undeservingly put on the all star team only to later in the game make himself look like a fool.

He was also a non factor for pretty much the entire LDS series, though the voting happened before that i can still rip on him for it

HometownHero
11-18-2012, 03:49 AM
Lets be real, harper won because of his name.

His name helped for the All-Star game but the reason he won ROY was because he played the whole year at 19yo and did what few players have ever done in the long history of the game at his age. He had the 2nd most HR by a teen in a season with 22 leaving him 2 off the record and set the record for most XBH and Total Bases.

People tend to dislike Harper for being hyped up and cocky but the best WAR in a season by teenager in MLB was 3.7 by HOFer Mel Ott in 1928, Ott played parts of the previous two years in the majors. This year Harper had a 5.0 and was the youngest play in all of MLB this year.

So not only does does his numbers have a legit claim to the ROY as is he did ir at an crazy young age which puts the over all performance over the top.

Larry Largen
11-18-2012, 12:24 PM
I watched alot of games last year both on TV and live. Not just Reds games. I think BP was quicker to the ball and helped make both Cozart and Votto look better defensively. Frazier IMO has alot more versatility than Harper. Harper had more runs because he was in the top of the order. Harper is a better base runner and has more upside potential but I believe the media helped him win this award.

HometownHero
11-18-2012, 01:03 PM
I watched alot of games last year both on TV and live. Not just Reds games. I think BP was quicker to the ball and helped make both Cozart and Votto look better defensively. Frazier IMO has alot more versatility than Harper. Harper had more runs because he was in the top of the order. Harper is a better base runner and has more upside potential but I believe the media helped him win this award.

Darwin Barney won the fielding bible version of the GG which is the most respected defensive award in the game. Here is what they had to say...


Second Base – Darwin Barney, Chicago Cubs
Darwin Barney’s defense is a shining star in an otherwise cloudy season for the 2012 Chicago Cubs. After a nondescript debut at second base in 2011, when he saved only one run defensively, Barney led all second basemen in 2012 with 28 runs saved. This total led by a wide margin. He had a lot more runs saved than defending Fielding Bible Award winner Dustin Pedroia’s total of 11, a lot more than Robinson Cano’s 15, and a lot more than Brandon Phillips’ 11. Those three came in second, third and fourth in a vote that wasn’t close; Barney received eight of ten first-place votes. Barney’s vote tabulation of 96 points was only four short of perfection.

Also Cozart and Votto are good defenders on their own they don't need BP to make them better. As far as Harper and Todd go versatility means nothing for this award. Harper was on pace to lead the NL in runs if he didn't miss the first 20 games, he was 2nd to McCutchen in most bases taken as a runner. Harper also had a better average with RISP, 2-out with RISP and the bases loaded.