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Five years ago, who among us wouldn't have been penciling in Lutz and Cingrani as starters for the next ten years? now the general consensus is that while they've performed well, they need more seasoning. The Reds are fine without them. What a turn around.
And check the payroll status, we're upper 3rd now in all of baseball. That was a total pipe dream at one point. The Votto & Phillips deals were a definite turning point.
They've done a good job, I agree.
But. In this business, every season is a challenge.
Next year, assume no Choo. Probably no Arroyo. Relatively weak minor league system right now.
So, as always, it's one season at a time.
I looked at baseball-ref, says we're 7th of 30.
From 1996 to 2009, the Reds had two winning seasons and zero division titles. It was a long time coming, but they've definitely turned it around. The best part for me is the pitching. It's the strongest pitching staff the Reds have ever had, IMO.
I'm not so sure the payroll thing is all that much to be positive about.
It's wonderful to point at a new huge media deal for the Cincinnati market, but even as the Reds cash in, so does virtually every other franchise. The only result is that contracts are becoming more expensive. Despite the spending by this ownership, there comes a point of saturation where the Reds cannot keep up with the big boys in spending. There is no way the Reds can compete with the larger markets long term.
Another very real possibility to consider is that the Reds are spending money from a house of cards industry (cable TV) that next generation technology and innovation could render obsolete almost overnight. Obviously, new technology will lead to new sources of income, but sometimes the transition from old to new isn't as smooth as desired.
Having said that, I am pleased that the major spending has gone mostly toward the home grown talent. To me, the key for the Reds' success will ALWAYS be the scouting and development and keeping the farm system as a continual pipeline for major league talent.
I'm just not that enthralled with outside talent brought in. Always wonder why if they were such a talent, why their old team chose to replace them.
Absolutely agree....kudos to Mr. Castellini as none of this is possible without him. Now sign Choo... ;)
We have one of the best ownership groups in baseball. Would love to see this team capture a world series title and pack the house on a regular basis. Great seeing a packed GABP over the weekend.
In a vacuum having a high payroll isn't going to be a positive or a negative, as we've seen with Miami or the Dodgers, or the Yankees. But we're talking about the Reds. The Reds have a high payroll in 2013. It's a good thing because we still have all our homegrown players. It's all good together. The Reds will continue to find young talent as well. There really is no negative to this year's payroll, or to a high payroll later on since we don't know any of the future details.Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeS21
Wrt the weak minor league system. It's much easier to rebuild a depleted minor league system, when you have a very competetive major league team. In general there isn't the itch to move guys up to the majors (Hamilton, I know) before they are ready which reverberates into moves all the way down the minor league system most times. Players are promoted as they are ready. So while the Reds minor league system may be in the weaker ranks of the MLB right now, I don't expect that to last long. IMHO All we need is a few strong drafts and we'll be back in business.
A little off subject but those numbers show how this year so many large market teams are struggling and in most cases blowing a lot of money on players whose skills are declining. Both LA teams and Philadelphia meet that criteria.Quote:
Originally Posted by BillDoran
If you take it by market, I believe the 4 largest markets in America are NY, LA, Chicago and Houston. Well, there's a lot of bad baseball in those cities right now. Usually money buys you better teams than that but not this year. Of course in Houston's case, they're not blowing money. They're just a bad large market team.
Not trying to argue, but what outside talent do you not like?Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeS21
With the exception of the infamous Willie T, I think pretty much every player Walt has brought in has been close to expectations or exceeded expectations (other than some injury cases)
I know some people were against signing Broxton, but every time he appears in a game, I remind myself that if Broxton was not here, that Arrondo or Logan might be pitching right now instead of Broxton.
Payroll increasing is a good thing if you're paying the right players. The current regime has been spending their money on good ballplayers instead of the former regime's habit of being penny wise and pound foolish by paying a few "names" and trying to hit the jackpot on a collection of penny stocks.
BTW, I'm sure I mixed my metaphors somewhere in there, my apologies in advance.
Indeed.Quote:
Originally Posted by traderumor
I like signing a young pitcher like Johnny Cueto to a pricey extension. I don't like signing a guy like Eric Milton to a pricey FA contract.
Exactly, no longer are we run by leadership who think the path to success lies in paying mediocre talent like they were cornerstones.Quote:
Originally Posted by bigredmechanism
Being strong in player development can be related to outside talent. Certainly the Padres had to be high on Latos - can you imagine the numbers he would be putting up out there? - and yet the Reds were able to pry him loose. The reason we were able to do so is that the Padres valued the prospects we had scouted and developed. Had those picks been wasted - if there was the belief that Grandal, Alonso, etc. had low ceilings - the Padres would not have done the deal. Same re Gregorious/Choo - Choo was held in extremely high esteem in Cleveland, can't remotely be considered a castoff. Same re Marshall/Cubs.Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeS21
It's not like the Reds have made a practice of spending a bunch of money on free agents - almost the entire team is the product of either developing players internally or giving up players we developed liked for good players on other teams.