Ex-Red Graves front-runner to pitch in Indians' bullpen
'I told them I didn't care if I wasn't the closer,' he says
By Hal McCoy
Dayton Daily News
WINTER HAVEN, Fla. | While the Cincinnati Reds enter the 2006 season without a designated closer, their old closer is in camp with the Cleveland Indians, his mullet-style hair flowing toward his shoulders and another piece of ever-present body art snaking up his left arm.
Danny Graves is on a path toward making the Indians' relief staff after he was nearly exiled out of baseball last year by the Reds, some of it because of a sudden and lasting siege of ineffectiveness and more of it because of an unfortunate finger-flashing incident with a vulgar fan.
Told the Reds were devoid of a closer, Graves said, "I don't think that city is ready for me to come back just yet. Maybe down the road, you never know."
Graves, 32, is in Cleveland's camp on a minor-league contract but is the front-runner in pursuit of the last spot on the pitching staff, where he will pitch in the seventh or eighth inning.
He pitched a 1-2-3 inning against the Reds earlier this spring, but his former teammates turned ugly Sunday, punching him for three runs in the fourth inning, including a home run by Austin Kearns during Cleveland's 9-4 victory.
"I told them I didn't care if I wasn't the closer," said Graves. "As long as they don't start me, I'm good."
That was a not-so-veiled reference to 2003 when then Cincinnati manager Bob Boone reeled in him into the starting rotation and he went 4-15 in 26 starts with a 5.33 earned run average.
He was not the same as a closer after that.
This spring, he is thinner of body and wiser of mind.
"I got prepared for spring training this year before spring training began," he said. "The previous eight years with the Reds I used spring training to get ready for the season. I had to do it this year because I didn't have a spot on the roster. I wish I had done it with the Reds, but when you are young and dumb, that's the way it is. You think everything is easy and it isn't."
Graves said the Indians coaching staff, particularly bullpen coach Louie Isaac, in his 42nd year with the Tribe, has resurrected his career.
"Louie has made a couple of adjustments of mechanical flaws he spotted," said Graves. "When he saw me throw this spring, he said, 'That's not how you used to throw.' I'm using my legs more and I'm going straight at the the plate rather than fall off side — stuff I didn't realize I was doing or not doing."
Of the coaching help, Graves added, "I've never been around so many coaches who want to help rather than see their names in the papers. They've helped me get the movement on my fastball back and my sinker has been good. I'm getting action on my pitches again."
Before giving up three runs Sunday, Graves had made 10 appearances and was 1-1 with a 2.31 earned run average, giving up three earned runs in 11 2/3 innings, walking none and striking out five.
"Mentally, I'm back together again," he said. "I feel like I'm a baseball player again, and I haven't felt like that since before I left Cincinnati. Being in a winning atmosphere, like here, got me back on track."
The Reds, though, may have derailed him. Graves' main competition for a spot is Steve Karsay, who pitched a scoreless inning Sunday.
Karsay gave up a double to Brian Buchanan, but that doesn't count. Buchanan had a double off Graves, too, and nobody gets him out. In fact, he saw four pitches Sunday and had four hits.
For the spring he is 20 for 33 (.606) with eight doubles and a home run bringing a smile to manager Jerry Narron's face and the words, "He has done everything in his power to make the club. He is hitting and playing defense, done well to help himself not only here but throughout baseball."
Re: Ex-Red Graves front-runner to pitch in Indians' bullpen
"I've never been around so many coaches who want to help rather than see their names in the papers."
Poor Don....
Re: Ex-Red Graves front-runner to pitch in Indians' bullpen
Quote:
"I got prepared for spring training this year before spring training began," he said. "The previous eight years with the Reds I used spring training to get ready for the season. I had to do it this year because I didn't have a spot on the roster. I wish I had done it with the Reds, but when you are young and dumb, that's the way it is. You think everything is easy and it isn't."
You know, when I see a quote like that, as a Reds fan during those breezy, lackidasical days, it makes me feel really small.
Re: Ex-Red Graves front-runner to pitch in Indians' bullpen
Quote:
Originally Posted by Danny Graves
"I don't think that city is ready for me to come back just yet. Maybe down the road, you never know."
don't hold your breath, danny.
Re: Ex-Red Graves front-runner to pitch in Indians' bullpen
Quote:
Originally Posted by RFS62
You know, when I see a quote like that, as a Reds fan during those breezy, lackidasical days, it makes me feel really small.
Makes me wonder why young and dumb players didn't have closer supervision in the offseason. Like regular checkups, and a stricter training regimen.
DG had an awful season and a half, and it was likely because of the failed starter experiment without the proper buildup.
I'm happy the guy is pitching. I wish him well.
Re: Ex-Red Graves front-runner to pitch in Indians' bullpen
Quote:
Danny Graves is on a path toward making the Indians' relief staff after he was nearly exiled out of baseball last year by the Reds, some of it because of a sudden and lasting siege of ineffectiveness and more of it because of an unfortunate finger-flashing incident with a vulgar fan.
Actually, reverse the emphasis there and it would be an accurate statement.
Quote:
"Mentally, I'm back together again," he said. "I feel like I'm a baseball player again, and I haven't felt like that since before I left Cincinnati. Being in a winning atmosphere, like here, got me back on track."
Carefull, Danny, Winning brings pressure.
In all fairness, I hope Danny makes it. He was a stand up guy 99% of the time. I just feel the ill fated starting experiment trashed his arm.
Re: Ex-Red Graves front-runner to pitch in Indians' bullpen
He has a clause in his contract that if he doesn't make the 25 by April 1, he can opt out of any ties to the Indians.
Re: Ex-Red Graves front-runner to pitch in Indians' bullpen
Quote:
ome of it because of a sudden and lasting siege of ineffectiveness and more of it because of an unfortunate finger-flashing incident with a vulgar fan.
2003-2005 as a Red
Code:
DANNY GRAVES
CINCINNATI REDS
YEAR TEAM AGE W L PCT G GS CG SV GF IP H R ER BB SO ERA RSAA
2003 Reds 29 4 15 .211 30 26 2 2 3 169 204 108 100 41 60 5.33 -20
2004 Reds 30 1 6 .143 68 0 0 41 59 68.1 77 39 30 13 40 3.95 0
2005 Reds 31 1 1 .500 20 0 0 10 18 18.1 30 18 15 12 8 7.36 -6
TOTALS 6 22 .214 118 26 2 53 80 255.2 311 165 145 66 108 5.10 -26
LG AVERAGE 14 14 .502 1 22 255.2 257 132 122 97 189 4.29 0
YEAR TEAM HR H/9 BR/9 SO/9 BB/9 SO/BB SHO WP IBB HBP BFP BK NW NL
2003 Reds 30 10.86 13.42 3.20 2.18 1.46 1 2 6 7 741 0 8 11
2004 Reds 12 10.14 12.12 5.27 1.71 3.08 0 2 6 2 290 0 4 3
2005 Reds 4 14.73 20.62 3.93 5.89 0.67 0 3 3 0 99 0 1 1
TOTALS 46 10.95 13.59 3.80 2.32 1.64 1 7 15 9 1130 0 13 15
LG AVERAGE 30 9.04 12.81 6.66 3.40 1.96 0 9 9 11 1106 1
Re: Ex-Red Graves front-runner to pitch in Indians' bullpen
Yeah, his last year wasn't helped by a sub 1 SO/BB ratio either... and his K rate, which was abnormally high in '04 (for him), went back down.
Re: Ex-Red Graves front-runner to pitch in Indians' bullpen
I really hope Graves succeds. I find it the comments about the coaching very interesting.
Quote:
"Louie has made a couple of adjustments of mechanical flaws he spotted," said Graves. "When he saw me throw this spring, he said, 'That's not how you used to throw.' I'm using my legs more and I'm going straight at the the plate rather than fall off side — stuff I didn't realize I was doing or not doing."
Of the coaching help, Graves added, "I've never been around so many coaches who want to help rather than see their names in the papers. They've helped me get the movement on my fastball back and my sinker has been good. I'm getting action on my pitches again."
Make you continue to wonder what was going on with the Reds Pitching coach the last few years.
Re: Ex-Red Graves front-runner to pitch in Indians' bullpen
Quote:
Originally Posted by RedsFan75
I really hope Graves succeds. I find it the comments about the coaching very interesting.
Make you continue to wonder what was going on with the Reds Pitching coach the last few years.
In NY, the theory was he was tipping his pitches.
Danny also seems to have changed his tune regarding his pitching coach from his Reds days. Per the Post, last July:
Quote:
Graves was particularly upset at the firing of Gullett, whom he credits with much of his success in his career.
"He's had all these different guys come in during his time and they keep saying, 'Gully can fix him, Gully can fix him,'" Graves said. "Give him a top-notch guy where he doesn't have to fix him and he's going to look like a better pitching coach. I was the only one there with him for so long, there were always other guys coming in and out, in and out with him trying to fix them. There are a lot of pitching coaches that have great staffs and don't have to fix them."
OK, I sepent way too much time on a guy who doesn't pitch for the Reds anymore...when does the season start?
Re: Ex-Red Graves front-runner to pitch in Indians' bullpen
For as "highly regarded" as the Cincinnati press made Don Gullett out to be the "pitching guru", it is hard to believe he hasn't been offered a coaching job in major league baseball.
Re: Ex-Red Graves front-runner to pitch in Indians' bullpen
Quote:
Originally Posted by savafan
For as "highly regarded" as the Cincinnati press made Don Gullett out to be the "pitching guru", it is hard to believe he hasn't been offered a coaching job in major league baseball.
That does say a lot, doesn't it?
As for Graves, the way I remember it, he was starting to be ineffective as a closer BEFORE the move to the starting rotation. That was part of the reason they tried to make him a starter--he wasn't getting it done in the bullpen. (The other part of the reason they tried to make him a starter, of course, was that they were desperate for starting pitching.)
Re: Ex-Red Graves front-runner to pitch in Indians' bullpen
Quote:
Originally Posted by tsj017
That does say a lot, doesn't it?
As for Graves, the way I remember it, he was starting to be ineffective as a closer BEFORE the move to the starting rotation. That was part of the reason they tried to make him a starter--he wasn't getting it done in the bullpen. (The other part of the reason they tried to make him a starter, of course, was that they were desperate for starting pitching.)
You're exactly right.
Re: Ex-Red Graves front-runner to pitch in Indians' bullpen
I thought the Indians wanted to win ;)
