Why do Reds fans hate the Cubs?
 

I confess to not getting it, at all, but clearly the Cubs seem to be the enemy-du-jour for Reds fans. Certainly that's the take I get looking at this board's reaction to the Cubs. We disagree about lots of things around here, but most everyone seems to take particular delight in beating the Cubs.

But why the Cubs have become the new Dodgers is something that leaves me baffled.

For instance, the Reds-Dodgers rivalry was built around constantly warring for the NL West over the course of two decades. It was built around there being something at stake.

Yet what have the Reds and Cubs ever battled over? You pretty much have to go back to Hod Eller vs. Hippo Vaughn to find a time when both teams managed to be simultaneously relevant. Or maybe we're still angry about the whole King Kelly deal.

Have the Cubs had an easy-to-hate team in recent years? Well, Dusty Baker can work a nerve, but people didn't seem to hate the Giants when he spent a decade in San Francisco. Ryne Sandberg and Mark Grace were personable, easy-going guys. Sammy Sosa, roids or no, was a generally congenial, happy guy. He didn't get along with Dusty so well, but wouldn't that wind up in the plus column for most folks? Derrek Lee? Nice guy. Nomar Garciaparra? Nice guy, cute wife. Todd Walker? Hell of a nice guy. Mark Prior, Kerry Wood and Carlos Zambrano? Well, I'm jealous, but that's about it. Kyle Farnsworth? Sure he was a jerky guy, but he was a short-timer and he was right when he called the Reds a second division club.

So maybe it's the fans. I've got to admit, being from the east coast, I don't bump into a lot of Cubs fans, though the ones I've known have been generally good-natured about how lousy the franchise has been for the past half century. Maybe I'm meeting the exceptions, but I vastly prefer the pathology of the Cubs fans I've met than the Phillies fans I've known (and often am related to).

Though Cubs fans do seem to take over the GAB these days when the Baby Bears are in town. I'm not sure what's so wrong with that. So they care enough to show up. Seems to me that the GAB turning into a homefield advantage for Chicago says at least as much about Reds fans as Cubs fans.

Then there's geography. Chicago's close to Cincinnati and in the same division. Then again, Pittsburgh's closer and the Reds actually have a history with the Pirates. Plus, the Cubs have a rival. They and the Cardinals are mortal enemies. It's one of the best rivalries in sports in terms of fan intensity. Kind of bad form to be chasing after a married franchise like that. The Reds will never be more than a fling for Cubs fans. In fact the Reds might never be more than second runnerup because Milwaukee's just a hop, skip and jump away from Chi Town.

And that gets me to market size. Chicago's a big city, a cosmopolitan city, and it dominates the midwest. As I once heard someone say, "You don't fly over Chicago." Of course if you're on a Delta/Comair flight you don't fly over Cincinnati (or at least northern Kentucky, but I digress). Good or bad, Chicago teams get inordinate attention. The city has a sports media horde that probably outnumbers the sum total of the other five cities in the NL Central. So I can understand the "Shut up already about your lousy franchise" reflex. That said, small market fans making a to-do over the nearest big market is a little too much like locker room envy for my tastes. It's like saying, "Take your skyline, your nightlife and your international prominence and shove it." I've known Red Sox fans who react that way to New York, not the Yankees, the city. It always comes across as desperate and hollow when I run across it.

As you can tell, I'm still groping for why this Cubs thing has developed. I'd really like to see the Reds and Indians get in the same division somehow. Then the club would have itself a rival worth sinking your teeth into.

Re: Why do Reds fans hate the Cubs?
 

Years of attending Reds-Cubs games in Cincinnati. It's not just recent years, but for as long as I remember. They behave, in general, much differently than fans of other teams in the home park.

Re: Why do Reds fans hate the Cubs?
 

There ya have it. In Nuxhalls new book it opens with that same gripe during the 2003 season.

Same reason why the Braves were so hated early on too.

Re: Why do Reds fans hate the Cubs?
 

Cub fans are to blame, the arrogance! especially for a team that last won anything of note when Teddy Roosevelt was on office.

Re: Why do Reds fans hate the Cubs?
 

I used to like the Cubs quite a bit. Loved the atmosphere at the ballpark, I even watched lots of Cub games when I could back in the 80's on channel 55 WFFT when we got a total of 6 channels. Something happened to alter my perspective - no doubt. I attribute a lot of it to Dusty (though I too thought he was kinda cool in SF), some of it to shedding the "lovable loser" tag a bit, a some of it to me just getting older and more cynical ;) Hard to pinpoint, as you aptly described M2. And I am one of those who has "turned"...

Re: Why do Reds fans hate the Cubs?
 

Three words: "Wrigley South, baaaa-beee!"

Which is what I always end up hearing every time I have sat next to some zipper-headed, sand-blowing, mouth-breathing idiot Cub fan who bothered to make the trip to Riverfront/Cinergy/GABP to watch his beloved Cubbies play the Reds. And for what? Because the Cubs have had some sucess (albeit not recently :mooner: ) in the past against the Reds--a team with a much smaller revenue stream and a lousy FO for the past thirty years? Choker...Losers....The whole lot of 'em.

Steve Bartman..Steve Bartman..Steve Bartman..Steve Bartman..Steve Bartman..Steve Bartman..Steve Bartman..Steve Bartman..Steve Bartman..Steve Bartman..Steve Bartman..Steve Bartman..

There. I feel better.

Re: Why do Reds fans hate the Cubs?
 

They come to our ballpark...the sit there...they stand up...<SHUDDER> they cheer for their team.

Re: Why do Reds fans hate the Cubs?
 

Bingo.

Like I said in the game thread yesterday, I gritted my teeth big time when the front-running Cubs fans came to GABP and carried around big signs saying Wrigley Field South and carried on like they invented the game of baseball.

There wasn't much to be done when the Cubs beat the snot out of the Reds. Yell louder I suppose.

It does generate bad blood and it's one of those things you file away for a future date. And when that future date comes (like the season ending series last year and this latest 3 game sweep at Wrigley), it just makes it all the much sweeter.

I've got nothing against the players or Dusty. And the times when I've been to Wrigley, the fans have been friendly.

There must just be an obnoxious subset that comes to Cincinnati.

Re: Why do Reds fans hate the Cubs?
 

For me hating the Cubs doesn't have anything to do with being a Reds fan, I'd hate the Cubs even if I was a Devil Rays fan. It's how they played up the lovable loser angle for so long. Do you know what being a loverable loser makes you? A loser. They trotted out bad team after bad team after bad team, and for some reason people just ate it up. They expected to lose, and their fans didn't care. They're people who define themselves as losers and smile about it. Ugh. As long as they had Wrigley Field and Haray Caray, who cares about what the actual team does. It seems like so many people aren't fans of Cubs baseball, they're fans of the Cubs brand name, and I just find that really annoying.

Re: Why do Reds fans hate the Cubs?
 

I like the Cubs... but not there fans.

Re: Why do Reds fans hate the Cubs?
 

I know that for myself growing up I could never tell you other than in 1984 and 1989 how the cubs did in a certain season. I have been living in Chicago since 1999 and I think part of the problem is that Reds fans remember the cubs as a team that didn't spend that much on players but since 1998 they have always been a higher payroll team which has helped them make the playoffs in 98, 2000, and 2003 while we have been waiting 10+ years to get back to the postseason.

Then you also have the WGN factor in that since the owners of the Cubs happen to own their own tv network you are force fed the cubs from April to October. In this vein you have the Chip and Dip factor which I think the main reason why most of the recent cub haters have jumped on that bandwagon.

The last thing I can see is a little bit of jealousy in that the Cubs have drawn so well in the past few years at home that is now easier to get tickets for Cubs away games then it is to go to Wrigley to see them there. That coupled with the fact the reach of WGN means you will always see a lot of Cub fans attending away games. this obviously angers a lot of people but if you think about it they are putting butts in the seats at GABP which should help the Reds revenue.

Just my humble opinion

Re: Why do Reds fans hate the Cubs?
 

Other than the whole "Wrigley South" crap, has anyone else ever heard any of these little gems repeated by Cubs fans ad nauseum while watching the game? I have.....

"Look at all of the Northsiders here...We own this joint!"

"We oughta buy Reds season tickets. The tickets are much easier to get here--than they are at the Confines."

"They ain't gonna try to run on Sammy's arm ( :confused: )...."

Re: Why do Reds fans hate the Cubs?
 

I have always disliked the Cubs, even way way back when I was a Yankee fan.

I think part of it is the loveable losers tag... they are losers, but they're not very loveable. Most I've run into (here and at Wrigley) are not very nice.

Plus, for a team that hasn't done squat in a whole lot of years, they still draw a ton of media attention. I've never understood why.

And, I think their old, stinky park (literally, on the inside anyway) is waaaay overrated.

Re: Why do Reds fans hate the Cubs?
 

I agree with TB, but I'm shocked at these former yankee fan revelations :help:

Re: Why do Reds fans hate the Cubs?
 

I'm sorry? but it sounded like you just said: "when I was a Yankee fan"... :eek:

Uhm. Okay. We'll be needing to get that Barbie backpack from you when you have a chance.... ;)