RedsZone.com - Cincinnati Reds Fans' Home for Baseball Discussion
Page 1 of 2 1 2
Show 40 post(s) from this thread on one page

RedsZone.com - Cincinnati Reds Fans' Home for Baseball Discussion (http://www.redszone.com/forums/index.php)
-   The Old Red Guard (http://www.redszone.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=7)
-   -   Red Sox, Pineiro agree to preliminary $4 million deal (http://www.redszone.com/forums/showthread.php?t=53708)

Spitball 01-03-2007 07:40 PM
Red Sox, Pineiro agree to preliminary $4 million deal
 
Red Sox, Pineiro agree to preliminary $4 million deal By Jerry Crasnick
ESPN.com


Pitcher Joel Pineiro has reached preliminary agreement on a one-year deal for a guaranteed $4 million with the Boston Red Sox, multiple baseball sources said Wednesday.

The contract is contingent on Pineiro passing a physical exam later this week, the sources said. The deal includes a player option for 2008 and $2 million in performance bonuses based on games finished, according to The Associated Press.

Pineiro, who pitched exclusively as a starter during his last four seasons with Seattle, is expected to work out of the bullpen for Boston. He could be given a chance to compete for the team's closer's job in spring training.

Jonathan Papelbon, who saved 35 games as a rookie for the Red Sox before going down with shoulder problems, is expected to move to the starting rotation in 2007. Veterans Mike Timlin and Julian Tavarez and youngsters Manny Delcarmen and Craig Hansen could also be in the mix for the closer's job when the Red Sox arrive in spring training in Fort Myers, Fla., in February.

Pineiro, 28, went a combined 30-18 for the Mariners in 2002-03, but has tailed off badly over the last three seasons. His ERA has risen from 3.78 to 6.36 since the 2003 season, and his ratio of strikeouts per nine innings has declined from 7.10 to 4.73 over the past three years.

Some scouts, however, think that Pineiro can do a better job of maintaining his velocity and effectiveness in shorter doses out of the bullpen.

Pineiro made a base salary of $6.8 million last season, but became a free agent in December when the Mariners declined to offer him a contract rather than have him go to salary arbitration.

While the Red Sox have considered the idea of using Papelbon as a closer again next year, they're leaning strongly toward pitching him in the rotation. Red Sox officials think that Papelbon has a better chance of staying healthy and having a more productive future as a starter.

Even with Pineiro in the bullpen, Boston currently has six starters -- Curt Schilling, Josh Beckett, Tim Wakefield, Daisuke Matsuzaka, Papelbon and Jon Lester.

edabbs44 01-03-2007 08:48 PM
Re: Red Sox, Pineiro agree to preliminary $4 million deal
 
Not sure why he wasn't pursued instead of the Geriatric Gang.

pedro 01-03-2007 08:51 PM
Re: Red Sox, Pineiro agree to preliminary $4 million deal
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by edabbs44 (Post 1221582)
Not sure why he wasn't pursued instead of the Geriatric Gang.

Are you kidding? If The Reds signed Piniero, RZ would meltdown. Hell, we already have him in the form of Kyle Lohse (who is better IMO) and everyone is freaking out that we haven't cut him.

Falls City Beer 01-03-2007 08:52 PM
Re: Red Sox, Pineiro agree to preliminary $4 million deal
 
Pineiro blows corn. He'll be a disaster in Boston.

pedro 01-03-2007 08:52 PM
Re: Red Sox, Pineiro agree to preliminary $4 million deal
 
Code:
EASON        TEAM        G        GS        CG        SHO        IP        H        R        ER        HR        BB        SO        W        L        SV        HLD        BLSV        ERA
2000        Sea        8        1        0        0        19.1        25        13        12        3        13        10        1        0        0        0        --        5.59
2001        Sea        17        11        0        0        75.1        50        24        17        2        21        56        6        2        0        2        --        2.03
2002        Sea        37        28        2        1        194.1        189        75        70        24        54        136        14        7        0        3        --        3.24
2003        Sea        32        32        3        2        211.2        192        94        89        19        76        151        16        11        0        0        --        3.78
2004        Sea        21        21        1        0        140.2        144        77        73        21        43        111        6        11        0        0        --        4.67
2005        Sea        30        30        2        0        189.0        224        118        118        23        56        107        7        11        0        0        --        5.62
2006        Sea        40        25        1        0        165.2        209        123        117        23        64        87        8        13        1        4        1        6.36

Heath 01-03-2007 08:52 PM
Re: Red Sox, Pineiro agree to preliminary $4 million deal
 
$4 Mill for PINEIRO?

Maybe FCB is right - maybe there IS a market for Milton.

edabbs44 01-03-2007 08:53 PM
Re: Red Sox, Pineiro agree to preliminary $4 million deal
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by pedro (Post 1221585)
Are you kidding? If The Reds signed Piniero, RZ would meltdown. Hell, we already have him in the form of Kyle Lohse (who is better IMO) and everyone is freaking out that we haven't cut him.
He is going to be in the pen. For $1.5 million more, I'd rather have someone who hits 90 on the gun over Stanton.

pedro 01-03-2007 08:56 PM
Re: Red Sox, Pineiro agree to preliminary $4 million deal
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by edabbs44 (Post 1221589)
He is going to be in the pen. For $1.5 million more, I'd rather have someone who hits 90 on the gun over Stanton.
speed doesn't matter if you can't pitch. I'd rather the Reds not spend 4 million to find out if a guy can even cut it in the pen.

edabbs44 01-03-2007 09:23 PM
Re: Red Sox, Pineiro agree to preliminary $4 million deal
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by pedro (Post 1221590)
speed doesn't matter if you can't pitch. I'd rather the Reds not spend 4 million to find out if a guy can even cut it in the pen.
And do what with it, sign another 40 year old soft tosser? This team is going nowhere fast and I'd rather see then try and get someone with upside rather than signing pitchers who are one 88 MPH "heater" away from TJ surgery (i.e., Mercker, Guardado, etc).

Listen, I don't think Pineiro would be the smartest signing to pull off (that would have been Dotel) but I'm kind of getting desperate. I'd rather see someone who has a shot at turning into something good than watching Stanton throw dribblers to the plate for 2 years.

Pineiro could be a complete bust, or he could be Joe Nathan. We shall see.

pedro 01-03-2007 09:38 PM
Re: Red Sox, Pineiro agree to preliminary $4 million deal
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by edabbs44 (Post 1221607)
And do what with it, sign another 40 year old soft tosser? This team is going nowhere fast and I'd rather see then try and get someone with upside rather than signing pitchers who are one 88 MPH "heater" away from TJ surgery (i.e., Mercker, Guardado, etc).

Listen, I don't think Pineiro would be the smartest signing to pull off (that would have been Dotel) but I'm kind of getting desperate. I'd rather see someone who has a shot at turning into something good than watching Stanton throw dribblers to the plate for 2 years.

Pineiro could be a complete bust, or he could be Joe Nathan. We shall see.

Joe Nathan? That's funny. Now, I'm not enamored of Stanton either but signing a guy like Piniero to a 4 million contract with the hopes that he might not SUCK in the bullpen is the kind of risk that only teams like the Red Sox can make. As for Dotel, I'm not a big proponent of giving 5 million to a guy who has only pitched 24 innings the last 2 years. The fact that he ended up with KC tells me that no one else was willing to take that kind of risk.

edabbs44 01-03-2007 10:17 PM
Re: Red Sox, Pineiro agree to preliminary $4 million deal
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by pedro (Post 1221611)
Joe Nathan? That's funny. Now, I'm not enamored of Stanton either but signing a guy like Piniero to a 4 million contract with the hopes that he might not SUCK in the bullpen is the kind of risk that only teams like the Red Sox can make. As for Dotel, I'm not a big proponent of giving 5 million to a guy who has only pitched 24 innings the last 2 years. The fact that he ended up with KC tells me that no one else was willing to take that kind of risk.
Why is Joe Nathan funny?

Nathan: age 24-25 as a starter: 109 walks in 183 2/3 innings.
Gagne: age 24-25 as a starter: ERAs of 5.15 and 4.75.
Mariano: age 25 as a starter: 19 games, 10 games started, 5.51 ERA.

Sometimes all it takes is a move to the bullpen. You can laugh at the names I just mentioned, but why couldn't it happen to Pineiro? It's a longshot, but I would have taken the risk over Stanton, Weathers, Cormier, etc. In two years these guys will be glue. If Pineiro pans out and Cincy is out of it, he would be a hot commodity at the deadline. If he bombs Cincy is still in 4th place, at best, with or without him. Good luck trying to deal the three old guys for more than Brendan Harris-type players when the deadline comes. Esspecially with those attractive 2 year deals.

http://www.balochvoice.com/Pictures/...ee_old_men.jpg

reds44 01-03-2007 10:24 PM
Re: Red Sox, Pineiro agree to preliminary $4 million deal
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by pedro (Post 1221587)
Code:
EASON        TEAM        G        GS        CG        SHO        IP        H        R        ER        HR        BB        SO        W        L        SV        HLD        BLSV        ERA
2000        Sea        8        1        0        0        19.1        25        13        12        3        13        10        1        0        0        0        --        5.59
2001        Sea        17        11        0        0        75.1        50        24        17        2        21        56        6        2        0        2        --        2.03
2002        Sea        37        28        2        1        194.1        189        75        70        24        54        136        14        7        0        3        --        3.24
2003        Sea        32        32        3        2        211.2        192        94        89        19        76        151        16        11        0        0        --        3.78
2004        Sea        21        21        1        0        140.2        144        77        73        21        43        111        6        11        0        0        --        4.67
2005        Sea        30        30        2        0        189.0        224        118        118        23        56        107        7        11        0        0        --        5.62
2006        Sea        40        25        1        0        165.2        209        123        117        23        64        87        8        13        1        4        1        6.36
What happend to him? Roids?

edabbs44 01-03-2007 10:24 PM
Re: Red Sox, Pineiro agree to preliminary $4 million deal
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by reds44 (Post 1221626)
What happend to him? Roids?
Elbow.

pedro 01-03-2007 10:34 PM
Re: Red Sox, Pineiro agree to preliminary $4 million deal
 
Joe Nathan's problem was walks, not that he gave up a ton of hits, but as he did get converted to a reliever after getting hurt I can kind of see your point.

Pineiro hasn't been hurt the last 2 years, he's just sucked. I don't see that turning around just by virtue moving to the bullpen.

Maybe I'm wrong though, a quick look at his split stats show he was pretty good pitches 1-30. But he still gave up a lot of walks pitches 1-30. We'll see.

Another thing you have to consider is a 4 million $, one year contract probably wouldn't have gotten him to Cincinnati.

edabbs44 01-03-2007 10:59 PM
Re: Red Sox, Pineiro agree to preliminary $4 million deal
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by pedro (Post 1221632)
Joe Nathan's problem was walks, not that he gave up a ton of hits, but as he did get converted to a reliever after getting hurt I can kind of see your point.

Pineiro hasn't been hurt the last 2 years, he's just sucked. I don't see that turning around just by virtue moving to the bullpen.

Maybe I'm wrong though, a quick look at his split stats show he was pretty good pitches 1-30. But he still gave up a lot of walks pitches 1-30. We'll see.

Another thing you have to consider is a 4 million $, one year contract probably wouldn't have gotten him to Cincinnati.
Agreed...it's tough to compete with Boston. But this FO has to do something to make Cincy a little more enticing. It's a vicious cycle that may never end.


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 05:46 AM.
Page 1 of 2 1 2
Show 40 post(s) from this thread on one page

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2013, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.