Around 18% of the 2012 Payroll
 

Will be tied up in 2 players who actually are not MLB caliber. $6.5 Mill for Rolen and $7 Million for Arroyo. That is tough for a team with a 75-80 M payroll to stomach.

Re: Around 18% of the 2012 Payroll
 

Arroyo makes $12M in '12 according to Cot's.

This argument is neverending.

If Rolen is healthy and returns to form with a respectable offensive output, factor in his GG defense and leadership, and he'll be worth every bit of $7M.

If Arroyo pitches like 2009 & 2010........both seasons sub-4.00 e.r.a.'s with 15 to 17 wins, then he is worth it too.

Both players have track records that leave open the possibility they could return to form. And Arroyo suffered the lingering effects of Mono all season, and Rolen wasn't healthy.

Never say never.

Re: Around 18% of the 2012 Payroll
 

It certainly could be worse. We'll have far less if any going towards Cordero, and once upon a time Harang was making 12 million for even worse production than what Arroyo gave us this season. Arroyo's history says that he's likely to bounce back, and Rolen is only one injury-filled season removed from being a gold glover, all-star, and unanimous team leader. I'd rather have that than the 18 million that the Astros have sunk into Carlos Lee for this season.

Re: Around 18% of the 2012 Payroll
 

Not MLB caliber? Really and your basis for that call is what?

Re: Around 18% of the 2012 Payroll
 

Arroyo makes 7 Mill next year...not 12.

What classifies Rolen/Arroyo as non MLB caliber players?


Well, in Rolens last 450 At bats dating to the ASB of 2010...Rolen is hitting .249 with a .715 OPS, 8 Homers and 56 RBI.

That is hiorrible.


Arroyo has given up more HOmers than anyone in the game. HOw do you just ignore this?

Re: Around 18% of the 2012 Payroll
 

Pretty much 2012 in a nutshell. If they both bounce strong the Reds will contend. If they both reprise their 2011 seasons the Reds will struggle. How these two perform next season is a fairly good litmus test of things to come.

Re: Around 18% of the 2012 Payroll
 

Again, not according to Cot's (click on the following link): https://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?...0E&output=html

In David Wright's last 380 at bats, he's hitting .255 with a .755 OPS, 14 Homers and 59 rbi. And he's making $14 million. So what's your point?

Oh yeah, both guys have been injured alot in that time span. But we won't bring that astounding fact into the argument. Hmmm.

We ignore this pretty much the same way you ignore the fact that Bronson had lingering effects from mononucleosis all season. In 2009 and 2010 he won 15+ games and had sub-4.00 e.r.a.'s. But let's not bring facts into the argument.

Re: Around 18% of the 2012 Payroll
 

Neither were 100% healthy, when healthy look at their numbers. Unlike you I understand the importance of health when it comes to playing sports....I guess you don't. What was Bronson's numbers in 2010 and 2009 when he was healthy? How about Rolen?

Re: Around 18% of the 2012 Payroll
 

Cutting lose Cordero and spreading that money on a new bullpen would be great. I like Chapman as a closer. Can just come in an throw hard fastballs, intimidating and would justify his salary. Closers make a lot of money. I'm not the GM nor am I a scout.

Re: Around 18% of the 2012 Payroll
 

Darn. I heard Mike Brown was looking for a GM or a scout. :thumbup:

Re: Around 18% of the 2012 Payroll
 

I would be shocked if Cordero isn't back next year...