Originally Posted by Chip R
The only manager I've heard of that was fired over pitch counts was Grady Little.
If Wayne wants to make his managers keep his pitchers on pitch counts and make them accountable to follow it, that's fine. But if he doesn't, how can you blame a manager for that?
This is a classic trade off between short term and long term success.
Pete, and Krivsky (Kriv to maybe a lesser degree) are both in "win-now" mode. They have been directed by Cast to win now. Pete's future directly depends on finishing as close as he can get to the top of the dismal NL Central. Because if he does that and the Reds don't want him, there are other teams out there who have seen what he has done.
The Reds managers this year, and in years past, have not had the relief pitching available to get a guy like Harang out of the game after 100 pitches or so, or they have not had the foresight to do so anyway. Probably a combination of both- especially in Narron's case.
Short term success would lead one to keep a guy in there an extra inning or so. But when you look at mbgrayson's stats from above, that's not really a winning strategy, either.
Long term success would mean getting the SP out of there at a responsible pitch number, saving his arm for the next time around, and hopefully for years after that as well. It might cost you a game here and there, especially if you have a weak bullpen.
This directive, of taking the long view, needs to come directly from the top.
The Reds have invested a ton of money in the right arms of Harang and Arroyo. They have solid statistical evidence of how poorly they both pitch after 110 pitches or so, and in Arroyo's case how it affects him for the next 3-4 starts.
Castellini and Krivsky need to make sure the manager, whomever it is, does the right thing.