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Thread: 2013 Golf Season Thread

  1. #316
    Waitin til next year bucksfan2's Avatar
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    Re: 2013 Golf Season Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by MWM View Post
    This tournament highlighted one of the downsides to the USGA approach. The 18th hole didn't have a birdie in the last 2 rounds. So here you have Mickelson standing on 18 needing a birdie to tie, yet we knew there was no chance it could happen. To me, that's going too far and makes for boring golf. They need to find a little more balance between requiring precision and allowing a player an opportunity to take a risk if he needs to make a birdie or two.
    If 18 would have been listed as a short par 5 would that have made 18 more dramatic?

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  3. #317
    First Time Caller SunDeck's Avatar
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    Re: 2013 Golf Season Thread

    I don't consider it the best test, just brutal. And that's fine with me for one time a year. But it's a valid point, there's no point in having no real risk/reward element on the 18th hole. Or any hole for that matter.
    Next Reds manager, second shooter. --Confirmed on Redszone.

  4. #318
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    Re: 2013 Golf Season Thread

    If the Reds continually finished 2nd behind the Cardinals, year after year, while arguably having more talent, you guys would be singing a different tune. But for some reason Phil is seen as this sympathetic, tragic figure who gets more praise for losing than most golfers get for winning. Just listen to the talk shows today. Much more talk about "poor Phil" than the actual winner, Justin Rose. Phil missed a ton of makeable putts the entire week. If he just hits 10% of those he runs away from the field. He had 37 putts in the final round alone, the most of any player in the field. You can insert whatever word you want in place of "choke" but the bottom line is he led every round and it was his tourney to win, and once again he found a way to lose.
    "I talked to an advance scout that told me if Joey Votto and Albert Pujols were on the same team he'd advise his team to do the unthinkable...pitch around Votto to get to Pujols." - Buster Olney, ESPN

  5. #319
    Pre-tty, pre-tty good!! MWM's Avatar
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    Re: 2013 Golf Season Thread

    NYR, I'm not sure you can appreciate how odd all that sounds. Phil has won 4 professional major championships. Do you know how many golfers in the history of the game have won more than that?

    Answer: 14

    Any idea how many of those 14 are currently competing on one of the major tours? One - Tiger Woods.

    Phil has won 41 times on the PGA TOUR. Guess how many have won more than that in the history of golf.... 8. Phil is 9th all time. If you still consider Vijay active (he hasn't won in years), then he's the next closest with 34. After thatyou have Ernie Els with 19. That's correct, Phil over twice as many PGA TOUR wins as the next closest guy to him (excluding Vijay who isn't relevant anyway).

    After Ernie, you have Furyk with 16. There are a small group of guys currently playing who have won more than 10 times. Because they play over 40 tournaments a year, it's easy to forget just how hard it is to win on the PGA TOUR, or in major championships. The vast majority of guys who play the TOUR never win.....ever. Any given week on TOUR, there are around 170 golfers teeing it up. The level of skill required to even be in this group at all is beyond what most of can comprehend. And a VERY high percentage of those guys will never win a PGA TOUR golf tournament. Not a single one.

    Yet Phil has won 41 times, including 4 majors. Sorry, but your argument holds no water at all, IMO.

    The whole "if he just made 10% of those" is not applicable to golf because they ALL miss those. If every golfer made just 10% more of their make-able putts, you'd probably have about the exact same results as you have now. And even if Phil misses more of those than most guys, he also makes more of the more difficult putts than they do. Golf is nothing like baseball. Not even close. You can't compare them.
    Last edited by MWM; 06-17-2013 at 04:51 PM.
    Grape works as a soda. Sort of as a gum. I wonder why it doesn't work as a pie. Grape pie? There's no grape pie. - Larry David

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    Homer Bailey (06-24-2013), Puffy (06-17-2013), Razor Shines (06-17-2013), TSJ55 (06-17-2013)

  7. #320
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    Re: 2013 Golf Season Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by MWM View Post
    NYR, I'm not sure you can appreciate how odd all that sounds. Phil has won 4 professional major championships. Do you know how many golfers in the history of the game have won more than that?

    Answer: 14

    Any idea how many of those 14 are currently competing on one of the major tours? One - Tiger Woods.

    Phil has won 41 times on the PGA TOUR. Guess how many have won more than that in the history of golf.... 8. Phil is 9th all time. If you still consider Vijay active (he hasn't won in years), then he's the next closest with 34. After thatyou have Ernie Els with 19. That's correct, Phil over twice as many PGA TOUR wins as the next closest guy to him (excluding Vijay who isn't relevant anyway).

    After Ernie, you have Furyk with 16. There are a small group of guys currently playing who have won more than 10 times. Because they play over 40 tournaments a year, it's easy to forget just how hard it is to win on the PGA TOUR, or in major championships. The vast majority of guys who play the TOUR never win.....ever. Any given week on TOUR, there are around 170 golfers teeing it up. The level of skill required to even be in this group at all is beyond what most of can comprehend. And a VERY high percentage of those guys will never win a PGA TOUR golf tournament. Not a single one.

    Yet Phil has won 41 times, including 4 majors. Sorry, but your argument holds no water at all, IMO.

    The whole "if he just made 10% of those" is not applicable to golf because they ALL miss those. If every golfer made just 10% more of their make-able putts, you'd probably have about the exact same results as you have now. And even if Phil misses more of those than most guys, he also makes more of the more difficult putts than they do. Golf is nothing like baseball. Not even close. You can't compare them.
    I'm well aware of everything you posted. It doesn't change my opinion. I was referring to his numerous US Open failures, so nothing else you posted applies. I'm a golfer and I've watched Phil's entire career. I didn't just start watching yesterday. It seems this site is the only place that doesn't think Phil has choked away multiple chances to win the US Open. As for "everyone" missing all those putts, that just isn't true. Check the stats for the tournament. No one missed as many makeable putts as Phil did. Not even close.

    Again, if the Reds led the entire season, year after year, with arguably more talent, but lost the division every time to the Cardinals in September, you guys wouldn't have the same opinion of the Reds as you have of Phil's US Open failures. The fact is, Phil has become a sympathetic figure in the sport because of all the US Open losses. I wonder if you guys would have the same sympathy for the Reds. I don't think so.
    "I talked to an advance scout that told me if Joey Votto and Albert Pujols were on the same team he'd advise his team to do the unthinkable...pitch around Votto to get to Pujols." - Buster Olney, ESPN

  8. #321
    Bread Gloves Razor Shines's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by New York Red View Post
    I'm well aware of everything you posted. It doesn't change my opinion. I was referring to his numerous US Open failures, so nothing else you posted applies. I'm a golfer and I've watched Phil's entire career. I didn't just start watching yesterday. It seems this site is the only place that doesn't think Phil has choked away multiple chances to win the US Open. As for "everyone" missing all those putts, that just isn't true. Check the stats for the tournament. No one missed as many makeable putts as Phil did. Not even close.

    Again, if the Reds led the entire season, year after year, with arguably more talent, but lost the division every time to the Cardinals in September, you guys wouldn't have the same opinion of the Reds as you have of Phil's US Open failures. The fact is, Phil has become a sympathetic figure in the sport because of all the US Open losses. I wonder if you guys would have the same sympathy for the Reds. I don't think so.
    I think that actually speaks well for RZ. Most sports sites suck and "choker" gets tossed around way too frequently. "Phil choked" makes sense if you don't think about it too much and I like that the majority opinion here is that he really didn't choke. "Choking" becomes a catch all because most sports fans want a reason for why someone or some team lost and "randomness/unlucky" or "they just got beat" isn't as satisfying.

    I don't think anyone here is in that "poor Phil" camp either. That also doesn't make sense. We don't feel bad for Phil he had his chances and played ok but Rose was better. I don't think he choked but I don't feel bad for him either.

  9. #322
    Pre-tty, pre-tty good!! MWM's Avatar
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    Re: 2013 Golf Season Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by New York Red View Post
    I was referring to his numerous US Open failures
    That's fine, but you've changed your tune a little. Earlier you said Phil does not have the clutch gene. That's what I was responding to.
    Grape works as a soda. Sort of as a gum. I wonder why it doesn't work as a pie. Grape pie? There's no grape pie. - Larry David

  10. #323
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    Re: 2013 Golf Season Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by MWM View Post
    That's fine, but you've changed your tune a little. Earlier you said Phil does not have the clutch gene. That's what I was responding to.
    I posted it right after the US Open ended, so I assumed that part was understood. Anyway, I've given my take and I'm moving on. As always, all opinions appreciated, guys. Looking forward to the British Open. Now that Justin Rose has his major, I'd like to see another first-time major winner at Muirfield. Preferably an American, but if not, maybe Jason Day. I really like his game and demeanor.
    "I talked to an advance scout that told me if Joey Votto and Albert Pujols were on the same team he'd advise his team to do the unthinkable...pitch around Votto to get to Pujols." - Buster Olney, ESPN

  11. #324
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    Re: 2013 Golf Season Thread

    Professional Major Championships - Runner-up finishes

    Jack Nicklaus 19
    Arnold Palmer 10
    Greg Norman 8
    Sam Snead 8
    Tom Watson 8
    Phil Mickelson 8

    Pretty good company
    Everything that can be counted does not necessarily count; everything that counts cannot necessarily be counted.

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    Re: 2013 Golf Season Thread

    Mishap.
    Last edited by New York Red; 06-18-2013 at 09:42 AM.
    "I talked to an advance scout that told me if Joey Votto and Albert Pujols were on the same team he'd advise his team to do the unthinkable...pitch around Votto to get to Pujols." - Buster Olney, ESPN

  13. #326
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    Re: 2013 Golf Season Thread

    Mishap ... Grrrr
    Last edited by New York Red; 06-18-2013 at 09:43 AM.
    "I talked to an advance scout that told me if Joey Votto and Albert Pujols were on the same team he'd advise his team to do the unthinkable...pitch around Votto to get to Pujols." - Buster Olney, ESPN

  14. #327
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    Re: 2013 Golf Season Thread

    Mishap ... Grrrrr
    Last edited by New York Red; 06-18-2013 at 09:43 AM.
    "I talked to an advance scout that told me if Joey Votto and Albert Pujols were on the same team he'd advise his team to do the unthinkable...pitch around Votto to get to Pujols." - Buster Olney, ESPN

  15. #328
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    Re: 2013 Golf Season Thread

    Wow!! Threebie!! Good work NYR.

    Yep, Tiger has been feast or famine a lot of times. Not really good at coming from behind to win. I'll defend him a little though: When he was playing well back in the day he was blowing people's doors clean off and there was really no other golfer around to challenge him. Finishing 2nd wasn't really an option.

    Jack had true rivals like Palmer, Travino, Watson, Palmer, and Johnny Miller for a few years there.
    Everything that can be counted does not necessarily count; everything that counts cannot necessarily be counted.

    All the dishes rattle in the cupboards when the elephants arrive

  16. #329
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    Re: 2013 Golf Season Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by TSJ55 View Post
    Wow!! Threebie!! Good work NYR.
    LOL ... what the heck? I kept getting an error message, then the site just went down. I come back a few minutes later to a three-peat? Embarrassing.

    Guess I better do some editing.
    "I talked to an advance scout that told me if Joey Votto and Albert Pujols were on the same team he'd advise his team to do the unthinkable...pitch around Votto to get to Pujols." - Buster Olney, ESPN

  17. #330
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    Re: 2013 Golf Season Thread

    OMG, I accidentally edited all three.
    "I talked to an advance scout that told me if Joey Votto and Albert Pujols were on the same team he'd advise his team to do the unthinkable...pitch around Votto to get to Pujols." - Buster Olney, ESPN


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