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Thread: Keith Law ranks Cardinals No. 1 farm system in MLB

  1. #16
    Five Tool Fool jojo's Avatar
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    Re: Keith Law ranks Cardinals No. 1 farm system in MLB

    Quote Originally Posted by MikeThierry View Post
    I think what Law is saying is that rumors of the Cardinals demise due to age are not true, to the chagrin of some of the posters here on this board who spread that rumor.
    Calves on the pasture aren't filet mignon on the plate.....
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    Re: Keith Law ranks Cardinals No. 1 farm system in MLB

    In case folks missed it, John Sickels released his system rankings last week. He also had the Cardinals first and had the Reds at 15.
    http://www.minorleagueball.com/2013/...ystem-rankings

    1) St. Louis Cardinals (ranked #5 last year): Strengths: Everything. They have pitching, hitting, high upside, and depth. They have a proven track record of player development. Weaknesses: none really. They could use a shortstop with a better bat but so could most teams.

    15) Cincinnati Reds (21): Strengths: pitching at the top with Robert Stephenson, Dan Corcino, Tony Cingrani and additional arms to back them up. Weaknesses: offense, once you get past Billy Hamilton and Jesse Winker though there are some bats at the lower levels that could develop. As with Arizona, this is a solid system in a transition phase and ranking here is no insult.

  5. #18
    Salukifan2
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    Re: Keith Law ranks Cardinals No. 1 farm system in MLB

    Cards farm system lacks a good power right handed bat. The best is probably Piscotty or Garcia and both of them are in high-A. I'm not sure i've ever seen a system have as many good right handed pitchers come through in as little time as the cards are about too though.

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    Re: Keith Law ranks Cardinals No. 1 farm system in MLB

    Quote Originally Posted by jojo View Post
    Calves on the pasture aren't filet mignon on the plate.....
    Just ask the A's with Van Poppel, Dressendorfer and Slusarski, or the Mets with Wilson, Pulispher and Isringhausen, or the Royals pretty much for the last decade.

    I'm excited to see O. Taveras, but history has not been kind to pitching prospects in general, and the heart of the Cards' Crown Jewels are pitchers.

  7. #20
    Salukifan2
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    Re: Keith Law ranks Cardinals No. 1 farm system in MLB

    All due respect to those guys, all the cards top pitching prospects are flame throwers. That doesn't necessarily mean they are going to be hall of famers or anything but if you can throw 98mph with decent command you will at minimum be an effective relief pitcher, barring injury.

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    Re: Keith Law ranks Cardinals No. 1 farm system in MLB

    Quote Originally Posted by Salukifan2 View Post
    All due respect to those guys, all the cards top pitching prospects are flame throwers. That doesn't necessarily mean they are going to be hall of famers or anything but if you can throw 98mph with decent command you will at minimum be an effective relief pitcher, barring injury.
    I agree, and that's a healthy way to look at it. I just wouldn't count the Cardinal future rotation to be set at this point.

    Btw, all the guys I listed above were flame throwers too.

  9. #22
    Salukifan2
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    Re: Keith Law ranks Cardinals No. 1 farm system in MLB

    I think cardinal fans are so, perhaps overly, excited because the last 4 pitchers that have brought up (Rosie, Miller, Lynn, and Kelly) dazzled at times and were all very effective in their roles as rookies.

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    Member Wonderful Monds's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Salukifan2 View Post
    All due respect to those guys, all the cards top pitching prospects are flame throwers. That doesn't necessarily mean they are going to be hall of famers or anything but if you can throw 98mph with decent command you will at minimum be an effective relief pitcher, barring injury.
    Don't know so much about that last part. There are plenty of hard throwing relievers who get knocked around because they don't know what they're doing or it's straight as an arrow.
    They don't think it be like it is, but it do.
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    He has also taught me that even when the Reds win it is important to focus on the fact that they could have lost.

  11. #24
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    Re: Keith Law ranks Cardinals No. 1 farm system in MLB

    Obviously there are many that don't pan out, but many of their top pitching prospects have spent time on the big league roster during a pennant race and during a 7 game NLCS and they flourished in those roles. Obviously, not proof that they are going to be superstars, but certainly something to be excited about.

  12. #25
    Moderator Tommyjohn25's Avatar
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    Re: Keith Law ranks Cardinals No. 1 farm system in MLB

    Quote Originally Posted by Salukifan2 View Post
    Obviously there are many that don't pan out, but many of their top pitching prospects have spent time on the big league roster during a pennant race and during a 7 game NLCS and they flourished in those roles. Obviously, not proof that they are going to be superstars, but certainly something to be excited about.
    They undoubtedly looked to have a ton of promise during the regular season and playoffs. Miller and Rosenthal both looked electric, at times. The real truth will lie in how they adjust to the league adjusting to them.
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    Re: Keith Law ranks Cardinals No. 1 farm system in MLB

    Quote Originally Posted by Salukifan2 View Post
    I think cardinal fans are so, perhaps overly, excited because the last 4 pitchers that have brought up (Rosie, Miller, Lynn, and Kelly) dazzled at times and were all very effective in their roles as rookies.
    For the record, Lynn and Kelly aren't prospects anymore, they are bonafide major leaguers, which is better. I really like Kelly, love his fastball. He could be a solid #3-5 starter for years, imo. Lynn seems headed to the pen for most his career, not a bad thing, but not nearly as valuable as Kelly.

    I actually like Rosenthal better than Miller. I wasn't impressed with Miller. He was hit hard time the second time anyone saw him. I don't see him as anything better than Kelly, and I wouldn't be surprised if Kelly has a better career.

    Still, a very nice batch of young arms, even if none of them become a Top of the Rotation starter.
    "Man, the pitch looks fast, even in slow motion." Thom Brennaman on Chapman's fastball.

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    MikeThierry (02-04-2013)

  15. #27
    Salukifan2
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    Re: Keith Law ranks Cardinals No. 1 farm system in MLB

    Kelly was a rookie this season, and he was called up from double-A midseason. So while he isn't "technically" a prospect i still kinda consider him one. I agree that Lynn is best suited as a set up man or closer.

    I believe the Miller outing your talking about was the one in San Diego, after i saw that, i was also concerned. However, his start on the final day of the season against the Reds changed my mind, and then in the playoffs he was very good. He was also way too small last season, the cards told him to gain weight this offseason and apparently he has put on about 20 lbs which should help him get his velocity back up and have it stay up.

    100% agree on Rosenthal. I've said it on here before, but ill say it again, i think Rosenthal has the potential to be the next Verlander.

  16. #28
    Member MikeThierry's Avatar
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    Re: Keith Law ranks Cardinals No. 1 farm system in MLB

    Quote Originally Posted by 757690 View Post
    For the record, Lynn and Kelly aren't prospects anymore, they are bonafide major leaguers, which is better. I really like Kelly, love his fastball. He could be a solid #3-5 starter for years, imo. Lynn seems headed to the pen for most his career, not a bad thing, but not nearly as valuable as Kelly.

    I actually like Rosenthal better than Miller. I wasn't impressed with Miller. He was hit hard time the second time anyone saw him. I don't see him as anything better than Kelly, and I wouldn't be surprised if Kelly has a better career.

    Still, a very nice batch of young arms, even if none of them become a Top of the Rotation starter.
    If you like Rosenthal, you'll probably love Carlos Martinez as well. He sort of gets left out of the equation because he's very young but people who have seen him compare his mechanics and his stuff to Pedro. He might turn out to be the crown jewel pitcher in the organization in a couple of years. He needs to add some weight though in my opinion.

    People are right to say that it's unproven talent but if they hit on just one of these guys, the Cards are pretty much set in their rotation for years to come in my opinion.

    EDIT: Carlos Martinez's fastball, to put in perspective, is supposed to be on par or slightly better than Rosenthal's.
    Last edited by MikeThierry; 02-04-2013 at 10:18 PM.
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    Re: Keith Law ranks Cardinals No. 1 farm system in MLB

    Quote Originally Posted by Salukifan2 View Post
    Cards farm system lacks a good power right handed bat. The best is probably Piscotty or Garcia and both of them are in high-A. I'm not sure i've ever seen a system have as many good right handed pitchers come through in as little time as the cards are about too though.
    They also lack a stud SS. I'm not too worried about 2B because I firmly believe that Wong will win that job in Spring Training from Daniel Descalso. Matheny and Mozeliak said it was his job to lose and Wong is arguably the best 2B prospect in the minors right now.

    If push comes to shove, I wouldn't be shocked if the Cards trade some of their chips for a high end SS mid-season.

    EDIT: Baseball America also rated the Cards system as #1 for 2013.

    http://www.stltoday.com/sports/baseb...836de8b3a.html
    Last edited by MikeThierry; 02-04-2013 at 10:14 PM.
    “Our next home stand follows this road trip.”

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    Re: Keith Law ranks Cardinals No. 1 farm system in MLB

    The rankings seemed pretty accurate to me. I personally was glad to see a club at the top of the list this year was at the bottom just 6 years ago.

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