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View Poll Results: Is Carpenter a Hall of Famer?

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  • Yes

    2 3.08%
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  • On the fence

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Thread: Hall of Fame worthy? ....

  1. #1
    Flash the leather! _Sir_Charles_'s Avatar
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    Hall of Fame worthy? ....

    I know it's possible his career isn't over, but Chris Carpenter. I can't stand the guy myself, but what say you Redszone....HoF career?
    Chapman to the rotation!!!! Do it already!!!!

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  3. #2
    breath westofyou's Avatar
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    Re: Hall of Fame worthy? ....

    Not in a million years

  4. #3
    Beer is good!! George Anderson's Avatar
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    Re: Hall of Fame worthy? ....

    Don Drysdale was better than Carp and he doesn't belong.
    "Boys, I'm one of those umpires that misses 'em every once in a while so if it's close, you'd better hit it." Cal Hubbard

  5. #4
    Member MikeThierry's Avatar
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    Re: Hall of Fame worthy? ....

    He had Hall of Fame stuff but was too injured in his career.
    “Our next home stand follows this road trip.”

    “I just want to tell everyone Happy Easter and Happy Hanukkah.” says on the day before Easter

    Mike Shannon

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  7. #5
    Member MikeThierry's Avatar
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    Re: Hall of Fame worthy? ....

    Quote Originally Posted by George Anderson View Post
    Don Drysdale was better than Carp and he doesn't belong.
    Don Drysdale was one of the most dominant pitchers in his generation. He does belong in the HOF.
    “Our next home stand follows this road trip.”

    “I just want to tell everyone Happy Easter and Happy Hanukkah.” says on the day before Easter

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  8. #6
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    Re: Hall of Fame worthy? ....

    Quote Originally Posted by MikeThierry View Post
    He had Hall of Fame stuff but was too injured in his career.
    that pretty much sums it up.

  9. #7
    Member MikeThierry's Avatar
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    Re: Hall of Fame worthy? ....

    The real question is, how is Chris Carpenter going to explain this thread to his son?
    “Our next home stand follows this road trip.”

    “I just want to tell everyone Happy Easter and Happy Hanukkah.” says on the day before Easter

    Mike Shannon

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    JB12 (02-06-2013), Joseph (02-06-2013)

  11. #8
    Redsmetz redsmetz's Avatar
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    Re: Hall of Fame worthy? ....

    I went to Baseball-Reference and was actually shocked at how far off the mark Carpenter falls on their several HOF standards. I was going to say no, but was open to be persuaded if the record hinted at the possibility. I'm a broad-brush person with the HOF, but I'm not even convinced Curt Schilling belongs and Carpenter's career is miniscule compared to Schilling. (caveat, I have a huge bias against Schilling, so I acknowledge that likely colors my viewpoint)
    “In the same way that a baseball season never really begins, it never really ends either.” - Lonnie Wheeler, "Bleachers, A Summer in Wrigley Field"

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  12. #9
    Beer is good!! George Anderson's Avatar
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    Re: Hall of Fame worthy? ....

    Quote Originally Posted by MikeThierry View Post
    Don Drysdale was one of the most dominant pitchers in his generation. He does belong in the HOF.
    Check this book out by Bill James. He spent a whole chapter explaining why Drysdale did not belong.


    http://www.amazon.com/The-Politics-G...s+hall+of+fame
    "Boys, I'm one of those umpires that misses 'em every once in a while so if it's close, you'd better hit it." Cal Hubbard

  13. #10
    breath westofyou's Avatar
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    Re: Hall of Fame worthy? ....

    Quote Originally Posted by redsmetz View Post
    I went to Baseball-Reference and was actually shocked at how far off the mark Carpenter falls on their several HOF standards. I was going to say no, but was open to be persuaded if the record hinted at the possibility. I'm a broad-brush person with the HOF, but I'm not even convinced Curt Schilling belongs and Carpenter's career is miniscule compared to Schilling. (caveat, I have a huge bias against Schilling, so I acknowledge that likely colors my viewpoint)
    Jose Rijo is more qualified for the HOF than Carpenter

  14. #11
    breath westofyou's Avatar
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    Re: Hall of Fame worthy? ....

    Quote Originally Posted by George Anderson View Post
    Check this book out by Bill James. He spent a whole chapter explaining why Drysdale did not belong.


    http://www.amazon.com/The-Politics-G...s+hall+of+fame
    from 1950 to 1990 the game was pretty much a pitching centric game (the 50's are debatable) In that era here are the top 25 pitchers in Runs Saved Against Average, 2000 IP

    Code:
    CAREER
    1950-1990
    
    ERA vs. the league average displayed only--not a sorting criteria
    INNINGS PITCHED displayed only--not a sorting criteria
    WINS displayed only--not a sorting criteria
    LOSSES displayed only--not a sorting criteria
    SHUTOUTS displayed only--not a sorting criteria
    
    RSAA                           RSAA      ERA      IP        W        L       SHO    
    1    Tom Seaver                  404     0.79   4782.2      311      205       61   
    2    Bert Blyleven               353     0.54   4837        279      238       60   
    3    Bob Gibson                  350     0.67   3885        251      174       56   
    4    Phil Niekro                 322     0.33   5404.1      318      274       45   
    5    Whitey Ford                 321     1.10   3171        236      106       45   
    6    Gaylord Perry               317     0.53   5350.1      314      265       53   
    7    Jim Palmer                  314     0.86   3948        268      152       53   
    T8   Hoyt Wilhelm                282     1.24   2253        143      122        5   
    T8   Steve Carlton               282     0.41   5217.1      329      244       55   
    10   Ferguson Jenkins            271     0.32   4500.2      284      226       49   
    11   Juan Marichal               252     0.67   3506        243      142       52   
    12   Dave Stieb                  245     0.72   2666.2      166      123       30   
    13   Warren Spahn                241     0.79   4254.2      298      204       49   
    14   Billy Pierce                231     0.75   3068        201      154       38   
    15   Don Drysdale                229     0.70   3432        209      166       49   
    16   Sandy Koufax                220     0.94   2325        165       87       40   
    17   Jim Bunning                 205     0.43   3759.1      224      184       40   
    T18  Rick Reuschel               203     0.28   3537.2      214      189       26   
    T18  Robin Roberts               203     0.51   4315        264      221       42   
    20   Nolan Ryan                  187     0.53   4989.1      302      272       59   
    21   Dennis Eckersley            180     0.41   2815.1      169      140       20   
    22   Tommy John                  173     0.42   4710.1      288      231       46   
    23   Luis Tiant                  172     0.31   3486.1      229      172       49   
    24   Ron Guidry                  166     0.77   2392        170       91       26   
    25   Larry Jackson               164     0.26   3262        194      183       37

  15. #12
    Member MikeThierry's Avatar
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    Re: Hall of Fame worthy? ....

    I'm looking at that list and I'm thinking to myself "does anyone feel that Tommy John is kind of underrated and should have been debated more for the HOF?"
    “Our next home stand follows this road trip.”

    “I just want to tell everyone Happy Easter and Happy Hanukkah.” says on the day before Easter

    Mike Shannon

  16. #13
    Beer is good!! George Anderson's Avatar
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    Re: Hall of Fame worthy? ....

    Quote Originally Posted by MikeThierry View Post
    I'm looking at that list and I'm thinking to myself "does anyone feel that Tommy John is kind of underrated and should have been debated more for the HOF?"
    I dont have the book in front of me but i think James felt Tommy John was worthy.
    "Boys, I'm one of those umpires that misses 'em every once in a while so if it's close, you'd better hit it." Cal Hubbard

  17. #14
    breath westofyou's Avatar
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    Re: Hall of Fame worthy? ....

    Quote Originally Posted by MikeThierry View Post
    I'm looking at that list and I'm thinking to myself "does anyone feel that Tommy John is kind of underrated and should have been debated more for the HOF?"
    He's borderline.

    Pitched in Dodger Stadium and Comiskey when it was a pure pitchers park

    Billy Pierce pitched in a hitters era so I'd say he's underrated and nearly forgotten

  18. #15
    Member mdccclxix's Avatar
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    Re: Hall of Fame worthy? ....

    Had a late start and doesn't have the counting stats. As for injuries, I think our own Barry Larkin was initially written off when he retired as having very little chance. Without checking the numbers at all, I'd say he's got a long term, long shot. He pretty much presided over the NL central for 3-5 years.


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