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Thread: Brandon Phillips Batting 2nd

  1. #31
    Member smixsell's Avatar
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    Re: Brandon Phillips Batting 2nd

    Quote Originally Posted by *BaseClogger* View Post
    Did you just hop out of a time machine from 2005?
    No. I simply have actually PLAYED the game at a high enough level to know something about it and don't LIVE for looking up stats without getting paid to do it.

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  4. #32
    Start the Reactor! *BaseClogger*'s Avatar
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    Re: Brandon Phillips Batting 2nd

    Quote Originally Posted by smixsell View Post
    When a good situational hitter (typically a subset of contact hitters good contact hitters are more likely to be good situational hitters, but not always) comes up with a man on first he will simply try and slap/drive a single the other way (in which case he is fooled less by the pitch because he is waiting longer to commit) or where the defense is weak (1B-2B hole if runner held on or in the hole vacated by the likely cover guy). A good situational hitter has a big advantage in these situations.
    I'm sorry, but I just don't see how that is the case. How is intentionally hitting the ball on the ground going to decreaes the likelyhood of a double play?
    "On-base percentage is great if you can score runs and do something with that on-base percentage," Baker said. "Clogging up the bases isn't that great to me."

  5. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by smixsell View Post
    No. I simply have actually PLAYED the game at a high enough level to know something about it and don't LIVE for looking up stats without getting paid to do it.
    Tracy Jones?
    numbersinthereds.blogspot.com I actually made a post on 7/14/14. I promise.

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  7. #34
    Member mdccclxix's Avatar
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    Re: Brandon Phillips Batting 2nd

    I think Votto could move into the 2 hole later in his career. For now, ride out his most powerful years in the 3 or 4 spot. I think he'll always be a .360+ OBP guy even in his late 30's.

  8. #35
    Party like it's 1990 Blitz Dorsey's Avatar
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    Re: Brandon Phillips Batting 2nd

    Great post. I was getting ready to say "Get ready for a lot of GIDPs" with BP batting second.

    However, he hits into a lot of double plays no matter where he bats, sans leadoff. You're absolutely right. I'd rather have Phillips hitting in front of great OBP guy like Votto than hitting right after him. Part of the reason is that he's so durable and racks up ABs, but it just seems like BP leads the world in GIDPs every year. Usually getting thrown out by about 10 steps too. Haha. BP is the slowest "fast" player out of the batter's box I've ever seen. Once he gets going, he can run. But his quickness out of the box is no bueno.

  9. #36
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    Re: Brandon Phillips Batting 2nd

    Choo gets on first base quite a bit. Last season he had 108 singles and 73 walks and 14 HBP. Without including "reached by error" Choo was standing on first base 195 times last year.

    It may not be ideal for Phillips to hit directly after Votto, but is it ideal for him to hit directly after Choo? I think that's the question, and my guess is he gets the second spot essentially by default.

  10. #37
    Flash the leather! _Sir_Charles_'s Avatar
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    Re: Brandon Phillips Batting 2nd

    Quote Originally Posted by *BaseClogger* View Post
    I'm sorry, but I just don't see how that is the case. How is intentionally hitting the ball on the ground going to decreaes the likelyhood of a double play?
    It's a matter of WHERE you're hitting that ground ball. To the right side when a man is on first, the hole over there is huge due to the first-baseman holding the runner on.
    2014 predictions:
    99-63 WS champs (Cards take 2nd WC, Mil 3rd, Pit 4th, Chi 5th)
    Bruce/Votto neck and neck MVP race (neither takes it)
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    Hamilton ROY & GG

  11. #38
    Be the ball Roy Tucker's Avatar
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    Re: Brandon Phillips Batting 2nd

    Stats aside, I think Dusty would have to do a real sales job on BP to have him bat 6th and be content with it.

    Pay attention to the open sky

  12. #39
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    Re: Brandon Phillips Batting 2nd

    Quote Originally Posted by _Sir_Charles_ View Post
    It's a matter of WHERE you're hitting that ground ball. To the right side when a man is on first, the hole over there is huge due to the first-baseman holding the runner on.
    Philllip's averages a DP every 25 PA, or about 26 in every 600 PA season.

    That's above the league average, so the second slot might be not the best place for him in theory, but with this lineup it's better than the other spots he prefers. The key will be for him to try and be more selective, but 28 walks in 623 PA's isn't exactly that.

    Code:
    PLATE APPEARANCES             YEAR     PA       RB       BB       AVG      OBA     GIDP    
    1    Brandon Phillips         2007      702      232       33     .288    -.011       26   
    2    Brandon Phillips         2010      687      226       46     .275     .000       14   
    3    Brandon Phillips         2011      674      236       44     .300     .026       15   
    4    Brandon Phillips         2009      644      211       44     .276    -.010       21   
    5    Brandon Phillips         2012      623      199       28     .281    -.006       19   
    6    Brandon Phillips         2008      609      190       39     .261    -.027       13   
    7    Brandon Phillips         2006      587      189       35     .276    -.019       19

  13. #40
    RaisorZone Raisor's Avatar
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    Re: Brandon Phillips Batting 2nd

    Quote Originally Posted by smixsell View Post
    No. I simply have actually PLAYED the game at a high enough level to know something about it and don't LIVE for looking up stats without getting paid to do it.
    blah blah mother's basement blah blah never played the game blah blah sliderule blah

    It IS 2005 ish in this thread.
    "But I do know Joey's sister indirectly (or foster sister) and I have heard stories of Joey being into shopping, designer wear, fancy coffees, and pedicures."

  14. #41
    Member mdccclxix's Avatar
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    Re: Brandon Phillips Batting 2nd

    Quote Originally Posted by westofyou View Post
    Philllip's averages a DP every 25 PA, or about 26 in every 600 PA season.

    That's above the league average, so the second slot might be not the best place for him in theory, but with this lineup it's better than the other spots he prefers. The key will be for him to try and be more selective, but 28 walks in 623 PA's isn't exactly that.

    Code:
    PLATE APPEARANCES             YEAR     PA       RB       BB       AVG      OBA     GIDP    
    1    Brandon Phillips         2007      702      232       33     .288    -.011       26   
    2    Brandon Phillips         2010      687      226       46     .275     .000       14   
    3    Brandon Phillips         2011      674      236       44     .300     .026       15   
    4    Brandon Phillips         2009      644      211       44     .276    -.010       21   
    5    Brandon Phillips         2012      623      199       28     .281    -.006       19   
    6    Brandon Phillips         2008      609      190       39     .261    -.027       13   
    7    Brandon Phillips         2006      587      189       35     .276    -.019       19
    Are you sure it isn't 26 gidp per 600 ab? That number seems high based on the above chart.

  15. #42
    breath westofyou's Avatar
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    Re: Brandon Phillips Batting 2nd

    Quote Originally Posted by mdccclxix View Post
    Are you sure it isn't 26 gidp per 600 ab? That number seems high based on the above chart.
    You're right, I read the wrong column... I was looking at his outs (3222 outs in his career as a Red) my bad, nice catch.

    One GIDP every 35.5 PA (one every 32.5 AB)

    Or 17 every 600PA

  16. #43
    Member smixsell's Avatar
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    Re: Brandon Phillips Batting 2nd

    Quote Originally Posted by Raisor View Post
    blah blah mother's basement blah blah never played the game blah blah sliderule blah

    It IS 2005 ish in this thread.
    Blah blah blah, mother's bedroom blah blah if I don't understand it it doesn't exist blah blah blah

  17. #44
    Member smixsell's Avatar
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    Re: Brandon Phillips Batting 2nd

    Quote Originally Posted by Blitz Dorsey View Post
    Great post. I was getting ready to say "Get ready for a lot of GIDPs" with BP batting second.
    I want to make one thing clear which I probably didn't do as well as I should have in my earlier posts, I wholeheartedly agree that if BP stays exactly the hitter he has been up to this point in his career, yes he will hit into a lot of DPs.

    My whole thrust is that if BP make the adjustments to his approach at the plate which I beleive he is CAPABLE of making, he will be a fantastic #2 man. That's why I would place him there and encourage him to make the appropriate adjustments to his hitting approach. If he can't or won't make the proper adjustments, then on to plan B.

  18. #45
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    Re: Brandon Phillips Batting 2nd

    Quote Originally Posted by smixsell View Post
    Blah blah blah, mother's bedroom blah blah if I don't understand it it doesn't exist blah blah blah
    I don't mean to speak for Raisor, but I took his point as being one about articulating a position in a way that people can understand and less as a jab directed towards you.

    His reference is one towards the old divide between "the stats say..." crowd and the "my eyes say..." crowd. Basically, he's saying that a statement without any qualification beyond "I played the game, so you wouldn't understand" isn't a very compelling one. This was already stated earlier when someone asked how hitting more ground balls (read- trying to hit singles, trying to hit the other way, etc. with runners on) can lead to less GIDPs.

    My view is that more valuable and "better" players tend to lead to more favorable outcomes and bigger hits in higher leverage situations. I view Phillips as being a valuable player, and think that hitting 2nd for him is just about ideal (especially when considering what he "is" to the team as a leader and his role over his tenure as a Red). Worrying about "event rates" like GIDP is a little bit silly and can lead one to miss the big picture. Likewise, I don't want Votto hitting 4th because of his grand slam on Mother's Day last year.

    Putting players in a position to succeed isn't as hard as it might seem. A top of the order of Choo-Phillips-Votto (Ludwick-Bruce) is extremely daunting for even the best pitchers. Being concerned about the possibility that Choo could be erased because of a Phillips DP is not a unique event to him; Votto would be more than capable of hitting into a lot of DPs with a guy with a .400 OBP in front of him.
    Quote Originally Posted by westofyou View Post
    Thus his team was punished

    Long live punishment
    Quote Originally Posted by BCubb2003 View Post
    The base you want to acquire is home.


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