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Thread: March Madness 2013 discussion

  1. #61
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    Re: March Madness 2013 discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by traderumor View Post
    OSU gets a pass this year for playing ugly bball because they are using their personnel in a way that gives them the best opportunity to succeed, and when Matta has the horses, he likes to run 'em.
    Not really. OSU played much more up tempo last season (72nd fastest in the nation), but that was the exception. Last season was the first since '06 where OSU didn't rank in the 200s in tempo.

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  3. #62
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    Re: March Madness 2013 discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by Assembly Hall View Post
    There are a lot of Wisky fans out there that think Bo is holding his horses back. But it is hard to argue with a philosophy that at the end of the year you look at the standings and the Badgers are close to top all the time. However I also think that although Wisconsin's style is very successful in the B1G it doesnt work as well in the NCAA. The same isnt true for MSU. Izzy's style has been successful in the tournament.
    I don't like playing Wisconsin but I do respect their style of play. It isn't about holding the ball late in the shot clock it is about moving the ball and making the other team guard for a full 30+ seconds. Its about making a team spend a lot of energy on defense and about creating mismatches with bigs who can shoot the outside shot. I think Bo has done a heck of a job at Wisconsin.

    IMO the reason it doesn't work in the tournament is its too had for that style to work 6 games in a row. When your not playing games at home and playing in big dome arenas once you start to miss shots your doomed. The sure fire way to beat Wisconsin is to get an early substantial lead on them or have them miss shots. If Wisky plays their style of basketball it takes a damn good team to beat them.

    As for MSU they play a beat you up style of basketball but will score with the best of them. One ironic thing about Izzo is he has been to a ton of Final 4's but only championship came when Martin broke his leg.

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    Re: March Madness 2013 discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by bucksfan2 View Post
    I don't like playing Wisconsin but I do respect their style of play. It isn't about holding the ball late in the shot clock it is about moving the ball and making the other team guard for a full 30+ seconds. Its about making a team spend a lot of energy on defense and about creating mismatches with bigs who can shoot the outside shot. I think Bo has done a heck of a job at Wisconsin.

    IMO the reason it doesn't work in the tournament is its too had for that style to work 6 games in a row. When your not playing games at home and playing in big dome arenas once you start to miss shots your doomed. The sure fire way to beat Wisconsin is to get an early substantial lead on them or have them miss shots. If Wisky plays their style of basketball it takes a damn good team to beat them.

    As for MSU they play a beat you up style of basketball but will score with the best of them. One ironic thing about Izzo is he has been to a ton of Final 4's but only championship came when Martin broke his leg.
    Good stuff.

    In regards to Wisconsin, I thought I read somewheres where in Bo's tenure with the Badgers.....they have only ever defeated one higher seed in the NCAA's.

    I do agree with you about their style and would add that it aint conducive to blowing people out of the gym. Their games are usually close, and gives teams opportunities at the end.
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    Re: March Madness 2013 discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by RiverRat13 View Post
    Not really. OSU played much more up tempo last season (72nd fastest in the nation), but that was the exception. Last season was the first since '06 where OSU didn't rank in the 200s in tempo.
    Which could be a function of the sluggish conference, no? Oh, and I prefer "ACTUALLY" when I'm gonna brashly correct someone.
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    Re: March Madness 2013 discussion

    I am too lazy to look it up but why are there two play-in games to decide 16 seeds, one to decide a13 seed and one to decide an 11 seed? Shouldn't all four games be to decide who the final and 16th seed in that particular region is? What is the rhyme or reason?
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    Re: March Madness 2013 discussion

    They wanted to expand the Tournament from 65 to 68 teams, but they did not want to solely penalize the 16th seeds. Thus, they only added one more play-in game for the 16th seeds. Thus the four worst 16 seeds face off for 2 16 seeds. The other two play-in games are for the last four at-large teams to get it. Since they are basically the beneficiaries of the Tournament expanding to 68 teams, they can't really complain about facing off in the play-in games. There are presumably two 11 seeds because on or two of the 12 seeds got moved around on the seeding lines for reasons other than being worse than the 11 seeds in front of them (geography, avoid rematches, etc.).

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    Re: March Madness 2013 discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by Boston Red View Post
    They wanted to expand the Tournament from 65 to 68 teams, but they did not want to solely penalize the 16th seeds. Thus, they only added one more play-in game for the 16th seeds. Thus the four worst 16 seeds face off for 2 16 seeds. The other two play-in games are for the last four at-large teams to get it. Since they are basically the beneficiaries of the Tournament expanding to 68 teams, they can't really complain about facing off in the play-in games. There are presumably two 11 seeds because on or two of the 12 seeds got moved around on the seeding lines for reasons other than being worse than the 11 seeds in front of them (geography, avoid rematches, etc.).
    Thanks.

    So if I am following this correctly; if they had all play-in games for 16 seeds, then that would have involved the 8 lowest-ranked teams. And these 8 teams, more than likely, would have been the representatives of the minor conferences. I am assuming that the losers of these four play-in games are going to get the same amount of money as if they lost a first round game. So it would seem to me, just MO, that those teams would want to play in the play-in games. They would have the eyes of the nation upon them on Tuesday and Wednesday evening instead of just being cut in on from time to time as will likely happen on Thursday and Friday. There entire tourney experience would not have been a beat-down administered at the hands of the #1 seeds. And someone has to win those play-in games. So they would get to play a team more on their level and have a 50/50 chance of playing on Thursday or Friday anyway. Maybe I am misunderstanding, but that is how I see it.
    Last edited by texasdave; 03-19-2013 at 10:22 PM.
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  9. #68
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    Re: March Madness 2013 discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by texasdave View Post
    Thanks.

    So if I am following this correctly; if they had all play-in games for 16 seeds, then that would have involved the 8 lowest-ranked teams. And these 8 teams, more than likely, would have been the representatives of the minor conferences. I am assuming that the losers of these four play-in games are going to get the same amount of money as if they lost a first round game. So it would seem to me, just MO, that those teams would want to play in the play-in games. They would have the eyes of the nation upon them on Tuesday and Wednesday evening instead of just being cut in on from time to time as will likely happen on Thursday and Friday. There entire tourney experience would not have been a beat-down administered at the hands of the #1 seeds. And someone has to win those play-in games. So they would get to play a team more on their level and have a 50/50 chance of playing on Thursday or Friday anyway. Maybe I am misunderstanding, but that is how I see it.
    IIRC, the precedent for the play-in round we have today began in the early '80's. Before the tournament expanded to 64 and 48 teams qualified, there were 4 play-in games in Dayton to determine the four lowest seeds - which were then #12 seeded. It was referred to as the Preliminary Round back then.

    Xavier participated in the '83 preliminary round, falling to a very good Alcorn State team, who then gave Patrick Ewing and Georgetown all they could handle in the next round.

    Another notable Preliminary round survivor was Richmond in '84, who then proceeded to knock off Auburn - a team with a couple of dudes named Charles Barkley and Chuck Person.
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  10. #69
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    Re: March Madness 2013 discussion

    No one wants to play in the play-in games. If you lose, it's like you were never in the Tournament. Most people don't really start paying attention to the Tournament until Thursday. There have been years I forgot the play-in games were even on.

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    Re: March Madness 2013 discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by Revering4Blue View Post
    IIRC, the precedent for the play-in round we have today began in the early '80's. Before the tournament expanded to 64 and 48 teams qualified, there were 4 play-in games in Dayton to determine the four lowest seeds - which were then #12 seeded. It was referred to as the Preliminary Round back then.

    Xavier participated in the '83 preliminary round, falling to a very good Alcorn State team, who then gave Patrick Ewing and Georgetown all they could handle in the next round.

    Another notable Preliminary round survivor was Richmond in '84, who then proceeded to knock off Auburn - a team with a couple of dudes named Charles Barkley and Chuck Person.
    I remember that Blue. Where are you finding those brackets at? I cannot find any brackets that show the preliminary rounds from those days.
    ...and this one belongs to the Reds.

  12. #71
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    Re: March Madness 2013 discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by traderumor View Post
    Which could be a function of the sluggish conference, no? Oh, and I prefer "ACTUALLY" when I'm gonna brashly correct someone.
    I apologize if it came off that way. I was going to agree with the original poster but I looked it up and we both were wrong.

    And as far as the conference style, I used Pomeroy's adjusted tempo which takes into account who you play.

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    Re: March Madness 2013 discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by Assembly Hall View Post
    I remember that Blue. Where are you finding those brackets at? I cannot find any brackets that show the preliminary rounds from those days.
    http://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/postseason/

    Once you click the link for the bracket for, say, 1983, click the "opening round" link.

    Warning: This website is addictive. Your free time will quickly disappear.
    Last edited by Revering4Blue; 03-20-2013 at 01:43 PM.
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  14. #73
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    Re: March Madness 2013 discussion

    Speaking of free time/ production (or lack of it), fellow Redzoners may not be happy with me posting this link, but here 'tis.

    http://vault.ncaa.com/

    Classic highlights and complete classic games are here.
    "I have just been more than a little suspect of all the trades since the Willy (Scott Williamson) cash grab. That one left such a bad taste in my mouth that even a 1985 Dom Pérignon couldn't cleanse it." -- Creek14

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    Re: March Madness 2013 discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by RiverRat13 View Post
    I apologize if it came off that way. I was going to agree with the original poster but I looked it up and we both were wrong.

    And as far as the conference style, I used Pomeroy's adjusted tempo which takes into account who you play.
    Fair enough, appreciate the apology, and respect your use of a statistic, but I'm not sure that it is even possible to capture what I was speaking to in a stat. I'm sure it is a vetted stat, I was speaking from observation, not sure I'd characterize Matta's OSU as purposefully a slow tempo team with an up tempo style the exception.
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    Re: March Madness 2013 discussion

    Does anyone know if there is a MM app or site to watch online this year? Do you need to register?
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    Calipari is not, nor has he ever been accused or "caught", cheating. He himself turned in one of his players (Camby) for dealing with an agent to get one Final Four overturned. The other is all on the NCAA and Rose. (IF Rose cheated.)
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