Junior Griffey's dedication as a Red

[texasdave]

I only have one problem with Griffey Jr...I can't even imagine going to sleep during a game...who does that?? I don't know if the rumors are true that I read...that he layed around the lockerroom in his later yrs (not talking about when he was injured)..I do believe he was getting a pay check though...He was a bright light though... with memories that don't seem to end...I'm having trouble picturing really dedicated ball players going to take a nap during the game...

[SunDeck]

I think we are six pages in and no mention of genetics.

[Always Red]

I know I'm the villain of this thread for questioning Griffey's dedication and work ethic. ... The question is how hard he worked off the field.

Lou Piniella was asking those same questions and noticing that about Junior long, long ago.

Junior was perhaps the most talented player any of us have laid eyes on, during his first tour with the Mariners.

He had a fantastic, Hall of Fame career. For all of the angst about his time with the Reds, he will still be a member of the Reds Hall of Fame, if he agrees to be.

The seed was planted, unknowingly, by Piniella, and even Harold Reynolds, long ago, that Junior did not like to put in work off the field.

Would he have been able to avoid those injuries if he had? I don't think anyone can answer those questions. I'm pretty sure Junior worked harder and certainly lived much cleaner than Mickey Mantle, yet Mantle is not held to the same scrutiny as Junior. Especially here in Cincinnati, where Junior is seen as a disappointment. Meanwhile, MLB celebrates Mickey Mantle.

As for me, I have no idea how hard or not hard Junior or anyone else worked off the field. But those comments by Lou and Reynolds are easily findable on any search engine.

I enjoyed watching Junior during his time as a Red, and I put the blame for those poor teams right on the shoulders of Carl Lindner, who promised to build around Junior and then never did. I'm also a big Lindner fan, in general, for his outstanding generosity towards this city. But the man did not know how to own and operate an MLB team, or hire others to do so.

[westofyou]

I think we are six pages in and no mention of genetics.

Oh yeah Perfesser what's dat?

Some sort of seafood?

[texasdave]

Oh yeah Perfesser what's dat?

Some sort of seafood?

Or the follow-up to the best-selling book - Dianetics?

[Blitz Dorsey]

Lou Piniella was asking those same questions and noticing that about Junior long, long ago.

Junior was perhaps the most talented player any of us have laid eyes on, during his first tour with the Mariners.

He had a fantastic, Hall of Fame career. For all of the angst about his time with the Reds, he will still be a member of the Reds Hall of Fame, if he agrees to be.

The seed was planted, unknowingly, by Piniella, and even Harold Reynolds, long ago, that Junior did not like to put in work off the field.

Would he have been able to avoid those injuries if he had? I don't think anyone can answer those questions. I'm pretty sure Junior worked harder and certainly lived much cleaner than Mickey Mantle, yet Mantle is not held to the same scrutiny as Junior. Especially here in Cincinnati, where Junior is seen as a disappointment. Meanwhile, MLB celebrates Mickey Mantle.

As for me, I have no idea how hard or not hard Junior or anyone else worked off the field. But those comments by Lou and Reynolds are easily findable on any search engine.

I enjoyed watching Junior during his time as a Red, and I put the blame for those poor teams right on the shoulders of Carl Lindner, who promised to build around Junior and then never did. I'm also a big Lindner fan, in general, for his outstanding generosity towards this city. But the man did not know how to own and operate an MLB team, or hire others to do so.

Well said. Everyone should pay close attention to this post. You have Griffey's manager and one of his teammates in Seattle -- while he was tearing MLB up -- saying he was actually a lazy guy off the field.

Hmm.

Might Griffey have been a guy that got by on extreme natural talent for the first part of his career? He was so naturally gifted he could have rolled out of bed and OPS'd 1.000 in his prime without putting any work in.

[757690]

I think we are six pages in and no mention of genetics.

[757690]

Mickey Mantle slept, as for around the locker room, numerous players on most teams can be found in the locker room during the game, some in easy chairs.

It's a reality, unsure how I really feel about it or if it even affects the game, these are guys spending, more than half their day at the stadium they tend to lay around, eat, soak in the whirlpool and watch video. Some even do it during the game.

Really not Mickey's fault, he was probably drunk most of those times

[dougdirt]

Harold Reynolds played with a 19-23 year old Ken Griffey Jr. I could not give an ounce of care for his thoughts on what he put in work wise.

[Razor Shines]

Wow all you want.

I have a friend who was a clubby with the Reds during the Griffey era and his training regimen was questioned throught the entire organization. He made it well known to people that he didn't believe in weight lifting back then.

And Griffey is my favorite athlete of all time. I didn't ever want to believe that.

I bet he drank a man's coffee, though. Am I right?

[Captain Hook]

I still don't get why people get upset when guys don't "Pete Rose" it to first base on a routine groundball. You are out 99% of the time on those plays.

Knowing that all you need to do when certain guys step up to the plate is to knock it down, pick it up, get a good grip, then plant to make a strong throw in order to record an out probably makes more of a difference then you claim it does. I still wouldn't say it upsets me though but I will say that there's a time when it's ok and a time when it's not. In the big picture it's probably best that older stars don't risk it by busting it down the line on every play but there's also a time when those older guys need to suck it up and put some effort into getting down the line and not just on routine ground balls. If they're not able to run hard in certain circumstances toward the end of close games while they're still capable of it they should consider either retiring or just accept that some people are going to think they're lazy.

[The Operator]

Harold Reynolds played with a 19-23 year old Ken Griffey Jr. I could not give an ounce of care for his thoughts on what he put in work wise.

Harold Reynolds was also fired from ESPN for being the office pervert, wasn't he?

Even if not, I've always found him to be incredibly annoying and arrogant, and really not that knowledgeable.

[The Operator]

And if Lou Piniella really did openly question Junior's work ethic, then shame on him.

Dusty Baker has his faults, but one thing I love about him as that he defends his players to the end - and that's a big part of why they'll gladly go to war for him.

A manager should never throw a player under the bus like that, especially your (arguably - it's not many teams that have talent like Junior, A-Rod and Randy Johnson all in their prime) best player. That's something Tony LaRussa does.

[SunDeck]

Oh yeah Perfesser what's dat?

Some sort of seafood?

Someone will probably say that Jr. may have a genetic predisposition to be lazy.
This conversation reminds me that people accused Hank Aaron of loafing as well.

[redsrule2500]

I'm sure Griffey still wanted to be great. The problem, IMO, is that he was not willing to put in the work to be great late in his career. That, coupled with the bad luck with the injuries, greatly hurt his career down the stretch. Some guys are able to play well late into their 30's and some are not. In fairness, Griffey also had a lot of wear and tear on those tires due to taking over as a starting CF in MLB at the ripe age of 19.

We all love Griff. But let's not pretend that his laziness didn't play a role in his decline. (Cue the "How do you know he was lazy?" questions. I don't know for sure. Just my opinion from following the Reds extremely close as I know most on here do. He always looked pudgy and like a guy who didn't put in much work in the weight room.)

I tend to agree, later in his career he definitely seemed to be plump so he clearly wasn't working out as much as he did earlier in his career, or his body was catching up with him and he didn't care. Assuming that you say that it was natural because of age, I'm sure it's normal for players to have to try even harder as they get older to stay in shape, which he may have been unwilling to do.

It seemed baseball came naturally to him, and so when family/kids started becoming his top priority, who's to blame him for trying less or not trying more to overcome his aging body? I'm as big of a Griffey fan as anyone, but I refuse to put on blinders for the guys struggles later in his career.

For those that keep blaming injuries, there are plenty of reasons someone can be injured, but one of them is due to improper or weak training for the game they play. Example: If his trainer was telling him to do a certain #minutes training per day, instead he cut those minutes into half, he would have been at a higher risk for injury.