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Thread: This team is worse than last year.

  1. #61
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    Re: This team is worse than last year.

    Quote Originally Posted by Vottomatic View Post
    Blow it up! Blow it up!!!

    Just kidding.
    Hahaha. I know you're kidding. The softer schedule in may ought to help. While it doesn't need blown up there are definite areas of concern. Choos D in center is suspect but my major concerns are the one dimensional, impatient, undisciplined nature of the offense and the massive hole in the 2 spot of the order and while he's doing a great job Phillips at cleanup. The two spot is dead. It's not even getting runners over let alone getting hits. And while Phillips is doing a great job, I really don't think pitchers see him as enough of a threat to give votto something to hit. Votto is getting hits off of pitchers pitches. I think it's frustrating him more now too and he's trying to be over aggressive and hit stuff he shouldn't be swinging at. Lets hope the pitching can carry us against good teams and the offense can beat up on the cupcakes until the deadline and Walt can make a deal to plug the holes.

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  3. #62
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    I think this team is better than last year, but the offense is plain awful. How many quality starts have the Reds lost this year?

  4. #63
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    Re: This team is worse than last year.

    Quote Originally Posted by joshua View Post
    I think this team is better than last year, but the offense is plain awful. How many quality starts have the Reds lost this year?
    I know. It's getting crazy. You never want to give up quality pitching for offense but I think it may be time that the reds start considering it especially if cingrani continues his success.

  5. #64
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    Re: This team is worse than last year.

    Quote Originally Posted by Old school 1983 View Post
    Hahaha. I know you're kidding. The softer schedule in may ought to help. While it doesn't need blown up there are definite areas of concern. Choos D in center is suspect but my major concerns are the one dimensional, impatient, undisciplined nature of the offense and the massive hole in the 2 spot of the order and while he's doing a great job Phillips at cleanup. The two spot is dead. It's not even getting runners over let alone getting hits. And while Phillips is doing a great job, I really don't think pitchers see him as enough of a threat to give votto something to hit. Votto is getting hits off of pitchers pitches. I think it's frustrating him more now too and he's trying to be over aggressive and hit stuff he shouldn't be swinging at. Lets hope the pitching can carry us against good teams and the offense can beat up on the cupcakes until the deadline and Walt can make a deal to plug the holes.
    Is there really am issue at the 2 spot or is the bigger issue the lack of hitting at the 2, 5, 6, 7, and 8 spots? We thought a lead off guy would fix the problems but it hasn't. It is a team issue, not one spot in the order.

  6. #65
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    Re: This team is worse than last year.

    Quote Originally Posted by reds700 View Post
    Is there really am issue at the 2 spot or is the bigger issue the lack of hitting at the 2, 5, 6, 7, and 8 spots? We thought a lead off guy would fix the problems but it hasn't. It is a team issue, not one spot in the order.
    The two spot really isn't what is broken. It's just the obvious result of it. No one to protect votto bc ludwick went down. The reds need to fix the four spot that'd automatically fix the two. As far as 5 through 8 I'd make my first criteria for replacement in the lineup be defense. That leaves one glaring hole to me. Frazier. And combined with bruce (low contact high pop feast or famine guys) they kill too many rallies with impatient undisciplined at bats that end in weak contact or Ks. I wouldn't move Bruce bc his D is all star caliber, he's younger than Frazier, and Bruce will heat up. I actually like what mes has done. He seems to have decent plate discipline for his age and a good eye and makes solid contact. And if somehow the reds could get that 4 hole guy cozart goes from being a drain at the top to a guy who had plus pop for an 8 hole guy.

  7. #66
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    Re: This team is worse than last year.

    Quote Originally Posted by Old school 1983 View Post
    The two spot really isn't what is broken. It's just the obvious result of it. No one to protect votto bc ludwick went down. The reds need to fix the four spot that'd automatically fix the two. As far as 5 through 8 I'd make my first criteria for replacement in the lineup be defense. That leaves one glaring hole to me. Frazier. And combined with bruce (low contact high pop feast or famine guys) they kill too many rallies with impatient undisciplined at bats that end in weak contact or Ks. I wouldn't move Bruce bc his D is all star caliber, he's younger than Frazier, and Bruce will heat up. I actually like what mes has done. He seems to have decent plate discipline for his age and a good eye and makes solid contact. And if somehow the reds could get that 4 hole guy cozart goes from being a drain at the top to a guy who had plus pop for an 8 hole guy.
    Why not just move Frazier to the 2? Fastball hitter and you would think hitting in front of Votto would lead to more fastballs to hit. Or Phillips to the 2 and Frazier to cleanup.

  8. #67
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    Re: This team is worse than last year.

    Quote Originally Posted by reds700 View Post
    Why not just move Frazier to the 2? Fastball hitter and you would think hitting in front of Votto would lead to more fastballs to hit. Or Phillips to the 2 and Frazier to cleanup.
    I just dont think frazier is as good as some people to believe him to be. Hes not bad but it seems a lot if people on here think hes some kind if super star. Frazier to four would just cause the he and Bruce back to back strikeout thing to continue. He hits a lot of grounders too. In the two spot I could seeing him hit into a bunch of DPs but honestly he'd probably do better than the alternative at this point. In all reality a trade for a real 4 hole hitter would be the ideal solution. No offense to Todd but I'd love to see a Headley for cueto or bailey type deal if cingrani proves himself a legit MLB starter. It'd Take the pitching a notch back but you can't be losing games 2-1 all of the time. With a legit hitter behind votto he'd have to see better pitches and with Phillips in the two spot they can't pitch around him too. One if my work friends is a huge cards fan and he more or less says there gameplan is to pitch to choo Phillips and votto so they do minimal damage. Pretty much don't give them anything direct and let them get theirselves out and go after everyone else.

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    Re: This team is worse than last year.

    Quote Originally Posted by Old school 1983 View Post
    I just dont think frazier is as good as some people to believe him to be. Hes not bad but it seems a lot if people on here think hes some kind if super star. Frazier to four would just cause the he and Bruce back to back strikeout thing to continue. He hits a lot of grounders too. In the two spot I could seeing him hit into a bunch of DPs but honestly he'd probably do better than the alternative at this point. In all reality a trade for a real 4 hole hitter would be the ideal solution. No offense to Todd but I'd love to see a Headley for cueto or bailey type deal if cingrani proves himself a legit MLB starter. It'd Take the pitching a notch back but you can't be losing games 2-1 all of the time. With a legit hitter behind votto he'd have to see better pitches and with Phillips in the two spot they can't pitch around him too. One if my work friends is a huge cards fan and he more or less says there gameplan is to pitch to choo Phillips and votto so they do minimal damage. Pretty much don't give them anything direct and let them get theirselves out and go after everyone else.
    I am with you on Frazier. That experiment may be coming to an end with the way he is hitting. It's sad he is one of our better options. At this point it seems like anyone other than Choo, Votto, and Phillips is an automatic out.

  10. #69
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    Re: This team is worse than last year.

    Overall this is also a dumb baseball team. Just today against the Cardinals Frazier lets 2 fastballs go by on 2-0 and 2-1 counts with a man on 3rd and one out. With Lutz and Miller behind you you have to swing. Then Bailey gets hosed at 2nd. He had already slowed around 1st. At that point just stop. You have the top of the order coming up. Just stupid baseball.

  11. #70
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    Re: This team is worse than last year.

    Beavis and Butthead scored more than the Reds do against good pitching.

  12. #71
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    Re: This team is worse than last year.

    The loss of Ludwig has really hurt the entire chemistry of the lineup and Joey is a shell of his former self. The team played much hungrier with Votto out of the lineup last year.

  13. #72
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    Re: This team is worse than last year.

    Quote Originally Posted by xsteve1 View Post
    The loss of Ludwig has really hurt the entire chemistry of the lineup and Joey is a shell of his former self. The team played much hungrier with Votto out of the lineup last year.
    Ludwicks loss was huge. He was the one player the reds could not replace at leadt partially without going outside of organization...a right handed power bat with experience and good plate discipline.

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    REDREAD (05-13-2013)

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    Re: This team is worse than last year.

    I would bet that if you look at the starting pitching the Reds have faced since opening day and produced a winning record right now are some of the top pitchers in baseball. Nationals 7 games against a pretty strong staff, 6 games against the Cards who I think are tops in starters so far, 3 vs Pirates who are doing pretty well so far. When we faced lesser pitching we did just fine. Over the next month outside of the Braves we face a little less dominate pitching, so lets see where we stand on June 1 before we leap off the bridge...

  16. #74
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    Re: This team is worse than last year.

    Quote Originally Posted by xsteve1 View Post
    The loss of Ludwig has really hurt the entire chemistry of the lineup and Joey is a shell of his former self. The team played much hungrier with Votto out of the lineup last year.
    Yeah, that .393 wOBA really does suck balls!

    And chemistry? Ugh. Are these kind of comments just a sun deck thing? Because I sure hope so.

  17. #75
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    Re: This team is worse than last year.

    Quote Originally Posted by Johnny Fan View Post
    I would bet that if you look at the starting pitching the Reds have faced since opening day and produced a winning record right now are some of the top pitchers in baseball. Nationals 7 games against a pretty strong staff, 6 games against the Cards who I think are tops in starters so far, 3 vs Pirates who are doing pretty well so far. When we faced lesser pitching we did just fine. Over the next month outside of the Braves we face a little less dominate pitching, so lets see where we stand on June 1 before we leap off the bridge...
    I know the numbers will look better against lesser pitching but I already know the reds can beat those teams. I want to know the reds can win a series against high quality pitching like the cardinals have done with us. I think it comes down to are we happy to make the playoffs or do we want to win. If we are happy to make it we can kid ourselves into thinking our offense is ok when we beat the snot out of pitchers who are not playoff quality. Or do we want to win in the playoffs? If that's the case we need to find a legit 4 hole guy and some more selective hitters while finding a way to improve our third base and centerfield defense.(move choo to a corner)


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