Zack Greinke broke his collarbone

[Reds Fanatic]

Quentin gets an 8 game suspension which he has appealed.

[1940757690]

Ridiculous. I don't get how some excuse the charge because Greinke said something...whatever he said. Makes zero sense unless you're the NHL. Whatever happened to sticks and stones (and hard blows to the shoulder) but words....?

[jhiller21]

Greinke shouldn't have said whatever he said after a HBP which obviously wasn't intentional, and Quentin shouldn't have charged the mound. Either way, I think 8 games sounds fair.

[kaldaniels]

Nm

[1940757690]

Nm

When it's intentional. Don't think anyone, including Quentin, was arguing that the hit yesterday was intentional. By Quentin's own telling, it was the "history" and whatever Greinke said to "bait" him. If we allow the false equivalence of mean words and physical assault, we become the NHL, where the fights are more important than the game.

[1940757690]

Greinke shouldn't have said whatever he said after a HBP which obviously wasn't intentional, and Quentin shouldn't have charged the mound. Either way, I think 8 games sounds fair.

No way. They're simply not the same. Saying mean things doesn't hurt anyone or risk anyone's health or ability to play. That's why the NBA has its 'don't leave the bench' rule. MLB needs that rule to restore civility to a game that usually is civil. Only way to do that is to punish the action most severely--intentional bean balls (which yesterday wasn't) or a physical attack.

[kaldaniels]

When it's intentional. Don't think anyone, including Quentin, was arguing that the hit yesterday was intentional. By Quentin's own telling, it was the "history" and whatever Greinke said to "bait" him. If we allow the false equivalence of mean words and physical assault, we become the NHL, where the fights are more important than the game.

What I was trying to say was that it wasn't just words that provoked Quentin. It was words and a 90 mph baseball. I'm not saying he was right, but it wasn't just words that made him charge.

[kaldaniels]

I still don't get the thought that this couldn't be intentional. Once the count hits 3-2 if Greinke wasn't confident in his stuff at that juncture and weighed the percentages, there may have been no time like the present to plunk him. We will never know, but too many people are ruling that out.

[dougdirt]

No way. They're simply not the same. Saying mean things doesn't hurt anyone or risk anyone's health or ability to play. That's why the NBA has its 'don't leave the bench' rule. MLB needs that rule to restore civility to a game that usually is civil. Only way to do that is to punish the action most severely--intentional bean balls (which yesterday wasn't) or a physical attack.

I like this rule. Make it happen. Don't leave the bench or you are suspended.

[VR]

I like this rule. Make it happen. Don't leave the bench or you are suspended.

DP show was talking about that today. My concern? Pitcher just keeps hitting batters. What are they going to do? Charge the mound and get pummeled by the 9 guys on the field? I think they would set an HBP record pretty quickly, as there would be little recourse for the batter, unless you were a knucklehead in the Nyger Morgan class.

[Salukifan2]

Seriously, its Greinke's own damn fault he broke his collarbone. A sensible person would side step and try to avoid on the confrontation so that they could keep pitching and win their team a ball game. Greinke chose to lower his shoulder into the oncoming idiot creating a clash similar too a couple of rival rams competing for a mate. Baseball doesn't need to make a rule change. This was not Ron Artest in the stands. The players who needed to be suspended were suspended.

[HometownHero]

Greinke has hit .0044402 of the batters he has faced.

Quentin he has hit 9.6% of the time.

Quentin also gets hit more per PA than any player in baseball history. Greinke hit him for the 3rd time in his 31st PA that's a far lower rate than many others who he has never charged the mound on.

http://www.baseball-reference.com/pl...=1&submitter=1

[HometownHero]

This is a good read...
http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/carlo...tins-hbp-zone/

[mth123]

I like this rule. Make it happen. Don't leave the bench or you are suspended.

Actually, this is a point I was going to make. Watching that clip, I just don't see how that collision between Greinke and Quentin was so violent that it broke his collarbone. It was pretty visible, so everyone seems to be pointing to the collision, but I wonder if Greinke's injury didn't occur later when he was at the bottom of the pile. Quentn took him down and then a bunch of guys piled on. My guess is that did the real damage.

My take:

Charging the mound is always stupid. Take your base and make him pay and get him the next AB.

I think this is about history more than this play. The pitch didn't look overly harmful and Quentin sure didn't seem hurt by it.

Guys coming off the bench is going to happen. One hitter on the field with 9 defenders is always going to make benches clear to even the odds, but if guys join the fray other than in a peacekeeping capacity, they should get the longest suspension of all IMO. 8 Games for Quentin seems about right, but I'd try real hard to pick out the others who joned in and double it for them.

[Slyder]

DP show was talking about that today. My concern? Pitcher just keeps hitting batters. What are they going to do? Charge the mound and get pummeled by the 9 guys on the field? I think they would set an HBP record pretty quickly, as there would be little recourse for the batter, unless you were a knucklehead in the Nyger Morgan class.

I'm sure teammates will step in and say they're tired of taking pitches in the ribs for retaliation.

Plus National League pitchers bat.