2013 Cardinals Discussion

[MikeThierry]

The SB stat was used to show they weren't getting a tons of extra bases off steals to cover up the fact the have all these runs with low OPS. Hitting with RISP isn't a skill and you just can't magically decide to get hits with RISP, you are a total fool if you think having a RISP of .400 100 AB into the season isn't lucky when its about .150 higher than the league average.

This ignorant stuff you post here is why Cards fans have such a terrible reputation, at least the other Cards fan who posts here often is honest enough to admit how lucky they are and I can actually respect him for that

As ignorant as your contention that Oscar Taveras is hitting because he plays in the PCL and practically every scout is wrong on him?

Where did I say that they will continue to hit at a .400 clip? I stated that they will not continue that pace. However you shouldn't overlook either that they have a lot of guys who have proven in their career that they can hit with runners in scoring position. No, it isn't a skill but you also get into trends when looking at someone's career. Carlos Beltran hitting over .300 with RISP isn't some anomaly or something that's luck based in his long career.

[MikeThierry]

Even if Cueto is out for the entire year, I would rather have the Reds starting pitchers for 2013 than the Cardinals. It's not even close.

Hyperbole for the win!

[MikeThierry]

Cardinals 2012 with runners in scoring position: .262 avg, 9th in baseball

Cardinals 2011 with runners in scoring position: .290, 4th in baseball


Yep... all luck there.

[HometownHero]

As ignorant as your contention that Oscar Taveras is hitting because he plays in the PCL and practically every scout is wrong on him?

I didn't say he was hitting just because of the PCL I said his stats are inflated by playing in hitters parks that favor LH hitters many of which are in hitters leagues. He's a good prospect but he isn't going to do the same things in the majors.

He spiked to 23 HR in 124 games last year after 17 in his first 203 games and he played in the leagues best HR park in a hitters league as Springfield saw 2.35 HR/G which was 6th in the minors the 2nd and 3rd best parks in the league also came inside 4 team division Springfield plays in. Not only are they HR parks they favor LH hitters. Its the same reason Adams in HR in the same league.

[MikeThierry]

I didn't say he was hitting just because of the PCL I said his stats are inflated by playing in hitters parks that favor LH hitters many of which are in hitters leagues. He's a good prospect but he isn't going to do the same things in the majors.

He spiked to 23 HR in 124 games last year after 17 in his first 203 games and he played in the leagues best HR park in a hitters league as Springfield saw 2.35 HR/G which was 6th in the minors the 2nd and 3rd best parks in the league also came inside 4 team division Springfield plays in. Not only are they HR parks they favor LH hitters. Its the same reason Adams in HR in the same league.

Couldn't his spike in home runs also be contributed to the fact that he started his minor league career at 17 and that he's become a better hitter with more strength? Your park theory also doesn't explain the low K rate of 10.5%.

EDIT: Everyone single scouting agency is wrong about Taveras but Hometownhero has the answers. Baseball America, what a horrible production they have over there since they're not in line with your ball park theory.

[757690]

Cardinals 2012 with runners in scoring position: .262 avg, 9th in baseball

Cardinals 2011 with runners in scoring position: .290, 4th in baseball


Yep... all luck there.

You are correct. No luck, just percentages working out as expected.

In 2011, Cards were 5th in MLB in BA
In 2012, Cards were 4th in MLB in BA

They are just good hitters. It has nothing to do with their ability to hit with RISP, which history tells us is not a skill that teams possess.

[HometownHero]

Cardinals 2012 with runners in scoring position: .262 avg, 9th in baseball

Cardinals 2011 with runners in scoring position: .290, 4th in baseball


Yep... all luck there.

It was actually Tied for 2nd in the NL in 2012 in 2012 behind the Rockies who play in a massive hitters park and in 2011 it was #1 in the NL by 21 points with a OPS lead of .058 so hell yeas that's very lucky.

[757690]

Couldn't his spike in home runs also be contributed to the fact that he started his minor league career at 17 and that he's become a better hitter with more strength? Your park theory also doesn't explain the low K rate of 10.5%.

Reds fans are going to be very frustrated trying to downplay the talent of Taveras. He's scary good.

[HometownHero]

Couldn't his spike in home runs also be contributed to the fact that he started his minor league career at 17 and that he's become a better hitter with more strength? Your park theory also doesn't explain the low K rate of 10.5%.

Every single LH hitter sees a HR spike there as its one of the best parks in all of the minors for LH hitters.

[MikeThierry]

It was actually Tied for 2nd in the NL in 2012 in 2012 behind the Rockies who play in a massive hitters park and in 2011 it was #1 in the NL by 21 points with a OPS lead of .058 so hell yeas that's very lucky.

So what does that tell you? That maybe the Cardinals have a good lineup or are you still going to use the "luck monster" for a 3rd year in a row?

They are just good hitters. It has nothing to do with their ability to hit with RISP, which history tells us is not a skill that teams possess.

I know it's not a skill that teams posses nor is there really anything such as clutch. It's just that collectively if a team has guys in the lineup that can hit for average and hit for average with RISP, they're going to score a lot of runs and they will go through stretches where they hit for high average with RISP (like they are now)

[MikeThierry]

Every single LH hitter sees a HR spike there as its one of the best parks in all of the minors for LH hitters.

Ok, explain his extremely low K rate.

[Salukifan2]

Every single LH hitter sees a HR spike there as its one of the best parks in all of the minors for LH hitters.

This is true mike. Look at the dimensions of the ball field in Springfield. Its a lefties haven. That being said taveras still has legit mlb power. Remember, he was 19 last season. 23 home runs for a 19 year old is impressive no mattwr where they are playing.

[MikeThierry]

This is true mike. Look at the dimensions of the ball field in Springfield. Its a lefties haven. That being said taveras still has legit mlb power. Remember, he was 19 last season. 23 home runs for a 19 year old is impressive no mattwr where they are playing.

He also had 37 doubles and 7 triples there. A small ball park might explain some home runs but it doesn't explain his ability to A. hit to all fields and B. his penchant for extra base hits.

[MikeThierry]

Oh and Matt Adams has legit power regardless of where he plays. You would have to be blind not to see that.

[Salukifan2]

He also had 37 doubles and 7 triples there. A small ball park might explain some home runs but it doesn't explain his ability to A. hit to all fields and B. his penchant for extra base hits.

Oh dont get me wrong, i completely agree with you that Taveras is more than legit. I just think his power numbers were slightly boosted last year by playing in that ball park.