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Thread: VottOBP

  1. #1
    Stat Wanker Hodiernus RedsManRick's Avatar
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    VottOBP

    Much has been made of the ridiculous rate at which Joey Votto is walking. Through 15 games, he has twice as many unintentional walks as ANYBODY else in in baseball. It's literally Bonds-esque.

    Of course, baseball traditionalists are freaking out a bit, saying that Votto has taken his focus on his OBP too far, that he's not paid to score runs but rather to drive them in. I don't think I need to address that point directly. We all know where I stand. (That said, while I do think he's costing himself in terms of power production, I don't think his lower power output will continue to this degree).

    However, I wonder... could it be possible that Dusty will look at Votto's walks and decide that he actually would be better off batting 2nd? Is it even a remote possibility? Or will he and the rest of baseball traditionalists privately (or publicly) lament that he's not doing his real job?
    Games are won on run differential -- scoring more than your opponent. Runs are runs, scored or prevented they all count the same. Worry about scoring more and allowing fewer, not which positions contribute to which side of the equation or how "consistent" you are at your current level of performance.

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  3. #2
    Start the Reactor! *BaseClogger*'s Avatar
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    Re: VottOBP

    If Joey Votto has morphed into a durable, met his potential Nick Johnson, is that a bad thing?
    "On-base percentage is great if you can score runs and do something with that on-base percentage," Baker said. "Clogging up the bases isn't that great to me."

  4. #3
    Potential Lunch Winner Dom Heffner's Avatar
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    Re: VottOBP

    If he keeps up the Sal Bando routine, nobody's going to be walking him.

    He swings like he's constipated.

  5. #4
    Potential Lunch Winner Dom Heffner's Avatar
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    Re: VottOBP

    Never thought I'd see him be a rally killer over and over but good lord, he is lost up there.

  6. #5
    Box of Frogs edabbs44's Avatar
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    Re: VottOBP

    Quote Originally Posted by Dom Heffner View Post
    If he keeps up the Sal Bando routine, nobody's going to be walking him.

    He swings like he's constipated.
    Agree. No matter what, it is stunning that Mesoraco has more RBI than Votto. And that Cozart has 3 more HR and 2 less RBI than Joey and Jay combined.

  7. #6
    Member Tom Servo's Avatar
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    Re: VottOBP

    He doesn't look right at all.
    "Since I've been with the Reds in 1989, we've never had a farm system this loaded," Bowden said. "If we were the New York Yankees and had unlimited dollars, we could have traded for Colon, (Jeff) Weaver, Rolen, (Cliff) Floyd, (Kenny) Rogers and Finley and gotten them all -- and still held onto our top five prospects. That's an amazing statement."

  8. #7
    Potential Lunch Winner Dom Heffner's Avatar
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    Re: VottOBP

    A .370 slugging woth a .560 OBP...this is the weirdest start to a season I've seen....

    Someone needs to pull him aside and tell him the "I'm not going to make any outs" approach is not working.

    Give up 30 points of batting average and stop swinging like Bert Campaneris.

  9. #8
    Et tu, Brutus? Brutus's Avatar
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    Re: VottOBP

    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Servo View Post
    He doesn't look right at all.
    That's another way of saying he looks human for once lol

    I know this: if the star player's worst is a .500 OBP and .900 OPS, and the team is hitting like crazy with him playing his worst, things are looking up.
    "No matter how good you are, you're going to lose one-third of your games. No matter how bad you are you're going to win one-third of your games. It's the other third that makes the difference." ~Tommy Lasorda

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  11. #9
    Potential Lunch Winner Dom Heffner's Avatar
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    Re: VottOBP

    Here comes a WAR lecture....

    And here's the response: the walks aren't going to be there, kids.

  12. #10
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    Re: VottOBP

    What Joey is going through at the plate is one of the oddest things I've ever seen in baseball. Can't buy a hit or RBI, but OBPing around .500. This is bizarro world stuff.
    "I talked to an advance scout that told me if Joey Votto and Albert Pujols were on the same team he'd advise his team to do the unthinkable...pitch around Votto to get to Pujols." - Buster Olney, ESPN

  13. #11
    Et tu, Brutus? Brutus's Avatar
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    Re: VottOBP

    Quote Originally Posted by Dom Heffner View Post
    Here comes a WAR lecture....

    And here's the response: the walks aren't going to be there, kids.
    That's great. When the walks stop, it means teams are pitching to him. When they pitch to him, he'll snap out of it.
    "No matter how good you are, you're going to lose one-third of your games. No matter how bad you are you're going to win one-third of your games. It's the other third that makes the difference." ~Tommy Lasorda

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  15. #12
    Stat Wanker Hodiernus RedsManRick's Avatar
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    Re: VottOBP

    Quote Originally Posted by Dom Heffner View Post
    If he keeps up the Sal Bando routine, nobody's going to be walking him.

    He swings like he's constipated.
    I have to say, I've thought the same. He's wound up so tight at the plate. Watching Phillips or Frazier and their read-and-react style of hitting is just so different.

    While I refuse to complain about a guy with a .500 OBP, I'd much prefer a .450/.525 line over .500/.400.

    Though I do have to remind myself that it's never as simple as trading outcomes. Many people simply couldn't accept that Adam Dunn couldn't trade walks for singles without effecting his power output -- it's just more complicated than that and I'm a believer that, by-and-large, by the time guys reach the big leagues and are in their late 20's, they've already found the approach that best fits their natural talents in a way that maximizes their production.
    Last edited by RedsManRick; 04-18-2013 at 09:54 PM.
    Games are won on run differential -- scoring more than your opponent. Runs are runs, scored or prevented they all count the same. Worry about scoring more and allowing fewer, not which positions contribute to which side of the equation or how "consistent" you are at your current level of performance.

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  17. #13
    Be the ball Roy Tucker's Avatar
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    Re: VottOBP

    To put it politely, Joey needs to go out and enjoy some adult beverages and some female companionship.

    The man is wound tighter than a cheap watch.

    Pay attention to the open sky

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  19. #14
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    Re: VottOBP

    Quote Originally Posted by Brutus View Post
    That's great. When the walks stop, it means teams are pitching to him. When they pitch to him, he'll snap out of it.
    Agree.

    Put yourself in Votto's position. He's had precious few opportunities to hit so far. Mostly he's facing semi-intentional walks. It has to throw him off -- it's not a normal hitting situation.

    Over time, he'll see more good pitches and he'll hit.

    The key point is that Votto has NOT become impatient. I think the worst outcome would be Joey getting out on bad pitches.

    It's a long season, one way or the other Joey will produce.

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  21. #15
    Retro-Gamer Krawhitham's Avatar
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    Re: VottOBP

    Quote Originally Posted by Dom Heffner View Post
    A .370 slugging woth a .560 OBP...this is the weirdest start to a season I've seen....

    Someone needs to pull him aside and tell him the "I'm not going to make any outs" approach is not working.
    How is it not working?

    He has a .9 WAR same as Phillips
    He has scored 11 Runs (on pace for 111)
    The Reds will be no more that 1/2 game back after today game

    And he will start hitting better at some point

    So what is not working out?


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