Turn Off Ads?
Page 3 of 24 FirstFirst 123456713 ... LastLast
Results 31 to 45 of 350

Thread: Tony Cingrani Thread

  1. #31
    Moderator The Operator's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    Carlisle, OH
    Posts
    2,645

    Re: Tony Cingrani Thread

    He's certainly proving wrong some of the people who bemoaned the idea of Chapman going to the rotation because "A pitcher can't possibly be successful as a starter only throwing a fastball 75% of the time."

    Maybe we should make Cingrani the closer. Oh, we already have a closer?

    Then make him the DOUBLE SECRET closer!!!
    Quote Originally Posted by BCubb2003 View Post
    Don't worry. I'd say the game threads are about league average.
    2013 Reds Record when I attend: 5-4
    2012 Reds Record when I attend: 10-7

  2. Likes:

    remdog (04-24-2013), WildcatFan (04-24-2013)

  3. Turn Off Ads?
  4. #32
    I'm gettin paper Homer Bailey's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Chicago, IL
    Posts
    4,689

    Re: Tony Cingrani Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by The Operator View Post
    He's certainly proving wrong some of the people who bemoaned the idea of Chapman going to the rotation because "A pitcher can't possibly be successful as a starter only throwing a fastball 75% of the time."

    Maybe we should make Cingrani the closer. Oh, we already have a closer?

    Then make him the DOUBLE SECRET closer!!!
    Let's not get carried away. Two games doesn't "prove" anything. Nevermind the fact that his two starts were against the Marlins and the Cubs. Whether he can continue to get by with suspect secondary pitches is still very much a valid question.

    That being said, his fastball looks to obviously be a plus pitch.

  5. #33
    All work and no play..... Vottomatic's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Lebanon
    Posts
    7,067

    Re: Tony Cingrani Thread

    I've come to the conclusion that Cingrani has mastered some magical way of making the ball disappear from his hand to the catcher's glove. That's his success.
    "I can't take this homerism anymore." - 10xWSChamps, August 11, 2010. A Cardinals fan having a problem with all the homerism on Redszone. Classic.

    "Man do I miss the days where were didn't need a calculator and an encyclopedia of baseball metrics to enjoy a baseball game ... - MikeS21" - 8/2/12 game thread

  6. #34
    It's showtime! RedEye's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Atlanta, GA
    Posts
    7,939
    Are guys often able to develop major league caliber pitches while they are facing major league hitters? At this point, it seems like Cingrani has at least a plus fastball, but I wonder what he would do if his mechanics got screwed up. Seems like losing just a little of his deceptiveness could cause a steep decline in production. Curious what others think.
    "Iíll kind of have a foot on the back of my own butt. Thatís just how I do things.Ē -- Bryan Price, 10/22/2013

  7. #35
    The Boss dougdirt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    34,857

    Re: Tony Cingrani Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by RedEye View Post
    Are guys often able to develop major league caliber pitches while they are facing major league hitters? At this point, it seems like Cingrani has at least a plus fastball, but I wonder what he would do if his mechanics got screwed up. Seems like losing just a little of his deceptiveness could cause a steep decline in production. Curious what others think.
    Homer Bailey developed a split finger and slider at the Major League level.

  8. #36
    It's showtime! RedEye's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Atlanta, GA
    Posts
    7,939

    Re: Tony Cingrani Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by dougdirt View Post
    Homer Bailey developed a split finger and slider at the Major League level.
    Well, that answers my question. How many other pitches did Homer have to work with before that? Three?
    "Iíll kind of have a foot on the back of my own butt. Thatís just how I do things.Ē -- Bryan Price, 10/22/2013

  9. #37
    Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Omaha, NE
    Posts
    2,136
    Quote Originally Posted by REDREAD View Post
    When Cueto comes back, I send Cingrani down to AAA regardless of the results.
    Let him keep working on his secondary pitches down there.
    In AAA, he should be throwing the percentage of fastballs/mix of pitches that they want him to throw in the majors. Period. Even if that damages his AAA stats.


    I've been a big fan of Cingrani, but he's exceeded my expectations so far.
    I still think he can benefit from finishing the year in AAA.
    The Reds will also benefit. The season is still young. Having Cingrani stashed in AAA as a 6th starter (or late season addition to the bullpen) is an incredible weapon/insurance policy.
    Agree 110%.

    The best use for this season is keep him working regularly, and to NOT disrupt the other starters on our roster. We had a fluke of a season last year with no starters missing time, that obviously won't happen this year, we aren't trading/moving starting pitchers this year...

    Sent from my SCH-I605 using Tapatalk 2
    I think that in a year or two, one of these guys - Frazier, Dorn, Valaika, Cumberland, Stubbs - will be ready to replace Dunn. They won't hit as many home runs as Dunn, but they should have similar OPS. - 757690, July 22, 2008

    Alonso will be playing 1B for the REDS and batting 4th one year from today. - Kingspoint, July 9, 2009

  10. #38
    Stat Wanker Hodiernus RedsManRick's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Chicago, IL
    Posts
    15,898

    Re: Tony Cingrani Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by MWM View Post
    Even on TV his fastball is deceiving. I watched the first time last night and it looks like he's throwing serious gas just to have it come up at 89-90 on the radar. I'm sure it's a function of his slow windup and smooth delivery but if you just looked at him without looking at the ball you'd think he was just loosening up.

    To be able to throw it even 90 with that kind of motion/effort....or whatever you want to call it.... may have the same effect on a hitter of one several mph faster. I don't know how sustainable it is, but watching hitters react is similar to how some react to Chapman's pitches. They seemed to be swinging at a lot of bad pitches, and looking really bad in the process. It's like they just can't pick up on the ball. It's really interesting. I can't think of many pitchers that would fool even someone watching on TV.
    What stood out to me is how the ball jumped out of his hand. Maybe it's because of the way he cups his wrist early, but it just seems hard to pick up the ball from him.
    Games are won on run differential -- scoring more than your opponent. Runs are runs, scored or prevented they all count the same. Worry about scoring more and allowing fewer, not which positions contribute to which side of the equation or how "consistent" you are at your current level of performance.

  11. #39
    Member Tom Servo's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Posts
    7,135

    Re: Tony Cingrani Thread

    some Tony Cingrani pics for the Tony Cingrani thread










    "Since I've been with the Reds in 1989, we've never had a farm system this loaded," Bowden said. "If we were the New York Yankees and had unlimited dollars, we could have traded for Colon, (Jeff) Weaver, Rolen, (Cliff) Floyd, (Kenny) Rogers and Finley and gotten them all -- and still held onto our top five prospects. That's an amazing statement."

  12. #40
    It's showtime! RedEye's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Atlanta, GA
    Posts
    7,939

    Re: Tony Cingrani Thread

    If this guy pans out to be the pitcher statistically that he looks like right now, this will be a HUGE feather in the scouting department's cap. Heck, it already is. Correct me if I'm wrong, but deceptiveness of delivery is NOT currently something that stats can pick up... and that seems to be one of the biggest explanations for his success thus far.
    "Iíll kind of have a foot on the back of my own butt. Thatís just how I do things.Ē -- Bryan Price, 10/22/2013

  13. #41
    The Boss dougdirt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    34,857

    Re: Tony Cingrani Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by RedEye View Post
    If this guy pans out to be the pitcher statistically that he looks like right now, this will be a HUGE feather in the scouting department's cap. Heck, it already is. Correct me if I'm wrong, but deceptiveness of delivery is NOT currently something that stats can pick up... and that seems to be one of the biggest explanations for his success thus far.
    Being a lefty that can throw 89-95 probably has to be the biggest reasoning.

  14. #42
    It's showtime! RedEye's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Atlanta, GA
    Posts
    7,939

    Re: Tony Cingrani Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by dougdirt View Post
    Being a lefty that can throw 89-95 probably has to be the biggest reasoning.
    Right, that helps. But does just throwing 89-95 from the left hand side get you where he is? Seems like no to me. And if he doesn't have good secondary pitches, wouldn't that delivery be the x factor?
    "Iíll kind of have a foot on the back of my own butt. Thatís just how I do things.Ē -- Bryan Price, 10/22/2013

  15. #43
    Moderator The Operator's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    Carlisle, OH
    Posts
    2,645

    Re: Tony Cingrani Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Homer Bailey View Post
    Let's not get carried away. Two games doesn't "prove" anything. Nevermind the fact that his two starts were against the Marlins and the Cubs. Whether he can continue to get by with suspect secondary pitches is still very much a valid question.

    That being said, his fastball looks to obviously be a plus pitch.
    You're right, it hasn't yet poven anything - I actually meant to word it differently but was in a hurry to leave the house when I made the post.

    And I agree it still remains to be seen if he can continue to pitch so effectively, but some folks (I'm not calling you out, I can't even remember which side of that debate you were on) acted as if Chapman would never make it through the 4th inning of his first start only having 2 pitches.

    That, and I never miss an opportunity to quote Animal House.
    Quote Originally Posted by BCubb2003 View Post
    Don't worry. I'd say the game threads are about league average.
    2013 Reds Record when I attend: 5-4
    2012 Reds Record when I attend: 10-7

  16. Likes:

    Homer Bailey (04-25-2013)

  17. #44
    always ask questions bigredmechanism's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    new jersey
    Posts
    2,219

    Re: Tony Cingrani Thread

    I have a two-part question that hopefully someone can answer for me.

    What makes a lefty throwing in the low-mid 90s so much more effective than a righty throwing the same velo, and why does it seem that lefties typically don't throw as hard as righties? Obviously there are exceptions to this, but it generally seems they throw softer.
    Award Winning Baseball Player

  18. #45
    Viva la Rolen kaldaniels's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Posts
    7,797

    Re: Tony Cingrani Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by bigredmechanism View Post
    I have a two-part question that hopefully someone can answer for me.

    What makes a lefty throwing in the low-mid 90s so much more effective than a righty throwing the same velo, and why does it seem that lefties typically don't throw as hard as righties? Obviously there are exceptions to this, but it generally seems they throw softer.
    For the second question I would wager that the same percentage (very tiny) of LH and RH on the planet can throw 95+ (pick any number in the 90's). You pretty much cannot "convert to being a lefty" like batters can so the pool from which LH fireballers come from is much, much, smaller.


Turn Off Ads?

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Board Moderators may, at their discretion and judgment, delete and/or edit any messages that violate any of the following guidelines: 1. Explicit references to alleged illegal or unlawful acts. 2. Graphic sexual descriptions. 3. Racial or ethnic slurs. 4. Use of edgy language (including masked profanity). 5. Direct personal attacks, flames, fights, trolling, baiting, name-calling, general nuisance, excessive player criticism or anything along those lines. 6. Posting spam. 7. Each person may have only one user account. It is fine to be critical here - that's what this board is for. But let's not beat a subject or a player to death, please.

Thank you, and most importantly, enjoy yourselves!


RedsZone.com is a privately owned website and is not affiliated with the Cincinnati Reds or Major League Baseball


Contact us: Boss | GIK | BCubb2003 | dabvu2498 | Gallen5862 | LexRedsFan | Plus Plus | RedlegJake | redsfan1995 | The Operator | Tommyjohn25