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Thread: The "age" of diva umpires

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  1. #1
    Five Tool Fool jojo's Avatar
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    The "age" of diva umpires

    Adam Wells reacts to a confrontation between Bryce Harper and John Hirschbeck by apparently asking "if player's should just shut up and play the game, shouldn't umps just shut up and call the game?".

    http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1...l%20&hpt=hp_t5

    After a few more seconds of Harper talking and tossing his helmet down, Hirschbeck decided that he wanted to toss the 20-year-old out of the game just to send a message.

    And if that sounds like an exaggeration, here is what Hirschbeck told the Washington Post after the game:

    "I didnít like that he put his hands up with the bat. Thatís kind of what I yelled at him. He continued and threw his bat. I kind of pointed like, ĎThatís equipment.í And then, he still continued and slammed his helmet down. Thatís when I ejected him.

    I was actually just being nice. Even the hands up in the air is showing me up, to me. I could have ejected him right then. I was nice enough to leave him in the game"
    "This isnít stats vs scouts - this is stats and scouts working together, building an organization that blends the best of both worlds. This is the blueprint for how a baseball organization should be run. And, whether the baseball men of the 20th century like it or not, this is where baseball is going."---Dave Cameron, U.S.S. Mariner

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  3. #2
    Member dunner13's Avatar
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    Re: The "age" of diva umpires

    I think umps could get away with this kind of stuff 30 years ago but today fans are paying a lot of money to come see superstar players play the whole game, I'm sure there were a lot of very upset Nationals fans that came just to see Harper that game. Theres to much money in the game for players to be getting thrown out for showing a little bit of emotion. Umps need to get thicker skin.

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  5. #3
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    Re: The "age" of diva umpires

    Quote Originally Posted by dunner13 View Post
    I think umps could get away with this kind of stuff 30 years ago but today fans are paying a lot of money to come see superstar players play the whole game, I'm sure there were a lot of very upset Nationals fans that came just to see Harper that game. Theres to much money in the game for players to be getting thrown out for showing a little bit of emotion. Umps need to get thicker skin.
    Did they pay to see Harper act like a brat?

    Throw your bat and helmet? That's a clown move, bro.

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    Member jimbo's Avatar
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    Re: The "age" of diva umpires

    Meh, I think it's much more accurate to say it's the "age" of diva sports columnists.

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    Most of them seem to be power-abusing clowns. The game will be far better off without them when they're finally able to be replaced.
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    He has also taught me that even when the Reds win it is important to focus on the fact that they could have lost.

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  11. #6
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    Re: The "age" of diva umpires

    The ump was just being nice.
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  12. #7
    Be the ball Roy Tucker's Avatar
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    Re: The "age" of diva umpires

    I think players have a share of that diva quality these days as well.

    Pay attention to the open sky

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    Re: The "age" of diva umpires

    I like umps, I like people complaining about them as if they are the first to be the ones complaining

    Mother, may I slug the umpire
    May I slug him right away?
    So he cannot be here, Mother
    When the clubs begin to play?
    Let me clasp his throat, dear mother,
    In a dear delightful grip
    With one hand and with the other
    Bat him several in the lip.

    Let me climb his frame, dear mother,
    While the happy people shout;
    I'll not kill him, dearest mother,
    I will only knock him out.

    Let men mop the ground up, Mother,
    With his person, dearest do;
    If the ground can stand it, Mother,
    I don't see why you can't too.

    Mother, may I slug the umpire,
    Slug him right between the eyes?
    If you let me do it, Mother
    You shall have the champion prize.

    Chicago Tribune 1886:

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  16. #9
    THAT'S A FACT JACK!! GAC's Avatar
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    Re: The "age" of diva umpires

    Quote Originally Posted by westofyou View Post
    I like umps, I like people complaining about them as if they are the first to be the ones complaining
    I like those "imperfect" umps too. But the perfect always strives to eradicate the imperfect.

    I say we replace the fans with machines.

    Lessens from Karn Evil 9....

    I am all there is
    Negative! primitive! limited! I let you live!
    But I gave you life
    What else could you do?
    To do what was right
    I'm perfect! are you?

    Besides, replacing the umps won't lessen fan complaining either. There's still the players, manager, GM, owner, base coaches, trainers, team physician, bat boy, mascot, and concession prices.


    Captain Kirk needed his pain.... and fans need to complain. LOL
    "panic" only comes from having real expectations

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    Re: The "age" of diva umpires

    i was just commenting the other day to a friend that it seems umpires let players whine a lot more about balls and strikes than ever before in my 30 years of watching baseball...this was after one of choos at bats

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    Re: The "age" of diva umpires

    There's nothing wrong with umpire/player altercations.

    The umpires need to assert their authority every once in awhile. Players can't be able to yell at umps while the umps have to act like the British guard. Of course certain situations can get out of hand for both sides but there's nothing different about this than what was happening back in the day. If anything, it's gotten better. I believe A LOT of stuff went undocumented in the past therefore we have an impression there were less back and forth between ump/player.

    The "fans paid to see the superstars" is a bull argument. That's arguing a superstar should get special treatment over average players. The umpires are a neutral presence between two teams. If you don't like them, then you can go play MLB The Show.

  20. #12
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    Re: The "age" of diva umpires

    Quote Originally Posted by Trajinous View Post
    There's nothing wrong with umpire/player altercations.



    The "fans paid to see the superstars" is a bull argument. That's arguing a superstar should get special treatment over average players. .
    The NBA has built their league based on this premis.
    I was in the ORG once, best 6 months of my life.

  21. #13
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    Re: The "age" of diva umpires

    MLB umps are absolutely the worst professional referees in sports and absolutely the most arrogant and powerful. The game really needs to move towards lessening their power and role in baseball. Would love to see the game eliminate 1-2 umps per game. The technology exists to do that right now. Or at the very least institute some type of challenge system like so many other pro sports already have (ie NFL and Tennis). Their calls are relatively easy compared to what NBA and NFL refs have to deal with and yet they seem to get a large proportion of calls wrong all the time..

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  23. #14
    For a Level Playing Field RedFanAlways1966's Avatar
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    Re: The "age" of diva umpires

    Rule 9.02(a) Comment: Players leaving their position in the field or on base, or managers or coaches leaving the bench or coaches box, to argue on BALLS AND STRIKES will not be permitted. They should be warned if they start for the plate to protest the call. If they continue, they will be ejected from the game.
    I think umpires tolerate a lot in regard to ball and strike calls. Batters/players say things and some make it obvious with body language that they are not happy. However, we rarely see ejections for this despite what is clearly written in the rulebook.

    Now let me say a thing or two about the author of the link, Adam Wells...

    Home plate umpire Bob Davidson asked for help from third base umpire John Hirschbeck, who has a history with players on teams managed by Davey Johnson.
    A history? Hirschbeck was the umpire that was spit in the face by Roberto Alomar in 1996. A Baltimore team managed by Davey Johnson. There is that HISTORY.

    Hirschbeck decided that he wanted to toss the 20-year-old out of the game just to send a message.
    Just to send a message? Really. I do not read that in Hirschbeck's comments regarding the ejection for violating rule 9.02(a). Perhaps Harper got THE MESSAGE that he violated rule 9.02(a). And perhaps his manager/coaches will send him A MESSAGE that one AB is not as important as the 3-4 add'l ABs he'll have for their team.

    Me thinks Wells wants to send a message that he does not like umpires and is doing a poor job of making his point. Too bad this young journalist does not have a rule 9.02(a) that ejects him for poorly written articles.
    Small market fan... always hoping, but never expecting.

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  25. #15
    Flash the leather! _Sir_Charles_'s Avatar
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    Re: The "age" of diva umpires

    Quote Originally Posted by RedFanAlways1966 View Post
    I think umpires tolerate a lot in regard to ball and strike calls. Batters/players say things and some make it obvious with body language that they are not happy. However, we rarely see ejections for this despite what is clearly written in the rulebook.

    Now let me say a thing or two about the author of the link, Adam Wells...



    A history? Hirschbeck was the umpire that was spit in the face by Roberto Alomar in 1996. A Baltimore team managed by Davey Johnson. There is that HISTORY.



    Just to send a message? Really. I do not read that in Hirschbeck's comments regarding the ejection for violating rule 9.02(a). Perhaps Harper got THE MESSAGE that he violated rule 9.02(a). And perhaps his manager/coaches will send him A MESSAGE that one AB is not as important as the 3-4 add'l ABs he'll have for their team.

    Me thinks Wells wants to send a message that he does not like umpires and is doing a poor job of making his point. Too bad this young journalist does not have a rule 9.02(a) that ejects him for poorly written articles.
    I can't like this one enough. I get it that fans get mad at umps. That's NEVER going to change. But players getting mad and showing it is a whole different thing. The assertions in that article are just flat out laughable.

    The people that argue that MLB umps are the worst officials in professional sports...need to reevaluate that assessment. The quality of umps today compared to what it was even just 20 years ago is astounding IMO. And today's players get away with quite a bit more than they used to as well. I'm not an "umpire apologist"...I'm just not going to side with the fans and players blindly is all. The argument "just get the call right" is much easier said than done...and almost always said by someone who's never even attempted to "just get the call right" first hand.
    2014 predictions:
    99-63 WS champs (Cards take 2nd WC, Mil 3rd, Pit 4th, Chi 5th)
    Bruce/Votto neck and neck MVP race (neither takes it)
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