Cingrani and the bullpen

[Kc61]

Ondrusek, Hoover, Simon, Parra are useful relievers, but without Marshall the Reds' front line of relief is a little thin.

I'm not advocating bringing Cingrani up now. Repeat. I'm not advocating bringing Cingrani up now.

But after some AAA time, if Marshall isn't back, or maybe even if he is --

Isn't Cingrani the best choice to fill out the bullpen this year for the stretch drive?

Not suggesting a full switch to the pen. He's a starter next year.

But maybe winning this year is important too, and maybe after some time in AAA to work on secondary pitches -- say like July 1 -- Cingrani could make a big impact as a reliever on the Reds.

Just for 2013.

[hebroncougar]

I think he should come up now. But I know fans are going to scream Chapman part II. I want the Reds to go all the way this year.

[Tony Cloninger]

Ondrusek, Hoover, Simon, Parra are useful relievers, but without Marshall the Reds' front line of relief is a little thin.

I'm not advocating bringing Cingrani up now. Repeat. I'm not advocating bringing Cingrani up now.

But after some AAA time, if Marshall isn't back, or maybe even if he is --

Isn't Cingrani the best choice to fill out the bullpen this year for the stretch drive?

Not suggesting a full switch to the pen. He's a starter next year.

But maybe winning this year is important too, and maybe after some time in AAA to work on secondary pitches -- say like July 1 -- Cingrani could make a big impact as a reliever on the Reds.

Just for 2013.

Mike Flanagan
Scott McGregor
Orel
Pedro
They all did the bullpen thing before they became full time starters.
They do not need him to start this year unless there is an injury.
However....there is still time to get some useful LH to help the bullpen.

I still DO NOT understand though why Chapman cannot pitch in 3 straight games....ever?
Hoover would have been in the 8th.... even if Logan had been fine previously...and had 2 outs...he is liable to implode at anytime.

As wacky as Vottomatic can be.....he did have a point as to why a team that has starters go into the 7th innings just about every game and usually go 7....has a bullpen that is this tired?

[Always Red]

Mike Flanagan
Scott McGregor
Orel
Pedro
They all did the bullpen thing before they became full time starters.
They do not need him to start this year unless there is an injury.
However....there is still time to get some useful LH to help the bullpen.

I still DO NOT understand though why Chapman cannot pitch in 3 straight games....ever?
Hoover would have been in the 8th.... even if Logan had been fine previously...and had 2 outs...he is liable to implode at anytime.

As wacky as Vottomatic can be.....he did have a point as to why a team that has starters go into the 7th innings just about every game and usually go 7....has a bullpen that is this tired?

Yep, Don Gullett did it too.

[Kc61]

Mike Flanagan
Scott McGregor
Orel
Pedro
They all did the bullpen thing before they became full time starters.
They do not need him to start this year unless there is an injury.
However....there is still time to get some useful LH to help the bullpen.

I still DO NOT understand though why Chapman cannot pitch in 3 straight games....ever?
Hoover would have been in the 8th.... even if Logan had been fine previously...and had 2 outs...he is liable to implode at anytime.

As wacky as Vottomatic can be.....he did have a point as to why a team that has starters go into the 7th innings just about every game and usually go 7....has a bullpen that is this tired?

There may be time to get a useful LH to help the bullpen. But I think Cingrani can be more than useful. His K rate would work great in the bullpen against all kinds of hitting and he could pitch multiple innings.

The point about a tired bullpen? Maybe it's because Dusty really trusts very few of these guys in big innings. Hoover is now 0-4. Ondrusek blows up once in a while. Parra is Parra. Simon is a long man. Lecure seems to need much rest.

In thinking of how to help, Cingrani looks like a good short term answer to me.

[Tony Cloninger]

There may be time to get a useful LH to help the bullpen. But I think Cingrani can be more than useful. His K rate would work great in the bullpen against all kinds of hitting and he could pitch multiple innings.

The point about a tired bullpen? Maybe it's because Dusty really trusts very few of these guys in big innings. Hoover is now 0-4. Ondrusek blows up once in a while. Parra is Parra. Simon is a long man. Lecure seems to need much rest.

In thinking of how to help, Cingrani looks like a good short term answer to me.

Well I am all for TC doing it. He does not need more than that 1 good pitch he has to do it as well.

They also do need to have Lutz play full time at AAA and get a RH bat.

This allows Dusty the ability to bat a LH 2nd....or the RH....but either way....flexibility against that pesky LOOGY that keeps Dusty up at night.

[smixsell]

Ondrusek, Hoover, Simon, Parra are useful relievers, but without Marshall the Reds' front line of relief is a little thin.

I'm not advocating bringing Cingrani up now. Repeat. I'm not advocating bringing Cingrani up now.

But after some AAA time, if Marshall isn't back, or maybe even if he is --

Isn't Cingrani the best choice to fill out the bullpen this year for the stretch drive?

Not suggesting a full switch to the pen. He's a starter next year.

But maybe winning this year is important too, and maybe after some time in AAA to work on secondary pitches -- say like July 1 -- Cingrani could make a big impact as a reliever on the Reds.

Just for 2013.

Totally agree. If Marshall does go down long term, I think we WILL eventually see Cingrani called up and put in the pen.

[mth123]

I wanted Cingrani on the opening day roster pitching out of the pen. He does need work on secondary stuff, so I get the hesitation. I like the July 1 deadline. They'd probably bring him up to be eligible for the post-season anyway. I still think they should go get a reliever.

As for today, this game was lost yesterday. The Reds have 4 trustworthy relievers right now. There should always be 2 available. Three run lead going into the 9th yesterday. Seemed like a time to use Simon and keep Chapman on the shelf. Then today could have been Hoover in the 8th and Chapman in the 9th. The Cubs announcers were questioning why in the world Dusty would burn Chapman with a 3 run lead.

The bigger worry IMO is that not only is Marshall hurting, but Broxton doesn't look quite right to me either. Hoover/Cingrani may be the late inning set-up guys by the All Star break. I'd go after an arm no matter what. Bigger need than LF IMO.

[reds44]

Another starter will go down at some point in Cingrani will be needed in the rotation.

Leave him where he is. Don't overreact from one game.

[mth123]

Another starter will go down at some point in Cingrani will be needed in the rotation.

Leave him where he is. Don't overreact from one game.

That's why the July 1 idea. Let him start in AAA and work on secondary stuff for another month. If a starter goes down after he comes up, it won't take more than a game or two to stretch him out. Let him piggyback with another guy and go three. Next time he goes 5. Then, he's all ready to go.

Used to be a pretty common way to go about things before the days of rehab assignments.

The problem is that it isn't one game. Marshall has been hurting all season and Broxton doesn't look right.

[757690]

I wanted Cingrani on the opening day roster pitching out of the pen. He does need work on secondary stuff, so I get the hesitation. I like the July 1 deadline. They'd probably bring him up to be eligible for the post-season anyway. I still think they should go get a reliever.

As for today, this game was lost yesterday. The Reds have 4 trustworthy relievers right now. There should always be 2 available. Three run lead going into the 9th yesterday. Seemed like a time to use Simon and keep Chapman on the shelf. Then today could have been Hoover in the 8th and Chapman in the 9th. The Cubs announcers were questioning why in the world Dusty would burn Chapman with a 3 run lead.

The bigger worry IMO is that not only is Marshall hurting, but Broxton doesn't look quite right to me either. Hoover/Cingrani may be the late inning set-up guys by the All Star break. I'd go after an arm no matter what. Bigger need than LF IMO.

I have no problem with the July 1st deadline for Cingrani.

Concerning yesterday's and today's games: both were three run leads. If Simon or Ondrusek were fine to protect a three run lead yesterday, why weren't they fine to protect one today?

[Red Swagger]

I would DL Broxton and rest him, he looks awful, no velocity and no breaking balls.

I would DFA Parra and send down Ondrusek.

I would call up Cingrani, Freeman and Arredondo(after the suspension)

Bullpen:

Chapman
LeCure
Hoover
Cingrani
Simon
Arredondo
Freeman

Dusty needs to QUIT BLOWING Chapman in a 3 R ballgame, Logan had NO business facing Soriano, Simon or Hoover should have came in, Dusty is the worst bullpen manager in the game of baseball

[mth123]

I have no problem with the July 1st deadline for Cingrani.

Concerning yesterday's and today's games: both were three run leads. If Simon or Ondrusek were fine to protect a three run lead yesterday, why weren't they fine to protect one today?

Because yesterday you had Chapman available if you need to go get him. Today they were all you had and no one to bail them out and were stuck living with it.

[757690]

Because yesterday you had Chapman available if you need to go get him. Today they were all you had and no one to bail them out and were stuck living with it.

So they blow it, Chapman comes in and saves it (maybe), and then you have no one to pitch the next day.

Play to win to today, you have no idea what will happen tomorrow.

[smixsell]

Another starter will go down at some point in Cingrani will be needed in the rotation.

Leave him where he is. Don't overreact from one game.

Your assuming that our responses are related to today's game. Mine is not. Cingrani has a great arm, and can contribute this season out of the pen w/out unduly damaging his future as a starter. I was thinking that we would see him in the 'pen during the stretch drive and playoffs before the season even started.