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Thread: On the declining quality of the ORG

  1. #46
    It's showtime! RedEye's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Larry Schuler View Post
    In my opinion, if "bad" threads or posts stick out like a sore thumb and many users are identifying it, that means the quality is high. If there were no complaints, that would mean the quality level was low and not being sunken below.

    I think the effective discussion should be what to do when low quality posts emerge, not whether this is an epidemic that will destroy the board or whether the board itself has lost quality. Bad posts happen. Deal with them appropriately. All talk beyond those points seem more like an opportunity to reminisce about the quality of years past or to share personal anecdotes about how the board has let them down.

    As I said, it takes a high quality board for a handful of bad threads to stick out so sorely. They will never disappear completely and moderation is a necessary part of a high quality forum.
    This makes a lot of sense. I particularly like your dictum "bad posts happen."
    "Iíll kind of have a foot on the back of my own butt. Thatís just how I do things.Ē -- Bryan Price, 10/22/2013

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  3. #47
    Member klw's Avatar
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    Re: On the declining quality of the ORG

    Quote Originally Posted by RedEye View Post

    That said, our main offender (RedTruck) seems to have disappeared. So maybe the most egregious problem has passed for now.
    I can't find a red truck listed on the member list, fwiw.

  4. #48
    On the brink wolfboy's Avatar
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    Re: On the declining quality of the ORG

    Quote Originally Posted by Larry Schuler View Post
    In my opinion, if "bad" threads or posts stick out like a sore thumb and many users are identifying it, that means the quality is high. If there were no complaints, that would mean the quality level was low and not being sunken below.

    I think the effective discussion should be what to do when low quality posts emerge, not whether this is an epidemic that will destroy the board or whether the board itself has lost quality. Bad posts happen. Deal with them appropriately. All talk beyond those points seem more like an opportunity to reminisce about the quality of years past or to share personal anecdotes about how the board has let them down.

    As I said, it takes a high quality board for a handful of bad threads to stick out so sorely. They will never disappear completely and moderation is a necessary part of a high quality forum.
    Three whole paragraphs to smugly mock everyone that's chimed in on this topic? A bit verbose don't you think?
    How do we know he's not Mel Torme?

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  6. #49
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    Re: On the declining quality of the ORG

    I'm sorry you read my post that way.
    Cincinnati Reds 2014 W-L Record: 76.6-85.4*

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  7. #50
    Et tu, Brutus? Brutus's Avatar
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    Re: On the declining quality of the ORG

    Quote Originally Posted by westofyou View Post
    If it can be done in jest what's the problem?

    If it's done with a mean spirit then yeah it's non productive.

    One thing I hate is when a user creates a thread that poses a question and then never enters the thread again to participate. If one throws a ball in the air that is covered in gunk then they should try and catch it too.

    Rather than sit back and let the fur fly.
    I'm often annoyed by the opposite extreme... when someone starts a thread with a question (even if it was meant to be rhetorical), then chastises people that disagree with the original premise as though it's taboo to disagree with and discuss the thread's contents.

    I think the merger has largely been successful as the depth of discussions has picked up. But I do agree with RedEye in that there seems to be a trend toward more people putting their feet in the sand and firmly positioning themselves while striking at those that don't join them. The mocking of Baker, certain players and certain ideals seems to be going a bit overboard recently.
    "No matter how good you are, you're going to lose one-third of your games. No matter how bad you are you're going to win one-third of your games. It's the other third that makes the difference." ~Tommy Lasorda

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  9. #51
    On the brink wolfboy's Avatar
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    Re: On the declining quality of the ORG

    Quote Originally Posted by Brutus View Post
    I'm often annoyed by the opposite extreme... when someone starts a thread with a question (even if it was meant to be rhetorical), then chastises people that disagree with the original premise as though it's taboo to disagree with and discuss the thread's contents.

    I think the merger has largely been successful as the depth of discussions has picked up. But I do agree with RedEye in that there seems to be a trend toward more people putting their feet in the sand and firmly positioning themselves while striking at those that don't join them. The mocking of Baker, certain players and certain ideals seems to be going a bit overboard recently.
    I'd almost characterize these as timeless traditions on Redszone. I can be a little oblivious sometimes, but I haven't noticed an uptick in these types of threads lately. In fact, it seems like I haven't seen a "we should stone Dusty in the streets" thread in a while.
    How do we know he's not Mel Torme?

  10. #52
    Et tu, Brutus? Brutus's Avatar
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    Re: On the declining quality of the ORG

    Quote Originally Posted by wolfboy View Post
    I'd almost characterize these as timeless traditions on Redszone. I can be a little oblivious sometimes, but I haven't noticed an uptick in these types of threads lately. In fact, it seems like I haven't seen a "we should stone Dusty in the streets" thread in a while.
    Heck, there's a thread ongoing right now that is tarring and feathering Dusty (again):

    http://www.redszone.com/forums/showthread.php?t=101595
    "No matter how good you are, you're going to lose one-third of your games. No matter how bad you are you're going to win one-third of your games. It's the other third that makes the difference." ~Tommy Lasorda

  11. #53
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    Re: On the declining quality of the ORG

    Quote Originally Posted by Brutus View Post
    Heck, there's a thread ongoing right now that is tarring and feathering Dusty (again):

    http://www.redszone.com/forums/showthread.php?t=101595
    Which one?
    Last edited by dubc47834; 05-31-2013 at 07:42 PM. Reason: Nevermind...Im an idiot....I followed the link....LOL

  12. #54
    It's showtime! RedEye's Avatar
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    Re: On the declining quality of the ORG

    Quote Originally Posted by Brutus View Post
    Heck, there's a thread ongoing right now that is tarring and feathering Dusty (again):

    http://www.redszone.com/forums/showthread.php?t=101595
    How is holding Dusty responsible for the consequences of his own words a tarring and feathering? Really now, let's not be dramatic.
    "Iíll kind of have a foot on the back of my own butt. Thatís just how I do things.Ē -- Bryan Price, 10/22/2013

  13. #55
    Et tu, Brutus? Brutus's Avatar
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    Re: On the declining quality of the ORG

    Quote Originally Posted by RedEye View Post
    How is holding Dusty responsible for the consequences of his own words a tarring and feathering? Really now, let's not be dramatic.
    It's a tired act. People beat the thing to death everytime Dusty remotely contextualizes anything they don't agree with. This board obsesses with finding any quote they can that paints Dusty as an archaic, walks-hating, position stereo-typing hack that can't manage his way out of a paper bag.

    I mean really, your response was "holding Dusty responsible for the consequences of his own words."

    Consequences? What are the consequences? What do his words have to do with anything? Hurting feelings of fans on Redszone that he doesn't have the same exact philosophy to baseball? That he doesn't express his philosophy as eloquently as some? That he doesn't back up his words with a SABR stat? Why does he need to be "held responsible" for his words? Don't his wins and losses do that for him?

    That whole thread is dramatic. Every thread on Dusty winds up being dramatic. People huff and puff over Dusty's every words as if he is telling every Reds' hitter to not draw walks. It's, to use your term, "dramatic." Every game thread on this board winds up venting the same complaints and hand-wringing over his every move. It's, again, "dramatic."
    Last edited by Brutus; 06-01-2013 at 06:03 PM.
    "No matter how good you are, you're going to lose one-third of your games. No matter how bad you are you're going to win one-third of your games. It's the other third that makes the difference." ~Tommy Lasorda

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  15. #56
    breath westofyou's Avatar
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    Dead on, on Redszone the respect for real experience in the game is woefully underrated with a consistent air of disdain that is deafening.

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  17. #57
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    Re: On the declining quality of the ORG

    I think one problem is there's a few really condescending posters who feel it's their mission to win every thread and belittle anyone who doesn't share their exact opinion. The Choo/Votto OBP thread is the most recent example. I've been posting on internet message boards for 20 years and I've never seen anything like it. Whatever happened to just giving your opinion and leaving it at that?
    "I talked to an advance scout that told me if Joey Votto and Albert Pujols were on the same team he'd advise his team to do the unthinkable...pitch around Votto to get to Pujols." - Buster Olney, ESPN

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  19. #58
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    Re: On the declining quality of the ORG

    Quote Originally Posted by New York Red View Post
    I think one problem is there's a few really condescending posters who feel it's their mission to win every thread and belittle anyone who doesn't share their exact opinion. The Choo/Votto OBP thread is the most recent example. I've been posting on internet message boards for 20 years and I've never seen anything like it. Whatever happened to just giving your opinion and leaving it at that?
    Thank you!!! I tried the Agree to disagree with the guy and he just keeps on going!

  20. #59
    Five Tool Fool jojo's Avatar
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    Re: On the declining quality of the ORG

    I dont see the point of using threads like this to post shots at people.... If people know who a poster is openly criticizing, the PM function was probably a more appropriate place to post the thoughts IMHO.

    Use the ignore function if its going to get personal. And no, it's not on the other guy if one isnt disciplined enough to keep from responding (and seeing an ignored poster quoted isnt a valid reason to reengage).

    But ya, in this day and age it's tough to view an argument about the value of OBP as an argument that is actually about OBP. We know how extremely important getting on base is to scoring and the effect is demonstratably quantifiable.

    Can a hitter be too passive? Yes. Can a hitter be too aggressive? Yes. Do the best hitters tend to swing at fewer pitches out of the strikezone? Yes. Is it a shocker that hitters like Votto tend to wlk a lot? No.

    What the heck was the argument in that thread about again?

    IMHO the constant battle between old shool and sabermetrics is one of the most played and tired memes on any baseball discussion board. It's like watching a reality tv show starring an old married couple that bicker their day away.
    Last edited by jojo; 06-01-2013 at 10:10 PM.
    "This isnít stats vs scouts - this is stats and scouts working together, building an organization that blends the best of both worlds. This is the blueprint for how a baseball organization should be run. And, whether the baseball men of the 20th century like it or not, this is where baseball is going."---Dave Cameron, U.S.S. Mariner

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  22. #60
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    Re: On the declining quality of the ORG

    Quote Originally Posted by RedEye View Post
    Sorry about that -- it was totally meant as a clever jest, not as a personal affront, but I certainly see how you could have read it that way! Sometimes tone is hard to read in this format; I got carried away and should have been more respectful of that fact.

    I agree that the problem has been around for awhile, but before the merger it was more a problem of a lack of interesting threads and conversations. Now we have the threads and conversations, but I'm not sure quality has come along with quantity.

    That said, our main offender (RedTruck) seems to have disappeared. So maybe the most egregious problem has passed for now.
    No apology needed .


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