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Thread: On the declining quality of the ORG

  1. #271
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    Re: On the declining quality of the ORG

    can i say something? I know i rarely post. But ive been here since the original exodus from the Cincinnati enquirer exodus (98ish?) i went by rijo then... I know the original reason for this site was to leave behind all the trolling and just have the fans and enjoy each others company and leave the drama. We wanted members who actually add value to the community and not post dribble. But I gotta say something... this forum is really not fun anymore. The rules in order to protect the community makes this a hierarchical bore. There are a handful of threads which are 20 pages long in which people continually argue which stats or baseball methodologies are more valuable or not. A few posters seem to need to validate or dismiss every comment by lesser posters. I have to read through 30 back pages just to get to resent conversation about a players progress. It's like Lawyer Baseball and it sucks. You shouldnt have to be a sabermetric deity or 15 year old veteran to be on this sight.

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  4. #272
    Five Tool Fool jojo's Avatar
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    Re: On the declining quality of the ORG

    Have you tried unsubscribing from those "handful" of threads and putting those "few" posters on ignore?
    "This isn’t stats vs scouts - this is stats and scouts working together, building an organization that blends the best of both worlds. This is the blueprint for how a baseball organization should be run. And, whether the baseball men of the 20th century like it or not, this is where baseball is going."---Dave Cameron, U.S.S. Mariner

  5. #273
    Member jimbo's Avatar
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    Re: On the declining quality of the ORG

    Quote Originally Posted by hatcher View Post
    can i say something? I know i rarely post. But ive been here since the original exodus from the Cincinnati enquirer exodus (98ish?) i went by rijo then... I know the original reason for this site was to leave behind all the trolling and just have the fans and enjoy each others company and leave the drama. We wanted members who actually add value to the community and not post dribble. But I gotta say something... this forum is really not fun anymore. The rules in order to protect the community makes this a hierarchical bore. There are a handful of threads which are 20 pages long in which people continually argue which stats or baseball methodologies are more valuable or not. A few posters seem to need to validate or dismiss every comment by lesser posters. I have to read through 30 back pages just to get to resent conversation about a players progress. It's like Lawyer Baseball and it sucks. You shouldnt have to be a sabermetric deity or 15 year old veteran to be on this sight.
    Spot on. The ORG has become a very unfriendly environment. There is a select veteran group who polices it with a mob mentality. There are many members who no longer post there, and I think it's a direct result of this. Unfortunate, as IMO, this group is pretty small when considering the number of redszone members there are. I'm sure I'll get pounced on for this opinion, but I'm guessing there are many who feel the same way but are afraid to say it.

    I still come here first for Reds news, but not so much for the discussion anymore.

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  7. #274
    Five Tool Fool jojo's Avatar
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    Re: On the declining quality of the ORG

    The redszone 10 have always ruled by fear and mob intimidation. Don't let them smell your fear. It only makes it worse.
    "This isn’t stats vs scouts - this is stats and scouts working together, building an organization that blends the best of both worlds. This is the blueprint for how a baseball organization should be run. And, whether the baseball men of the 20th century like it or not, this is where baseball is going."---Dave Cameron, U.S.S. Mariner

  8. #275
    RaisorZone Raisor's Avatar
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    Re: On the declining quality of the ORG

    Quote Originally Posted by jojo View Post
    The redszone 10 have always ruled by fear and mob intimidation. Don't let them smell your fear. It only makes it worse.
    The first rule about the RZ 10 is you don't talk about the RZ 10.

  9. #276
    Potential Lunch Winner Dom Heffner's Avatar
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    Re: On the declining quality of the ORG

    I tried to have it expanded to 11 and was promptly shown the door.

  10. #277
    Five Tool Fool jojo's Avatar
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    Re: On the declining quality of the ORG

    Quote Originally Posted by Raisor View Post
    The first rule about the RZ 10 is you don't talk about the RZ 10.
    Not being in the _______, I have not had access to it's bylaws.
    "This isn’t stats vs scouts - this is stats and scouts working together, building an organization that blends the best of both worlds. This is the blueprint for how a baseball organization should be run. And, whether the baseball men of the 20th century like it or not, this is where baseball is going."---Dave Cameron, U.S.S. Mariner

  11. #278
    RaisorZone Raisor's Avatar
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    Re: On the declining quality of the ORG

    Quote Originally Posted by jojo View Post
    Not being in the _______, I have not had access to it's bylaws.
    It's actually easy to join the RZ 10. As treasurer I'm are arrangement could be made$$$$

  12. #279
    Member Sea Ray's Avatar
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    Re: On the declining quality of the ORG

    Quote Originally Posted by jimbo View Post
    Spot on. The ORG has become a very unfriendly environment. There is a select veteran group who polices it with a mob mentality. There are many members who no longer post there, and I think it's a direct result of this. Unfortunate, as IMO, this group is pretty small when considering the number of redszone members there are. I'm sure I'll get pounced on for this opinion, but I'm guessing there are many who feel the same way but are afraid to say it.

    I still come here first for Reds news, but not so much for the discussion anymore.
    It's clear from the posts that followed how seriously folks want to address this issue

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  14. #280
    Five Tool Fool jojo's Avatar
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    Re: On the declining quality of the ORG

    Quote Originally Posted by Sea Ray View Post
    It's clear from the posts that followed how seriously folks want to address this issue
    People come to discussion boards to engage in many different levels of discussion. It seems like a fairly predictable result that environments like the ORG which have a pretty lofty mission statement concerning content and fairly strong moderation might not be for everyone. Likewise for the various and evolving strategies that the site owners have used in attempts to create an environment that accomplishes the mission statement-people complained about the segregation, the point system, the voting system, the current system etc. By and large, this place will change just as a matter of fact and some won't like it. But also, by and large, how "fun" this lace seems to be is also determined in part by how fun the Reds actually are in a given season. From my stand point, the latest permutation hasn't made the ORG any less (or more) "friendly". But it probably has led to lower quality content. And I'd also suggest this.....there probably isn't a moderated baseball discussion board on the internet where sabermetrics isn't becoming a more signifincant part of the discussion.

    If an individual's enjoyment of this place is ruined by a handful of threads and a few posters or a "select veteran group", then solutions to address "this issue" already exist in the form of judicious use of the subscription and ignore functions coupled with a little personal discipline.

    I'd also add this to "the discussion". The ORG is a community constructed from a mission statement and an investment in moderation made by selected members of the community. It, as a community, depends upon member-contributed content. If the forum isn't fun anymore for any particular member due to the type of content on the site, then the most effective way to address "the issue" is for the individual to contribute interesting content that stimulates the type of dicsussions they want to participate in.... It's a fun fad to pick on sabermetric prone users and opine about how advanced stats are ruining everything but one thing that can't be criticized is the amount of thought/work that such posts/users put into such content when they post. The whole irony is that the ORG is named after a former member whose content was anything but sabermetric.... The lesson? Bring something to the table and you'll definitely find an audience and a forum for discussion. Despite all of the criticisms about the board structure over the years and the increasing prevelance of stats in discussions, this point still remains completely valid.

    Concerning the "posts that followed", friendly banter is now making the ORG unfriendly? Besides, we all know the mythical redszone 10 is simply cover for the fact that it's Raisor that completely runs the show.

    Frankly, I blame Raisor.
    Last edited by jojo; 05-28-2014 at 12:27 PM.
    "This isn’t stats vs scouts - this is stats and scouts working together, building an organization that blends the best of both worlds. This is the blueprint for how a baseball organization should be run. And, whether the baseball men of the 20th century like it or not, this is where baseball is going."---Dave Cameron, U.S.S. Mariner

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  16. #281
    Did we just become BFF's dubc47834's Avatar
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    Re: On the declining quality of the ORG

    Quote Originally Posted by Raisor View Post
    The first rule about the RZ 10 is you don't talk about the RZ 10.
    Who's this Redszone 10 people speak of???

  17. #282
    Did we just become BFF's dubc47834's Avatar
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    Re: On the declining quality of the ORG

    Quote Originally Posted by jojo View Post
    People come to discussion boards to engage in many different levels of discussion. It seems like a fairly predictable result that environments like the ORG which have a pretty lofty mission statement concerning content and fairly strong moderation might not be for everyone. Likewise for the various and evolving strategies that the site owners have used in attempts to create an environment that accomplishes the mission statement-people complained about the segregation, the point system, the voting system, the current system etc. By and large, this place will change just as a matter of fact and some won't like it. But also, by and large, how "fun" this lace seems to be is also determined in part by how fun the Reds actually are in a given season. From my stand point, the latest permutation hasn't made the ORG any less (or more) "friendly". But it probably has led to lower quality content. And I'd also suggest this.....there probably isn't a moderated baseball discussion board on the internet where sabermetrics isn't becoming a more signifincant part of the discussion.

    If an individual's enjoyment of this place is ruined by a handful of threads and a few posters or a "select veteran group", then solutions to address "this issue" already exist in the form of judicious use of the subscription and ignore functions coupled with a little personal discipline.

    I'd also add this to "the discussion". The ORG is a community constructed from a mission statement and an investment in moderation made by selected members of the community. It, as a community, depends upon member-contributed content. If the forum isn't fun anymore for any particular member due to the type of content on the site, then the most effective way to address "the issue" is for the individual to contribute interesting content that stimulates the type of dicsussions they want to participate in.... It's a fun fad to pick on sabermetric prone users and opine about how advanced stats are ruining everything but one thing that can't be criticized is the amount of thought/work that such posts/users put into such content when they post. The whole irony is that the ORG is named after a former member whose content was anything but sabermetric.... The lesson? Bring something to the table and you'll definitely find an audience and a forum for discussion. Despite all of the criticisms about the board structure over the years and the increasing prevelance of stats in discussions, this point still remains completely valid.

    Concerning the "posts that followed", friendly banter is now making the ORG unfriendly? Besides, we all know the mythical redszone 10 is simply cover for the fact that it's Raisor that completely runs the show.

    Frankly, I blame Raisor.
    My only issue with the SABR crowd is when statements are made that dont fall in line with the SABR movement, then those statements are shot down as meaningless. I know the SABR guys put a lot of work into the research and everything, but I'm not trying to convince them their stats are meaningless, they just aren't what I use to evaluate a ball player. Also, I've came around to some of the SABR stuff, I just haven't done a ton of research on it. I know its probly the future of baseball, or at least going to be a big part of it, but with the time I have to enjoy baseball, I would rather watch and enjoy rather than be online looking at stats!!! GOOD DAY!!!

  18. #283
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    Re: On the declining quality of the ORG

    Quote Originally Posted by dubc47834 View Post
    My only issue with the SABR crowd is when statements are made that dont fall in line with the SABR movement, then those statements are shot down as meaningless.
    Yeah, intuition and observation are important too. Often a thread is dragged into an arena of dueling stats because, to the dragger, that's the only legitimate way to resolve anything.

  19. #284
    They call me "chef"
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    Re: On the declining quality of the ORG

    Every time I post there are a bunch of posters who do not like my post and it's made for a very hostile forum experience.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Also I don't think Dom has ever responded to me when I quote his posts.

  20. #285
    Potential Lunch Winner Dom Heffner's Avatar
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    Re: On the declining quality of the ORG

    Quote Originally Posted by Larry Schuler View Post
    Every time I post there are a bunch of posters who do not like my post and it's made for a very hostile forum experience.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Also I don't think Dom has ever responded to me when I quote his posts.
    It would take away from my mystique.

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