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Thread: Most important player to NL Central teams

  1. #31
    Member 757690's Avatar
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    Re: Most important player to NL Central teams

    The question isn't how good Molina is. He's very good.

    The question is how did he get this good?

    Baseball players just don't suddenly, at age 28, go from 6 years of .688 OPS to over two years of .840 OPS. At least not without some help. The only time I can remember that happening was in the mid 1990's. Now what was special about that time in MLB?

    I wouldn't be surprised if eventually, we find Molina on a list in MLB offices similar to the one from that clinic in Miami. In fact, I'd be surprised if we don't.
    "Man, the pitch looks fast, even in slow motion." Thom Brennaman on Chapman's fastball.

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    Tony Cloninger (05-23-2013)

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  4. #32
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    Re: Most important player to NL Central teams

    Quote Originally Posted by 757690 View Post
    The question isn't how good Molina is. He's very good.

    The question is how did he get this good?

    Baseball players just don't suddenly, at age 28, go from 6 years of .688 OPS to over two years of .840 OPS. At least not without some help. The only time I can remember that happening was in the mid 1990's. Now what was special about that time in MLB?

    I wouldn't be surprised if eventually, we find Molina on a list in MLB offices similar to the one from that clinic in Miami. In fact, I'd be surprised if we don't.
    I'll disagree that he's very good. However, I do find it funny that he hit 22 HR's out of nowhere last year. HGH maybe?

    I really thought when I signed up here I wouldn't have to put up with Cardinal fans. Why in the world would another teams fans troll on a Reds board?

    Anyway, I guess the mods don't care, even though this is a REDS BOARD, or should be.

    I also find it funny no one sees the Pirates for what they are, the most improved team in baseball. Maybe no one has bothered to look at their roster, but they have a lot of good pitching and will stick around. It doesn't matter that they haven't made the playoffs since 1992, they're not playing with any of those teams.

    Oh well, I won't be trolling a Cards board anytime no matter how far the Reds pull away, which will be by the end of June. Maybe SI should have paid attention to another team in the NL Central instead of the Cardinals and realized not one Reds starter missed a start last year and actually have a better pitching staff again this year with Cingrani is someone goes down. Should be fun, I'll stop my rant now. Thanks to all that welcomed me with insults.

  5. #33
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    Re: Most important player to NL Central teams

    You obviously havent been watching the Cardinals this year. To say the Cards dont have any depth and quality players is just delusional. What happened when Jason Motte went down, Mujica took his place and is getting the job done. What happened when Jake Westbrook went down, John Gast took his place and his won all 2 of his starts. When Jaime Garcia went down, some unknown rookie took his spot and won his first start. The Cards have a guy named Matt Adams who could be hitting 20+ hr's if he played every day, but he's on the bench................so dont tell me the Cards dont have any players that match up to the Reds while your team is sitting in 2nd place, adn the Cards have the best record in baseball. The Reds have an excellent team with good depth, but the Cards do also

  6. #34
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    Re: Most important player to NL Central teams

    What's overrated about a catcher who can hit, has a lifetime average of .300+ with RISP, has an arm that nobody runs on, is in the top 10 in batting, has improved his offense stats the last 4 years? I get it, you're a REds fans trying to posture and seem cool to your friends.....but you're being a little delusional.

  7. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Metroid View Post
    What's overrated about a catcher who can hit, has a lifetime average of .300+ with RISP, has an arm that nobody runs on, is in the top 10 in batting, has improved his offense stats the last 4 years? I get it, you're a REds fans trying to posture and seem cool to your friends.....but you're being a little delusional.
    I'd love the Reds to have a Molina type catcher, he's a stud

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    Old school 1983 (05-23-2013)

  9. #36
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    Re: Most important player to NL Central teams

    Just a HINT of advice. You might not want to call out the mods on this board. Yeah you are a Reds fan...but one mod in particular will DFA you in a heartbeat.

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    Re: Most important player to NL Central teams

    Quote Originally Posted by RedsfaninMO View Post
    Once you guys have to use up Tavares, Wong and Wacha you will have nothing. I'm surprised so fan Reds fans on here think Molina is that good. I live here, watch a lot of Cards games and can tell you he is way overrated. I'm not sure how it got started nationally, but he does nothing mind blowing on defense. He's had 1 good power year, that's it, and has 2 HR's only this year.

    The Cards don't have the depth or arms to hang with the Reds, and I'll happily be back in September when the Cards have fallen in 3rd place. Wainwright, Miller and Lynn won't be enough in the rotation.

    Meanwhile, the Reds continue to win and the Cards can't pull away. With Cueto back, it's all over. Walt will trade for another bat and it won't be close. Eat my words I will not, and I have a feeling Cards fans won't be posting on a Reds board 2 months from now because there will be nothing to say.

    I just don't get all the love for Molina, especially on a Reds board. I imagine most fans go by what they hear on the MLB network, but I watch a lot of the Cards, and he's league average at best.

    Oh well, I guess it will be fun to talk about. The Cards fans I work with are nervous about the Reds, but I doubt many Reds fans are worried about the Cards. Pittsburgh is the team to watch out for, not the Cards. They always start hot, and end up sneaking in the playoffs as a wild card.

    I also think it's funny how the guys at work talk about Chrissy Carpenter coming back. Holding out hope of your season on a 38 year old pitcher screams of desperation. He won't pitch again, and hasn't been good in a few years now when he has pitched.
    This reeks of somebody that gets picked on daily at work.

  11. #38
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    Re: Most important player to NL Central teams

    Quote Originally Posted by 757690 View Post
    The question isn't how good Molina is. He's very good.

    The question is how did he get this good?

    Baseball players just don't suddenly, at age 28, go from 6 years of .688 OPS to over two years of .840 OPS. At least not without some help. The only time I can remember that happening was in the mid 1990's. Now what was special about that time in MLB?

    I wouldn't be surprised if eventually, we find Molina on a list in MLB offices similar to the one from that clinic in Miami. In fact, I'd be surprised if we don't.
    C'mon, you're better than that.












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  12. #39
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    Re: Most important player to NL Central teams

    Quote Originally Posted by jlcomo View Post
    This reeks of somebody that gets picked on daily at work.
    I was thinking black socks in gym class and showering in his underwear.
    We can share the women, we can share the wine.

  13. #40
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    Re: Most important player to NL Central teams

    I'm still confused to why people say closers here are a dime a dozen it really don't matter. Sure average closers are pretty easy to replace but shut down closers like chapman are not. To evaluate this only through saying so and so would get the same amount of saves as chapman so therefore he is an equal closer is ludicrous. Chapman has an effect that goes much farther than the save, which by all accounts is a very flawed way to measure a closers effectiveness, so why should it be used in an argument to compare on potential closer to another? Chapman anchors the back of the pen and allows for a nasty a boys type situation where the game is more or less over in the 7th for the most part with Marshall broxton then chapman. Having a setup like this makes the opposing team press earlier in the game and maybe not use the best strategy to win because they know they'll probably be shutdown the last three innings. Also there is a huge intimidation factor with knowing the game is probably over after 6 innings. This could play huge in a playoff situation. Chapman as the closer also saves the reds from going to guys like ondrusek or Simon in high leverage situations in say the 7th or 8th inning. So chapman a value as a closer cannot just be measured in saves. No shut down closers ability can. I'm not saying that he's the most important player on the team. That's pretty out there, but at the same time the thinking that closers are not important and bullpen guys are a dime a dozen kills me. So does the theory that a lot of people hold here that since chapman isn't starting we aren't getting maximum value out of him so he should be traded. That assumes a lot of stuff. Such as the closer being over rated In his effect, the fact that chapman would be a good starter ( I think so, but i think this year he should have been in the pen. Reds are going for it. Put your players in proven positions is success) and finally we assume we could get a huge return for him in a trade.
    Last edited by Old school 1983; 05-23-2013 at 10:08 PM.

  14. #41
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    Re: Most important player to NL Central teams

    Quote Originally Posted by TDogg View Post
    Just a HINT of advice. You might not want to call out the mods on this board. Yeah you are a Reds fan...but one mod in particular will DFA you in a heartbeat.
    I'll keep that in mind. I was looking for a Reds board where Cardinal trolls don't show up like they do on the MLB message boards. I really have no idea why fans of another team feel it's necessary to go on other teams message boards, but that's just me.

    I do get picked on at work. Like I said, I work with all Cardinal fans. Sometimes it's in good fun, most of the time it goes way overboard. Just looking for a place to post with fellow Reds fans, that's all.

  15. #42
    Member 757690's Avatar
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    Re: Most important player to NL Central teams

    Quote Originally Posted by RedsfaninMO View Post
    I'll keep that in mind. I was looking for a Reds board where Cardinal trolls don't show up like they do on the MLB message boards. I really have no idea why fans of another team feel it's necessary to go on other teams message boards, but that's just me.

    I do get picked on at work. Like I said, I work with all Cardinal fans. Sometimes it's in good fun, most of the time it goes way overboard. Just looking for a place to post with fellow Reds fans, that's all.
    I grew up a Reds fan in Cardinal country in the '80s, so I feel for you. It does become hard to stay objective in such a situation. You have it worse, as the average Cards fans is now like the average Cubs fan. At least when I was there, they were very classy, we just got into debates, and I was never picked on for being a Reds fan.
    "Man, the pitch looks fast, even in slow motion." Thom Brennaman on Chapman's fastball.

  16. #43
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    Re: Most important player to NL Central teams

    I live in Cardinal country and other than some kidding never have a problem. Most Cards fans are classy still. Trolls are most often found where they can be anonymous. Sounds like RFinMO has a bunch of yahoos working with him. Or young guys who haven't learned to respect other people's differences yet and act like fandom is a real life or death thing.

    Right now you are trying to take that frustration out on this board and making some dumb statements. That only loses you the respect your opinions might otherwise carry.

  17. #44
    Savante SpiritofStLouis's Avatar
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    Re: Most important player to NL Central teams

    Quote Originally Posted by RedsfaninMO View Post
    I'll keep that in mind. I was looking for a Reds board where Cardinal trolls don't show up like they do on the MLB message boards. I really have no idea why fans of another team feel it's necessary to go on other teams message boards, but that's just me.

    I do get picked on at work. Like I said, I work with all Cardinal fans. Sometimes it's in good fun, most of the time it goes way overboard. Just looking for a place to post with fellow Reds fans, that's all.
    Perhaps you would fare better at the workplace if you took a more objective tact. Most fans are realistic in their opinions and can admit that they respect an opponent, even if they don't like them.

    Making outlandish claims with no basis in reality usually won't endear you to your fellow employees, regardless of what team they follow. Most fans will overestimate their team and underestimate their opponents, that's just human nature. However, the majority can recognize an opponent with some level of objectivity.

    The Reds and Cardinals are worthy adversaries, and rational baseball fans recognize that. Everyone is welcome to their opinion, and spirited discourse is an natural part of the process. Offered in a civil manner, it can be entertaining and informative.

    Any forum worth it's salt has fans from various teams. This is such a site. There is nothing wrong with getting a flavor for the opposition and collecting information about said team and it's fans.

    I have found that sites that are exclusively homer based are boring, and get stale in a hurry. A singular opinion doesn't provide a realistic view of a team or it's opponents.

    You are obviously sensitive when it comes to the Redbirds, and I suppose that's understandable, but responding with ridiculous aspersions does nothing but undermine your credibility.
    We can share the women, we can share the wine.

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    MikeThierry (05-24-2013)

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    Re: Most important player to NL Central teams

    Quote Originally Posted by SpiritofStLouis View Post
    C'mon, you're better than that.












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    No he's not. They are obviously the same person. What a loser.


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