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Thread: When Will Shin Soo Choo Start Hitting

  1. #16
    It's showtime! RedEye's Avatar
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    Does anyone else think that puns with Choo's name and ethnic heritage are in poor taste?
    "Iíll kind of have a foot on the back of my own butt. Thatís just how I do things.Ē -- Bryan Price, 10/22/2013

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  3. #17
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    Re: When Will Shin Soo Choo Start Hitting

    Quote Originally Posted by RedEye View Post
    Does anyone else think that puns with Choo's name and ethnic heritage are in poor taste?
    Alex "Seabass" Gonzalez does.

    Anyone remember the umbrage over Gonzalez' "Seabass" nickname several years ago? Someone claimed that it was a derogatory insult. I vaguely remember some others trying to figure out if it was some kind of Latin slur.

    I think people play with Choo's name because they're fans and like the guy. I haven't seen any examples of offensive or negative puns being made.
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  4. #18
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    Re: When Will Shin Soo Choo Start Hitting

    Quote Originally Posted by Larry Schuler View Post
    I think people play with Choo's name because they're fans and like the guy. I haven't seen any examples of offensive or negative puns being made.
    Depends on what you mean by "negative." Most Koreans I know wouldn't take kindly to repeated jokes about what their names sound like or to continual references to kimchi. Even if they laugh the jokes off politely, even if the puns are intended as terms of endearment, they also probably hurt somewhere inside.
    "Iíll kind of have a foot on the back of my own butt. Thatís just how I do things.Ē -- Bryan Price, 10/22/2013

  5. #19
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    Re: When Will Shin Soo Choo Start Hitting

    There are different perspectives on stuff like this. You could say that playing with Choo's name is offensive to him/Koreans, you could also say it is offensive to make Choo off limits because of his nationality.

    From my perspective, I think it is offensive when language is used to make an individual an "other" or to dehumanize them. From what I've read, the puns and silly base references are being used to include Choo as a member of the team. I'd find it more offensive to make a Joey Votto fancy coffee joke, a Phillips hotdog joke, and then to censor oneself in regards to Choo. That is treating him like an other, even if its intended well.

    But you can argue that using any racial/cultural/national references to describe an individual is potentially offensive. If that is the case, I wouldn't force you to make Choo jokes or say you approve of them. You should post from the perspective you are most comfortable with.
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  6. #20
    It's showtime! RedEye's Avatar
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    Re: When Will Shin Soo Choo Start Hitting

    Quote Originally Posted by Larry Schuler View Post
    From my perspective, I think it is offensive when language is used to make an individual an "other" or to dehumanize them. From what I've read, the puns and silly base references are being used to include Choo as a member of the team.
    Not sure why kimchi and stupid puns with Choo's name have to be used to "include him in the team." Either way, both of these got quite old to me a long time ago. And yes, they are starkly racial jokes.

    I can't remember anyone here referring to BP as a "hotdog" recently, though I do tend to find that to be a racially loaded term. I suspect many of you would think the same.

    I've been perplexed by the "fancy coffee" joke about Votto since the beginning. I don't get it.
    Last edited by RedEye; 05-27-2013 at 09:39 PM.
    "Iíll kind of have a foot on the back of my own butt. Thatís just how I do things.Ē -- Bryan Price, 10/22/2013

  7. #21
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    Re: When Will Shin Soo Choo Start Hitting

    He was bound to come back to earth. We knew he wasn't going to have a .500+ OBP all year. The good thing is the team has continued to win

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  9. #22
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    Re: When Will Shin Soo Choo Start Hitting

    If I were you, I would argue the point of you not finding it funny more than the point that it is in bad taste or offensive. You can prove the former objectively with clear support more than you can the latter. It might also influence others' posting style more if they knew a fellow poster found it confusing than if they tried to imagine a theoretical person potentially being offended.
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  10. #23
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    Re: When Will Shin Soo Choo Start Hitting

    Quote Originally Posted by Larry Schuler View Post
    If I were you, I would argue the point of you not finding it funny more than the point that it is in bad taste or offensive. You can prove the former objectively with clear support more than you can the latter. It might also influence others' posting style more if they knew a fellow poster found it confusing than if they tried to imagine a theoretical person potentially being offended.
    And yet finding it offensive is the main reason for me to post about this issue in the first place. Should we then call Lutz a "Kraut"? Perhaps make funny sound effect jokes every time an Asian player steps in the on-deck circle?

    Making fun of the way Choo's name sounds and repeatedly referring to him by the most stereotypical dish from his home country is offensive and IMO has no place on this board.

    I can't imagine I need to grasp for "theoretical" people who would find that sort of reference in poor taste.
    "Iíll kind of have a foot on the back of my own butt. Thatís just how I do things.Ē -- Bryan Price, 10/22/2013

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  12. #24
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    Re: When Will Shin Soo Choo Start Hitting

    Quote Originally Posted by RedEye View Post
    And yet finding it offensive is the main reason for me to post about this issue in the first place. Should we then call Lutz a "Kraut"? Perhaps make funny sound effect jokes every time an Asian player steps in the on-deck circle?

    Making fun of the way Choo's name sounds and repeatedly referring to him by the most stereotypical dish from his home country is offensive and IMO has no place on this board.

    I can't imagine I need to grasp for "theoretical" people who would find that sort of reference in poor taste.
    Really...Chris Berman has been making puns on peoples names for years. I don't think it's racially insensitive by any means.

    Plus I was stationed in Korea for 2 years, this would not offend most Koreans!!!

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  14. #25
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    Re: When Will Shin Soo Choo Start Hitting

    Quote Originally Posted by RedEye View Post
    And yet finding it offensive is the main reason for me to post about this issue in the first place. Should we then call Lutz a "Kraut"? Perhaps make funny sound effect jokes every time an Asian player steps in the on-deck circle?

    Making fun of the way Choo's name sounds and repeatedly referring to him by the most stereotypical dish from his home country is offensive and IMO has no place on this board.

    I can't imagine I need to grasp for "theoretical" people who would find that sort of reference in poor taste.
    Well, those comments aren't technically marginalizing you, so if your argument is that it's offensive and demeaning, you are arguing for a theoretical person who could feel offended. The offense that is occurring directly, first hand, to you is that people are making comments you don't see value or humor in. I guess you could say your right to not see comments you find potentially offensive to others is being marginalized.

    My point is that those comments aren't being racially insensitive to you. They are confusing/not funny/in poor taste to you. We can't have a meaningful discussion about the former but we can have a good discussion about the latter.
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  16. #26
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    Re: When Will Shin Soo Choo Start Hitting

    Redeye, it seems you have (at least in my mind) recently earned a reputation of thread cop and now morality cop. I enjoy your insights on baseball, but I'd be lying if I haven't thought recently, "there goes Redeye again".

    I saw a good Bill Maher bit on YouTube recently where he riffs on people demanding apologies/changes when they get offended. His advice - just ignore said offensive event. Great advice if you ask me.

    I'm no saint on this forum either, but I've just seen too much complaining lately.

    FWIW I reported my first post in about a year this past week, so of course there are times when something needs to be said.

    Just my 2 cents...

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  18. #27
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    Re: When Will Shin Soo Choo Start Hitting

    People try really hard to find ways to be offended these days. Jeez.

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  20. #28
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    Can we still call Chappy the Cuban Missile? Anyway....

    I think it's safe to say Choo's back. Looked better today and you gotta love the lead off #10.

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    coachpipe (05-28-2013)

  22. #29
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    Re: When Will Shin Soo Choo Start Hitting

    Lutz the difference? Votto Choo trying to say that we are Phillips-ing the meaning of their names?
    "On-base percentage is great if you can score runs and do something with that on-base percentage," Baker said. "Clogging up the bases isn't that great to me."

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    Re: When Will Shin Soo Choo Start Hitting

    Quote Originally Posted by RedEye View Post
    Even if they laugh the jokes off politely, even if the puns are intended as terms of endearment, they also probably hurt somewhere inside.
    Considering how many baseballs the guy takes off his body, I don't think he's hurting that much inside. He's making a lot of money and seems to like it here.

    His walkup music is "Gangnam Style"... He's proud of his Korean heritage and has a huge Korean fanbase. I'm sure he has his own funny thoughts about Americans.


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