Cardinals (Molina) crying again

[RedFanAlways1966]

Not Cardinals favoritism, star favoritism. If Molina was a nobody, I think he would have gotten 3-4 games.

Fair enough. However, I believe MLB has always been fair for these things. Pete Rose was a huge star (more as a player than a manager). He got 30 games for pushing Dave Pallone. Of course MLB did not have much choice when a guy obviously pushes an umpire lol.

I do believe one game was small. Yadier oughta be buying his brother multiple steak dinners. If not for him, Yadier probably would have received much more and god only knows what he might have done. Since Yadier has a history and not too long ago, I feel this warrants a stiffer penalty than a first time offender.

[jojo]

Is Bo Jackson still serving his suspension for snapping his bat over his knee like it was a twig? I haven't seen him play play for a while and am curious.

[SporkLover]

Are you suggesting Molina is a HoF'er? I hope not. The guy won't even sniff the HoF. I can think of three Cardinal catchers not in the HoF that are more deserving the Molina.

Perhaps a bit optimistic... Especially since we don't know how his career will end.

[swaisuc]

I actually thought the ejection was pretty weak.

Still, he deserves whatever he gets for his reaction. You can't just go after umpires like that.

[Salukifan2]

So much insecurity. There are many Cards threads that are being actively posted on (by Reds posters primarily) on redszone. They are, Cards are the luckiest team in baseball, More Talent: Cards or Reds?, Cardinals Just Keep on winning, Garcia to the DL, This thread about how whiny Molina is, which has spiraled into Yadi is overrated again, The difference between the reds and the cards, Why, as a cards fan, are you here?, and The scoreboard watching thread (75% of it is about the cardinals).

Why are so many RZ red's fans creating threads that show how freaked out they are by the Cardinals?

[Salukifan2]

So if someone doesn't think a Cards' player is as good as advertised, they're just inciting people? Could it be someone has an opinion that doesn't align with Cards' fans?

That can't be, can it?

Mike thinks redsfaninmo is a troll because so many of his posts are just about the how much he hates the cardinals and even when a topic has nothing to do with the cards or STL he will still throw some unnecessary jab at the cards, their fans, or STL as he did in the Best MLB stadiums thread.

Here is the link

http://www.redszone.com/forums/showthread.php?t=101655

[Salukifan2]

My two cents on where Yadi stands in terms of all-time greatness. Johnny Bench is the greatest all-around catcher ever. Pudge was an all around more productive player than Yadi. However, just because he isn't as good as arguably the two greatest catchers of all-time doesn't take him out of consideration for the hall. Only Bench has won more Gold gloves in the NL than Yadi and Yadi has been given the Platinum glove award. Yadi has won two World titles, this season will be his fifth consecutive all-star game which is very impressive for a catcher, and with the cardinals playing like they are this will be his best shot at an MVP. If he does get an MVP (he is leading the NL in hitting right now) i believe he will have the pedigree necessary when its all said and done to make the hall.

To say a catcher who now has 4 all-star games (soon to be 5), 5 gold gloves, and 2 world titles by the age of 30 won't even "sniff" the HOF means you just aren't paying attention

[RedTeamGo!]

Mike thinks redsfaninmo is a troll because so many of his posts are just about the how much he hates the cardinals and even when a topic has nothing to do with the cards or STL he will still throw some unnecessary jab at the cards, their fans, or STL as he did in the Best MLB stadiums thread.

Here is the link

http://www.redszone.com/forums/showthread.php?t=101655

He would be a troll if he were doing this on a cardinals message board, but alas, this is a reds message board.

A better example of trolling on redszone is calling redszone posters "insecure" on redszone.

[RedTeamGo!]

My two cents on where Yadi stands in terms of all-time greatness. Johnny Bench is the greatest all-around catcher ever. Pudge was an all around more productive player than Yadi. However, just because he isn't as good as arguably the two greatest catchers of all-time doesn't take him out of consideration for the hall. Only Bench has won more Gold gloves in the NL than Yadi and Yadi has been given the Platinum glove award. Yadi has won two World titles, this season will be his fifth consecutive all-star game which is very impressive for a catcher, and with the cardinals playing like they are this will be his best shot at an MVP. If he does get an MVP (he is leading the NL in hitting right now) i believe he will have the pedigree necessary when its all said and done to make the hall.

To say a catcher who now has 4 all-star games (soon to be 5), 5 gold gloves, and 2 world titles by the age of 30 won't even "sniff" the HOF means you just aren't paying attention

If Yadier Molina wins the MVP with a mid 800 OPS it will be terrible.

Everyone is ripping on redsfaninmo for calling out Yadier, but he is absolutely correct about Molina being a singles hitter. 18 XBH in 2 months? That is not good enough to be an MVP candidate. To put in perspective, Jay Bruce, a player people constantly complain about has 28 XBH.

[George Anderson]

To say a catcher who now has 4 all-star games (soon to be 5), 5 gold gloves, and 2 world titles by the age of 30 won't even "sniff" the HOF means you just aren't paying attention

In the grand scheme of things WS titles won and AS games played in really dont count for a whole lot when it comes to HOF voting. The writers
dont regard those highly when voting for the HOF.

Here are some good stats and comparisons to show that Molina really is not worthy of the HOF. He is an outstanding catcher but not HOF worthy.

http://www.baseball-reference.com/pl...olinya01.shtml



Hall Of Fame StatisticsPlayer rank in (·)
Black Ink Batting - 4 (425), Average HOFer ≈ 27

Gray Ink Batting - 15 (1198), Average HOFer ≈ 144

Hall of Fame Monitor Batting - 52 (384), Likely HOFer ≈ 100

Hall of Fame Standards Batting - 26 (425), Average HOFer ≈ 50

JAWS Catcher (55th), 23.0 career WAR/21.5 7yr-peak WAR/22.2 JAWS
Average HOF C (out of 13) = 52.4 career WAR/33.7 7yr-peak WAR/43.1 JAWS

Similar Batters

1.Milt May (940)
2.Sammy White (933)
3.Earl Battey (933)
4.Ron Hassey (930)
5.Don Slaught (929)
6.Shanty Hogan (928)
7.Birdie Tebbetts (927)
8.Bo Diaz (926)
9.Damian Miller (924)
10.Joe Oliver (924)


Similar Batters through 29
1.Tim McCarver (951)
2.Thurman Munson (927)
3.Benito Santiago (924)
4.Jack Clements (919)
5.Frankie Hayes (919)
6.Shanty Hogan (914)
7.Terry Kennedy (912)
8.Russell Martin (910)
9.Butch Wynegar (905)
10.A.J. Pierzynski (904)

[Salukifan2]

he is going to play 150 games this season at the most demanding position in the sport, while playing the finest defense at that position in the sport. If he wins the batting title, the gold glove, and the cardinals win the division, Molina will win the MVP. I'll call that right now.

[RedTeamGo!]

he is going to play 150 games this season at the most demanding position in the sport, while playing the finest defense at that position in the sport. If he wins the batting title, the gold glove, and the cardinals win the division, Molina will win the MVP. I'll call that right now.

The batting title is overrated. Freddy Sanchez and Bill Mueller won it. It means more if you can actually hit extra base hits while doing it.

[Strike3Called]

This is one reason I generally don't like Cardinal boards. Yadier Molina should not be mentioned in the same sentence as Hall of Fame. Not yet anyway. He needs to do what he's been doing the last 4 years for about another 4 years and THEN there can possibly be a discussion. The guy has had 4 good offensive seasons. Since when does having 4 good offensive seasons lead to HOF talk? That's how you take a perfectly good player and overrate him. Overrated does not = bad player. Yadi is a really fantastic player these last 4 years but there is no need to overrate him.

Oh and **** I thought this was a cardinals board. My bad.

[Salukifan2]

MVP/HOF consideration for a right fielder is much different from a catcher so the Bruce comp is moot. Yadi has also been a clutch post season performer. Another thing that people think about when they vote

[RedTeamGo!]

Wasn't comparing for HOF, was talking this year's MVP, but fine, I will play your position game. These numbers come from Baseball Reference.

Buster Posey won the MVP last year at catcher with .957 OPS and 171 OPS+ - the highest OPS+ in the NL. Posey also finished with the best WAR in the NL at 7.4

Molina currently has an .869 OPS and 141+ OPS+. Molina currently has a 1.8 WAR - which is not good enough to be in the top 10 in the NL, in fact he is not in the top 10 in the NL in ANY of these stats - his defensive WAR is actually 0.2, which is actually lower than Ryan Hanigan. The only thing that sets Molina apart is his single driven batting average of .350, which he is a 2 game slump from not being in the lead anymore.

Molina is having a good year, but not close to as good as the year another catcher put up last year to win the MVP. In fact, Molina isn't having as good of a year this year as the current NL MVP.

Also, let's put the HOF talk on hold until Molina puts together another 5-6 elite season, please. jeez oh pete.