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Thread: Cardinals (Molina) crying again

  1. #76
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    Re: Cardinals (Molina) crying again

    Tossing equipment is one thing. Slamming it down in anger so it goes halfway across the field is a judgement call. Thats pretty much how it worked when i played ball.

    The way molina slammed his helmet im not surprised at all. And wouldnt argue about it if it was votto that did the same thing. However him making contact and looking as if he would have beat the umpire down if nobody was holding him back. 1 game suspension is a joke for what he did after. at least 3-5 was deserved. 1 game is nothing to a baseball player. Its a day off.

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  3. #77
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    Re: Cardinals (Molina) crying again

    HOF was started by me... again I admitted to it being optimistic

    But I did a little Googling today.... perhaps an ejection for spiked helmet is not so egregious or unprecedented... I found a few examples of it, and the call not being made by NEWB umps.

    http://wapc.mlb.com/play/search?query=Ejected+Helmet

    If you watch the Parra video from a few years ago the circumstances not all that different from Yadi's incident.... with exception of the inexcusable meltdown.

  4. #78
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    Re: Cardinals (Molina) crying again

    Molina IS on track for the Hall. His output and importance and overall leadership is almost identical to the greatest catcher to play the game, Pudge Rodriguez. Molina needs about fourmore productive years, and he will be in. Catchers should be judged on a shortened period. Barring Berra who played OF and Pudge's (both Fisk and Irod) freakish durability, most great catchers have about a seven year period of dominance. For all intents and purpose, Molina is halfway there. He is a great baseball player. Period

    Don Cameron
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  5. #79
    Beer is good!! George Anderson's Avatar
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    Re: Cardinals (Molina) crying again

    Quote Originally Posted by Don Cameron View Post
    Molina IS on track for the Hall. His output and importance and overall leadership is almost identical to the greatest catcher to play the game, Pudge Rodriguez. Molina needs about fourmore productive years, and he will be in. Catchers should be judged on a shortened period. Barring Berra who played OF and Pudge's (both Fisk and Irod) freakish durability, most great catchers have about a seven year period of dominance. For all intents and purpose, Molina is halfway there. He is a great baseball player. Period

    Don Cameron
    A man who is not small minded and can appreciate greatness no matter what hat they wear.
    You made two mistakes, obviously above and stating Molina's performance puts him halfway to Cooperstown.

    See below.

    Similar Batters through 29
    1.Tim McCarver (951)
    2.Thurman Munson (927)
    3.Benito Santiago (924)
    4.Jack Clements (919)
    5.Frankie Hayes (919)
    6.Shanty Hogan (914)
    7.Terry Kennedy (912)
    8.Russell Martin (910)
    9.Butch Wynegar (905)
    10.A.J. Pierzynski (904)


    Hall Of Fame StatisticsPlayer rank in ()
    Black Ink Batting - 4 (425), Average HOFer ≈ 27

    Gray Ink Batting - 15 (1198), Average HOFer ≈ 144

    Hall of Fame Monitor Batting - 52 (384), Likely HOFer ≈ 100

    Hall of Fame Standards Batting - 26 (425), Average HOFer ≈ 50

    JAWS Catcher (55th), 23.0 career WAR/21.5 7yr-peak WAR/22.2 JAWS
    Average HOF C (out of 13) = 52.4 career WAR/33.7 7yr-peak WAR/43.1 JAWS
    "Boys, I'm one of those umpires that misses 'em every once in a while so if it's close, you'd better hit it." Cal Hubbard

  6. #80
    breath westofyou's Avatar
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    Molina a HOF player!

    Laughable, he's not as good as Bill Freehan and invoking Pudge in the comparison is missing a mess of guys in between those two

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  8. #81
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    Re: Cardinals (Molina) crying again

    Yes, as I said, he is half way there... ( by your own grey ink quote). Of the 10 catchers listed Molina is FAR superior defensively. And yes, I grew up a Cincinnatian, but Pudge Rodrigiez was the greatest. Bench had two monster years. In some of the 1970's offensively Simmons, Fisk, and Carter were better. For the majority of his career no catcher performed better offensively and defensively than Irod.

  9. #82
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    Re: Cardinals (Molina) crying again

    Yes, as I said, he is half way there... ( by your own grey ink quote). Of the 10 catchers listed Molina is FAR superior defensively. And yes, I grew up a Cincinnatian, but Pudge Rodrigiez was the greatest. Bench had two monster years. In some of the 1970's offensively Simmons, Fisk, and Carter were better. For the majority of his career no catcher performed better offensively and defensively than Irod.

    Don Cameron

  10. #83
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    Re: Cardinals (Molina) crying again

    Freehan? PLEASE.

  11. #84
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    Re: Cardinals (Molina) crying again

    Quote Originally Posted by Don Cameron View Post
    Freehan? PLEASE.
    Code:
    Molina
    
    YEAR TEAM         AGE G    AB    R    H    2B  3B  HR   HR%   RBI  BB   SO   SB   CS  AVG   SLG  OBA   OPS
    2004 Cardinals    21   51   135   12   36   6   0   2   1.48   15   13   20    0   1  .267  .356  .329  .684 
    2005 Cardinals    22  114   385   36   97  15   1   8   2.08   49   23   30    2   3  .252  .358  .295  .654 
    2006 Cardinals    23  129   417   29   90  26   0   6   1.44   49   26   41    1   2  .216  .321  .274  .595 
    2007 Cardinals    24  111   353   30   97  15   0   6   1.70   40   34   43    1   1  .275  .368  .340  .708 
    2008 Cardinals    25  124   444   37  135  18   0   7   1.58   56   32   29    0   2  .304  .392  .349  .740 
    2009 Cardinals    26  140   481   45  141  23   1   6   1.25   54   50   39    9   3  .293  .383  .366  .749 
    2010 Cardinals    27  136   465   34  122  19   0   6   1.29   62   42   51    8   4  .262  .342  .329  .671 
    2011 Cardinals    28  139   475   55  145  32   1  14   2.95   65   33   44    4   5  .305  .465  .349  .814 
    2012 Cardinals    29  138   505   65  159  28   0  22   4.36   76   45   55   12   3  .315  .501  .373  .874 
         TOTALS          1082  3660  343 1022 182   3  77   2.10  466  298  352   37  24  .279  .394  .336  .730 
         LG AVERAGE            3698  498  983 200  23 112   3.02  474  366  726   67  26  .266  .423  .336  .759 
         POS AVERAGE           3625  383  920 187   9  97   2.69  463  337  698   15  11  .254  .391  .322  .713
    	 
    	 
    	 
    	Freehan 
    	 
    YEAR TEAM         AGE G    AB    R    H    2B  3B  HR   HR%   RBI  BB   SO   SB   CS  AVG   SLG  OBA   OPS
    1961 Tigers       19    4    10    1    4   0   0   0   0.00    4    1    0    0   0  .400  .400  .455  .855 
    1963 Tigers       21  100   300   37   73  12   2   9   3.00   36   39   56    2   0  .243  .387  .331  .718 
    1964 Tigers       22  144   520   69  156  14   8  18   3.46   80   36   68    5   1  .300  .462  .350  .812 
    1965 Tigers       23  130   431   45  101  15   0  10   2.32   43   39   63    4   2  .234  .339  .306  .645 
    1966 Tigers       24  136   492   47  115  22   0  12   2.44   46   40   72    5   2  .234  .352  .294  .646 
    1967 Tigers       25  155   517   66  146  23   1  20   3.87   74   73   71    1   2  .282  .447  .389  .835 
    1968 Tigers       26  155   540   73  142  24   2  25   4.63   84   65   64    0   1  .263  .454  .366  .819 
    1969 Tigers       27  143   489   61  128  16   3  16   3.27   49   53   55    1   2  .262  .405  .342  .747 
    1970 Tigers       28  117   395   44   95  17   3  16   4.05   52   52   48    0   3  .241  .420  .332  .752 
    1971 Tigers       29  148   516   57  143  26   4  21   4.07   71   54   48    2   7  .277  .465  .353  .818 
         TOTALS          1232  4210  500 1103 169  23 147   3.49  539  452  545   20  20  .262  .418  .343  .761 
         LG AVERAGE            4122  495 1033 159  27 107   2.60  461  414  644   57  34  .251  .380  .321  .701 
         POS AVERAGE           4049  376  956 146  16  94   2.32  445  390  687   15  17  .236  .350  .306  .657

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  13. #85
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    Re: Cardinals (Molina) crying again

    Quote Originally Posted by Don Cameron View Post
    Yes, as I said, he is half way there... ( by your own grey ink quote). Of the 10 catchers listed Molina is FAR superior defensively. And yes, I grew up a Cincinnatian, but Pudge Rodrigiez was the greatest. Bench had two monster years. In some of the 1970's offensively Simmons, Fisk, and Carter were better. For the majority of his career no catcher performed better offensively and defensively than Irod.

    Don Cameron
    From 1970-75 there was NO better Catcher than Bench in the 70's on Offense or Defense.
    Bench was playing in 1973 after surgery ... near his lung and was still way better than any Catcher that year and a bum shoulder from April through the year in 1975. Bad year in 1976. Very good in 1977..... started to lose it in 1978 with back issues.

    NO he was better in the 70's than Carter ever was... Simmons? Did you ever see him play defense? Fisk I can say is closets out of any of them.

    Carter was better in the 80's.

  14. #86
    Daffy Duck RedTeamGo!'s Avatar
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    Re: Cardinals (Molina) crying again

    Pudge better than bench = laughable.

    There are all the statistics AND the fact pudge was PED user.

  15. #87
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    Re: Cardinals (Molina) crying again

    I will admit I stnd corrected on Molina. He does have a way to go for HOF. But as far as I-Rod v Bench....

    What stats are you speaking of RedTeamGo?

    IVAN V BENCH

    .296 BA V .267 BA--WIN IROD
    .334 OBP V .342 OBP-- WIN BENCH
    .464 SLG V .476 SLG-- WIN BENCH
    1354 RUNS V 1091 RUNS-- WIN IROD
    311 HR V 389 HR --WIN BENCH
    1332 RBI V 1376 RBI -- WIN BENCH
    127 SB V 68 SB --WIN IROD

    46% CAUGHT STEALING V 43 % CAUGHT STEALING--WIN IROD
    .991 FIELD PERCENT V .990 FIELD PERCENT--WIN IROD
    6.63 RANGE FACTOR V .642 RANGE FACTOR--WIN IROD

    13 GOLD GLOVES V 10 GOLD GLOVES --WIN IROD

    EVIDENCE OF PEDS?????

    DON CAMERON
    A man on a gluten-free diet

  16. #88
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    Re: Cardinals (Molina) crying again

    Is it me or do those numbers prove without question that Bench was better than Pudge?


    And seriously, thank you for admitting you were getting ahead of yourself
    With Molina and the HOF. As a cards fan myself I don't see how on earth card fans always try to make that baseless argument.

  17. #89
    Salukifan2
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    Re: Cardinals (Molina) crying again

    Quote Originally Posted by Strike3Called View Post
    Is it me or do those numbers prove without question that Bench was better than Pudge?


    And seriously, thank you for admitting you were getting ahead of yourself
    With Molina and the HOF. As a cards fan myself I don't see how on earth card fans always try to make that baseless argument.
    It was said that Molina won't "sniff" the HOF, implying that Molina won't even be on the ballot. This appears to be the consensus of the RZ, and it is false.

    Molina is not a top 5 all-time catcher, but if he can continue to put up these offensive numbers a few more years and play the HOF defense he has been playing then I believe he can become a top 10 all-time catcher.

    Yadi is one of only 5 catchers to ever win 5 consecutive gold gloves and he is still going. He will sniff the HOF.

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  19. #90
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    Re: Cardinals (Molina) crying again

    Quote Originally Posted by Salukifan2 View Post
    It was said that Molina won't "sniff" the HOF, implying that Molina won't even be on the ballot. This appears to be the consensus of the RZ, and it is false.

    Molina is not a top 5 all-time catcher, but if he can continue to put up these offensive numbers a few more years and play the HOF defense he has been playing then I believe he can become a top 10 all-time catcher.

    Yadi is one of only 5 catchers to ever win 5 consecutive gold gloves and he is still going. He will sniff the HOF.
    I was unaware there is a definition of "sniff the HOF." Thank you for enlightening me.


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