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Thread: Bronson Arroyo pitches per start

  1. #1
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    Bronson Arroyo pitches per start

    Joel Luckhaupt tweeted something about this earlier in the week or some time last week. . . well, at some point he mentioned Bronson's pitch counts for the year. So I found out info for pitch counts by year as a Cincinnati Red.

    2006: 109.9
    2007: 100.8
    2008: 101
    2009: 103.2
    2010: 98.7
    2011: 103.2
    2012: 92.4
    2013: 90.9

    Arroyo is 36 this year. I'm not sure anyone is surprised by this decline, but it's worth noting that he's gone above 100 pitches only once this year.

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    Member NebraskaRed's Avatar
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    Re: Bronson Arroyo pitches per start

    This is exactly why I was fine with him being pulled after the 8th tonight. There was no reason to send him back in knowing that he crumbles as soon as he nears 90 pitches.

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    Stat Wanker Hodiernus RedsManRick's Avatar
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    Re: Bronson Arroyo pitches per start

    Quote Originally Posted by Todd Gack View Post
    Joel Luckhaupt tweeted something about this earlier in the week or some time last week. . . well, at some point he mentioned Bronson's pitch counts for the year. So I found out info for pitch counts by year as a Cincinnati Red.

    2006: 109.9
    2007: 100.8
    2008: 101
    2009: 103.2
    2010: 98.7
    2011: 103.2
    2012: 92.4
    2013: 90.9

    Arroyo is 36 this year. I'm not sure anyone is surprised by this decline, but it's worth noting that he's gone above 100 pitches only once this year.
    What's that look like from an IP/GS basis? Maybe he's just being more efficient and he ends up getting pulled because guys pick up on him after a few turns through the lineup regardless of pitch count.
    Games are won on run differential -- scoring more than your opponent. Runs are runs, scored or prevented they all count the same. Worry about scoring more and allowing fewer, not which positions contribute to which side of the equation or how "consistent" you are at your current level of performance.

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    Re: Bronson Arroyo pitches per start

    He had mono in 2011, hence more pitches because he was bad that year. He hasn't thrown as many pitches in 2012 & 2013 because: (a) he's been good and (b) the bullpen is great, why not use them? Other than 2006, his innings have pretty much been the same (199-220IP each year) and he's on pace for about 220IP in 2013.

    The real questions is -- who won the Arroyo trade?

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    Re: Bronson Arroyo pitches per start

    Quote Originally Posted by terminator View Post
    He had mono in 2011, hence more pitches because he was bad that year. He hasn't thrown as many pitches in 2012 & 2013 because: (a) he's been good and (b) the bullpen is great, why not use them? Other than 2006, his innings have pretty much been the same (199-220IP each year) and he's on pace for about 220IP in 2013.

    The real questions is -- who won the Arroyo trade?
    Opponents are also hitting .333 after Arroyo reaches 75 pitches. (They're actually hitting .340 between 46-60)

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    Re: Bronson Arroyo pitches per start

    I think the fear of him giving up a home run vs others comes into play here.

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    Member VR's Avatar
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    Re: Bronson Arroyo pitches per start

    This is an error. Dusty ruins starters.
    Baseball is like church. Many attend, few understand

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    Re: Bronson Arroyo pitches per start

    Numbers from Chicago-2003 and Cincinnati-2012 pitching staffs. Dusty may or may not have ruined any arms. I am staying out of that one. However, he certainly has become more conservative in his handling of starting pitchers. In 2003, Dusty let his starters stay out there for 120 or more pitches 29 times. In 2012, that number was 2. 2003 Cubs' starters threw more pitches than Reds' starters in 7 less games. Given the health of the Reds' starters for the last two years, I am not complaining.

    Code:
    CHI-03	Starts	Pitches	Pit/St	100-109	110-119	120-129	130-139	>140	Pct>100
    Zambrno	32	3414	106.7	10	7	6	0	0	71.9%
    Prior	30	3401	113.4	7	10	6	3	0	86.7%
    Wood 	32	3546	110.8	5	7	11	1	1	78.1%
    Clement	32	3145	98.3	9	6	1	0	0	50.0%
    Estes	28	2598	92.8	7	8	0	0	0	53.6%
    									
    Totals	154	16104	104.6	38	38	24	4	1	68.2%
    									
    CIN-12	Starts	Pitches	Pit/St	100-109	110-119	120-129	130-139	>140	Pct>100
    Arroyo	32	2958	92.4	7	3	0	0	0	31.3%
    Bailey	33	3334	101.0	11	10	0	0	0	63.6%
    Cueto	33	3449	104.5	9	10	2	0	0	63.6%
    Latos	33	3271	99.1	12	6	0	0	0	54.5%
    Leake	30	2714	90.5	4	4	0	0	0	26.7%
    									
    Totals	161	15726	97.7	43	33	2	0	0	48.4%
    Zero chance the Reds miss the playoffs!

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    Re: Bronson Arroyo pitches per start

    Quote Originally Posted by RedsManRick View Post
    What's that look like from an IP/GS basis? Maybe he's just being more efficient and he ends up getting pulled because guys pick up on him after a few turns through the lineup regardless of pitch count.
    This. When Bronson is having a good game, he consistently gets weak contact early in counts, its not odd to look up and see a pitch count in the 50's in the 6th innings.

    Well assuming I am not suffering from a case of conservation bias.
    "Today was the byproduct of us thinking we can come back from anything." - Joey Votto after blowing a 10-1 lead and holding on for the 12-11 win on 8/25/2010.

  12. #10
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    Re: Bronson Arroyo pitches per start

    Quote Originally Posted by texasdave View Post
    Numbers from Chicago-2003 and Cincinnati-2012 pitching staffs. Dusty may or may not have ruined any arms. I am staying out of that one. However, he certainly has become more conservative in his handling of starting pitchers. In 2003, Dusty let his starters stay out there for 120 or more pitches 29 times. In 2012, that number was 2. 2003 Cubs' starters threw more pitches than Reds' starters in 7 less games. Given the health of the Reds' starters for the last two years, I am not complaining.

    Code:
    CHI-03	Starts	Pitches	Pit/St	100-109	110-119	120-129	130-139	>140	Pct>100
    Zambrno	32	3414	106.7	10	7	6	0	0	71.9%
    Prior	30	3401	113.4	7	10	6	3	0	86.7%
    Wood 	32	3546	110.8	5	7	11	1	1	78.1%
    Clement	32	3145	98.3	9	6	1	0	0	50.0%
    Estes	28	2598	92.8	7	8	0	0	0	53.6%
    									
    Totals	154	16104	104.6	38	38	24	4	1	68.2%
    									
    CIN-12	Starts	Pitches	Pit/St	100-109	110-119	120-129	130-139	>140	Pct>100
    Arroyo	32	2958	92.4	7	3	0	0	0	31.3%
    Bailey	33	3334	101.0	11	10	0	0	0	63.6%
    Cueto	33	3449	104.5	9	10	2	0	0	63.6%
    Latos	33	3271	99.1	12	6	0	0	0	54.5%
    Leake	30	2714	90.5	4	4	0	0	0	26.7%
    									
    Totals	161	15726	97.7	43	33	2	0	0	48.4%
    I would imagine those numbers are pretty similar to all of MLB. Big shift in way pitchers are handled in last decade.

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    Member Kcbuckeye22's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Todd Gack View Post
    Opponents are also hitting .333 after Arroyo reaches 75 pitches. (They're actually hitting .340 between 46-60)
    Yes sir. You gotta remember that junk he throws the 3rd time around is easier to figure out. He does hit the wall hard when he's done. His last game he pitches in Cincy this year he'll get a much deserved standing ovation.

    We got a work horse for a peanut on that trade.

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    Flash the leather! _Sir_Charles_'s Avatar
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    Re: Bronson Arroyo pitches per start

    Does anybody doubt that he'll go into the Reds Hall of Fame? I sure don't. He's a lock.
    2014 predictions:
    99-63 WS champs (Cards take 2nd WC, Mil 3rd, Pit 4th, Chi 5th)
    Bruce/Votto neck and neck MVP race (neither takes it)
    Bailey CYA winner
    Hamilton ROY & GG

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    Member cumberlandreds's Avatar
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    Re: Bronson Arroyo pitches per start

    Quote Originally Posted by _Sir_Charles_ View Post
    Does anybody doubt that he'll go into the Reds Hall of Fame? I sure don't. He's a lock.
    No doubt about it.
    Reds Fan Since 1971

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    Re: Bronson Arroyo pitches per start

    Quote Originally Posted by RadfordVA View Post
    I would imagine those numbers are pretty similar to all of MLB. Big shift in way pitchers are handled in last decade.
    Especially true when you factor the Reds 2012 Bullpen vs the rotating cast of gas cans the Cubs had in 2003.
    When people say that I donít know what Iím talking about when it comes to sports or writing, I think: Man, you should see me in the rest of my life.
    ---Joe Posnanski

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    Member joshua's Avatar
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    Re: Bronson Arroyo pitches per start

    Despite rarely going over 100 pitches a game...

    Weathered Fan ‏@WeatheredFan 18m
    Bronson Arroyo is currently the #Reds leader in WHIP (1.10), Wins (6), IP (80.0) & FH (feathered hair). Overall, a very solid season so far.
    I also saw on MLB Tonight that, since 2006, Arroyo leads the NL in wins with 97, Beating out the likes of Cain, Wainwright and Hamels. So while he could never be called the most dominant starter in the NL over the last 7 years, an argument could definitely be made that he's definitely the most consistent.

    The Reds have a really tough choice to make at the end of this season with Arroyo. Whether the Reds decide to keep him around, or let him walk...I trust Jocketty. But man, Arroyo has been absolutely awesome since he's been in the Queen City. A guy who can pitch 200+ innings, never miss a start and get you a win the majority of the time are hard to come by. And it's not like his skill set is the kind that suddenly falls off a cliff at age 37 either. And you have to wonder if he's played a part in the development of our young pitching staff.

    If he does move on to another team, every time he comes back to GABP he should get a 10 minute long standing ovation.
    Last edited by joshua; 06-04-2013 at 12:11 PM.

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