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Thread: Speier as 3B coach...

  1. #31
    Unsolicited Opinions traderumor's Avatar
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    Re: Speier as 3B coach...

    Quote Originally Posted by Rantly View Post
    Has there been any explanation by either Votto or Spier on what happened on that play? If not, where is the reporting?
    Bruce singled to right, Votto attempted to get to third, but did not make it. Speier was reportedly distracted by a vision of Morganna running onto the field to give him a kiss, while Votto admittedly was still bristling (and lollygagging) over Marty's comments he heard while batting earlier in the game (earbuds) about how he is not paid to walk and is NOWHERE near the player that Miguel Cabrera is, not even in the same conversation because Miggy has a gazillion RBIs already and will shorten up and try really, really hard to hit a ball that will score baserunners when he gets two strikes, and Joey hardly even has any ribbies because he's up there for a walk, like so many little leaguers.

    At least that's the word on the street.

    UPDATE: Marty did not acknowledge that Votto was choked up on the bat when he hit a HR in Tuesday's night game.
    Last edited by traderumor; 06-12-2013 at 07:10 PM.
    Can't win with 'em

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    RedEye (06-13-2013)

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  4. #32
    Member jimbo's Avatar
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    Re: Speier as 3B coach...

    Quote Originally Posted by RANDY IN INDY View Post
    There shouldn't be any doubt. Baseball players slide. They practice sliding. Joey Votto practiced sliding for a long time, the opposite way that he had been used to sliding. There is no reason not to slide when you run through a stop sign at second base. He was holding you for a reason. It was going to be close. There should be no doubt in your mind. Slide. Period. He's a ballplayer. Nothing more to say.
    The live play was to his back. His major league third base coach was standing calmly and pointing at the base. In Votto's mind, Speier's actions erased any doubt there was going to be a play at third. If he slides for nothing and injures himself, redszone goes into meltdown. Nothing more to say.

  5. #33
    Matt's Dad RANDY IN INDY's Avatar
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    Re: Speier as 3B coach...

    Quote Originally Posted by jimbo View Post
    The live play was to his back. His major league third base coach was standing calmly and pointing at the base. In Votto's mind, Speier's actions erased any doubt there was going to be a play at third. If he slides for nothing and injures himself, redszone goes into meltdown. Nothing more to say.
    I could care less if Redszone goes into meltdown. Spier was holding him at second and he ran through the stop sign. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out the play will most likely be close. Sliding is a part of baseball. Just do it. He's a baseball player.
    Talent is God Given: be humble.
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    Always Red (06-13-2013), mth123 (06-13-2013)

  7. #34
    All work and no play..... Vottomatic's Avatar
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    Re: Speier as 3B coach...

    I actually trust Speier more than Berry.

    I think Votto missed the sign and Speier got blamed for that incident.
    "I can't take this homerism anymore." - 10xWSChamps, August 11, 2010. A Cardinals fan having a problem with all the homerism on Redszone. Classic.

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  8. #35
    They call me "chef"
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    Re: Speier as 3B coach...

    Votto needs to learn to submit to authority less his insolence disrupts the delicate order of our own lives.
    Cincinnati Reds 2014 W-L Record: 76.6-85.4*

    Cincinnati Reds 2015 W-L Record: TBA

    *UPDATED: 2/11/2014

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    Roy Tucker (06-14-2013)

  10. #36
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    Re: Speier as 3B coach...

    Again ... the replay angle from the third base dugout area clearly showed that Votto was approaching/rounding second at the same time Speier was waving a runner home. Speier never made any kind of signal to Votto, at any point, even though he had plenty of time to.
    "I talked to an advance scout that told me if Joey Votto and Albert Pujols were on the same team he'd advise his team to do the unthinkable...pitch around Votto to get to Pujols." - Buster Olney, ESPN

  11. #37
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    Re: Speier as 3B coach...

    Quote Originally Posted by RANDY IN INDY View Post
    Spier was holding him at second and he ran through the stop sign.
    That wasn't the case. The replay clearly showed that Speier never made any type of signal towards Joey. He waved a runner home and then did nothing after that.
    "I talked to an advance scout that told me if Joey Votto and Albert Pujols were on the same team he'd advise his team to do the unthinkable...pitch around Votto to get to Pujols." - Buster Olney, ESPN

  12. #38
    Matt's Dad RANDY IN INDY's Avatar
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    Re: Speier as 3B coach...

    Post the video. I'm pretty sure I saw the hold sign.
    Talent is God Given: be humble.
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  13. #39
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    Re: Speier as 3B coach...

    Quote Originally Posted by New York Red View Post
    That wasn't the case. The replay clearly showed that Speier never made any type of signal towards Joey. He waved a runner home and then did nothing after that.
    Votto was on first when Bruce laced the single to right. There was no runner being waved home on the play. Speier held up both arms and Votto ignored him. It looks like Speier points at the ground, which may or may not be a signal to slide. Speier certainly was not very animated.

    http://wapc.mlb.com/play/?content_id...pic_id=9782246
    Zero chance the Reds miss the playoffs!

  14. #40
    Rally Onion! Chip R's Avatar
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    Re: Speier as 3B coach...

    Quote Originally Posted by texasdave View Post
    Votto was on first when Bruce laced the single to right. There was no runner being waved home on the play. Speier held up both arms and Votto ignored him. It looks like Speier points at the ground, which may or may not be a signal to slide. Speier certainly was not very animated.

    http://wapc.mlb.com/play/?content_id...pic_id=9782246
    Now is that a stay at second sign or a stand up at third sign? Remember there were 2 outs and Votto was running with contact. Anyone who isn't Corky Miller is going to go to third on that play.
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  15. #41
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    Re: Speier as 3B coach...

    Quote Originally Posted by Chip R View Post
    Now is that a stay at second sign or a stand up at third sign? Remember there were 2 outs and Votto was running with contact. Anyone who isn't Corky Miller is going to go to third on that play.
    To me that is a stay at second sign. I could be wrong.


    Here are some things we do know now:

    1) There was no runner being waved around third that could have caused any confusion.
    2) Votto was at first and had to have seen that was a rocket off the bat of Bruce that was going to get to Beltran quickly.
    3) Beltran has a very good arm.

    Putting all that together you would think that Votto had to know he wasn't going to make it to third standing up. And he didn't.
    Zero chance the Reds miss the playoffs!

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    Always Red (06-13-2013)

  17. #42
    Member jimbo's Avatar
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    Re: Speier as 3B coach...

    Quote Originally Posted by RANDY IN INDY View Post
    I could care less if Redszone goes into meltdown. Spier was holding him at second and he ran through the stop sign. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out the play will most likely be close. Sliding is a part of baseball. Just do it. He's a baseball player.
    I know he's a baseball player. Doesn't mean I want him taking unnecessary risks. He missed a significant amount of time last season because of an injury occurring on a slide to third base. Votto isn't a good slider, regardless of how much he has practiced it, and he is still hesitant when he has to slide. I felt the same way about Griffey dogging it to first on ground balls after all of his hamstring issues.

    Speier's job is indicate to a runner how to approach third base because the live play is to the back of the runner. Whether or not he ran through a stop sign at second is irrelevant. Votto shouldn't be sliding nilly willy just because there is some sort of perceived doubt. The lack of any kind of action on Speier's part told Votto that something happened behind him that negated the necessitated need to slide.

  18. #43
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    Re: Speier as 3B coach...

    Quote Originally Posted by texasdave View Post
    Votto was on first when Bruce laced the single to right. There was no runner being waved home on the play. Speier held up both arms and Votto ignored him. It looks like Speier points at the ground, which may or may not be a signal to slide. Speier certainly was not very animated.

    http://wapc.mlb.com/play/?content_id...pic_id=9782246
    OK, we are obviously talking about different plays. Speier has had 3 or 4 issues in just the past week, so I can see why there'd be confusion. Bottom line is, if no one is sure whether he gave a signal or what kind of signal he gave, then why should we expect Joey to know? This is 100% on Speier and that's why the announcers were talking about him on multiple occasions during two different games.
    "I talked to an advance scout that told me if Joey Votto and Albert Pujols were on the same team he'd advise his team to do the unthinkable...pitch around Votto to get to Pujols." - Buster Olney, ESPN

  19. #44
    RZ Chamber of Commerce Unassisted's Avatar
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    Re: Speier as 3B coach...

    Quote Originally Posted by 757690 View Post
    When Vern Rapp was manager, he posted a sign in the Reds clubhouse saying just that.
    I think that may be the first time this year I've read Vern Rapp's name. It'd be OK with me if it was also the last. That was an era of Reds baseball best forgotten. It's an era that might be likened to having your significant other take a half-year vacation from personal hygiene.
    Last edited by Unassisted; 06-13-2013 at 05:30 PM.
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  20. #45
    Matt's Dad RANDY IN INDY's Avatar
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    Re: Speier as 3B coach...

    Seems to me that running through the stop sign is very relevant. It created the play. He should have been sliding.
    Last edited by RANDY IN INDY; 06-13-2013 at 07:51 PM.
    Talent is God Given: be humble.
    Fame is man given: be thankful.
    Conceit is self given: be careful.

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    Always Red (06-13-2013)


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