Interesting Dusty Quotes

[RedTeamGo!]

It was sort of a joke. But you don't know me or my humor.

So, you are saying all of what you said is made up?

[swaisuc]

In extra innings on the road, there is no reason to use your closer until you have a lead unless you plan on using him more than 1 inning. Dusty preferred him only pitching one, so wasn't going to use him until he had no choice. I don't see a problem with that.

It's what basically every manager does, but there has been some pretty good points made about why that could be a bad strategy. For one, in a tie game in the bot9, you have no chance to score yourself so 1 run ends it. If you pitch your worse pitcher in the 10th instead, he might have runs to work with from the T10. That in itself would be a pretty good reason to pitch your closer B9 regardless in a tie game.

[Vottomatic]

I hear this argument a lot and I understand its surface appeal. And yet I don't fully understand what specifically Dusty is supposed to do in practice.

For example, let's say that we're playing at home and up a run; Dusty brings in Broxton to pitch the 8th; he gets an out but then hits the next batter on the foot on a 1-2 pitch and then gives up a double down the line; now it's 2nd and 3rd with one out, a left-handed batter coming to the plate. This is now a high leverage situation and it would be great if Chapman could pitch in this spot. But there's no way that Chapman would be able to be ready to come in, even assuming he started to warm up after the HBP (in my example - and the HBP was hardly a signal that the inning was coming apart). The only answer to that problem is to have Chapman throwing all the time in the bullpen but there's going to be a lot of innings where the 8th inning guy would be able to handle matters just fine and then Chapman has to cool down - getting up, getting down, getting back up is how pitchers get hurt.

All that is to say that I think some people look at these situations as if playing a video game or a fantasy league, and not giving full consideration to just how these situations work in an actual game.

And the truth of the matter is that unless the 7th and 8th inning guys figure things out, we're not going to win over the long haul. Sure, Dusty could perhaps swing the outcome of a game here or there by more aggressive use of Chapman, but to win the division and advance in the playoffs, someone needs to be able to get some people out between the starters and Chapman.

Obviously there are many factors and situations to consider. Many which won't happen very often.

Also, Chapman is pretty much lights out and rarely pitches to more than 3 or 4 batters in the 9th. If he isn't lights out, more than likely it means a loss and the game is over anyway.

If Chapman pitches 3 days in a row, closes out 3 games and maybe pitches to 1 batter in the 8th and 3 in the 9th...........obviously, he needs a day or two off. But how often does this happen? Not much.

And how often do high leverage situations come up in the 8th inning? Not much.

It's not like Chapman is going to be pitching the 8th inning 5 games a week and get worn down. Our starting pitching is pretty good about going 7 or 8 innings most of the time. Occasionally the bullpen gets overworked in a game or two. Then you have to adjust.

BUT.....most of the time, the starters go deep, and there is rarely a high leverage situation in the 8th.

[Vottomatic]

So, you are saying all of what you said is made up?

No. It's the truth, but it was tongue in cheek response to someone treating me like I was stupid.

[RedTeamGo!]

You were talking down to him to begin with, but I suppose he shouldn't talk back to someone that graduated near the top of their high school class.

[remdog]

hahahahahahaha worst.post.ever.

For someone that's been here a very short time, I doubt you have any knowledge to know that is correct.

Rem

[PuffyPig]

I hear this argument a lot and I understand its surface appeal. And yet I don't fully understand what specifically Dusty is supposed to do in practice.

For example, let's say that we're playing at home and up a run; Dusty brings in Broxton to pitch the 8th; he gets an out but then hits the next batter on the foot on a 1-2 pitch and then gives up a double down the line; now it's 2nd and 3rd with one out, a left-handed batter coming to the plate. This is now a high leverage situation and it would be great if Chapman could pitch in this spot. But there's no way that Chapman would be able to be ready to come in, even assuming he started to warm up after the HBP (in my example - and the HBP was hardly a signal that the inning was coming apart). The only answer to that problem is to have Chapman throwing all the time in the bullpen but there's going to be a lot of innings where the 8th inning guy would be able to handle matters just fine and then Chapman has to cool down - getting up, getting down, getting back up is how pitchers get hurt.

All that is to say that I think some people look at these situations as if playing a video game or a fantasy league, and not giving full consideration to just how these situations work in an actual game.

And the truth of the matter is that unless the 7th and 8th inning guys figure things out, we're not going to win over the long haul. Sure, Dusty could perhaps swing the outcome of a game here or there by more aggressive use of Chapman, but to win the division and advance in the playoffs, someone needs to be able to get some people out between the starters and Chapman.

You pegged it exactly, Chapman needs to be warming up whenever Dusty might need him. Which means right from the get go in the 8th.

[New York Red]

If Chapman went through most of spring training conditioning to be a starter, why on earth is it such a big deal for him to go two innings when needed?

I don't get it.

Or at least come in to kill a rally with maybe an out or two already down in the 8th. If he pitches an inning and a third, and throws 25 pitches, how is that any different than just pitching the 9th and throwing a similar number of pitches?

[PuffyPig]

It's what basically every manager does, but there has been some pretty good points made about why that could be a bad strategy. For one, in a tie game in the bot9, you have no chance to score yourself so 1 run ends it. If you pitch your worse pitcher in the 10th instead, he might have runs to work with from the T10. That in itself would be a pretty good reason to pitch your closer B9 regardless in a tie game.

I get those arguments and they make some sense. I think it tends to realte to how many innings you want to go with your closer in that situation. If you bring him to face the bottom of the 9th, it's likely 1 inning. Yesterday, if Broxton had gotten out of the jam, Chapman was in for at least two innings if required. If you use your best bullet early, you really don't know yet if you need him for 2 innings, so you assume you don't.

[RedTeamGo!]

For someone that's been here a very short time, I doubt you have any knowledge to know that is correct.

Rem

Been lurking for 7-8 years and actually used to post before the whole Sun Deck thing. Obviously I do not know if it is the worst post ever, but was probably the worst I have read on here.

[PuffyPig]

If Chapman went through most of spring training conditioning to be a starter, why on earth is it such a big deal for him to go two innings when needed?

I don't get it.

(1) Spring training was a long time ago, he's no longer stretched out as a starter. Whatever conditioning he was doing in the spring is no longer relevant.

(2) He can pitch 2 innings, but it would make him unavailable for 1-2 games thereafter. So, Dusty would like to avoid that.

[Raisor]

(2) He can pitch 2 innings, but it would make him unavailable for 1-2 games thereafter. So, Dusty would like to avoid that.

Except he keeps mentioning that he keeps considering it.

I think Dusty is warring with himself.

[RedTeamGo!]

To stray from the serious Dusty quotes, here is a fun one about Dusty inventing the high five:

It was the last day of the regular season, and Dodgers leftfielder Dusty Baker had just gone deep off the Astros' J. R. Richard. It was Baker's 30th home run, making the Dodgers the first team in history to have four sluggers – Baker, Ron Cey, Steve Garvey and Reggie Smith – with at least 30 homers each. It was a wild, triumphant moment and a good omen as the Dodgers headed to the playoffs. Burke, waiting on deck, thrust his hand enthusiastically over his head to greet his friend at the plate. Baker, not knowing what to do, smacked it. "His hand was up in the air, and he was arching way back", says Baker, now 62 and managing the Reds. "So I reached up and hit his hand. It seemed like the thing to do."[4]

[Always Red]

To stray from the serious Dusty quotes, here is a fun one about Dusty inventing the high five:

It was the last day of the regular season, and Dodgers leftfielder Dusty Baker had just gone deep off the Astros' J. R. Richard. It was Baker's 30th home run, making the Dodgers the first team in history to have four sluggers – Baker, Ron Cey, Steve Garvey and Reggie Smith – with at least 30 homers each. It was a wild, triumphant moment and a good omen as the Dodgers headed to the playoffs. Burke, waiting on deck, thrust his hand enthusiastically over his head to greet his friend at the plate. Baker, not knowing what to do, smacked it. "His hand was up in the air, and he was arching way back", says Baker, now 62 and managing the Reds. "So I reached up and hit his hand. It seemed like the thing to do."[4]

[_Sir_Charles_]

I'll bow out of this statistical part of this argument and simply say Chapman should be available in high leverage situations in the 8th inning when the setup man gets into trouble.

That is all.

I have a question. Why is it that fans always want closers to pitch in the high leverage situations in the 7th or 8th instead of just the 9th? My point is why not a high leverage situation in the 3rd or the 5th? The big inning that decides a game isn't always a late inning, right? And how is anyone, mainly the manager, supposed to know when the highest leverage situation is going to be? If you get a critical situation in the 7th and use Aroldis...who's to say there won't be an even BIGGER problem in the 8th or 9th?

I think that having designated roles, while frustrating for the fans, does make it easier on the players and managers and allows them to prepare properly for each game. It also lessens the wear and tear on a guy's arm. People look at the number of appearances, innings pitched or even the number of pitches thrown...but the number of warm-up pitches and the number of times he's gotten up and down in a game or gotten up only to not enter the game...those things are JUST as important if not MORE important to the health of a pitcher and the effectiveness of a pitcher. Heck, to the SANITY of a pitcher too. :O) Set roles are NOT a bad thing.