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Thread: The Burying of Devin Mesoraco

  1. #406
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    Re: The Burying of Devin Mesoraco

    Quote Originally Posted by edabbs44 View Post
    He has had a monster two game span where he has hit more than quite well. My logic is that he will need to do more than blow up in two games where many hitters in the lineup blew up before I believe that we are witnessing anything more than just that.
    July OPS of .954.

    Again, you move the goalposts a lot. Either "he doesn't make the most of his opportunities in limited playing time" or "it's only a few games so it doesn't prove anything." It's 1 or the other.

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  3. #407
    The Boss dougdirt's Avatar
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    Re: The Burying of Devin Mesoraco

    Quote Originally Posted by kaldaniels View Post
    Just because a guys best 2 games just happened doesn't mean you can't count them.

    Mes is a .730 OPS bat for the season, and is trending up. What is there to argue on that?
    Catchers ERA.

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  5. #408
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    Re: The Burying of Devin Mesoraco

    Quote Originally Posted by fearofpopvol1 View Post
    July OPS of .954.

    Again, you move the goalposts a lot. Either "he doesn't make the most of his opportunities in limited playing time" or "it's only a few games so it doesn't prove anything." It's 1 or the other.
    He has made the most of the first two games of the series vs SF. For the rest of the month, he has been the same player we have seen all season and previously. The longer he produces, the more faith he will earn from me. I'm not sure why that is such a problematic position to take.

    Also, please stop with the July OPS nonsense. 48 PA samples don't typically get me all worked up. If you think that it is the start of something big, that's your opinion and I won't specifically criticize that opinion. I may argue the logic behind it, but not the position itself. You might end up being right. But why 48 PAs in July trump three other lackluster months in 2013 with more PAs in each is beyond me. Maybe it's the .419 babip that, for some reason, no one seems to care about.

  6. #409
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    Re: The Burying of Devin Mesoraco

    Quote Originally Posted by edabbs44 View Post
    Maybe it's the .419 babip that, for some reason, no one seems to care about.
    Funny how no one seemed to care that his BABIP was in the .230's in small samples for his career before July happened too. Now that his season BABIP is at .295, it seems silly to bring up a .419 for one month in which he still hasn't played full time.

  7. #410
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    Re: The Burying of Devin Mesoraco

    If I remember correctly Mes had a history in the minors of needing an adjustment period before his hitting would take off each time he was promoted to the next level. The adjustment was probably quicker in the minors because he was playing mostly full time. I hope we're seeing the same trend now and he'll develop into that RH middle of the order bat the Reds need so badly.

    Choo, BP, Votto, Mes, and Bruce would be deadly if Mes began to hit like he did in the minors.

  8. #411
    One and a half men Patrick Bateman's Avatar
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    Re: The Burying of Devin Mesoraco

    Being at the last few games for Mes, I can certainly see the fuss made about him as a prospect. And that is not based on his success at the plate so far.

    You can just tell he's an absolute physical speciman. Physically the game seems so easy for him out there. I've enjoyed his hitting approach... in that he really seems to be going up there being "patient aggressive"... in that it looks like he's looking for a specific pitch, and if he gets it, he's going after it with aggression, and if he doesn't, seems like he's waiting until next time.

    Hope his success the last 2 games continues. I certainly feel like the sky could be the limit for him. He's earned the chance to keep going.

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  10. #412
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    Re: The Burying of Devin Mesoraco

    Quote Originally Posted by dougdirt View Post
    Funny how no one seemed to care that his BABIP was in the .230's in small samples for his career before July happened too. Now that his season BABIP is at .295, it seems silly to bring up a .419 for one month in which he still hasn't played full time.
    Very fair point, however that full season .295 babip leaves us at .731 ops. Which works, generally, but I think maybe some are viewing the lesser production of pre-July 22 as an outlier b/c of the perceived playing time issues. And that we are seeing the awakening of Devin at this time, which will be more prevalent as more playing time is bestowed upon him. Which I'm not sure how accurate that would be.

  11. #413
    One and a half men Patrick Bateman's Avatar
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    Re: The Burying of Devin Mesoraco

    Quote Originally Posted by edabbs44 View Post
    He has made the most of the first two games of the series vs SF. For the rest of the month, he has been the same player we have seen all season and previously. The longer he produces, the more faith he will earn from me. I'm not sure why that is such a problematic position to take.

    Also, please stop with the July OPS nonsense. 48 PA samples don't typically get me all worked up. If you think that it is the start of something big, that's your opinion and I won't specifically criticize that opinion. I may argue the logic behind it, but not the position itself. You might end up being right. But why 48 PAs in July trump three other lackluster months in 2013 with more PAs in each is beyond me. Maybe it's the .419 babip that, for some reason, no one seems to care about.
    Ya, i'd agree with the others, really seems like you are contradicting your arguments here. The criticisms of overanalyzing of small sample size BAPIP's, the throwing away of success in limited playing time are all examples of things that you normally roast others on...

    It just reads to me like you have made up your mind on the subject, and trying to argue whatever justifies that position. I've always looked at it the other way... in that you should be looking at the arguments to make a position.

    Needless to say, Mes has showed obvious signs of improvement with the most recent opportunity. True that his July OPS numbers are mostly due to the two most recent games, but thats normally how it works in small sample sizes. There are few guys that able to OPS .900 every game for 2 weeks. In 5 at-bats, you are either going to hit .200 or .400, or .000 or .600. So yes, of course 2 games will inflate a small sample size.

    In the end, you can't throw out the good games, just like you can't throw out the bad games. The sum of the parts has been good, and he's looked good doing it. Hanigan has played bad and looked bad and old and tired doing it. Time to give Mes a real chance.

  12. #414
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    Re: The Burying of Devin Mesoraco

    Quote Originally Posted by edabbs44 View Post
    He has made the most of the first two games of the series vs SF. For the rest of the month, he has been the same player we have seen all season and previously. The longer he produces, the more faith he will earn from me. I'm not sure why that is such a problematic position to take.

    Also, please stop with the July OPS nonsense. 48 PA samples don't typically get me all worked up. If you think that it is the start of something big, that's your opinion and I won't specifically criticize that opinion. I may argue the logic behind it, but not the position itself. You might end up being right. But why 48 PAs in July trump three other lackluster months in 2013 with more PAs in each is beyond me. Maybe it's the .419 babip that, for some reason, no one seems to care about.
    The problem is that others in the past have claimed small sample size when Mes hasn't hit well and you have taken a strong position previously that Mes has simply not made the most of his opportunities and doesn't deserve more playing time as a result.

    He's now made the most of these opportunities, has hit better than average for a catcher on the season, and has outplayed Hanigan on the season in more PAs. It's pretty straightforward.

    I'm failing to understand you logic because you keep moving the goalposts.

  13. #415
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    Re: The Burying of Devin Mesoraco

    Quote Originally Posted by fearofpopvol1 View Post
    The problem is that others in the past have claimed small sample size when Mes hasn't hit well and you have taken a strong position previously that Mes has simply not made the most of his opportunities and doesn't deserve more playing time as a result.

    He's now made the most of these opportunities, has hit better than average for a catcher on the season, and has outplayed Hanigan on the season in more PAs. It's pretty straightforward.

    I'm failing to understand you logic because you keep moving the goalposts.
    He's had 2 crazily phenomenal games that were overall crazily phenomenal for the team. I think we are taking it a bit far by saying that "he's now made the most of these opportunities".

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    Re: The Burying of Devin Mesoraco

    Quote Originally Posted by edabbs44 View Post
    He's had 2 crazily phenomenal games that were overall crazily phenomenal for the team. I think we are taking it a bit far by saying that "he's now made the most of these opportunities".
    Just think if he had decided that it wouldn't matter if he got those hits because the whole team got hits those games...Why bother when some are just going to toss them out just out of bias. I'm sure Hanigan wouldn't have had the gall to pile hits on in those 2 onslaughts of offense. He would know that it wouldn't be fair to Mes...

    Bum

  15. #417
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    Re: The Burying of Devin Mesoraco

    Quote Originally Posted by edabbs44 View Post
    He's had 2 crazily phenomenal games that were overall crazily phenomenal for the team. I think we are taking it a bit far by saying that "he's now made the most of these opportunities".
    That's two more crazily phenomenal performances than Hanigan has had this year.

    He's a catcher. You have to take notice of the big offensive outputs from them. Because a guy capable of doing that at the catcher position could have unreal value.

  16. #418
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    Re: The Burying of Devin Mesoraco

    Quote Originally Posted by edabbs44 View Post
    He's had 2 crazily phenomenal games that were overall crazily phenomenal for the team. I think we are taking it a bit far by saying that "he's now made the most of these opportunities".
    And if he failed would it be ok to beat on him like a pinata?

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  18. #419
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    Re: The Burying of Devin Mesoraco

    Quote Originally Posted by westofyou View Post
    And if he failed would it be ok to beat on him like a pinata?
    If he went 0-8 in two games? Nope.

  19. #420
    Viva la Rolen kaldaniels's Avatar
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    Re: The Burying of Devin Mesoraco

    I feel like we are getting bogged down in minutiae Eddabbs. What is your overall view/take of Mesoraco now and going forward?


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