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Thread: Chris Davis

  1. #226
    The Boss dougdirt's Avatar
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    Re: Chris Davis

    Quote Originally Posted by New York Red View Post
    I'm talking about marquee players and their accomplishments. That's what I originally replied to. I never said there aren't drugs in other sports. I said the marquee players who are putting up eye-opening numbers in football, basketball, hockey, etc., aren't being questioned or suspected. And no, I never considered Shawne Merriman a marquee player.

    I guarantee you, if Adrian Peterson, Tom Brady and Drew Brees tested positive for steroids, the media would be all over it. Baseball is going through a period, stretching well over a decade now, in which many of the biggest stars and most glamorous records, have involved PED use. No other major sport has endured a period like that, so maybe that's why there isn't the same suspicions and assumptions as there is in baseball.
    That is because in the NFL 99% of the players can walk down the street and not be noticed by anyone other than "wow, that guy is huge". Guys that are elite players are basically no one unless they play quarterback or running back. How many people could pick Calvin Johnson out of a lineup of just headshots? My guess would be not many. The time these guys are seen, they are wearing helmets that cover their entire head and face. Shawne Merriman was one of the absolute best players in the league for several years, but you don't consider him a marquee player. Why? Because he plays defense and isn't named Ray Lewis. The NFL has two and a half glory positions. Quarter, running back and a wide receiver here or there. If you play any of the other 20 positions on the field hardly anyone cares about you.

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  3. #227
    The Boss dougdirt's Avatar
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    Re: Chris Davis

    Quote Originally Posted by Brutus View Post
    Again, it's worth noting there are hundreds and hundreds of "banned" substances on the MLB list. Many of them are absolutely not illegal and can be purchased by any regular person at Wal Mart, GNC, etc.. That point really isn't very relevant to the conversation. There are many, many loopholes to legally take substances both legal and prescription-based.

    Furthermore, we're not speaking about people living in a convent. We're talking about athletes playing a game that has seen overwhelmingly pervasive usage of supplements. This isn't exactly a needle in a haystack. It's throwing the ball up against the side of a barn.
    End of the day it looks more like "He has good stats, therefore he must be cheating". I am surprised no one is speculating on Votto around here.

    [crazy logic]
    I mean his Major League numbers make his minor league numbers look bad. He topped out at 22 homers in the minors, twice. He only hit over .300 twice in 8 seasons. Clearly he uses by the crazy logic going on around here, right? I mean all of a sudden he is arguably one of the best hitters for average in baseball and man, that 37 home run season after only hitting 22 in a single year in the minors? Wreaks of cheating.
    [/crazy logic]

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    RedEye (07-15-2013)

  5. #228
    No half measures, Walter RedEye's Avatar
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    Re: Chris Davis

    Quote Originally Posted by dougdirt View Post
    End of the day it looks more like "He has good stats, therefore he must be cheating". I am surprised no one is speculating on Votto around here.

    [crazy logic]
    I mean his Major League numbers make his minor league numbers look bad. He topped out at 22 homers in the minors, twice. He only hit over .300 twice in 8 seasons. Clearly he uses by the crazy logic going on around here, right? I mean all of a sudden he is arguably one of the best hitters for average in baseball and man, that 37 home run season after only hitting 22 in a single year in the minors? Wreaks of cheating.
    [/crazy logic]
    What about Barry Larkin? Where did that 33 HR season come from?

  6. #229
    Member Superdude's Avatar
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    Re: Chris Davis

    When creating expectations for 300 some players, odds have it that we'll underestimate the talent of a few of them. Should I brace myself for seeing some random player's name with thirty pages attached to the thread every year from now on?

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    marcshoe (07-16-2013), mth123 (07-15-2013), westofyou (07-15-2013)

  8. #230
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    Re: Chris Davis

    Quote Originally Posted by dougdirt View Post
    That is because in the NFL 99% of the players can walk down the street and not be noticed by anyone other than "wow, that guy is huge". Guys that are elite players are basically no one unless they play quarterback or running back. How many people could pick Calvin Johnson out of a lineup of just headshots? My guess would be not many. The time these guys are seen, they are wearing helmets that cover their entire head and face. Shawne Merriman was one of the absolute best players in the league for several years, but you don't consider him a marquee player. Why? Because he plays defense and isn't named Ray Lewis. The NFL has two and a half glory positions. Quarter, running back and a wide receiver here or there. If you play any of the other 20 positions on the field hardly anyone cares about you.
    Again, the original point was about marquee players putting up eye-opening numbers. That would eliminate 99% of MLB's players too.

    As for Merriman, I never considered him a marquee player because he wasn't one. He had one great season, made three pro bowl rosters, and was basically done after his third year in the league. One great season doesn't make you a marquee player -- especially when you're busted for being dirty not long after that.
    "I talked to an advance scout that told me if Joey Votto and Albert Pujols were on the same team he'd advise his team to do the unthinkable...pitch around Votto to get to Pujols." - Buster Olney, ESPN

  9. #231
    The Boss dougdirt's Avatar
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    Re: Chris Davis

    Quote Originally Posted by Superdude View Post
    When creating expectations for 300 some players, odds have it that we'll underestimate the talent of a few of them. Should I brace myself for seeing some random player's name with thirty pages attached to the thread every year from now on?
    Yes, you should.

  10. #232
    breath westofyou's Avatar
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    Re: Chris Davis

    Torii Hunter on if 61 is "real" HR record: "No. Don't care what you're linked to, you still have to hit the ball out of park. It aint easy."

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  12. #233
    5.3 Posts Abv Replacement BluegrassRedleg's Avatar
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    Re: Chris Davis

    Quote Originally Posted by dougdirt View Post
    Yes, you should.
    Yeah, because there's a clear track record for guys belting 37 HRs in the first half of a season EVERY YEAR.
    Rounding third and heading for home...

  13. #234
    Stat Wanker Hodiernus RedsManRick's Avatar
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    Re: Chris Davis

    Quote Originally Posted by westofyou View Post
    Torii Hunter on if 61 is "real" HR record: "No. Don't care what you're linked to, you still have to hit the ball out of park. It aint easy."
    I think that may be the first time I've heard a player advocate that position. Amen!
    Games are won on run differential -- scoring more than your opponent. Runs are runs, scored or prevented they all count the same. Worry about scoring more and allowing fewer, not which positions contribute to which side of the equation or how "consistent" you are at your current level of performance.

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    RedEye (07-15-2013)

  15. #235
    Member Wonderful Monds's Avatar
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    Re: Chris Davis

    Quote Originally Posted by westofyou View Post
    Torii Hunter on if 61 is "real" HR record: "No. Don't care what you're linked to, you still have to hit the ball out of park. It aint easy."
    Is Torii speaking from experience?

    They don't think it be like it is, but it do.
    Quote Originally Posted by Larry Schuler View Post
    He has also taught me that even when the Reds win it is important to focus on the fact that they could have lost.

  16. #236
    Et tu, Brutus? Brutus's Avatar
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    Re: Chris Davis

    Quote Originally Posted by westofyou View Post
    Torii Hunter on if 61 is "real" HR record: "No. Don't care what you're linked to, you still have to hit the ball out of park. It aint easy."
    No one said it's easy, but in a sport where hitting 50 homers instead of 30 homers is the difference between being in the Hall of Fame and being an all-star candidate, as well as the difference between being rich and being filthy wealthy, any degree of difficulty being removed is noteworthy.
    "No matter how good you are, you're going to lose one-third of your games. No matter how bad you are you're going to win one-third of your games. It's the other third that makes the difference." ~Tommy Lasorda

  17. #237
    The Boss dougdirt's Avatar
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    Re: Chris Davis

    Quote Originally Posted by BluegrassRedleg View Post
    Yeah, because there's a clear track record for guys belting 37 HRs in the first half of a season EVERY YEAR.
    Griffey held the record once upon a time for most homers through April and May. Must have been steroids. Funny that he held that record with Ruth. Must have been steroids for him too.

    Anyone who holds any kind of record in baseball.... STEROIDS! You know, because no one has ever done better.

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    RedEye (07-15-2013)

  19. #238
    Worst Behavior. reds44's Avatar
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    Re: Chris Davis

    Quote Originally Posted by dougdirt View Post
    Griffey held the record once upon a time for most homers through April and May. Must have been steroids. Funny that he held that record with Ruth. Must have been steroids for him too.

    Anyone who holds any kind of record in baseball.... STEROIDS! You know, because no one has ever done better.
    Welcome to the hole baseball players dug themself in the steroid era. When guys hitting a ton of HRs looks too good to be true, it usually has been.
    Quote Originally Posted by PuffyPig View Post
    Let's face it, you mis-hit the bun with the mustard squirter, no one will really care.

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    Brutus (07-15-2013)

  21. #239
    Five Tool Fool jojo's Avatar
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    Re: Chris Davis

    Quote Originally Posted by dougdirt View Post
    End of the day it looks more like "He has good stats, therefore he must be cheating". I am surprised no one is speculating on Votto around here.

    [crazy logic]
    I mean his Major League numbers make his minor league numbers look bad. He topped out at 22 homers in the minors, twice. He only hit over .300 twice in 8 seasons. Clearly he uses by the crazy logic going on around here, right? I mean all of a sudden he is arguably one of the best hitters for average in baseball and man, that 37 home run season after only hitting 22 in a single year in the minors? Wreaks of cheating.
    [/crazy logic]
    How about Arroyo?

    But if we're talking about basing it solely on an in season performance that is different past ones, Leake is an obvious person to try a PED thread about. His ERA doesn't jive with his DNA.
    Last edited by jojo; 07-15-2013 at 09:42 PM.
    "This isnít stats vs scouts - this is stats and scouts working together, building an organization that blends the best of both worlds. This is the blueprint for how a baseball organization should be run. And, whether the baseball men of the 20th century like it or not, this is where baseball is going."---Dave Cameron, U.S.S. Mariner

  22. #240
    Member Wonderful Monds's Avatar
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    Re: Chris Davis

    Quote Originally Posted by jojo View Post
    How about Arroyo?
    I wouldn't be surprised in the least if Arroyo was taking PEDs, but that's only because he's been fairly open about using a lot of other things.
    They don't think it be like it is, but it do.
    Quote Originally Posted by Larry Schuler View Post
    He has also taught me that even when the Reds win it is important to focus on the fact that they could have lost.


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